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1. US Election On Best Political Blogs » Blog Archive » A Wake-Up Call for Conservatives:

[...] A Wake-Up Call for Conservatives No one will help the right if they don’t help themselves. [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:25 am 2. jvon:

McCain was my fourth choice in the Republican primary, but once he took it, I donated heavily to the campaign and to the RNC. If every registered Republican gave what I did, the McCain campaign would have had 98 billion dollars to spend. (Yes, I just did the math.)

I have no idea what they would have done with that much money, and I doubt I would have wanted to turn on a TV or even go outside while it was going on, but Obama would have got the thrashing he deserved. The thoroughly metaphorical thrashing, mind you.

Also, imagine what kind of outfits Sarah Palin would have had!

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:26 am 3. David Thomson:

This is perhaps the number one thing individual conservatives must realize: life is not fair—and other people are likely not going to do their fair share. In other words, you are often going to feel like a sucker! Well, what do you want me to tell you? Life sucks and then you die. Doing virtually nothing only makes things worse for you and your loved ones.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:53 am 4. Mike T:

It’s not the conservatives who voted 3rd party who cost the election, it’s the ones who stayed home. I’ll never understand that. When I got sick and tired of the unchallenged Republican in my old district, who spent all of his time lobbying for Hollywood and Disney interests, I went to vote and simply wrote in “Cthulhu” on the ballet because there weren’t even any other write in candidates that year. Why is it so hard for conservatives to do the same? Staying at home, rather than voting for a 3rd party if you can’t stand one of the major two, is like saying “hey look guys, if you’re not going to listen to me, I’ll just shut up and be quiet.” There’s nothing the RNC and DNC would love more than that.

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:30 am 5. George Bush On Best Political Blogs » Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives:

[...] Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives Quite a bit actually. We were too slow to challenge Republicans in D.C., including George Bush, when they veered from a conservative course. Yes, we complained, but not loudly enough and too late in the game. … [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 3:45 am 6. Sara:

Unbelievable….you are trying to make a case that we lost because the GOP didn’t have enough of our MONEY to spend?

If McCain had a trillion more dollars he couldn’t have bought a fountain of youth (although he could’ve afforded teeth whiteners). I suppose if I sent hundreds more dollars he could’ve run more spanish language ads promoting illegal immigration and cap and trade……he could’ve run lots more of those crappy tv spots that said virtually nothing.

I get it!!! More wasteful spending, that’s what could’ve won the election!!!

Thanks for the enlightenment.

http://www.saraforamerica.com

Nov 25, 2008 - 4:39 am 7. Ann:

I always wonder who the “we” is in these articles appointing, excusing or accepting blame for a group.

So convenient.

Leave me out of it. I complained…loudly. I gave financially…more than in any previous election cycle. I talked with friends and family…’til I was blue in the face. I voted against Al Franken. I contacted Amy Klobuchar and asked her if she would publicly state that she likes, supports and defends the Constitution of the United States, to offset the declarations of Barry Soetero that he does not. (She didn’t have any comment.)

The fact is, the people who want a nanny government now outnumber the adults in the country. Thanks to our public school system, those same people don’t have a clue how government is financed, of course, and wouldn’t understand it if you told them.

Nov 25, 2008 - 4:40 am 8. Typewriter King:

You started off wrong, Mr. Hawkins, Edmund Burke said no such thing in any of his writings.

You can complain about me not being loud enough, but I was practically alone in criticizing George Bush over the very first of these bailouts in September of 2001.

And the greatest accomplishment of conservatives was “taking their ball and going home.” From the time the first shots were fired at Concord, to when General Cornwallis surrendered at Yorktown, American Conservatives committed the greatest act of disengaging from British politics.

When we homeschool, we’re disengaging. When we retire early, we’re disengaging. When we move assets out of the country, we’re disengaging.

Simply withholding our consent topples them in time. As our political system is cyclical, sometimes the only thing we can do politically is stand aside and let the wrong people demonstrate just how wrong they are while governing.

Tancredo named his PAC Team America? Kind of tacky, considering that Matt Stone lives in his congressional district.

Nov 25, 2008 - 4:41 am 9. Kirk Maberry:

Mr. Hawkins, are you on crack? Conservatives need to help themselves? Since you obviously haven’t been paying attention,let me enlighten you. We have fought Bush tooth and nail. We killed the Myers appointment, Amnesty and fought with everything we had the prescription bill and the bailout. We are fighting the Auto deal right now. What you call apathy is actually marginalization. We are supposed to vote for McCain? Why would I vote for a republocrat when I can get the real thing in Obama. My hope is that the republican party will realize that you will never win with a liberal republican. Let the democrats run this thing into the ground, they can’t be any worse than the 4 trillion dollar expenditure this republican president has saddled us with this year. Traitors like McCain and Bush do not require our support, only our derision. They may be good on terrorism, but do you think I care if 3,000 more innocent Americans go up in flames when the republican party doesn’t care about screwing 300 million? Give us a Conservative and we’ll rally. Otherwise, I’ll let the democrats do what the republicans have been doing since Reagan, screwing republicans.

Nov 25, 2008 - 5:08 am 10. Thinking Person:

Have to concur with #9 Kirk….Give us a conservative to rally around and then we will coalesce. I await the tomato shower that will happen when I propose that if Huckabee would have won more than Ohio, we would have had an actual horserace on our hands. At least he had some charisma to counter Obama’s right? Commence with the tomatoes….I know they’re coming….

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:17 am 11. Jeff Carter:

The problem may be with defining what is a conservative. Many have litmus tests for abortion and other social causes-and some just have economic goals in mind.

How you define conservatism going forward will define how you do in elections. Being clear, concise, and then staying the course once you are elected will determine if you are successful at bringing conservatism back.

Conservatism is not dead, it’s just in hibernation.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:27 am 12. Kirk:

I am setting aside the blame and fraud accusations, and believing that “in the whole” the system worked. The American people got who they wanted. I believe, in general, the American people have sunk to a new low, and we are collectively getting what we deserve. Maybe not YOU personally … but if you stick 10 Americans together in a row, 6 out of 10 deserve it. Harsh times are coming. Get out of debt and start preparing for the unexpected.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:29 am 13. aharris:

Sorry, Thinking Person, I disagree about Huckabee. I like him just fine as a person, but he’d have Government do in the name of God what Obama will do in the name of “spreading the wealth.” It may be more palatable to you if it’s done in the name of God, but socialism by any other name is still the same failed thing. Besides, God wants us to give of ourselves of our own free will, not because Government forces us to. That’s the essential lesson both Huckabee and Obama seem to have missed.

I’m not much of a leader, but I am a planner. If someone around here primed a campaign I could lend myself to, I’d go to town (and the mat) if they’d let me.

We need to articulate that American freedom is about being free to reach as high as you dare, but that the flip side of that incredible freedom means also risking failure, and not just any failure but the sort that lands you lower than you ever thought you could get. People today fear failure too much. They want government to save them from it because they don’t want to experience it, but I contend that a people that do not know true failure will likewise never realize true success. We need a leader who can express that and make people buy into that. Only then, can we maybe start to undo the stranglehold the government has on our lives.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:39 am 14. Tex Taylor:

I was with you until we got to the role of donating money. What we spend on politicial elections in this country is atrocious and sinful.

I refuse to give one dime to any candidate and have in fact, donated money to far more worthwhile causes, such as mend crisis pregnancy centers to care for both the newborn and unborn.

When I see a billion dollars spent on a presidential election, I know something has gone seriously amiss in this country. Count me out concerning the political donations.

P.S. – I also admire people who home school; however my children went the private road.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:43 am 15. Conservative Interests:

Conservatives are rightfully named, for their political purpose is sole conservation. The conservation of their own personal wealth and standard of living, irregardless of the condition that the rest of the country is in.

But I agree. Conservatives do need a wake up call. A wake up call that says ‘I am an egotistical, self-centered, hypocritical person concerned only with my own self-interests and without regard for the welfare of the country as a whole.’

Perhaps this should be included in the oath future Republicans are sworn in to office by.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:47 am 16. Cybergeezer:

Many of the Liberal Left voters today have come from the “new education” system that will not give you a passing grade unless you agree with their Liberal Left agenda. I detected “dumming down” 30 years ago with my kids. These are the mindless dolts that make up the media that is carrying on the tradition of agreeing with the Liberal agenda.
McCain saying he would “fight” for us in Washington is like a paraplegic threatening to kick my ass. McCain has never had any fight in him. I think he likes the torture he gets.
Until we have a Conservative representative that displays real spunk, we are victims of the uneducated, incompetent, malicious liberals “allowed” to assume power.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:57 am 17. Tommy:

This article is the biggest piece of horse hockey I’ve read on this website. You know what really delivered America to the Democrats? Talk like this…”blah blah blah Ayers blah blah blah Wright blah blah blah Socialist blah blah blah tax and spend liberal blah blah blah Muslim blah blah blah Arab blah blah blah Marxist blah blah blah.” If only the Republicans had concentrated on the issues that are of a concern to the American people instead of ducking them with name-calling there might be more of them in office right now.

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:00 am 18. BMoon:

And please Libertarians, don’t even let the notion of abandoning the abortion or preservation of marriage causes waft into your half-baked heads. The Conservative movement will truly dies once you surrender those walls, to use ted Nugent’s metaphor. After you stop preserving life and marriage, what else is there to preserve? Your 401k?

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:01 am 19. Jim M:

“Conservatives” have and will continue to fail because they have no ideology; no coherent political philosophy. Tradition is not an ideology. Antipathy towards intellectuals will not address the arguments of modern liberals. Being against is not the opposite of being for. It takes no brains to be against. There used to be a party of “Know Nothings”. Conservatives are more like “no-nothings”. Do they have any ideas? No, nothing. They have the same moral code as the liberals: altruism; they’re just not as “extreme” about it. The one author in the last half century who tried to define a moral code to justify the political achievement of the United States has been condemned, disparaged, vilified, ignored, dismissed…..most harshly by “Conservatives”. Where is the “Conservative” who declares that your life belongs to you – not the government or society or your neighbors – to you, and that the good is to live it?

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:02 am 20. Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives:

[...] Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives However, the greatest flaw conservatives have is that when we get frustrated with the performance of the Republican Party, we have a tendency to pick up our ball and go home. “Well, if they do that, then I’m not giving any money, … [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:20 am 21. US Election On Best Political Blogs » Blog Archive » Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives:

[...] Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives US Election On Best Political Blogs » Blog Archive » A Wake-Up Call for Conservatives:. [...] A Wake-Up Call for Conservatives No one will help the right if they don’t help themselves. [...] Nov 25, 2008 – 12:25 am 2. jvon: … [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:27 am 22. FreedomLover:

What were all those calls to Senators and Representatives about the $700B bailout? We all made our voices heard, to the tune of 100-to-1 against, and they still voted for it. What more can individual citizens do when our leadership are a bunch of RINOs??

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:47 am 23. Jodspat:

Honest conservatives with real ideas are sorely missing in the current dialog over how to solve the economic crisis. This tripe doesn’t help.

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:59 am 24. Saltherring:

“Conservative Interest” @ 15:

Conservatives, and particularly Christians, donate many times what liberals do to private charities. In doing so, we choose to donate to causes that benefit those truly in need, rather than those who have chosen (and continue) a path to self-destruction. Conversley, liberals demand that government confiscate tax dollars from working people and redistribute such earned income to the liberals’ constituency of “victims”, the ones who lay one their collective, indolent a$$ and demand society take care of them.

It has been nearly 50 years since LBJ’s “Great Society” bankrupted future generations in a failed attempt to eradicate poverty. It is time to end government handouts and let families and private charities determine who is truly in need and who is merely lazy.

Nov 25, 2008 - 8:00 am 25. anton:

@15. Conservative Interests: And I suppose your “principles” consist of taking money from people who worked for it and giving it to those too lazy to get off their a$$ and earn it?

The failure of the Conservatives is that they have not coherently presented the values they hold and the obvious benefits of those principles. We have tried triangulating but the liberals are better at than we are. We need to stop playing their game.

Nov 25, 2008 - 8:30 am 26. jvon:

Sara: yes, it is a fact that Obama won the campaign because he out-raised McCain by a wide margin. It certainly isn’t because he was more qualified, as he will now demonstrate for four very long years. Very amusing website by the way.

Nov 25, 2008 - 8:30 am 27. The Historian:

AMERICA’S REAL ECONOMIC CHAOS
Those in charge, trying to fix this economy, don’t have a clue:

http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2008/11/americas-real-economic-chaos.html

Nov 25, 2008 - 8:30 am 28. geokstr:

Most of you have missed the main point of this post, that conservatism is failing because we only get charged up over certain issues, and then only in the short term.

The left is charged up about leftism ALL THE TIME, to the point of making their own life choices based on it. It’s because leftism is the RELIGION of secularists, and so they start with a zealotry we will never possess. Why don’t we have lots of conservatives in the schools of journalism and education, and in the halls of academe, so that we can influence the minds of people who will be voting 10-20-30 years from now? That’s the approach of the left.

Where are all the conservatives running for local and state office, to build a pool of strong candidates and influence the political direction of the smaller ponds first? Those positions pay poorly in most cases, so only those willing to sacrifice for their philosophy gravitate to them – leftists.

A major part of the problem is that conservatives go into non-governmental, non-media careers because they feel a need to be productive, or to enhance their own wealth, so they start a business or join a corporation. They are not willing to enter the political fray until after they’ve already made it in the world, when it’s way too late.

Personally, I think leftism is inevitable. No matter who is in charge, pandering to the great mass of ignorant voters to get elected will ALWAYS rachet the system to the left. They even took away the allure of tax cuts, the only way conservatives really have to buy voters, by making the near majority free of tax liabilities in the first place.

The left is focused in a way that the right will never be. We just want to be left alone to pursue our own dreams. Their dream is to attain the power to control us, and they are very good at it.

Nov 25, 2008 - 8:49 am 29. Joe Bison:

As I see it-Grassroots Conservatives get actual
jobs that require actual effort. This leaves
them with less time for political effort.

Liberals tend to suck the public teat in some
way. This gives them more time on their hands.
Also the danger of government cuts to their
jobs is a very real incentive.

The active Conservatives tend to be rich or
super motivated. The average Joe has to earn
a living. The Joe may be active for a short
time only.

The Liberal will also bring more Liberals to
the public teat in one way or another. They
may not even have been Liberals but once
they rely on public money they become defacto
Liberals.

Look to Canada for the future. The public
service unions and members are the most radical
forces for government consumption and higher
taxes.

The middle class is always the danger to the
Liberals and their clients that include those
companies getting corporate welfare handouts.

Nov 25, 2008 - 8:57 am 30. Jack Okie:

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The only route to victory for conservatives is through the Republican party. Third party efforts only dilute our effect and confuse our message. One can be a purist in the arts or the kitchen, but it is fatal in politics. I believe there are four things necessary to prevail:

1. We MUST become active in our local party. I’m as guilty as anyone in this. No longer.

2. Hasten the death of Old Media. Their ability to filter and make stuff up greatly hurts our cause(DUH!).

3. Eliminate open primaries. In any other setting (church, clubs, associations) one has to be a member to participate in the governance.

4. Get real about politics. It is “the art of the possible”. Fight like hell for what you want, but sometimes you don’t get all of what you want; be happy if at least you are gaining. All the pettiness and prissiness on exhibit after this election accomplishes nothing but sow discord. And I’d bet most of it comes from the armchair quarterbacks Mr. Hawkins describes.

Nov 25, 2008 - 9:03 am 31. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Jack Okie
RE: Good Luck!

1. We MUST become active in our local party. I’m as guilty as anyone in this. No longer. — Jack Okie

I’m active in my local Republican Party.

I’m co-chair of my precinct. I established a more pro-active web-site for the party, but the party chair, who is literally in bed with the local newspaper—married to the publisher’s daughter—killed that.

Maybe you’ll have better luck re-energizing your local party. And I certainly hope so.

As for me, I’m hammering the county and state apparatchik for being utter failures, which contributed heavily to this last election result.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[In politics the middle way is none at all. -- John Adams]

Nov 25, 2008 - 9:30 am 32. upetrovska:

A much better clarion call for McCain would have been, not change, but “Stop the Insanity”. Criticize Bush for reaching across the aisle on all the wrong issues, particularly spending increases and growing the size of government. It was the worst possible compromise to make with the Democrats, and the one he would not make — that should have been his credo. Obama is not change, by that measure, he is more of the same — in fact **more** of the same takes on a new meaning. Just like Bush, Obama will grow the size of government to untold new heights.

He could have been railing against the growth of government as the cause of the economic hard times, and multiplied that theme electrically when the financial markets began to collapse.

McCain’s loss is sad, mainly in this respect. He was the first candidate in two generations credibly to stand against growing government, one who might have changed the course of out-of-control, unaccountable spending.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:02 am 33. Chuck Pelto:

TO: All
RE: Based on Past Experience

I’d say that the real problem with the Republican Party is that the apparatchik thereof have their priorities bass-ackward.

When I was a young captain serving in a Mech Infantry Division, we watched as the CINCFORSCOM relieved one of his water-walking colonels who was a brigade commander for cause.

The reason? He had HIS priorities bass-ackward.

It took all of about five minutes. The four-star walked into the colonel’s offices on a visit to one of his fair-haired children and saw a list of ‘priorities’ on the wall. He went over and examined it. And, after 5 seconds he took out his pen and crossed it out. Then, according to eye-witnesses, he turned to the flabbergasted colonel and said, “If your last priority was your first one, all the others would fall into their proper place automatically.” He then turned and walked out of the brigade headquarters building.

A couple of days later, the tank-heavy brigade of that Mech Infantry Division had a new commander.

The Republican Party apparatchik has the same problem today. And until we get NEW people at the at national, state and local levels, along with getting rid of the utter waste of time and money in the staff there, we’re just going to keep failing at (1) getting our message out and (2) having any real impact on political issues and government at all levels.

It’s really that simple.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[A lack of leadership is no substitute for inaction. -- sardonic US Army staff puke axiom]

P.S. With the last election, it looks like we of the Republican persuasion had both.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:17 am 34. Thinking Person:

One little tidbit that just occurred to me today….We need to start calling the current bailout of everything from banks to automakers (that’s coming and we all know it) the “Democratic Bailout” because 1)this mostly stems from Nancy Pelosi and her ilk and 2) in four years if it hasn’t been rightly labeled as “Democratic” then it will all be wrongly dumped in Bush’s lap. Just a thought but one that could be important in four years.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:18 am 35. BMoon:

As an ex-pat, my options are limited as to participating more in Rep. Party grassroots. However my brother has heroically put up with the assorted scoundrels, opportunists, and nutballs in his local chapter, in an attempt to filter them out before they are allowed to become a Ted Stevens or Tom DeLay. With a cynical Pravda-like news media, and an academia that the Societs would have been proud of, we have the odds stacked against us.

All that means is we have to play harder, smarter and better.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:23 am 36. elfman:

Damn Conservatives!

Lets blame them and then ignore them again next election. Let’s run another most liberal Republican ever nominated. What could go wrong…

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:25 am 37. Chuck Pelto:

TO: BMoon, et al.
RE: That….

All that means is we have to play harder, smarter and better. — BMoon

…ain’t likely to happen with the current line-up of people in the Party structure at national, MY state and MY county levels.

Seriously….

The distaff ran for the state legislature in 2006. It was appalling how little support, in the way of information necessary to argue the issues or get the ‘word’ out, was made available by the Party at the state and county level. The characters state sent did NOTHING to assist with effective analysis of the precincts. When we asked for information on the voting record of the Democrat incumbent….they didn’t give us squat.

If you’re going to fight a ‘war’—and politic campaigning IS a ‘war’—you need more than a smile, a hand-shake and someone saying, “Good luck.” You need to know what the opposition has done in the last several years. You need to know EXACTLY what they think, where they’ve been and what they’ve done and have the evidence to back up your claims.

As far as I can discern, this state and county have absolutely NOTHING to assist a would-be candidate in gathering intelligence, formulating plans and executing them in a ’smarter’ and/or ‘better’ manner.

We have all this technology at our fingertips and the old-goats running the system haven’t got a clue. Either that or much, much worse, as I suspect is the case at MY county level. After all, if your wife is a blood-relation to the local newspaper, would it be in the newspaper’s best business interest to have a competitive source of information going about gain-saying what they put out in their articles and editorials? And he’ll probably garner more money from his relationship with the newspaper than he ever could from his association with the county party.

We need to get rid of the current crop of party bosses and their supporting crony staffers and install a new more effective and efficient group. A group that is not rooted in the previous millennium.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Politics is not a game. It is an earnest business. -- Winston Churchill]

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:37 am 38. Richard:

Well, I did my part. But, I’ll have to say that there are “our” years and there are “their” years and this one was “their” year. More than that, it’s hard to follow “leaders” who insist that we are the problem and that they need to find better voters to replace us. But, not to worry. There is nothing like governing to turn any idea into a bad idea. We get to go on offense again and if we’re smart about it, we’ll be back.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:44 am 39. Tom H:

Republican Party has a problem because the choices of candidates (president, senate, HR) were poor choices. Should I give my money and effort to a candidate that I don’t believe is conservative (such as John McCain)? Basically, the republican party is telling conservatives, vote for us because we aren’t quite as bad as the democrats. Sorry folks, that is a poor reason to separate from my beliefs. Conservatism is a set of BELIEFS….the republican party is more interested in ‘appealing to more people’ (said numerous times at the republican governors meeting) than sticking with core beliefs. I will not select the lesser of 2 evils. The republican party needs to either immediately move back to it’s core or it will be marginalized for the next 30 yrs. Had the republicans, including McCain, voted against the bailout and at least tried to reign in this crazy downward spiral to socialism McCain might have won…instead he proved to be the same as democrats (as did many other republicans). As far as I’m concerned their appears no difference between the parties. Republicans may claim to stand for conservative values, but their actions in the white house and congress have shown different.
Until the republicans show that they ARE different I am ‘taking my ball’ and going to a 3rd party.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:45 am 40. Conservative Sins of Omission « The Right Knight:

[...] Jump to Comments Did folks on the Right not do enough to secure victory in 2008?  John Hawkins dishes out a little pragmatic reformist conservatism by informing us that (1) conservative [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:45 am 41. MarkD:

We elected the class of 1994 which swept the Dems from power. The good and honest ones left. The worst became part of the problem, to the point where Republican meant something between Dem lite and corrupt.

That is our fault? It’s our fault that the judges have twisted the plain words of the Constitution to the point where the founding fathers would not recognize this government? Perhaps you are suggesting we shoot the ones we don’t like? Having lived through the sixties, you’ll forgive me if I don’t advocate that. I’ve seen it before.

“A Republic, if you can keep it.” Well, I guess we can’t. The bill will be due, soon. About the time the boomers retire in force, and they open that drawer in DC where all the FICA surplus money is stored and find IOUs, this will look like the good old days.

What will they do? Confiscate our 401Ks and sell the stock? To whom? Once you’ve proven you are a thief, nobody will buy from you. Good luck kids, you’re going to need it.

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:47 am 42. Follow Me!:

Geokstr is right: conservatives want to be left alone and pesky leftists are always “out there,” but creeping statism is not inevitable, even if it overtook Rome and GB.

One: conservative intellectuals need to get out and preach to the masses, instead of isolating themselves behaind the walls of comfortable plushly furnished think tanks and magazines made to talk –to each other.

Like fat, successful priests in the middle ages, conservative intellectuals sat comfortably for 8 years, forgetting their purpose, growing only their waistlines, burping after the main course and talking to EACH OTHER about how great is was to be a conservative.

Few spoke to students. Few tried to connect to the Latino influx in California.

The City Journal is great: a shame it can’t put its product on 1 minute YouTube clips and advertise them in college newspapers. (Horrors! It might be seen as crass).

Meanwhile, as Geokstr notes, comitted liberals were out in force–like successful priests in Latin America versus their plump, co-opted, content, belching useless counterparts here.

Only Anne Coulter risks pies in the face and she’s mainly theatre, not substance. Her last book was pathetic. So great: people think Republican=Coulter. THAT is the best we can do?

Two: the deadwood republicans, holding on limpet like to their local party posts have done nothing to advance the cause. They oppose really smart people.

If it was up to them, Arnold would never have been nominated and we’ve have a democrat for governor (a real California spending democrat). They hinder development and the “Big Tent.” Like Chuck Pelto, they seem to inject religion and a tiresome moral superiority into everything down to ordering a hamburger.

Classic examples of people shouting “stop!” but never “follow me!”

Three: -Republicans ought to oppose increased student fees by over-paid college professors and administrators (who have better pensions than the rest of the world)–but noooooo, they’re out there opposing gay marriage and being judgmental on everyone else.

-Republicans ought to have been vociferously attacking Ted Stevens and Dennis (”The Meal”) Hastert but refrained, allowing those corrupt pigs at the public trough to tar the GOP with an image it will take years to wipe away. Never again!

-Republicans ought to be screaming about state employee pensions–but again are bogged down by the Pelto republicans that are so fixated by the idea of gays getting married that they cannot focus on anything else.

-Republicans ought to be looking for 15 good candidates now to run for offices nationwide. People with some ideas–something to be FOR instead of spending their life stubbornly and uselessly standing the wrong way on the escalator.

-Being FOR things does not mean spending: it can mean being FOR a balanced budget (and giving examples of the waste); being FOR lower student fees; FOR more park rangers at the expense of higher union health benefits; FOR a college tuition credit; FOR a deduction for some health care costs…FOR something!

Christ, half of the people in the GOP now couldn’t sell beer on a troop ship!

Sponsor a teen party, hire a great band (even if I couldn’t stand the lyrics), serve simple food, and hand out GOP pamplets on acne prevention with complimentary Proactive. Nice pamphlets not ones attacking the democrats. maybe celebrating free speech or providing a easy to read history of a free maret story–like the triumph of fedex. Or ford.

I’d sponsor an essay contest giving 20 prizes of $7,000 to the winners of ” The Superiority of Free Markets,” and offer all participants some anthology on the subject written for non-professors. You know how many people would read that anthology that otherwise would not?

And duh!!! Put 1 minute clips on YouTube.

It can be done!!! Find things to be FOR! Do not compromise with corrupt politicians! Stand up for the kids and the Future!

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:50 am 43. Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives:

[...] Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives Basically, the republican party is telling conservatives, vote for us because we aren’t quite as bad as the democrats. Sorry folks, that is a poor reason to separate from my beliefs. Conservatism is a set of BELIEFS….the republican … [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 11:04 am 44. Rich Barrett:

While there is much wisdom in the posts, one sad fact remains and that is all Republicans who come to Washington eventually morph into Democrats — spending whatever it takes to stay in offic, their public be darned. I have seen it time and time again, a big-talking conservative shows up here and two or three elections later he or she has changed into a Democrat. And like #28 said, the Democrats play hardball all the time. They are zealots and the GOP simply is not. They eat and breathe politics 24/7.

Nov 25, 2008 - 11:24 am 45. Presidential Race On Best Political Blogs » Blog Archive » Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives:

[...] Pajamas Media » A Wake-Up Call to Conservatives When I see a billion dollars spent on a presidential election, I know something has gone seriously amiss in this country. Count me out concerning the political donations. P.S. – I also admire people who home school; however my children … [...]

Nov 25, 2008 - 11:29 am 46. Steve P.:

“While there is much wisdom in the posts, one sad fact remains and that is all Republicans who come to Washington eventually morph into Democrats — spending whatever it takes to stay in offic, their public be darned. I have seen it time and time again, a big-talking conservative shows up here and two or three elections later he or she has changed into a Democrat. And like #28 said, the Democrats play hardball all the time. They are zealots and the GOP simply is not. They eat and breathe politics 24/7.”

What a cop out.

1. Republicans who come to Washington do not “eventually morph into Democrats”, they are simply exposed as the hypocritical, corrupt parasites that they always were. You just never noticed that they were spitting on family values, embezzling, using tax dollars to finance their lavish lifestyles, giving tax breaks to their cronies and cozying up to lobbyists because you were too busy being bamboozeld by all their BS about banning abortions and marginalizing gays. You got hoodwinked by your own team, and you still find a way to blame the Dems. Nice try.

2. Wait, the Dems are zealots and the GOP are not? Really?? What about Karl Rove? What about Steve Schmidt? What about Sean Hannity? What about El Rushbo? The Republicans have just as many hardball-playing zealots as the Democrats. Zealotry is not the issue here. The issue is that people are simply fed up with the Republican product and no longer trust its salespeople. You can be as zealous and as passionate as you want about a burning bag of feces, but good luck selling it to anyone.

Nov 25, 2008 - 11:51 am 47. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Swallow Me!
RE: Religion & Politics

Like Chuck Pelto, they seem to inject religion and a tiresome moral superiority into everything down to ordering a hamburger. — Follow Me!

In the first place, I’m hardly what any real christian would say had ‘moral superiority’. I’m a sinner. Just like everyone else. The difference betwixt you and me is that I recognize I’ve got a problem. You’re still in denial. It’s a lot like one alcoholic who recognizes the problem telling another, who doesn’t, they have a problem.

Your problem, vis-a-vis politics and christian-based morality, is that you’re still in denial. Not necessarily of religion, but that there is a connection between politics and religious belief. And the laws of a society that are passed according to the majority of said morality.

It ain’t about ‘hamburger’. It’s about what or who goes into the meat to make the hamburger. Ask any cannibal. Ask any Muslim or Hindu or out-of-favor cannibal.

RE: Follow Me?

Interesting nom des blogs.

What does it mean to you? I know what it means to me…..

Or tell me….

….when did you last stand in the hallowed halls of Building 4 at Benning School for Boys?

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[God is alive....and airborne-ranger qualified. -- Chaplain at the US Army Airborne School chapel]

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:03 pm 48. Sandy Salt:

Rich,
You hit it on the head. If you want people that are more concerned with America than getting re-elected than force term limits and see the change in Washington. It seems that everyone likes them for the President and most states already have them at the state level, so why not go all in and force them on the piggies in Washington. This goes for all branches including the courts. We need to have people that have to live with their decisions making decisions for us vice the bloated and the corrupt that live off of lobbyist money. The Republicans will not return to power until they have a true “come to Jesus” momment where they admit that they failed the public trust and allowed unheard of spending and corruption. They need to apologize and promise things like term limits (actual come through would be nice as well), lobbying reform (get all the lobbyist out and take their bribe money with them), a law requiring balanced budgets, a plan to pay off the national debt, the removal of earmarks, and small government.

Now for the flip side we will have to spend on somethings but if the people want them then they have to vote for them like universal health care and social security, if so then they have to pay for them with their tax dollars after putting it to a national vote. We need to make the budget transparent, so things see the light of day and the wrath of the tax payer. Defense can certainly be scaled back but understand the cost of not being everywhere all the time. NATO can pay its own way without us and so can the UN. The UN is a huge waste of money and should be strict humanitarian because anything else has proven to be a joke.

Sure things are going to be painful for some time to come, but they are nearly as bad as they have been in the past 1980-1982 or 1930’s. Stop listening to the media and it crisis making machine (oil crisis of this summer and finanicial crisis this fall), they need news and will force the public to force Washington into stupid decisions ($2 Trillion and counting).

First, we must put our own houses in order and get out of credit card debt and buy houses that we can afford. We need to be realistic about what we are buying and if we don’t have the money then we shouldn’t be buying on credit. The banks and mortgage crisis would never have happened if people bought houses they could reasonably afford plain and simple, but we are a greedy nation top to bottom, so stop with the over paid executives because they did what most of you would have done given the opportunity. Stop crying and start doing! Go out and feed the poor, cloth the naked, and care for the widows and orphans. You do that and this country will be great again.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:11 pm 49. Jarret:

Yea, that’s right, Liberal ideas never work, never mind that Conservatism has been the dominant force in the U.S. since 1977. Never mind that Reaganomics finally exploded into the speculative nightmare that it built up. Never mind that since 1980 Republicans have dominated the White House except for the Clinton years (and Clinton adopted a lot of Reagan’s shoddy policies). Never mind that the right had all three branches from 2002-2006, and even when they lost some seats in 2006 Democrats were still stifled by Republican filbustering. Never mind that senseless tax cuts combined with Bush never vetoing a SINGLE spending bill has left the U.S. $3 Trillion in debt. Never mind that conservative trickle down policies created a corporate and Wall Street oligarchy free to speculate away this country’s future. Never mind that the income gap has widend massively since Reagan’s voodoo policies. Oh, and Iraq? Gosh, all these failures must mean that Liberalism doesn’t work. Sure. Keep pushing the bankrupt ideology of bigotry and socialism for the rich that turned the Republican Party into a relgious and economic freak show. That’s the way to win future elections.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:16 pm 50. Chuck Pelto:

TO: All
RE: Jarret and Rememberance

….never mind that Conservatism has been the dominant force in the U.S. since 1977. — Jarret

Obviously Jarret mus have been asleep during the Carter and Clinton years.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Consciousness: that annoying time between naps.]

P.S. Apparently, with respect to Jarret, consciousness is also a period where one can be nettled by people who didn’t ’sleep’ through such times…..

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:26 pm 51. Lily:

Here’s an idea: How about if the party leadership stops shoving ‘moderate’ candidates down our throats. If we had better leadership to begin with, we would have to protest our own party to get them to do the right thing by way of the economy and regulation. How’s that?

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:30 pm 52. tatanka:

It was the media, and the right’s fear of the media, and the economy that lost the election. The fear of confronting the media caused Republicans to lose their way. Both congress and the executive branch failed to talk over the media to the American people. Whatever the subject Republicans fail to confront the media bias effectively. Take global warming as an example. Or the economy from 2002 to 2008.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:31 pm 53. Follow Me!:

Hey Chuck:

The family straining to pay for the underworked college professors’ pension when they don’t have one isn’t a group of “sinners.”

Neither are gays who grumble over high taxes, obey the laws and want to get married; or straights like me who are tired of biblical zombies emerging from slumber every 4 years to cast their votes for whoever has the best bromides and the least chance of success.

Neither are muslims who work hard, pay taxes and obey the laws. And BTW, neither are those great kids in the military.

The GOP must stand FOR something. Not molder in your kitchen while life passes it by. Not excluding everyone that fails its misguided litmus tests for overturning Roe and opposing gays.

I am sure you devote quality service to one or more organizations and commend you. (I am not going to enter into a “I volunteer[or am a victim] more than you” contest. Liberals hijack conversations that way). Exactly what you are doing).

You and John McCain are equally clueless about why this election went south and what needs to be done to assure that basic ideas–freedom, capitalism–thrive and aren’t pushed into the “Some People Think” sections of Middle School textbooks. The enemic GOP has lost its converts.

It stands for nothing except exclusion and opposition. Oh, and corruption. Instead of attacking Barney Franks’s meddling, it sold out to Wall Street trying to make a buck on government meddling.

It won’t make a comeback crabbing at everyone from a shrinking base of religious exclusionists.

Open your mind. Look forward not backward.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:36 pm 54. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Lily
RE: Heh

If we had better leadership to begin with — Lily

Maybe you should consider some of my recent posts here.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Politics are very much like war. We may even have to use poison gas at times. -- Winston Churchill]

P.S. Look upon it as de-lousing…..

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:36 pm 55. Saltherring:

Perhaps Republicans need to re-think how we nominate our presidential candidates. By the time my state (Washington) conducted its primary, John McCain already had enough delegates to claim the nomination. I personally believe McCain would not have survived an open convention. Dump the primary system, or we’ll end up with another “moderate” in 2012.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:45 pm 56. Anneke:

I agree 100% with Ann in #7. I was out there campaigning, calling, donating time and money for Romney (primaries) and McCain. I did not like McCain. I do not like McCain. I am just waiting for McCain to reach across the aisle in the next session and screw us all over. I would like to see an end to open primaries in which “independents” can vote a partisan ballot. 90% of the independents I know are ex-Democrats who always vote the party line when it really counts.

As for preferring the nanny state, most of my single and divorced 40-something female acquaintances supported Obama because they felt he’d keep them afloat. Most are driven by fear of a destitute old age. Most of them are know where the government gets all that money, but they don’t care… just so long as they get taken care of.

Nov 25, 2008 - 12:52 pm 57. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Swallow Me!
RE: Soooo….

…you never did serve your country as tens of thousands of other men have.

Figures….

RE: This Last Election

I know why it went ’south’. But you’re hardly an answer to the problem.

RE: Morals & Laws

Interesting that failed to respond to the primary thrust of your initial complaint and my answer to it.

Why is that?

Regards,

Chuck(le)

Nov 25, 2008 - 1:16 pm 58. Follow Me!:

Chuck:
“…you never did serve your country as tens of thousands of other men have.”

Would you be happier if John Kerry who served his country was talking? Would he then have your rapt attention and unquestioning deference? (Not out of logic but because he served his country?). No?

How about Wes Clark–he served his country too: would you credit him with the golden truth? Or even better: how about one of those gay military guys that the New York Times features every so often–like the one that was a top pilot until ousted several years ago. Would he get your attention?

Please switch off that worn out “resistance to logic” button. Your admirable religious views are not an acceptable filter for facts nor a substitute for representing the needs of 300 million plus people.

Religious insularity has done more harm to the GOP than just about anything except Ted Stevens’spending habits.

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:07 pm 59. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Swallow Me!
RE: Kerry

RE: Clark

How about Wes Clark–he served his country too… — Follow Me!

I knew Clark, when he was a mere tank battalion commander in my brigade, where I was an infantry company commander. He was an overbearing megalomaniac with delusions of godhood THEN. And he didn’t improve with age, based on what we witnessed during the Clinton administration and afterwards.

He’s as much a dork as you’re coming across as.

So….

….you still haven’t answered my questions about (1) where you came up with that nom des blogs and (2) why it is you don’t have the synapses to recognize that all law is based on morals.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Hatred is the cowards revenge for being intimidated....by logic.]

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:18 pm 60. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Swallow Me!
RE: Kerry

Sorry I failed to drop the response into the previous post. I was distracted by someone coming into the office.

Would you be happier if John Kerry who served his country was talking? — Follow Me!

Kerry is a very disappointing person. And only people from Massachusetts would elect him to high office.

RE: Service Time

Thanks for answering me—by not answering me—regarding your military service.

And, I suggest you find another nom des blogs. Otherwise, some guy who actually DID go through Infantry Hall could well clean your clock if you tell them you go by the motto of the US Army Infantry.

Fair warning, buckie…..

Regards,

Chuck(le)
P.S. As I said earlier, most intelligent soldiers wouldn’t follow YOU into a whore house…..

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:22 pm 61. Pat J:

Gotta agree with the author here. Conservatives failed to notice which way the Republican Party was going and did nothing. Sometimes America does get the President it deserves. Sometimes not.

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:22 pm 62. KansasGirl:

Mr. Hawkins, you just took me to the woodshed. I deserved it.

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:34 pm 63. Follow Me!:

Chuck:

But Chuck! Kerry and Clark served in the military! Wasn’t that your “test” of whether someone was worthy of attention? Now you pretend it doesen’t matter? I’m shocked? Are you having synaptic overload?

Army guys are not so unbalanced as you suspect and not one in 10,000 would object to use of the term “Follow Me” (I hope that no firefighter telling people to leave a building yells loud enough for you to hear him! “Shhhh. Someone named Chuck think’s he owns the phrase!”)

Reality check: Real fighting guys don’t cotton to the mess room gung ho you embrace. LRRP’s, SEALS etc don’t have time for false bravado. Neither do the type of smart amateurs that ignored the battleship dinosaurs, broke Magic and Ultra, invented radar, or inisted on nuclear propulsion over the bitter oppositon of the professional navy men.

Kindly suggest that you read the article under which you are posting–or perhaps have it read for you. You are not thinking. You are lashng out (and growing ever more angry as you can’t hold a thought) You and others like you are a big part of the problem identified in this article. You exclude without the slightest basis for doing so. In so doing you cripple the country you want to help. Open your mind.

Nov 25, 2008 - 2:58 pm 64. The Whale:

Obama bought off the Reagan democrats with promises of tax reform. Obama lied to the left about what he was going to do. Which was get the right and have kangaroo trials. Who do you think is going to be more ticked at him.. HMMM. Oh yeah the nut bag left. If you were awake on election night, then you saw what i saw. The problem is nobody who runs the Republican party noticed. You know why I don’t vote for dems? Because no matter how centerist they are, all their help is looney tune leftys. Which is what you are going to get now. Wake Up RNC, act like you have a pair. You need to hammer and tong these guys starting on january 20Th 2009 and ending on january 20th 2013. When they get booted out of office. Err how we gonna do that dohhhhhhh. New Ideas for us, Bash them everytime they want to go back to 1932. If you don’t, we will be the united states of socialist wankers till 2017……

Nov 25, 2008 - 3:05 pm 65. Spindok:

Wake up call to Conservatives here.

You cant win elections anymore on your own.

The Republican party is not yours anymore.

Now lets talk.

Spindok

Nov 25, 2008 - 3:08 pm 66. Herb:

“There are liberals who go to college, get a journalism degree, and work their way up through the ranks for years — somewhere like the New York Times — all so that they can be in a position to effect change (in their case, slant stories in order to help causes and candidates they care about).”

Are you gonna name names or am I just going to take your generalization of the liberal boogeyman for granted?

This part was just downright ridiculous: “Or a liberal will go to college and become a teacher primarily so that he can effect change — and be in a position to feed their point of view to young minds, who will then vote for his side down the road.”

Riiiiight, because in the modern world teachers really are that influential.

Also “Free Mumia?” I haven’t seen a “Free Mumia” sign since 99!

So while I agree that conservatives screwed it up by not being very conservative, I think you should also start looking at the straw men you’re arguing against.

You got beat by REAL political opponents, but you keep fighting against cartoon caricatures.

Free Mumia….sheesh.

Nov 25, 2008 - 3:13 pm 67. Tom Grey:

First, because the Dems kicked the pro-life folk out already, the Republican Party will be, increasingly, the pro-life Party; but most Reps are two of the following three:
pro-life,
pro-market (small gov’t),
pro-victory / US Patriotism (better to kill terrorists in the Mid East than by using US buildings).

Any two of three and one should be a Republican, but often just Pro-Life is enough.

The Bush-Democrat economy (Dems won Congress in 2006) was blamed by Obama on the Free Market — but McCain and the Reps failed to place the blame more correctly on Fannie Mae and bad gov’t policies.

Nov 25, 2008 - 3:33 pm 68. el polacko:

there’s nothing conservative about stirring up hatred and prejudices. ‘heather has two mommies’ is not where we should be placing our emphasis. stick to fiscal issues, national security, and getting the government OUT of our lives (and bedrooms) and we’ll have a shot at making a comeback. otherwise, the GOP will head the way of the dinosaurs.

Nov 25, 2008 - 4:40 pm 69. Dave D:

I don’t think conservatives were suffering from being underfunded, and that increasing money spent or time volunteered would have changed things. Like it or not, it’s the leadership that attracts people, and the divided primary gave us a leader that simply didn’t have much to offer.

Huckabee siphoned off the social conservatives, and then puffed mccain, ending romney’s chance. Thompson and Giuliani didn’t even make a game of it.

Nov 25, 2008 - 4:44 pm 70. SeanLA:

the Democrats are an organized group, they work together for a unified end. One Democrat in one state will help another Democrat in different state, one may be a representative and another a congressman or a Mayor or whatever it is as long as they are in the party, the Democratic party. They mobilize.

Republicans are an elusive bunch of bickering voices going round and round. Conservatives, Libertarians and who knows what else, there is no unifying strategizing or togetherness.

Just look at the last election and see story after story of the RNC pulling out of this or that arena where their people are under attack, while Democrats along with the DNC stormed and swarmed any state where their people were under attack.

result: the guy who called his own constituants racist won and other almost shocking instances where the organized Dems stomped the bickering infighting pubs.

On this site and others Palin was under attack by her own damn people!!!! WHERE did you see Dems swiping at Biden?

final thought: Republicans (if you can even call that a party) are an every man for himself bunch. The Democratic Party is together.

Nov 25, 2008 - 4:47 pm 71. FORGET REAGAN!!!:

Reagan is remembered because he was one of a kind.

He didn’t copy anyone, he wasn’t phony and he wasn’t trying to be the next *insert Great Republican here*. There will never be another Reagan, period.

Let the man rest in peace. Good grief, he’s been out of office for TWENTY YEARS! He was elected 28 years ago. No voter under 42 could have EVER voted for him and most under 50 probably didn’t even participate in the 80 or 84 elections.

And Reagan wasn’t recognized as a great President until well after he left office so forget these phonies trying to act “great”. Pay attention to the real leaders who do the boring, hard, thankless work of party building or you’ll never know the next potential saviour when you see them.

Nov 25, 2008 - 5:11 pm 72. thegr8_1:

We have one last chance Saxby Chambliss in Georgia on Dec 2. If he loses we are screwed. The Democraps will be able to pass anything without Saxby Chambliss. Please go to Saxby.org or Goptrust and donate. If you stayed home instead of voting for McCain here is a chance for you to redeem yourself.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:21 pm 73. TomJW:

It was the RINOs and country club repubs who keep the primaries open to independants and dems who threw the election. Dems couldn’t help but win this election with a man leading ticket.

But yeah, John. Let’s blame it on conservatives who didn’t throw away their principles and vote for McCain. It will make it so much easier to repair the repub party that way.

Nov 25, 2008 - 6:23 pm 74. G Alston:

#71 SeanLA — “The Democratic Party is together.”

Incorrect. The differences between factions are less. Mainstream dems may not buy into far left green global warming hysteria but allowing it isn’t a showstopper, either. Dems as a rule don’t care if other dems don’t drive a hybrid or shop at Whole Foods. Greens might, but… so?

In comparison mainstream reps (80% of the party) are hamstrung with “social conservatives” who presume they can dictate just how republican one really is based on meaningless nonsense: if you don’t support abortion bans, you’re an amoral RINO. You’re not a real republican. The factional differences are greater.

The far right social conservative types have seemingly never heard of Tragedy of the Commons. As a result, the republican party will continue to slide into obscurity; the party bosses seem to think that the bible thumpers, due to them being vocal, are their “base.” They will discount the moderates because they don’t understand that moderates are straight up republicans sans fundamentalist mindset (they don’t see gay marriage abortion as mega-important hot button issues that are over and above any/all other concerns.) As such they’ll misread and overreact to this election (citing CA’s prop 8 as their poster example) and nominate a Huckabee or Jindal, which will excite the social conservatives to no end and of course lose the next election cycle even more spectactularly.

There’s no republican reps in the northeast, and few in the west. If the party nominates a bible thumping Huckabee or fundamentalist Jindal type, there won’t be enough left anywhere to matter. The party will crater.

How did the biblical crowd get so vocal? Easy. Mainstream media cheers for the left. The easy and simple way to make their opponents look abjectly idiotic is to feature the silliest ones on TV and refer to them as “typical.” The bible crowd saw themselves on TV and reckoned they must be the average republican. They bought the lie. So did everyone else. The average dem figures the average rep is a moron who is anti-scientific and has problems with evolution. Go to sites outside this echo chamber and — dare I say this out loud? — actually LISTEN to what they have to say. Their prejudices may be exactly that, prejudices, but they are REAL, and to those who hold them, they are facts. And they are facts to the *majority* of voters. That’s right. The MAJORITY.

The only way mainstream republicans can divorce themselves from that image is to divorce themselves from the social conservative crowd. And as you can read on this site, this is not likely. Too many people bought the same lie and it’s now a cultural truth. Orwell would be so proud.

Nov 25, 2008 - 7:48 pm 75. The Historian:

EDUCATORS NIGHTMARE: THE REAL THANKSGIVING STORY
This is what teachers don’t want our kids to know about the Thanksgiving holiday:

http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2008/11/educators-nightmare-real-thanksgiving.html

Nov 25, 2008 - 9:50 pm 76. cedarford:

Follow Me! has some great suggestions. As retiring VA Rep Tom Davis has said, Republicans have done a lousy job marketing themselves and on top of that, have damaged their brand name. “If Republican was a brand of dog food, it would be pulled off the shelves”, Davis said 4 months before the Election.

1. Yes, Republicans have retreated to only send their message to one another, talking in Code, where Hayek! Burke! Madison! scrawls are thrust as the true path and arguing which 30 year old Reagan slogan or part of Reaganomics they love the most.
We tell the masses they should read Hayek and Buckley. Liberals tell the masses they should skip reading Allard K Lowenstein and Keynes and the Collected Works of Adlai Stevenson and just watch liberal activists, community organizers, and their own local do-gooder associations in action, join, and vote the way they do. Then if the few amongst the many they have turned liberal Democrat want to become lifestyle liberal intellectuals – THEN pick up the fat tomes of Federalist Papers, Marxian theory, Alinsky’s works…

2. Republicans have deliberately erected barriers to entry. You have a well-off woman who believes in 80% of what Republicans do, but is pro-choice. You have a young Vet with a new family now out of the Service that cannot afford health insurance and thinks it should be affordable. You have a conservative hispanic family that wants to unionize because they are being exploited bad in the service industry.

Republicans tell the woman she is morally deficient. And worse, a RINO who needs to look to God to straighten her out.
Republicans tell the Vet he is a damn socialist for wanting something done about health care affordability. Or told to work harder, get educated and finally apply himself – so he can find a job as a young man that will cover the health needs of he, his wife and two kids.
They tell the Hispanic that unions are horrible, disgusting things and the Patron(owner) knows what is best, and possibly one day the Hispanic himself might become an owner and wish he too could exploit the workforce.

And if the woman and the Hispanic and the Vet don’t like that Republican dogma, they can just pack their asses off to the Democrats and vote there. Since Democrats accept “conservative deviants” from true Republicanism that doesn’t want them and their flaws polluting the party.

Ooops, they did pack their asses off!

3. More tax cuts that only appeal to 20% of the population? Still doing it despite little electoral gain in the last 2 elections as Reaganism has played that ploy to death.

4. The Republican message to young people is either read huge thick books on why you should be a conservative, or be a soldier then we will hero-worship you until you get out and become a nobody again, or be a nobody. The Dem message to young people is “Get Involved in Our Organizations” and make a difference. As Follow Me! said, would it really hurt to have Republicans put some attention on the young and give them issues they could sink their teeth into – like ridiculously high college costs Republicans will try to reduce?

5. Americans interested in the world hear Democrats talk about the world. They hear Republicans talk about how much they hate “doomed” Europe, dislike wussy Canada, hate “Islamofascist” nations, hate Russia, and most of Asia. And who ignore Latin America and Africa except when discussing an “easy surgical strike”. The only country Republicans talk positively about, and talk about all the time, is their “Special Friend” Israel and how our “best ally” needs our love, protection, and fulfillment of the prophecies of the Base’s “biblical zombies”. (which is cute, since Jews and Israelis generally dislike Republicans and voted for Obama 70-30 in polls and in the Election.)
For every time a conservative Republican is tempted to declare the centrality of Israel to being a good Republican, they should speak well of Latin America instead if they wish to come back as a minority Party.

6. Besides hispanics, somehow devotion to Israel also shortchanges Asian immigrants, natural Republicans, in national Republican leader speeches.
How much do our 5 million Filipino, 2 million Vietnamese, 3 million Chinese and Japanese, and 800K Korean ethnics and the welfare of their motherlands come up compared to the time Republicans devote to Jewish and Israel interests?
(It would be like the Democrats putting their concern for a free Cuba and the Cuba exiles in every other speech they make when Cubans go 70-30 Republican all the time)

7. All too frequently, Republicans of The Base react to environmental concerns most Americans have by rejecting the whole basis of the environmental issue to one of “freedom to reject” any environmental idea or concern as nutty. It comes out the the public perception of Republicans as a big “F*ck You!” – global warming is a crock, God will ensure we have unlimited oil, smog isn’t so bad, what’s wrong with species extermination if it interferes with profits or property owner rights??

8. Republicans of the Religious Right have settled into Faith-based Science on GW, age of the Earth, evolution, zygotes=human, acorn=oak tree. It is the wrong message, since far more techies and engineers (except the younger gen) are still Republican…but instead of selling our knowledge on matters like how wind and solar will be trivial contributors to America’s energy needs for 50 years – we get the public believing the typical Republican believes that dinosaurs lived with early humans after the world was created 6,000 years ago. Which helps kill credibility when a Republican says GW might be true, but not necessarily AGW..because part of the public is half-expecting to hear from the same Republican spokesman how men astride brontosaurus lived in a much warmer, better, innocent baby-killer, free, Earth..

9. If you have any doubts that the message “Free Markets! Free Trade! are best. You should be happy your jobs are being outsourced and almost all jobs are in danger. That China is gutting American industry, India high tech service sector jobs.. and that is great news because it will force lazy Americans to better themselves and possibly get another even more exciting high tech job!” Republicans have put out for 30 years is now obsolete – Look to the slow collapse of Republicans after 1998 – and return of Reagan Democrats to the party that seems to care more about their stagnant middle class incomes, the pervasive fear that most jobs and careers are now at risk from the lowest global bidder for labor..

Nov 25, 2008 - 10:03 pm 77. seeingright:

Personally I think this article is pretty damn cynical. Sure we got out butts kicked in the last election. Sure 18% (or whatever) of the registered Republican voters didn’t show up. Sure McCain was the most ineffective spokesman for the Conservative movement because he is just a stinking moderate. Sure, sure.. Okay you win. The Republicans suck and we lost. Well I do everything I can to tell people that Liberalism is a disease. What goes around comes around. We are still a majority of Conservative people in this Country.. if we recruit Conservatives to run for office and we get Conservative leadership in the right places we will win again.

Be patient.. let the Obama Nation really screw up — and they will.

The Conservative train will travel again. It always does!

Cheers,
Bob

Nov 26, 2008 - 2:14 am 78. GDT:

I think it helps to define conservatism. It is not a complicated set of social values. True conservatism is a simple statement of quantity as it relates to the amount of government. Conservatives believe in a conservative “amount” of government. Conservatives believe in constitutional governmental limits clearly articulated in the 10th amendment. Conservatives believe that identifying a problem does not automatically make the case for a government solution. Conservatives believe the old Regan adage that government is the problem far more often than it is the answer.
Liberals, on the other hand, believe in a liberal amount of government. Liberals believe that identifying a problem automatically makes the case for a government answer.
Absolutely every time this distinction is clearly made – conservatism wins. Absolutely every time RINO Republicans abandon conservatism and try to out-liberal the democrats, they loose. They do not loose because the far left wins over the sorta-left. They loose because conservatives vote “none of the above”.

Nov 26, 2008 - 4:38 am 79. Die Fledermaus:

The Left is scared ****less by Palin because they – unlike many Republicans – recognize that she has the potential to be another Reagan. She’s authentic. What she says resonates among common people. Her conservatism is shared by most Americans, and it’s exactly the same conservatism that was behind Reagan’s success. It’s not extreme, dismissive, or exclusionary. It’s mainline American. This is also why elitists can neither understand nor abide her. Whether this facility to connect with people was cultivated over time or came naturally, both Reagan and Palin displayed it. Both Reagan and Palin were also wise enough to understand that a president doesn’t need to know everything there is to know. The last human who was able to do that died in the 1700s. A president only has to have a few things, in the final analysis: competent advisors, a cogent philosophy by which problems are identified, the perception to recognize when action is required, the resolve to act, and the ability to take the heat afterward. Palin’s public record demonstrates she has more of what’s necessary than almost all of her contemporaries. Huckabee’s record as governor of Arkansas, for example, was not what I’d call conservative by any reasonable application of the term. Neither was Romney’s, Giuliani’s, or McCain’s. Conservatives didn’t have a dog in this hunt. Their choice was between a socialist/commie and a man whose one firm principle is that he, personally, is indispensable to American politics, with everything else being negotiable. Without Palin on his ticket, he’d have lost by double-digits, and he knows it. It’s a testament to Palin’s political appeal that conservatives turned out in the numbers they did to vote for a milquetoast politician like McCain. Come January we’re all gonna have front-row seats as the worst possible electoral outcome assumes the levers of American power, in the worst economic circumstances of the last 60 years. It will be spectacular – a slow-motion train wreck that will captivate its audience for several years.

Conservatives’ inertia, however, didn’t bring us here. Long-term insanity did. Insanity like the 16th Amendment, the Federal Insurance Contributions Act, payroll withholding, the New Deal, the Great Society, the War on Poverty, judicial excesses of Title 7 of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, Supplemental Social Security, Medicare, GSEs, etc… Conservatives were the only ones who uniformly resisted the political tides that brought us here. That they failed is obvious; our circumstances had they not resisted are not obvious. They’re the only reason we’re not already living in the U.S.S.A., and they’ll be the ones who pick up the pieces after the next four years and undertake to repair the damage. Blaming conservatives for our current straits is not only inaccurate, it’s absurd.

Steve. P: Well said.

Nov 26, 2008 - 5:42 am 80. Blogs For Victory » Who Is at Fault for Conservative Defeat?:

[...] my contention that when you are beaten in a political fight, you usually deserve it. John Hawkins notes: Edmund Burke once said, “All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do [...]

Nov 26, 2008 - 5:47 am 81. Sonia:

Liberal policies ended slavery, segregation, and religious discrimination. Liberal policies got all adult males and females the vote. Since the 1800s the “Liberal” ideology of John S. Mill has stood for very conservative amount of government interference in our bedrooms, families, libraries, schools, and associations (marriage). Modern conservatives are angry reactionaries who want to impose their own values on every aspect of the public and private life of citizens through government legislation.

Nov 26, 2008 - 5:56 am 82. Chuck Pelto:

TO: All
RE: Swallow Me!’s Test

But Chuck! Kerry and Clark served in the military! Wasn’t that your “test” of whether someone was worthy of attention — Follow Me!

This character really IS ‘dense’. And he/she/it cannot recall that Benedict Arnold served in the US military as well.

But the Swallow Me! is attempting to divert the issue of whether or not he/she/it served in the military. After all, their nom des blogs is the motto of the US Army Infantry School.

At this point, barring any useful information that might prove he actually DID walk the hallowed halls of High School on the Chattahoochi, he/she/it is nothing more nor anything less than a consummate liar and worthing of nothing but distain.

So be it…..

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Prevaricator, n., Liar in the larval stage of development.]

Nov 26, 2008 - 7:05 am 83. Die Fledermaus:

Sonia: Reading your post I had to wonder if you were out of your mind or just a troll. If you’re not an idiot, you’re doing a hell of an impersonation.

Lincoln was a Republican. The Democrats repeatedly voted against civil rights legislation, and it was, in fact, Republicans who finally passed the 1964 act. The deep South was a Democrat stronghold for decades, and all the while was the source of continued organized resistance against all the movements you cite.

Try not to confuse Democrats with traditional liberals. While it’s true that most Democrats are liberals in the modern sense, they are most definitely NOT traditional liberals. The modern liberal differs little in any substantive way from your garden variety Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist. Jefferson is the exemplar of the traditional liberal. He advised unrelenting caution against empowering a central authority of any kind, and viewed all such efforts as threats to individual liberty. The individual’s sanctity was the central concern for the traditional liberal, and concessions to a need for centralization were made infrequently and grudgingly. Conservatives today are the ones espousing the principles of traditional liberals, not Democrats or the weasels that try not to be labeled “liberal” as it is construed today.

As for conservatives wanting to impose their values on others, conservatives are NOT the ones behind political correctness, hate crime laws, hate speech codes on college campuses (ostensible bastions of free expression), statutory preference for one race over another, statutory deference to one class of citizen toward another, institutionalized racism, legislation via judicial fiat, diffused responsibility as a legal principle, etc… Those are ALL modern liberal badges of honor. Modern liberals elevate the state above the individual without fail; it’s not who you are that matters, it’s the group or class to which you belong that determines your worth and entitlements. As far as the modern liberal is concerned problems are soluble only by government, not by individuals. Conservatives spend their time trying to prevent legislation that would, in fact, impose modern liberals’ values on everybody else. Conservatives are the ones trying to restrain government growth and intrusiveness.

You are flat wrong on all counts, and you need to look-up the definition of “projection.”

Nov 26, 2008 - 7:16 am 84. BMoon:

“Modern conservatives are angry reactionaries who want to impose…” (#82 Sonia)

It is precisely the illiberal imposition of an angry minority of Far Left utopian, intellectual elites and their corrosive amorality, and their wish to redefine our cultural values by imposing their twisted statist view – this is what today’s true Conservatives oppose. Classic liberalism was not built upon the vapid radical individualism – the pigsty that both the half-baked libertarian and the western Leftist roll about in – rather it was founded on the bedrock of certain shared immovable and non-negotiable values based on the Judeo-Christian view of morality and the fallen nature of man. True, there was a serious divergence in classic liberalism that as much defines our differences today as it did between the French and the American Revolutions – one based on the radical secular vision of Rousseau, and the other upon the assumption of Burkian Judeo-Christian morality and values. The results, then and now, are clear – one leads to self-immolation and genocide while the other leads to true liberty and justice. The differences are just as clear as when those repelled by Rousseau sat on the right side of the Assembly like Robespierre, and those fascinated with the possibilities of utopian reformations of society sat on the Left.

>B>”He is a very shallow critic who cannot see an eternal rebel in the heart of a conservative.” -Gilbert Keith Chesterton

Nov 26, 2008 - 7:27 am 85. Who Is at Fault for Conservative Defeat - Obama,Barack? | Barack Obama - Sharpy News:

[...] my contention that when you are beaten in a political fight, you usually deserve it. John Hawkins notes: Edmund Burke once said, “All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do [...]

Nov 26, 2008 - 8:03 am 86. Herb:

A few dissents:

To GDT: “Conservatives believe in a conservative “amount” of government. Conservatives believe in constitutional governmental limits clearly articulated in the 10th amendment. Conservatives believe that identifying a problem does not automatically make the case for a government solution.”

Not true. Conservatives have no problem with “big” government when it comes to defining marriage, regulating language and nudity on TV and radio, or pretty much anything to do with the military, which remains the largest and most expensive arm of our government. Remember Terri Schiavo? Was that “small government” conservativism in action? What about the invasion of Iraq? (Ask Ron Paul, a genuine small government guy, what he thinks about that one.) Sorry, but “small government conservatives” should be called “small government conservatives when its convenient.”

To Die Fledermaus:
“The Left is scared ****less by Palin because they – unlike many Republicans – recognize that she has the potential to be another Reagan.”

As an official representative of the Left, let me just say this. No one is scared of Sarah Palin. We laugh at her. Unintentionally or not, Sarah Palin is funnier than Adam Sandler, Ben Stiller, and Jim Carrey combined.

To Chuck:
Your reliance on the “he/she/it” mass pronoun was also funny. Maybe you could just drop the “it” next time. I know this may be hard to understand, but it’s unlikely an animal is typing comments on a blog. They don’t have opposable thumbs! If you were alluding to the possibly that the commenter may be a transexual…well, Chuck, they’re still going to be a “he” or a “she.” Confusing, I know, just like when you were in Thailand.

Die Fliedermaus again:
“The modern liberal differs little in any substantive way from your garden variety Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist. Jefferson is the exemplar of the traditional liberal.”

Put down the Jonah Goldberg book and pick up a book that’s taken seriously by rational people who don’t have an ax to grind. Do you even know what “your garden variety Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist” is? That you lumped “Stalinist” with “Nazi” kind of indicates that you don’t.

Who’s the Stalinist in the liberal movement and who’s the Nazi? Do you even know?

Think on it, and get back to me.

Nov 26, 2008 - 9:30 am 87. Chuck Pelto:

TO: Herb
RE: Well…

Maybe you could just drop the “it” next time. I know this may be hard to understand, but it’s unlikely an animal is typing comments on a blog. — Herb

…they might not be human. Might be a ‘bot’. Then again, it might be something else, much, much worse.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Test every spirit.]

Nov 26, 2008 - 10:27 am 88. Free In Idaho! » Blog Archive » It Is NOT My Fault:

[...] right now on the right side of the writeosphere.  But really John, do you seriously think “we” lost the election for the GOP?  In my most respectful voice, I’m here to tell you that you and everyone else with that [...]

Nov 26, 2008 - 10:58 am 89. Die Fledermaus:

Herb: Laugh it up. The Left laughed at Reagan precisely the same way – for eight years. You’re entitled to your opinion, and no conservative will try to stop your laughing. But just because conservatives won’t stop you, doesn’t mean you can laugh without due consideration. Just make sure your laughter doesn’t offend a liberal, or you could wind up in court. And make real sure you don’t offend a homosexual protestor, or you could wind up in the hospital. The Left’s vaunted tolerance, you see, does not bear even cursory testing. Conservatives, OTOH, rarely even try to shout others down, let alone throw pies, rocks, or lawyers at them. So feel free to laugh; just make sure you do it where it won’t be misconstrued.

A totalitarian is a totalitarian is a totalitarian. The names they give themselves don’t matter a rat’s ass. All of the august figures I mentioned elevated the state above the individual as a matter of propriety. If there’s any difference at all among their corresponding philosophies, it’s vanishingly small in practical terms: If your statements are not consistent with the State’s requirements of its citizens, then you’ll have to be re-educated; If your pursuits don’t serve the State’s purposes, then you need to be assigned pursuits that do; If your existence doesn’t serve the State, then your existence will be ended. And being that Stalinists, Nazis, and Maoists were Statists above all else, they were ALL Leftists; none was from the Right. And being that modern liberals are nothing if not Statists, they’re of a kind with those three and all the other megalomaniacal dipsh**s who’ve made life so interesting for so many millions of people in the last hundred years. You’re in good company.

So prepare yourself for what’s coming under the beneficent reign of The One. Re-read your Little Red Book and ponder the next Great Leap Forward. Or marinate yourself in Das Kapital and Lenin’s treatise on Marx’ shortcomings. Or celebrate Der Fuhrer’s legacy of making the trains run on time and ridding the world of useless eaters. Or post snippets of Cone’s black liberation theological wisdom where you can’t fail to see it and be reminded of your guilt and insignificance. But stay away from words you don’t comprehend, like “rational.”

Above all, don’t get back to me. I’ll be re-arranging my sock drawer.

Nov 26, 2008 - 11:05 am 90. G Alston:

#87 Herb — “Do you even know what “your garden variety Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist” is? That you lumped “Stalinist” with “Nazi” kind of indicates that you don’t.”

You’re not only wrong, but painfully so.

See this: http://www.baen.com/chapters/axes.htm

Essentially nazis and stalinists and the like are best described as “Statists.” Shared attributes. Sorry to rain on your parade. The only thing more stereotypical than a halfwitted social conservative is a know-it-all lefty who’s abjectly wrong and has no idea that this is so.

Nov 26, 2008 - 11:09 am 91. cedarford:

GDT – Absolutely every time this distinction is clearly made – conservatism wins. Absolutely every time RINO Republicans abandon conservatism and try to out-liberal the democrats, they loose.

Uh huh…funy how those DINO Democrats now sweeping into office in the New South, Out West, in the Midwest, and even in the Right Wing Goddess Palin’s own state of Alaska have “abandoned” hardcore liberal Dem politics -Yet win, and keep winning more – because the Democrat leadership is behind those DINOs 100% and aren’t engaged in a civil war with them like the Republican “purists” in the Southern evangelical Base are with any Republicans in the rest of the country.

******************
Die Fledermaus:
The Left is scared ****less by Palin because they – unlike many Republicans – recognize that she has the potential to be another Reagan. She’s authentic. What she says resonates among common people. Her conservatism is shared by most Americans,

Oh yeah, the Dems, Independents, and non-Fundie Republicans are scared S***less by the Goddess of the Fundie Base. This formidable woman with a journalism degree who can’t articulate her thoughts well as sentences become mangled disjointed paragraphs absent a TelePrompter replete with 30-year old red meat talking points and slogans for her to rattle off…She dunno much about history, trigonometry, biology, or current events….but she can gut a caribou and has a Down’s baby, so she’s authentic.
Reagan was tested and engaged in debate and negotiation and making a living as a communicator for 20 years before he got in higher office, then did 8 Years as the battle-tested governor of America’s greatest state. He started battling Communists and greedy Owners and trying to make Hollywood a closed shop with a great pension system. He lived on debate and compromise from his union days, as governor of Cali, and then working with a majority Dem Congress.
Republicans looking for another Reagan are as dumb as people in the Democratic Party that kept trying to resurrect “another” FDR or JFK with their ideas that worked well in another era frozen in amber for reuse..unchanged by shifting American attitudes, events, and analysis that showed some of FDR, JFK, and Reagan’s ideas were bad ones that failed to work well and only with time were the errors recognized…
The point is that there was only one FDR, only one JFK, only one Reagan, or only one Lincoln for that matter. Times move on. And even if there magically was another Reagan or FDR, they would be fish out of water, with ideas and beliefs that worked great in past days that would be absolutely inappropriate for today’s challenges and culture.

The Democrats repeatedly voted against civil rights legislation, and it was, in fact, Republicans who finally passed the 1964 act.

Incorrect. It was LBJ with the help of RINO Republicans outside the South that joined with most Democrats in opposing the Fundie Dixiecrats of the Deep South that passed Civil Rights and most other 60s landmarks like the 1st environmental protection measures.

Ironically, the same Fundie Dixiecrats then shifted Parties and became the similarly intolerant “Religious Right” Base of the Republican Party – big-spending Republicans in love with the military and in love with cultural war and theocracy who hate the RINOs as much as they did when they were the most devoted Dem voters in the Solid Democrat South. The same pork-loving kleptocrats they were as Yellow Dogs in the 30s, 40s, 50s, and 60s. No amount of Federal money was too much for Southern ag subsidies, flood control, money down a rathole levees and hurricane insurance so Ohioans could pay to have Southern land barons build subdivisions in areas regularly wrecked by hurricanes, relocating America’s military bases and shipyards to the South.

Nixon was warned. Reagan was, too. That the Southern Strategy was dangerous. Not only for the alienation of Republicans elsewhere with the new Fundie arrivals…but the threat of ending traditional Republican conservatism of minding one’s own business, religious freedom, fiscal responsibility, and small government. And the right-leaning Dem Fundies were thought by people like Goldwater to be a grave threat to Libertarian Republican values and Goldwater waged war with Falwell and the anti-gay, right to life zealots and creationists from the start.

But the votes were just too juicy a lure to ignore..

Now, as Rev. Wright and Ward Churchill like to say, in 2006 and 2008, da chickens done come home to roost for da Republicans.

And a cleanup in recapturing what Republicans stood for from Lincoln’s day up to the late 1980s is in order.

Conservatives spend their time trying to prevent legislation that would, in fact, impose modern liberals’ values on everybody else. Conservatives are the ones trying to restrain government growth and intrusiveness.

No, both the extreme Left-Wingers and Right-Wingers seek to use the Fed Gov’t to intrude and impose their values on everybody else. That the liberals seek to indoctrinate kids and bypass democracy through lawyers makes them just a little bit more obnoxious and dangerous.

But the Religious Right Fundies and new cancers like the Neocons and Club for Growth have plenty to be blamed for in intruding on others..
1. The Terri Schiavo Fiasco and other spots of meddling in family decisions.
2. The distressing new Religious Right tendency to call Mormons, Catholics, atheists, and hispanic Catholics and Pentacostalists anything from heretics to RINOS and unfit to be President.
3. The Neocon belief that it is America’s job to intrude and impose our values on other nations.
4. The eagerness with which certain Republicans are destroying American jobs in the name of “Free Trade! Free Markets!” to impose their globalist New World Economic Order on American workers, to reward a small number of Elites. Widening income gaps, entire career fields destroyed. Traditional Republicans believed in the idea of towns where numerous factories competed for workers, who could quickly learn simple skills and simple tasks and advance or simply move to a different factory if they were not treated well, and easily start all over.

Those days are gone. These days, Reublicans have to recognize that you do not wipe out 20 years of education and experience in sending a job to China and expect the worker to do as well or better in a new job on their own. Years of retraining may be necessary, and above a variable age, it isn’t worth it.
A tour of gutted Northern and Midwest towns and masses of structurally unemployed workers, or workers struggling on 30-60% of what they used to make, everywhere, confirms this.
When Germany took over E Germany, they found it wasn’t worth retraining skilled or semi-skilled E Germans over the age of 40 in most industrial, gov’t, or service sector jobs. So they pensioned them out.

********************

Nov 26, 2008 - 12:01 pm 92. Herb:

Congrats to all who recognized that there’s no distinction between the Stalinists and the Nazis because they were both Statists. Let think of all the other, ahem, “shared attributes” between Stalin and Hitler. Let’s see, they’re both white and they’re both men. They both had mustaches. Hmmm…What else? They both fought each other in a bloody, existential war that engulfed the entire world. (At least in that one, Stalin was on our side.)

And now let’s list all the ways in which they were different… Wait, how much time you got?

Painfully wrong? Sorry, dude. You can’t elevate the similarities and ignore the (massive) differences and have me take you seriously. Save the remedial thinking and questionable grasp of history for the next GOP convention.

I’m still waiting for someone to tell me who’s the Stalin and who’s the Hitler in the American Left. It can’t be Obama. He’s black and he doesn’t even have a mustache!

(Oh, and Nazism…was a right-wing ideology. First comes denial, then anger and bargaining. Eventually depression will set in, and finally….acceptance. So it goes.)

Nov 26, 2008 - 12:09 pm 93. Follow Me!:

I bet 60% or more of the people here could agree on similar stuff.

-Reconsidering the “guild laws” in most states preventing good people from becoming teachers without a useless “education” credential. That blocks great potential history, english and math teachers. Our high schools are clogged with “educators” with little enthusiasm for what they teach, not real teachers.

–publishing transparent state and federal budgets on line–real ones not capsules or pro formas–per agency (OK not the CIA or NSA).

So we can see what top administrators are paid what, for what, the average number of paid leave days, sick days per departments, administrators to teachers…

How many people are employed as in Los Angeles, to address invitations in nice script when trauma centers are being closed); what relatives are on state, federal or city payrolls…who has a chauffer driven car…

–pardon or expunge conviction records for non violent one-time drug offenders who served time without incident, have kept clean for 10 years; great incentive; great reward.

–tax assistance for cities to enable them to restore bookmobiles, library hours and reading room not infested by homeless derelicts so kids can read more and AIM less;

–a tax deduction for individual’s legal fees–which are not now deductible for individuals except in linmited circumstances–when someone is sued by a non relative in a real lawsuit. Corporations can do this; why not people?

–refuse to allow corporations beneficially or genuinely owned by US citizens that move or site off shore and don’t pay US taxes from obtaining government contracts; they don;t want to be here, fine: no government contracts.

–cut our contribution to the UN to a maximum of $800 million anually and divert those funds to trauma centers in large cities impacted by uncontrolled immigration;

–teach US history and english in non-traditional (means non-boring, non school environment) summer programs for kids, esp non english speaking kids, so they are off the streets, in a class, learning common things, preparing for college, so when they vote 20 years from now, they cherish the country they’re in.

Parents will sign up n droves (a free place for the kids and they’re learnng something). Bus ‘em up to a mountain camp where they can swim, shoot arrows and sing. Just get them away from a TV and a PC for 4 weeks.

Nov 26, 2008 - 12:13 pm 94. '08ama:

OMG, 4 (8?) more years of self-loathing from the right…

It’s OVER folks, you lost, get over it and Move On. You’ll feel much better and your friends and family will notice.

Dont torture yourselves, eventho Bush has made it legal. If you love democracy, then accept Obama as the democratically elected winner and support him. ‘Conservatism in Exile’ will only lead to 4 (or years of depression, which will in turn reduce your life expectancy.

FREE yourselves !

good luck.

Nov 26, 2008 - 12:18 pm 95. ReConUSMC:

In Truth I as a devout Conservative hated the fact that McCain was the man that was suppose to represent ”Conservatives ” since we are the Main part of the REPUBLICAN voting block ! Hell McCain BELIEVES IN GLOBAL WARMING , against Drilling for Oil , New Coal and for Carbon Credits …… then he voted for the Bail out and then the 150 Billion dollar pork barrel deal as well ……. after Campaigning to STOP PORK BARREL SPENDING !
PLUS HE LOOKED AND ACTED VERY OLD AS WAS A WORSE DEBATOR THAN GEORGE BUSH 41 .
He ACTED like a Sissy never challenging Obama’s past in the 3 debates driving me and my friends crazy .
In the Future when should not have RePUBLICAN contest Not start in Liberal States like Iowa or New Hampshire but in Conservative states like Texas , Okla and Ga .
The media got McCain on our Ticket to guarantee we lose or Obama won !
One day after the Media got him chosen they ran articles in the NYTimes with him having and affair he never had .
The good news if there is any ……….If Mc Cain had won he would have ended the Conservative Movement and Republicans would be known as ”CENTRIST LOSERS ” in the Future .

Nov 26, 2008 - 12:50 pm 96. Die Fledermaus:

Herb: <<>>

cedarford: So, in sum, you said, to settle all the issues in this thread once and for all,

“Baaaah-aaaah-aaaah-aaaah.”

Well done.

Just to avoid embarrassment in the future, “conservative” is not synonymous with “Republican,” which is not synonymous with “religious right, ” which is not synonymous with “neocon.” The case has been made, however, that “PC-Gestapo,” “goose-stepping morons,” “Intolerance Police,” “Safety & Environmental Nazis,” and “Ministers of Truth” are terms synonymous with “the Religious Left.”

Most conservatives migrated from the old Democratic party to the Republican party when the new Democrat party adopted anti-American radicalism as its central plank. It has since become a collection of squabbling extremist groups, squandered the nation’s lifeblood in hare-brained social engineering programs (or by simply giving it to its cronies), and steadfastly pursued its goal of reducing the country to a third-world basket case, where everyone is equal – except for The Anointed who will have brought it all about, and who are, obviously, Much More Equal than others. But credit where credit is due. The Republican party deservedly got its ass handed to it, twice, when it abandoned the conservative ideals that gained it the congress in ‘94, and began mimicking the defining stupidity of the Democrats. After all, why cast a vote for a Republican acting like a Democrat when you can just vote for the Real Thing?

So the sugar-plum fairies have won. You have all for which you hoped, and more. Congrats. Four years from now, having foreseen what’s plainly coming down the pike, those on my side will still be standing. We shall see, collectively, about yours. No rush, though. Enjoy the ride. Savor the experience. And, as you do, bear in mind that all that befalls you will have been done at your own hand.

Now, genuflect slowly and repeat as necessary, “The One is our Salvation. The One is our Hope. The One will bring the Change we need. The One is all-wise. We live to serve The One.” There you go. That’s the ticket.

Nov 26, 2008 - 1:51 pm 97. G Alston:

#93 Herb — “Congrats to all who recognized that there’s no distinction between the Stalinists and the Nazis because they were both Statists.”

How they got there (statism) isn’t the issue, and nobody’s arguing this. The fact is that statism is what was shared, and the only distinction was in how they got there. All you seem capable of is regurgitating simplistsic memes such as Hitler got to statism via the right wing. Gee, ya think so?

Do try to keep up.

Nov 26, 2008 - 2:20 pm 98. cedarford:

“Follow me!” – More great ideas. If Republicans have any brains, they will begin listening to rank and file like you that have constructive ideas and not a “Base” tactic of whining and going with a list of who they hate and who they blame for not being in power. And how they need another Reagan and more people believing in Jesus and Palin….

It is long past time – that Republicans ended crap like “Flag Burning Amendments” – and turned a laser beam on stuff they let their heavy Corporatist donors pull on the American people – (A)Republican-endorsed tax breaks for firms relocating US jobs for overseas. (B)H1-B Visas to keep wages for in demand jobs low and allow importation of foreign labor rather than incentivize Americans to do the difficult training to be a nurse, an IT manager, a QA inspector..(C)Republican buy-off on their Corporatist friends both allowed to set up offshore entities to avoid taxes AND ladled out huge no-bid Iraq, WOT government contracts.

Follow me is right as well that we Republicans could have huge winners in opening up all those books on earmarks and contracts and nepotic connections that the Reps wanted kept from the US public every bit as much as Dem porkmeisters wanted to do as they pleased behind closed doors to legally enrich their families or advantage their ability to be in power.

Expunging drug convictions would be huge for the 10 million plus families that are stigmatized, underearn from a long ago drug conviction no matter what their exemplary behavior showed in ten, 15 years of being good citizens. All those millions think REpublicans are the ones that keep them from good jobs and stigmatize them and the Dems are their best shot at a normal life unless they have the money to buy a pardon….

“Follow me” points out something well-known but ignored by Republicans for 8 years in their tax-cutting zeal and Neocon phase – that we cannot get the people that do know the math and science we need to compete with India and China out of the corporate world, gov’t, ranks of retirees – because the “Teachers Master’s Degree” is still a huge barrier to entry.
(A guy who was a master mechanic in life and who taught hundreds to be great mechanics CANNOT teach – but a woman who never had any private sector expierence CAN and can read what to do out of a lesson plan because unlike the masters mechanic, SHE has a Teachers Masters Cert – though it is in what color schemes might help autistic children behave better..)

**************
ReConUSMC – In the Future when should not have RePUBLICAN contest Not start in Liberal States like Iowa or New Hampshire but in Conservative states like Texas , Okla and Ga .

Right, just what we need to have Republicans reconnect with the 3/4ths of the country that are moving away from them…Have all the Republican debates down in Fundie-Land! For added fun, limit primaries to the 5 Southern States Goldwater won, plus Texas. That way you get none of those “RINOs” from up North, in the New South, the Midwest. Or Cali. And best keep those Mormons, hispanic Pentacostalist heretics out…And all those union, JFK loving Reagan Democrats, the ones still left, that foul the purity of the Religious Right Base.

The media got McCain on our Ticket to guarantee we lose or Obama won..

Even you don’t think Republicans are stupider than the media, do you?
The media liked “Mr POW”, but his path to the top was determined by The Base having some members reject Romney as insufficiently “pure” on abortion, though he committed to the same things Reagan and Bush did…and being a Mormon heretic. Then embraced a free-spending Fundie Preacher and had a faction for Fred, who was a little too lazy and didn’t want it enough.

Then the Fundies went after Rudy, with “Pastor Huck” doing his best to puff up McCain – short of openly fellating him at his rallies..This aided the Religious Right considerably in wrecking the “baby killer” and adulterer. Mr 9/11 withdrew after Florida. That left Mr. Professional POW smooth sailing to clean up in winner take all states Rudy once was a lock in.

By knocking off Romney and Rudy, barring Ridge from even trying for office, The Base ensured McCain.

As for the General Election – Republicans had a 3-term well-liked Texas female Senator the Base rejected because she “voted for baby-killing”. Leaving them their inexperienced, ill-informed Goddess, who killed McCains most effective reason for being elected over Obama…Experience.
Then she killed more votes as she drove off voters outside Fundie-Land. The media had little to do with Palin’s loss of credibility with people outside the rural South and West. Her deployment as a Right Wing attack dog and failing open on interviews on simple questions ensured that.

Nov 26, 2008 - 3:17 pm 99. Herb:

Die Fliedermaus: Please defend your own analogies. You said, “The modern liberal differs little in any substantive way from your garden variety Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist.”

Hey, I get that you think they’re all bad guys (even the modern liberals, your fellow countrymen, friends and family members…unless you’re one of those rare beasts who only associates with conservatives). But PLEASE explain how there’s little difference between them. Because the facts don’t support that ridiculous assertion.

Failing that, go back to ridicule school to learn how to do it right.

G Alston, No, I’m not regurgitating simplistic memes. The simplistic meme is “Nazis are bad, Stalinists are bad, liberals are bad…and they’re all Statists, so they’re the same thing.” Reality is a little more complex, my friend.

Nov 26, 2008 - 3:28 pm 100. Jeff:

A WAKE UP CALL TO CONSERVATIVES AND HATEFILLED WEBSITES LIKE PAJAMASMEDIA —

Hate and propagandas of hate will not live in this century anymore because there is a much greater global threat to the very existence of humanity so we must either transcend above this or perish – December 21, 2012 or more symbolicly 12/21/12.

The current warning signs — global terrorism, famines, wars, consistent global natural disasters, high global unemployment, worst global economic collapse, global food shortages, etc. This is a global pandemic.

If hate in the differences of color, creed, religion, and cultural backgrounds do not diminish; all the warning signs above point to a grave end result for humanity.

Nov 26, 2008 - 4:02 pm 101. Die Fledermaus:

Herb said: “Die Fliedermaus (sic):… You said, ‘The modern liberal differs little in any substantive way from your garden variety Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist.’”

What I actually said was, “Above all, don’t get back to me.”

Nov 26, 2008 - 6:09 pm 102. Herb:

Sorry, Fieldmouse. You can’t say something abjectly ridiculous and get away with it by signing off, “Above all, don’t get back to me.”

Grow up. If you don’t want to be challenged, don’t say something stupid.

Nov 26, 2008 - 7:22 pm 103. Vivian:

The bitterness here (excepting flakes like Herb) is a beautiful illustration of the infighting and unwarranted hostility which is keeping back the Republican party.

Cedarford, you and Follow Me have some great thoughts, but the vituperative manner in which you express your hatred of any Christian conservative people, and those who revere the Bible is downright scary, not to mention intolerant. Furthermore, your disdain for southerners comes through loud and clear. Just who ARE the people in this nation whom you actually like, and are there enough of them to form a political party? Persisting in such extremely negative stereotypes will never help conservatism at all. Jabbing at different people in the GOP whom you despise reminds me exactly of Democrat tactics of dividing everyone up into little hyphenated groups in order to make them feel victimized. Conservatism MUST be the opposite of this. Conservatism is THE uniting philosophy of this nation. The fact that so many voters age 40 and under do not really understand the nature of conservatism is the central problem. As a result, the under-educated Republican grasps for any tidbit of the platform that sounds better than the kool-aid drinking alternative. I think some charity would go a long way. Certainly there are a few Bible-bashing types who bore others, but really, they are the minority, and perhaps they are under-educated, but does that mean they don’t deserve to breathe? And, there are a zillion libertarians who don’t know what they believe. And there are a lot of country club Republicans who would rather hang out with other “nice” people like themselves, even if they are Democrats. And there are IMO some overly sensitive gay conservatives who imagine every Christian is out to lynch them.

I have to laugh at the influence you seem to think Bible believing Christians have–just exactly where might that be? I have a lot of Christian friends, by the way, and they were divided between supporting Ron Paul, Mitt Romney, Huckabee, Giuliani, Thompson, Gingrich, etc. Hardly anyone I know was in love with McCain–and they voted for Obama. I’d bet most of the people who voted for him in the primary ended up voting for Obama. Unlike your frightening stereotypes the Fundies, the Base, and all the other pejorative names you have for Evangelical Christians, actual Christians are quite diverse. They do not vote in lock-step and are, in fact, a lot more intelligent in outlook than the Obama supporters, who cannot even tell you which party has the majority in Congress.

If we actually had some clear-thinking articulate conservative leaders who were seen in the media and were given more than a 10 second sound-byte, some of these voters would be able to focus their minds more coherently on the real issues. But since we have a brain-washed mass of young people, an electorate who has been told Bush is “ultra right-wing”, a media useful only for leftist propaganda, and a complete vacuum of intelligence at national & state party leadership as well as in our national candidates, those of us who actually are conservative are wrangling over a lot of non-issues. What I hear you saying boils down to your personal dislike of other conservatives. How, pray tell, is this going to be productive?

The reason conservatives are conservative is that they believe in the principles enumerated by the Constitution BECAUSE they are the best thing offered throughout history for ensuring that ALL people will have a chance to enjoy freedom and thrive. If we can’t manage to unite around this, then the cause is indeed hopeless.

So, those of you here, stop pointing the finger at your confreres and try to develop some charity towards your political allies.

Those who truly should be in our camp are that percentage of African-Americans who couldn’t resist voting for Obama. County and state Republicans generally don’t even bother spending campaign funds in African-American areas, because they regard them as hopeless. This is a huge mistake. And here is where your loathed social conservatives will come in handy.

One more big problem, bigger than any of the other issues cited, is that the GOP has no idea what to do about job-loss to Asia, and about free-trade. Because we’ve had so many generations of baleful government programs, it is hard to tell whether free trade is a good idea or not, since we’re never looking at just one variable. Wall Street Journalists are very much pro free trade, but they do not manage well to explain how this will affect middle-class Americans. Pat Buchanan believes that it is not a good thing, and he makes points others don’t bring up. Is he right? I’ve no idea, but no one takes up why his points are wrong. And then, is what we have now free trade? How do we even define it, and furthermore, if it is actually free trade, why do we need any government action at all? Can’t individual companies in one country sell to another if trade is free? Why would we require 1000-page documents to set it up?

I’m very sensitive to this issue, since I don’t think you can have a healthy country that specializes in “knowledge work”, or in “sales”. People are born with the abilities they have, and not all of us are qualified to be computer engineers and software developers. What are all of the rest of us supposed to do? And then, before we look at free trade, maybe we have to go back to the more radical idea of why companies are off-shoring. Obviously, our labor rates are higher than elsewhere, but why is that? And what government action sets up the scenario where it is more advantageous for companies to locate their facilities and employees abroad? I don’t see the fingers pointing in the right direction. If we don’t know what caused our problem, then we can’t do much to fix it; we’ll just be slapping another bandaid on the problem and coming up with yet another expensive government solution.

The fact that both GOP and Democrat leaders seem to take the same tack with this makes me really nervous….

Nov 27, 2008 - 2:07 am 104. Die Fledermaus:

Herb: The words “Stalinist, Nazi, or Maoist” were surrounded by a whole bunch of other words in my previous posts. It’s what’s called “context,” and is generally provided to clarify one’s position on an issue. Since you didn’t read them, ignored them, or they bounced off your mind-shield, there’s no point to providing yet more words for you to dismiss, ignore, or deflect.

You’re on a quest to hear yourself speak, without considering what’s said in response. Play that game by yourself, and spare me the pseudo intellectual pretense. Go find an eight-year old to impress.

Nov 27, 2008 - 3:09 am 105. ew:

A call to action is well-said. This election (even the grassroots illuminati effort) has shown that the Dems are willing to do things the republicans typically haven’t been willing to do.

Nov 27, 2008 - 6:11 am 106. Ventrue:

104. Vivian:

While I happily agree with your assessment of the singular redeeming quality of the conservative to eat his own, I am curious as to why you view, as you put it, “loathed social conservatives” as the ones to help put the “percentage”(97%, at last count)of African Americans who voted Democratic into the GOP camp.

Nov 27, 2008 - 10:46 am 107. genghis:

Mr. Hawkins is the voice of the future.
He says more smart things than just about anybody and I for one really appreciate his wisdm.

Nov 27, 2008 - 1:59 pm 108. Will Becker:

So let’s get some spine and balls,conservatives.Stand for what you beleive.

Nov 27, 2008 - 5:57 pm 109. Cara C:

I’ve been watching the liberal march in our media, but I assumed that while they were biased, they would at least report most of the facts. This turned out to be false. I knew teachers were liberal, but I didn’t know that this was due to a deliberate effort on behalf of the Left. I knew our culture was getting more liberal, but I liked that as I believe in individual liberty. I’ve seen groups like the ACLU and Media Matters take active roles while I don’t really see conservative equivalents. Who is the conservative George Soros?

I walk out my door in New York and there are often young people on the streets asking passersby to sign petitions and contribute to the fight against global warming. Where are the young people informing passersby that man-made global warming is a hoax?

Even now when I want to join the resistance, I don’t know where to go. I see freedommarch.org and grassfire.org and I’m happy these sites are there, but I’ve never heard of them until recently. Where are the leaders we can rally behind or organizations we can join to help us fight this socialist monster?

Why aren’t we storming the New York Times, ABC, CBS, and NBC and other media outlets with massive protests? They led our country like lambs to the slaughter by their refusal to vet Barack Obama or let the public know the significance of Ayers, ACORN, Wright, Rezko, Khalidi, the New Party, etc.

Why aren’t we protesting in large numbers the outrageous voter fraud we witnessed, with ACORN and with Obama’s unethical fundraising? Why aren’t we marching to protest the bailouts that don’t stop? Why is no one calling for the resignation and imprisonment of those who oversaw Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which seem to have been run in a way that was designed to cause our financial system to implode. It was either corruption or an intentional attack on our economy.

As for the direction of the Republican party, my vote is for a focus on individual liberty. Smaller government. Very strong military, an aggressive stance in the war against terror. Lower taxes. Fewer entitlements. Fewer regulations. Less political correctness. Patriotism, pride in America for all its greatness. Energy independence. Voting should take place on one designated day; maybe we need to have our fingers dipped in purple ink to stop the fraud. We should discuss creative ways to help the poor without having to resort to socialism.

I support gay marriage. I believe in a woman’s right to choose. If Republicans deny women the right to their own bodies, they can’t claim to be the party of freedom. Republicans lose a lot of fiscally conservative people on these social issues.

Where are the leaders and organizations who fight for individual liberty, capitalism, democracy, without adding a whole bunch of other stuff on top that should not be the business of the government?

As for conservatives not joining movements, we don’t have that luxury anymore. Now that we know what we’re up against, everyone who hates Marxism needs to join together and fight back hard. I’m not up to starting a political movement so if anyone knows where to do that, please let me know.

Nov 27, 2008 - 9:48 pm 110. simone:

Bull! The basic premise of the essay is grossly incorrect.

Conservatives these past 8 years were consistently lied to and misrepresented by the country club wing of the republican party. Let me say it again, for 8 years conservatives have been told by country club republicans that their views where too extreme to be shared in public. Conservatives were told by these losers that Americans would not accept the radical idea that we should have secure borders and a real immigration policy. At the sam time the polls showed that 80% of American voters were in fact of this very opinion. Then we were told that Americans would not tolerate inaction and thus we must support the bail out. We now see that the majority of Americans are now questioning the bail out. I could go on but will not.

My point is simple. Conservatives have gone above and beyond. It is time for the leadership to stop crying that no one will follow them. Conservatives won’t follow greed, self serving idiots. That’s how it should be. Please don’t use Reagan for your petty excusing of your failure to think and stand up.

The lesser of two evils has run its course. McCain was not not that different from Obama. The only difference I saw at the end was rhetoric. McCain treated conservatives more cruelly than Obama.

Please stop blaming conservatives for your stupidity. You are the loser who gladly sells principle for what?

Nov 28, 2008 - 2:47 pm 111. Rob:

BS – Baloney Spew

The difficulty is that Conservativism hasn’t been seen or heard since President Reagan.

As long as the GOP continues to be Liberal Lite, they are anathema to true conservatives.

The best thing may have been the loss of the NorthEast, which is largely a source of poisoning the well and nothing more.

Until Conservativism is not cast as quaint or a splinter-group which must be endured, but rather is the mainline of the party, the GOP will continue to lose.

When the country club (non) conservatives release their deathgrip on the party (or we wrest it from them) we may begin to win and reverse 70 years (at least) of the damage of liberal drift done to the republic.

If you see FDR as anything other than BAD for the country, if you do not see the certain evils in the concentration of Federal power due to Lincoln – hurting state’s (and individual) rights, you are not a conservative. It is the thinking that D.C. is the source of wisdom and solutions that is flawed.

“Government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem…. We’ve been tempted to believe that society has become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people. Well, if no one among us is capable of government himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else? All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one group singled out to pay a higher price.”
– Ronald Reagan

Nov 28, 2008 - 3:29 pm 112. Vivian:

Ventrue: #107
Studies which have been carried out in the late 90s on single issues within black communities and white communities (communities of voters, that is) have demonstrated that the average African-American voter is MORE conservative on issues than is the average white American voter. This is NOT translating into a larger percentage of GOP voting because our candidates do not want to focus on the social issues, such as school choices, definition of marriage, limitations placed on abortion, etc. We lose these voters because we talk about NAFTA, free trade, not taxing the wealthy, 401Ks, fixing Social Security, etc., and these are not hot button issues for these voters as are the social issues.

We have ignored the huge potential for gaining a greater percentage of African-American voters for years by underplaying issues of interest to them. Furthermore, we often don’t allow campaign funds to go to African-American congressional districts who vote largely Democratic because we just write them off as unwinnable. In most of these districts are dedicated willing GOP foot soldiers, but they are often undercut by the country-club old-boy network group think of those who often are in charge of party operations. We miss out on opportunities to work together with decent African-American Muslims who are staunchly pro-life and would like to provide a safe, non-secular education for their children.

It’s bad enough that local parties fail to endorse a candidate in these districts, let alone developing excellent candidates to run in these areas. I’ve seen all of this first-hand. We don’t need to have ALL of the African-American vote, we just need and can do a whole lot better than the 5% we received this year. Republicans who are embarrassed by the social issues and don’t want to talk about them are holding back the party from making inroads. For voters living in especially poor neighborhoods where both parents must work, the school choice issue is absolutely key and IS an economic issue. The ability to select schools of their own and pay for them via school vouchers would be a huge benefit. Perhaps nothing could have prevented this year’s election debacle, but statistically speaking, we won’t overcome it unless we face up to the reality. We should actively put resources in the hands of those who can effectively make the case for conservatism in the inner cities, and in Hispanic neighborhoods. Give these folks money, encouragement, and tools, and do everything to assist them to convince hearts and minds. We need another statement of purpose such as the Contract with America.

If we allow elections to be about personalities, we’re finished. Voters MUST get the issues to vote conservative—that’s just the reality. They must see what, specifically, we believe in, and they must see what the Democrats they’ve voted for do in office and what they stand for. GOP wins whenever the campaigns are about real issues. We lose when our candidates undercut the issues, or waffle around them. Many people were quite surprised by the Contract with America because they could see that they agreed with so much of it. However, once Gingrich got in, he went after peripheral issues and failed to follow through with the Contract. Nobody spoke anymore about which government departments should be shut down. Nothing was done to protect the public from the Dept. of Education or the teachers unions. Voters reacted in disgust, and the GOP has been losing ground ever since. We have made mistake after mistake, such as Dole, Bush, and McCain. I don’t understand the denial Reps indulge in at primary time, such as the pretense that Pres. Bush was ever a conservative. He did NOT have a conservative record as Gov. of Texas at all–he was a big spender there as well, and on education. This should have been a huge huge red flag, especially in light of the fact that our educational system is the single largest obstacle we face, but the party geniuses decided they needed him to ensure a “win”. Well, how has this worked exactly?? I’d call it a “Pyrrhic victory”.

Nov 28, 2008 - 5:51 pm 113. G Alston:

#112 Rob — “…if you do not see the certain evils in the concentration of Federal power due to Lincoln – hurting state’s (and individual) rights, you are not a conservative.”

Poly-sci based arguments always discuss Lincoln’s arrogation of power as if politics live in a vacuum. Simply put, Lincoln was responding — for the first time — to the closest thing to a real-time war as existed in that day due to the recently invented telegraph. If you take into account the effect that technology availability has played throughout history, a great deal more of what was done and why looks a bit different than the vacuum based premises you’re repeating.

I tire of arguments like yours that seek to dictate what a conservative is and is not based merely on your own inadequate understanding of historical events.

#113 Vivian — “GOP wins whenever the campaigns are about real issues.”

And what “real issues” do you have in mind? Many left voters voted that way due to a real issue to them — global warming. Others voted a pocketbook issue and simply believed that banking deregulation was a republican idea. Still others voted for doing something about health care. These are all real issues. The GOP lost on every one of them.

e.g. Vivian — “The ability to select schools of their own and pay for them via school vouchers would be a huge benefit.”

This is an issue to a MINORITY of the GOP voters and not an issue in any way with anyone else. I never vote left, and I think vouchers are an extremely short-sighted idea. Is that one of your real issues? I would think that if you’re going to invent issues then a reasonable starting point ought to be that most of your own party agrees with you.

I don’t think I heard Obama discuss vouchers. In fact I don’t think I heard *anyone* talk about them. I heard health care, war, financial crisis, and so on. No vouchers. Unsurprisingly with a war going on and money markets melting down and fed bailouts are being discussed, people were voting issues that meant something to them. Are you suggesting that the GOP ought to discount these other issues and say “no, no, we don’t need to talk about side issues like overseas wars and knowing WTF we’re doing vis a vis foreign policy; let’s talk about the really important stuff instead: school vouchers!”

Nov 28, 2008 - 8:10 pm 114. nobozons:

Crap unadulterated crap. Regan was a conservative and a republican. McCain is a republican. The msm did a job on the republicans and put McCain in the driver’s seat during the early days of the primary. Then Obama lied about taking the government deal during the election because he found a way around the McCain Finegold Election Law. He beat McCain 10 to 1 in financial support and saturated the airways. Obama relied on the fact that fifty percent of Americans have IQs less than 100 and got them to vote for hope for what ever. The the banking problem brought to you and I by the dark side but blamed on Bush put the stake through what was left of McCain. We did learn one thing–the press will kill the incumbent’s party any time there is a protracted war. The democrat party is the party of Chamberland. Look what Clinton did, he kept us out of war, he acquiesced but brought no transferable hate to the democrats.

Nov 29, 2008 - 9:57 am 115. Dave Surls:

“Do you know why Western societies, including ours, seem to always go leftward, despite the fact that liberal policies don’t work?”

Sure, I know why. Because just about everyone wants something for nothing.

Nov 29, 2008 - 1:09 pm 116. Ventrue:

113. Vivian:

Thank you for your thoughtful response. However, I must disagree with your assessment of the black community. While it is true that black voters tend to be more conservative than their white counterparts, black conservatism is of a different isotope(for lack of a better term)than white conservatism.

What I mean by this is, while many blacks(and other minorities)may be CONSERVATIVE, they are not CONSERVATIVES, at least not in the way the term is currently defined. On the issue of abortion, forexample, many black people are opposed to the practice, but are reluctant to empower the government to restrict its availability. The results of Proposition 8 in CA notwithstanding, the same goes for gay marriage, prayer in school, porn on the internet, recreational drug use and a whole host of other conservative pet causes. While I have not conducted any empirical studies on this issue, my hunch is that on Prop. 8, the issue was narrowly tipped toward passage by a confluence of outside intervention(by the Mormon and Catholic churches), conservative CA white voters, and black and latino voters who otherwise would not have voted but were there to support a minority for president. As I alluded to in my previous post, Obama did not receive a significantly greater percentage of the black vote than the previous Democratic presidential candidates since Kennedy’s time, but what he did do was bring a greater number of minority voters to the polls, and in CA, while they were in the voting booth, they pulled the lever in favor of Prop. 8. I submit that had Hillary been the Dem nominee, she would have garnered nearly the PERCENTAGE of the black vote(and perhaps slightly higher percentage of the latino vote)that Obama did, but the overall number of black voters would have been notably less….and Prop 8 likely would’ve failed by the same(or nearly so)margin by which it passed. My point? The black community is a very insular community, and pet causes that do not directly concern that community are not going to draw voters from that demographic to the polls.

Likewise, the Republican party cannot simply trot out black puppets who regurgitate right wing boilerplate into positions of power and expect black voters to support them based upon ethnic identification. Michael Steele and Lynn Swann would concur with me here, but in Ohio, I can tell you that an arch conservative Republican operative named Ken Blackwell ran for governor of the state in 2006. Oh, did I mention he is a black man? Now, granted, ‘06 was not a Republican year, and the OH GOP was burdened with a very scuzzy gubernatorial incumbent named Bob Taft(yes, he is related to President Taft….his great grandson), but what I am pointing to here is that Blackwell, a well known Republican who had served on the Bush/Cheney ‘04 re-election team was drubbed by little-known white Democratic congressman from Appalachia named Ted Strickland who barely campaigned. And when I say drubbed, I mean forget landslide, Blackwell was swallowed up by the Earth in a 60%-36% laugher in a nominally Republican state. The interesting thing is, he lost by an even greater margin in the black community.

There are understandable, if not necessarily good, reasons for this. I speak, of course, of the legacy of slavery and Jim Crow. While nearly a century and a half has passed since the Emancipation Proclamation and almost two generations have been born since the Civil and Voting Rights Acts were passed, that span of time is not very long in terms of cultural norms. To the extent to which the black community thinks and votes as a bloc, it is because of their historical treatment at the hands of those who identify themselves as conservatives. A few key concepts that need to be understood and considered by those outside the black community as a Rosetta stone of sorts to understanding it are

1. Privacy
2. Pragmatism, and as a corollary to #1,
3. MYOFB(Mind Your Own Freaking Business, euphemism mine)

All three concepts are alien to the conservative mindset, as conservatives, collectively are invasive of privacy(Does the name Terri Schiavo ring a bell?), a sacrifice of pragmantism on the altar of sanctimony(opposition to stem cell research), and the apparent conservative-held belief in the God-given right to determine the private behavior of other people that does not impinge upon them(Exhibit A, Proposition 8). As I said before, while black people may be conservative, they are first pragmatic, private and insular. That precludes them from being conservativeS. You may not approve of abortion, but in the black community, which has one of the highest abortion(and birth)rates of any demographic, you mind your own business and don’t stand in judgment of those who may want or need one. You may not like the fact that people engage in illegal commerce, but in many communities where there are no better options for young people who have criminal records, you show pragmatism and extend privacy by not interfering in the business of others. Those concepts are an anathema to white conservatives, and while they may share a common P.O.V. on specific issues, they will not be trusted or supported by the black community.

Now….what will it take to change that dynamic, you may well ask. Time and trust. Ironically, the election of Obama may provide the opportunity to eventually end the stranglehold the Democratic party upon the black electorate. How? By showing black Americans that whites can be trusted to treat them with respect and take them seriously. Mind you, however, many of your comrades in arms are off to an atrocious start in this regard. Y’know…by calling him “commie” or “marxist” or “socialist” or “terrorist” or “baby killer” or making fun of his non European based name or bashing his wife or his deceased mother, etc. Would Hillary or John Kerry or Al Gore have been treated this way? I highly doubt it. The more level headed among you would do well to advise your more volatile fellow travelers to hold their fire until at least he’s sworn in and actually does something that you can legitimately take issue with.

Beyond that, it’s going to take time….several decades at least, of establishing trust. Perhaps, by the 2040 elections, should we still be around(I will be 77 then myself), we will see a minority community that votes less as a bloc and more upon individually held beliefs.

That is the enduring legacy of America’s greatest shame. With regard to the First Lady-elect’s erstwhile lack of pride in her country, I offer the last line of my favorite passage in the Viking sagas:

“Do you know more now…..or not?”

Nov 29, 2008 - 4:44 pm 117. Vivian:

Wow–Ventrue–you have made so many assumptions here it would take much longer than it is worth to shoot them all down. You assume all sorts of political opinions I have not even discussed, thereby proving my central point that you assume that all “white” conservative Christians believe the exact same things, and that you know what they are. You’re living in stereotype-land, both respect to the conservatives you disdain, as well as to the black community.

If you believe that conservatives in general are busy attempting to intrude in other people’s lives and telling them how to behave, you don’t even get the fundamental idea of conservativism, which is indeed, minding your own business. It is the left which is always attempting to butt in, banning perfume in public, restricting smoking to areas within 10 feet radii of doors, limiting our choices of toilets, invading parents’ rights to raise their own children, helping themselves to our wallets, inflating our currency in order to extract more taxes without having to vote for them transparently, conducting therapy and vaginal examinations of children at school without parental consent, etc. You don’t know who your enemy is, apparently.

I am familiar with Ken Blackwell, as I am originally from Ohio. Trouble is, the Ohio GOP has been a horrible party for years—I’m sure they didn’t give much backing to Blackwell, and I find your description of black conservatives as puppets spewing boilerplate the sort of resentful and racist rhetoric I would expect to come from the left. Do you consider Thomas Sowell, Clarence Thomas, and Ken Blackwell to be “puppets”?

As far as School Choice is concerned, of course Obama would not bring this up, however, for those who live in the inner city, this is a big and winning issue, which is why, despite the influence of the Ohio Education Assoc., the local courts in Cleveland and the State Supreme Court actually have permitted school vouchers for students trapped in the Cleveland Public School system. I’ve no idea why you are so hostile and rigid on the issue of school choice, but that’s fundamentally far more important to most people over the age of 25 than global warming. And school vouchers are certainly not “my” idea. McCain didn’t mention them, or anything else of basic importance other than national defence, and my point is that he didn’t talk about anything of any importance to ANY community. My reference to the average black voter being more conservative than the average white voter was based on individual issues without any party label or philosophy being attached to them. I don’t think you even understood my point.

On the one hand, you claimed that black voters in California turned out mainly to vote for Obama, but then you say that they won’t turn out in Ohio for a black candidate there. So which is it? And, because while they voted in California a Democrat ticket, they supported Prop. 8. I’m thinking the only way to attract the black voter is to consistently court them with the issues which matter to them and to show them how the Democrat party consistently has hurt their interests, something which many of them already suspect. This is something the GOP has not really done. And I’m not stupid enough to think it would happen overnight just because Ken Blackwell ran for governor. Poor Ken had a whole ton of Democrat money poured into his state because of the national election and the importance of Ohio to Obama and to Clinton.

The Dems turned out a huge mass of young uneducated voters who don’t even know yet what is important. They will find out eventually, at least some of them will. Back in my day, this same voting bloc voted for McGovern. Many of those people later on grew up and voted for Reagan.

I would challenge you to illustrate how conservatism is hindering you in any of the 3 ways you claim–and furthermore, I have not the least idea what you mean in the case of Terry Schiavo, since it was the left who couldn’t wait to terminate her life based solely on the verbal opinion of her husband, without any statement of writing from Terry of any kind. When it is a matter of life at stake, I would never want to err on the side of killing. And you find this an invasion of privacy? What behavior of yours have you found Christians attempting to dictate? Inquiring minds want to know.

Nov 30, 2008 - 3:32 pm 118. Vivian:

I apologize that some of my previous post should have been accurately addressed to G. Alston, and the not all of the attributions I made to Ventrue were appropriate. My apologies!

To G. Alston–who stated that<>

You’re right, no one talked about them. And the right got slaughtered. My point exactly: our candidates, especially McCain, could not make any of the points which are important, and we paid for it.

With respect to our decaying educational system, I’m in favor of anything which will break up the monopoly of the teachers’ unions as anyone who understands the actual dynamics of the public school system realizes you cannot improve anything substantially within the existing structure. The ignorance of our youthful voters is just further proof of the failure of our educational institutions. If you don’t like my suggestion, I’d be happy to entertain any other suggestions. What’s yours, by the way?
Not all conservatives are my-way-or-no-way-at-all voters.
Again, Ventrue, my sincere apologies for the misappropriation of comments.

Nov 30, 2008 - 3:55 pm 119. G Alston:

#119 Vivian — “You’re right, no one talked about them. And the right got slaughtered.”

And the right would have been deservedly slaughtered in spectacular fashion if they tried to make an issue of them. Other issues are actually important. Vouchers are a non-issue. They are not a solution to a problem you claim exists. That’s because the problem you claim doesn’t exist.

Some claim that vouchers allow you to take your child from “bad” districts to “good” districts. Better education, they claim. Ummm, no. At best the “good” district is simply more effective at teaching whatever is on the standardized test. We’ve already seen this very thing many times. Being able to take a test is meaningless. Being able to think is not. Vouchers don’t address this.

Vouchers don’t address the actual problem in education, which is that kids on the right side of the bell curve require a completely different education in style and substance than kids on the left side. Kids on the right learn how to learn. They manipulate abstract symbols. Kids on the left side aren’t capable of manipulation of abstract symbols, and they can’t really learn how to learn. The kids on the right are the engineers and scientists and stockbrokers; the ones on the left are the plumbers and machinists and insurance agents and such.

In the current system smart kids learn something useful on their own despite the efforts of the system to stymie them. Smart kids are smart kids. They’re going to learn no matter what. The kids on the left need rote learning. They can’t learn any other way. For kids on the right side of the curve rote learning is punishment. The kids on the left need trades. Good paying ones. Not college. How you learn a trade is different than how you learn how to be a scientist.

This is the sort of problem that needs to be addressed in national policy from the top levels on down. Local school boards simply aren’t capable of dealing with this. School boards are adept at picking out football uniforms, deciding if the new music program ought to have 4 concerts or 3. They are not equipped for anything more. Deciding how to teach bright kids is far beyond their abilities (due in part to the simple fact that many of the bright kids are brighter than the board members in the first place.) The argument for local school board control is therefore laughable.

Schools need to have classes using the appropriate teaching methods for the kids in that class and the kids need to discovered and segregated early. Vouchers don’t even begin to address this, much less solve it. IQ tests would do the trick. Not vouchers.

The problem isn’t teacher unions. It isn’t the Dept of Education, either. The problem is that kids aren’t equal, and not all kids are college material. Some don’t have the requisite brainpower. Some kids are smarter than the other kids. Not all kids need a world class education. And just in case you’re having your own math trouble, I’m saying that college is a waste of time for at least HALF of the population.

What you are in favour of is that which sounds good, makes you feel good, and that which seems like it makes a difference. It doesn’t. Bright kids will succeed because they’re bright. Always. The school system won’t matter. Johnny can’t read because, by definition, half of us are below average, and Johnny isn’t going to ever read until he gets classes designed for his capacity. That’s simply a mathematical fact. Vouchers don’t solve this, and they don’t help the bright kids, either. The result is that vouchers would be just as ineffective and poorly implemented as what we have now.

Nov 30, 2008 - 7:39 pm 120. Vivian:

G. Alston–I at least understand now where you are coming from. We disagree on the fundamental diagnosis. You read the situation in terms of smart versus non-smart children and addressing their needs. That is not what is most crucially wrong with our education in my opinion, and doesn’t explain why our schools produce ever worsening results. I don’t believe human beings on the average are different in their abilities fundamentally than they used to be, and you have not proposed any sort of solution to the real problem, which is an educational philosophy as well as a model of a human being which is completely at odds with reality, and intends to “fix” society by molding children to their own ideas as opposed to educating them.

Having experienced several different school systems, I can see exactly where the problems are, and they have nothing to do with children of different “needs”. And I do not regard school as just a place to crank out someone to achieve a fat salary either.

Vouchers do one thing at the least, which would be to allow parents to spend the money which the state is going to spend anyway in the type of school system of their choice, whether the local public school or a private school. The education establishment has exclusive rights over children except those of the privileged.
Furthermore, since public schools will not and cannot sufficiently discipline students, their only threat is to chuck offenders out of the school, and generally they cannot do this. As long as the current system is in place, and the college education system for training teachers adheres to the same philosophy they’ve used for at least 60 years, nothing will improve. It doesn’t matter how much money you throw into the schools.

Essentially however, there is too much diversity of opinion now as to what constitutes a good education. I daresay you and I do not agree at all, which is why we each should have the choice. Parents disagree widely as to the extent and mode of discipline, to note one small example. Some parents want their children to be free of all restraints, and don’t care what their kids wear, how they behave, etc.

As far as addressing children of different learning styles is concerned, home-schooling is the easiest solution, but guess who is adamantly opposed to this? Anyone affiliated with the teachers unions. One out of every 7 delegates at the Democratic convention is a member of the Education Association. The teachers unions are permitted to use tax dollars to do their extensive lobbying for each and every left-wing cause imagined. They are a monopoly on the brains of the nation, and have exerted themselves in this direction ever since at least my father’s day back in the 1930s.

The educational establishment regards itself as THE authority over our children, and has no compunction about experimenting with them whenever someone comes up with a new theory which involved having to purchase a whole new curriculum. After all, it’s only the taxpayers money. Every study I’ve seen shows that the average SAT score for students entering college who then major in Education is lower than for any single other discipline. These are the people who whine about their salaries, go on strike, yet have tenure, retirement, and health insurance as well as extremely generous vacation time that few people in other fields have. The unions do what unions always do, try to force every teacher to join, and they have nearly always been successful up until just a few years ago. Our textbooks have been dumbed down bit by bit over the years and, according to actual scientists and historians, are full of misinformation.

So, there really is no point in continuing this particular subject since we have no agreement whatsoever about what is wrong with schools in the first place, even though you don’t really have a solution for what you believe is the problem either.

Dec 1, 2008 - 3:13 am 121. Tami:

One of the problems this cycle is that there were so many candidates early in the primary’s you has know idea who they were. My state voted early in Feb. what I knew of the candidates:
JOHN McCAIN- called me a bigot because I believe that our county should secure It’s boarders
RUDY GIULIANI- Was screwing around on his wife and was detested by New Yorkers before 9/11
FRED THOMPSON- That guy on Law and Order
MITT ROMNEY- Saved the Olympics, Gov.Of Mass when the roof fell in in the Big Dig
HUCKABEE- He was the Gov. of Arkansas & from Hope, Been there Done that. No Thanks.
I did not vote in the primary’s. I didn’t know what to do and I tried to get informed. Know one did much in my state,they knew it was red. Why should they bother? By March when I finally was able to make an informed decision it was too late.Before the primary’s were over the Media had called it for McCain, not my choice.
Over a year ago I had heard about Sarah Palin and was very impressed. When McCain selected her for VP I was thrilled. I talked to everyone I knew and said that she might be able to keep McCain in line.I backed her every chance I got. I am a older housefrau, and empty nester, I offered to make calls and knock on doors. Was told I wasn’t needed but if I could send MONEY it would be greatly appreciated. We don’t all have money to give, we have our time.My local party didn’t want it. Next go round let them try to stop me!

Dec 1, 2008 - 11:45 pm 122. Who Is at Fault for Conservative Defeat - Barack Obama? | Barack Obama - Sharpy News:

[...] my contention that when you are beaten in a political fight, you usually deserve it. John Hawkins notes: Edmund Burke once said, “All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do [...]

Dec 26, 2008 - 2:36 am

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