Pajamas Media

51 Comments

1. Marc Malone:

Maybe we should ask Obama if we should intervene pre-emptively to prevent genocide or whatever.

Oct 8, 2008 - 1:35 am 2. vivo:

Malone:

Why do we have to keep interfering in other countries affairs?

Do you want the Bolivians to come here and solve the financial crisis?

Oct 8, 2008 - 3:54 am 3. Bolivia » Bolivia: Morales dice no temer a un bloqueo económico de EEUU:

[...] Bolivia Spirals Toward CrisisThings have been going from bad to worse under President Evo Morales, a Chavez clone. [...]

Oct 8, 2008 - 5:12 am 4. asdf:

vivo,
Dont be a tard, it is in the WORLDS intrest that thugs like Morales and Chavez are confronted and taken down.

Oct 8, 2008 - 6:12 am 5. Austin:

Fighting over scraps is always fun to watch.

Oct 8, 2008 - 6:14 am 6. Douglas Bogle:

Never fear Obama is here.

As with Chavez and Morales, look for Obama and the Dems. to push through their agenda by decree. IE $700B + bailout.

Socialist have the same tactics in the first world as third world.

Never fear Obama is here.

Oct 8, 2008 - 6:33 am 7. Dan Irving:

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.” – Thomas Jefferson

Oct 8, 2008 - 6:36 am 8. The Anti Jihadist:

I’m sure The One will solve everyone’s problems through peaceful dialogue and toothless UN resolutions.

Oct 8, 2008 - 7:31 am 9. koedo:

Time never changes in South America.

Oct 8, 2008 - 9:15 am 10. Alice O'Finnegan:

Morales merely wants to bring the peace and prosperity to Bolivia that Mugabe brought to Zimbabwe. It is the paradise of Che finally coming to Earth. Understand that Obama has come to bring the paradise to America. Never fear, gringos, you will receive the dispensation.

Oct 8, 2008 - 10:07 am 11. Alice O'Finnegan:

In addition, Obama needs to apologize to everyone in the world for all that the US has done to destroy the planet.

Oct 8, 2008 - 10:10 am 12. Marc Malone:

vivo – It was sarcasm, dummy! When asked during the debates last night about our intervention in places, Obama seemed all for it. I think it’s stupid, so I obliquely referenced it.

All you saw was… alarm, alarm…negative towards Obama… negative towards Obama… alarm!

Oct 8, 2008 - 2:16 pm 13. Frank White:

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.” – Thomas Jefferson

General Hummel (Ed Harris) used that quote in The Rock. Sean Connery responded that “Patriotism is a virtue of the vicious according to Oscar Wylde” and then Hummel eblows him in the back of the neck. “Thank you for proving my point”

I say that to say this, The Rock is one of the best movies ever.

Oct 8, 2008 - 2:42 pm 14. Fausta’s Blog » Blog Archive » Bolivia, from bad to worse:

[...] Aliaga wrote an excellent article, Bolivia Spirals Toward Crisis Bolivia is in crisis. During the last month the lowland provincial leaders and their followers [...]

Oct 8, 2008 - 3:08 pm 15. Anonymous:

The almed thugs in Eastern Bolivia are the so called “Civic Groups” connected to the opposition prefects and supplied by the government of the United States of America.

Oct 8, 2008 - 7:12 pm 16. luke weyland:

Who arehe world’s greatest thugs?
It is nation who invaded Canada, Mexico, Guatemala, Cuba, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Honduras, Panama, Colombia, Venezuela, Brazil, Surinam, Bolivia, Peru, Ecuador, Chile, Argentina, Uraguay, Grenada,Puerto Rica ( and still holds it),

Which nation is this?
Have a guess!!

Oct 8, 2008 - 7:18 pm 17. Bill Ayers and Education (In His Own Words…His Visions) « Zipline Conservative:

[...] http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/bolivia-spirals-toward-crisis/  Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)Bill Ayers desecrates the United States FlagEd Rumsey for SC House District 2Colorado Governor Delays Switch to Vote By Mail, Supports Polls with Paper … [...]

Oct 8, 2008 - 7:29 pm 18. luke weyland:

Morales was supported by 2/3 of the voters in the recent recall referendum.

His belief in the territorial integrity of Bolivia, is supported by UNASUR – the twelve nations of South America.

The thugs who killed in the East, killed over 100 people – Those killed were indigenous MAS supporters. Those who killed were a “civic group” from Pando. That is why this prefect was arrested.

Every leader who Latin American leader who has ever supported the will of his people is deemed by Washington to be a popularist, a Peronist, a Communist, an extremist dicator worthy of being overthrown.

Oct 8, 2008 - 7:31 pm 19. Teleprompter Messiah:

Natural gas and oil are the lifeblood of tyrants. There is a real national security interest in working to make these resources relatively worthless and deprive these tyrants of their money.

Oct 8, 2008 - 8:07 pm 20. robotech master:

“Every leader who Latin American leader who has ever supported the will of his people is deemed by Washington to be a popularist, a Peronist, a Communist, an extremist dicator worthy of being overthrown.”

I won’t point out that

A. supporting the “will” of the ppl has nothing to do with being/not being a popularist, a Peronist, a Communist, an extremist dicator worthy of being overthrown.
and

B. The vast majority of leaders in latin American are popularist, a Peronist, a Communist, an extremist dictator worthy of being overthrown.

Sounds like civil war… in a latin american country… what a surprise… heh. I blame bush must be his fault.

Are the anti-a popularist, a Peronist, a Communist, an extremist dicator forces looking for some help?

Oct 8, 2008 - 8:34 pm 21. Gringo:

Morales himself freely admits to a rather cavalier attitude, or should we say a cocalero attitude, towards the legal process.

“When some jurist tells me: ‘Evo, you are making a juridical mistake, what you are doing is illegal’, well, I do it even if it is illegal. Afterwards I tell the lawyers: ‘if it is illegal, you make it legal, that’s what you have studied for,’” added the ruler.

Here Evo manipulates a vote on the Consitution without the presence of the opposition.

By now it is pretty much clear what is the government’s strategy to push its agenda. It seems that Morales has decided to just leave the opposition out of the decision process. First, we simply have to look at the way the MAS Constitutional Assembly approved their Constitution. According to various reports and personal accounts, the MAS decided to take the assembly sessions to La Glorieta (the military academy in Sucre). The directory argued that in the city of Sucre there was not enough security. Which was true, due to the demonstrators or citizens who were gathered around the building where the assembly was meeting. So president Lazarte and her MAS colleagues, took the sessions to the military academy because it was secure and it laid within the boundaries of the city, thus meeting the technical problems raised by the law. At the same time, the opposition was not informed and (according to some news reports) was not even allowed to go to the place. It was in that manner, that MAS, with around 130 assembly members, could rush through the passing of the new constitution.

Here is more evidence from February.

Well, the government has apparently gotten tired of talking and has decided to “push” through its will. Yesterday, the government faction in Congress “approved” three laws, with the help of a ring of security supporters outside the parliament building. Opposition parliamentarians could not enter the building. So, the government approved the referendum law which will ratify the new constitution, the referendum law which will ask people on how large the property of land can be and modified a law which was being interpreted by the departmental governments giving them power to call for referendums. The modification of the last law, of course, is giving the central government the exclusive power to call on such referendums.

Like Thugo Chavez, Evo sees the law as a sham, and has no hesitation at trying to pull a fast one.

Oct 8, 2008 - 8:36 pm 22. Gringo:

Morales himself freely admits to a rather cavalier attitude, or should we say a cocalero attitude, towards the legal process.

“When some jurist tells me: ‘Evo, you are making a juridical mistake, what you are doing is illegal’, well, I do it even if it is illegal. Afterwards I tell the lawyers: ‘if it is illegal, you make it legal, that’s what you have studied for,’” added the ruler.

Nice and legal.

Oct 8, 2008 - 8:39 pm 23. AD:

Bolivia and Evo Morales needs to apologize to Americans for supporting the “underground” growth and exports of cocaine to our land and to the world at large.

Oct 8, 2008 - 8:57 pm 24. vivo:

Marc Malone Oct 8, 2008 – 2:16 pm:

“vivo – It was sarcasm, dummy!”

Sorry, I didn’t get it. But I stand by my comment.

Oct 8, 2008 - 10:45 pm 25. vivo:

asdf Oct 8, 2008 – 6:12 am:

“vivo,
Dont be a tard, it is in the WORLDS intrest that thugs like Morales and Chavez are confronted and taken down.”

The World can care less. Evo Morales is the first Bolivian native to be elected President. The white and rich minority hates him for the obvious reasons. Same as Obama here (not all white). Chavez is helping the poor majorities there to obtain a better life and someone has to suffer for it (white and rich again). Just like the Indians in the US were annihilated, now we are guiltily paying them back with super profitable casinos. Can’t do that in South America.

Oct 8, 2008 - 10:55 pm 26. vivo:

Anonymous Oct 8, 2008 – 7:12 pm:

“The armed thugs in Eastern Bolivia are the so called “Civic Groups” connected to the opposition prefects and supplied by the government of the United States of America.”

You get the idea. It’s been done for so many years in so many countries. No wonder some hate the US.

Oct 8, 2008 - 10:58 pm 27. vivo:

luke weyland Oct 8, 2008 – 7:31 pm:

“Every Latin American leader who has ever supported the will of his people is deemed by Washington to be a popularist, a Peronist, a Communist, an extremist dicator worthy of being overthrown.”

It happens every time.

But the Banana Republic thinking may be fading as the countries get bigger and richer. The one lagging behind is the US with its retrograde policies. Wake up, Washington!!

Oct 8, 2008 - 11:04 pm 28. lobogris:

To all Latin American people: There is a reason you are all defined as “Third World Countries”. It’s because every single day really is a new day for you. So just drink the Kool-aid…and don’t come running for help from the United States when you realize(Que sorpresa)it’s been spiked with salt.

Oct 8, 2008 - 11:15 pm 29. Peace Like A River » Cables, dispatches and memoranda:

[...] Anna Aliaga – Bolivia Spirals Toward Crisis; Things have been going from bad to worse under President Evo Morales, a Chavez clone. [...]

Oct 8, 2008 - 11:17 pm 30. Populism’s Inequities : The New Nixon: News and Commentary about the President, his Times, and his Legacy:

[...] all while concentrating  natural gas resources, and violently cracking down on political dissent, pitting its socialist movement supporters (MAS) against the less politically unfortunate. The United Nations and the International press look on, [...]

Oct 9, 2008 - 3:10 pm 31. Chileno:

Would you all PLEASE take a minute and read up on Latin American history/politics, BEFORE declaring an opinion?

A) Not all Latin American governments are populist, Communist, or Peronist. There are several relatively successful democratic nations currently in Latin America, inclding Costa Rica, Chile, Brazil, Peru, and yes, even Colombia. Many of these nations, though with ostensibly socialist governments, have maintained a business-friendly atmosphere, which has promoted economic growth, and raised thousands above the poverty line.
B) Chavez & Co. have NOT raised many out of poverty. In fact, in Venezuela today there are shortages of some of the most basic food produces (such as milk), there’s rampant inflation, and rampant crime. The state oil company has become terribly inefficient, because no foreign company wants to invest in new infrastructure, and Chavez uses much of the company’s profits as his personal piggy bank.
C) It’s true that many Latinn American countries were ruled by inept or corrupt political elites for decades. Many of the impoverished masses were repressed by these elites, and the poor are now rebelling against them, in countries like Ecuador and Bolivia. But what they’re getting is often worse than what they had before. At least in Venezuela people are waking up to this reality. That’s why Chavez lost the constitutinal referenum last year.
D)For all you socialists out there, let me just say, as one born and raised in Latin America, I have seen how inefficient, bloated Latin “socialist” governments wasted what little capital a country had, and scared off investors who could bring in income and jobs. Tell me, if socialism is so good, why do people live so awfully in Cuba and Venezuela? Why do they live much better in countries with stable, free market economies like Chile and Costa Rica? Why is it that, after decades of impoverished Communist rule, countries like China or Poland are finally revving up their economies after embracing free market policies? The secret to lifting up the poor is not finding new means of income redistribution, it’s finding new means of income generation: jobs, small and large businesses, etc. That’s something socialism can’t create.

Oct 9, 2008 - 7:11 pm 32. Chileno:

Of course, the opposite extreme, a purely laissez-faire government mentality is also wrong. Government is necessary to regulate businesses (as is clearly evident with the financial crisis), make sure they’re honest, and up to par in terms of safety or environmental standards. But there’s a difference between regulating a market, and thinking you can control it. When Chavez, like many socialists before him, thought he could beat down inflation by enacting price controls, he created the food shortages now seen in Venezuela. Why would any business sell milk for $1 when it costs $1.50 to produce? Or why sell it in Venezuela for $1 if you can sell it in Colombia for $2? Would you?

And in terms of income redistribution, nobody’s talking about abolishing the income tax. But in tough times like these, it’s hard to attract new investors or new businesses to create new jobs in your country if you make it ever so more expensive with higher taxes.

Oct 9, 2008 - 7:35 pm 33. Granny3:

Chileon: Just wanted to say thank you – very interesting and informative commentary.

Oct 9, 2008 - 8:35 pm 34. Ian:

I am an englishman who has lived in Bolivia, hopes to live there again – I’m away working otherwise I’d be there now – and has family there.
Evo Morales is no thug. From what i saw living in the opposition heartland, he and his party are quite the opposite, in fact.He has, if you care to read any detailed account of the events of the last few years – years I witnessed at close hand – repeatedly backed off from using violence against the Bolivian opposition whilst their tactic – or is it a strategy, I can never tell?:) – has clearly been to provoke him into doing something for those sentinels of freeed’m ‘n democracy on the US extreme right to scream ‘TYRANT!’upon which the covert military operations that have gone on in that country and others in the region since the ‘election’ of Bush II will be made legitimate. The US in Bolivia is acting as agent provocateur. I apologise to any Republicans reading this for using a french expression there, I know how much you hate all other countries.
You need to be aware of the kind of embarrassingly transparent lies you are parrotting.
Morales is a man who was elected on a platform – 67% of the population at the last internationally monitored and verified count – to take the country’s hitherto stolen and fire-saled resources (water, gas) out of the hands of the few largely corrupt rich people who sold them off and put the money in the hands of the many poor, those often denied even the basics of a decent life.
One of his definitions of socialism – the word means different things to different people – is that a country’s national resources and any industries which are of necessity to the quality of life in that nation such as telephony, should be made the property of that nation and the profits fed back into the nation.
He is against the robber baronry of your President Cheney and his hand-puppet Bush. He is not against private business. My partner has a government loan to start up a small business. He wants people to start businesses and make the country more prosperous, not just the few rich families in and around Santa cruz.
I hope this helps to correct some of the drivelling extremist gibberish you have written about Bolivia in order to allow your ivy league terrorists and thugs to wage another war on the poor (see Nicaragua, Chile).Thank you.

Oct 10, 2008 - 5:06 pm 35. Gringo:

Ian:

I hope this helps to correct some of the drivelling extremist gibberish you have written about Bolivia in order to allow your ivy league terrorists and thugs to wage another war on the poor (see Nicaragua, Chile)

Those who consider the democratically elected Allende a victim of the US and CIA have examined the historical record in a very superficial manner. Three weeks before the coup, the also democratically elected House of Deputies passed by 81-47 a resolution titled the “Declaration of the Breakdown of Chile’s Democracy.” An excerpt follows.

“5. That it is a fact that the current government of the Republic, from the beginning, has sought to conquer absolute power with the obvious purpose of subjecting all citizens to the strictest political and economic control by the state and, in this manner, fulfilling the goal of establishing a totalitarian system: the absolute opposite of the representative democracy established by the Constitution;
6. That to achieve this end, the administration has committed not isolated violations of the Constitution and the laws of the land, rather it has made such violations a permanent system of conduct, to such an extreme that it systematically ignores and breaches the proper role of the other branches of government…”

In general and in specific, the resolution could be interpreted as an invitation to a coup. Allende himself called it such. The democratically elected members of the House of Deputies would not have passed such a strongly-worded resolution by a commanding 63- 37% majority if their constituents, the Chilean people, were not also disgusted with the Allende government’s repeated violations of law and democratic procedure.

Oct 10, 2008 - 6:28 pm 36. Suzy:

Gringo and Chileno

I like your posts!

Ian– I lived in Cochabamba many moons ago and I don’t see Bolivia as you do– it seems to be the same! Bolivia is one of the poorest countries in South America and it seems to follow the tradition of “Poverty and inequity also give citizenship a limited and precarious status.”
So if there are all these great changes, why is Bolivia still status: Poverty, restricting the exercise of human rights as it was 40 years ago when I lived there?

Last time I looked, President Bush was the President- not Cheney.

Oct 11, 2008 - 9:15 am 37. Suzy:

@gringo–

LOL to your “cocalero attitude.”

Oct 11, 2008 - 9:18 am 38. Suzy:

and hey–leave Obama out of this–

He has a great circle of past friends- friends who blow up buildings and lawyering for organizations who commit voter registration fraud gave him character- LOL!!!!

Oct 11, 2008 - 9:28 am 39. Gringo:

Suzy:
I was a “progressive” of the left before working four years in Latin America. The dogmas of the “progressive” left do not stand up to reality on the ground,such as the old saw of the US as the “Great Sinner.” Re the aforementioned Declaration, library research also demolishes the leftist dogmas about the Third World. The old saying is that a conservative is a liberal who has been mugged. My experience is that a conservative is a liberal who has worked and lived overseas.

Perhaps Ian here is the exception, but he may simply be one of the PSF (pendejos sin fronteras)who go overseas in order to confirm/ act on their beliefs. Also note he is not American.

Oct 11, 2008 - 9:55 am 40. Suzy:

Gringo–

you used one of my favorite words–pendejo! LOL and hugs to you for that one! but I like your acronym better! If you don’t mind, I would like to use it.

My friend who sent me this link to the blog mentioned you– as being one of the smart ones!

saludos!

Oct 11, 2008 - 10:52 am 41. Suzy:

and gringo– don’t forget this catch all phrase– reference to Morales, coca bud, Chavez, Putin et al

dime con quien andas y te dire quien eres- (I will leave the accents out)

Oct 11, 2008 - 10:56 am 42. Suzy:

Are we not allowed to post other blogs on here? I am trying to post a blog to which I would like for gringo to check out and it won’t come through-

Oct 11, 2008 - 11:12 am 43. Suzy:

gringo

Please click on my name–

gracias-

Oct 11, 2008 - 11:13 am 44. Suzy:

Gringo

Hope to see you again!

xxx

Oct 11, 2008 - 11:01 pm 45. Chileno:

Where did Ian go? We had just begun to talk….

It’s true that Morales won the recall election. But several of the anti-Morales state governors ALSO won their recall elections. Morales’ popularity is uneven: more among the poor indigenous populations that live in the Andean highlands, and less in the western lowlands, where the population is more European, more sparse, and more wealthy.

It’s true that the Bolivian indigenous population has been marginalized for decades. Morales taps into their frustration, and wins high marks among them with talk of “social justice.” But there are several other popular left-leaning governments in Latin America, such as those in Chile and Brazil, who have also promoted social reform. The difference is that Chile and Brazil have done so while maintaining business friendly policies that allow their economies to grow, and without having to alter the constitution to favor the President. Morales, on the other hand, antagonizes foreign investment and is busy rewriting the constitution. For those who say Morales is not anti-business, I’d say, I don’t consider sending the Army to “guard” foreign company refineries (as Morales did) a business-friendly policy.

If Morales was truly working to benefit his nation (and not himself), why does he need to divert more natural gas profits to his government? Why does he need to change the constitution to allow UNLIMITED Presidential terms? Does he want to lift up Bolivia, or himself?

Just like in Venezuela, it’s not just “the rich,” or the “American agitators” who are protesting against Morales. It’s laughable how Morales accuses the U.S. of being a destabilizing force in Bolivia (and expels the ambassador), yet continues to accept millions annually in US aid.

The truth is that Evo Morales is following in the footsteps of his mentor, Hugo Chavez. And they are both following the footsteps of Castro, down a path that invariably leands to a Cuban-style socialist republic. It’s a path that leads to repression and misery.

Paraphrasing a Cuban blogger (living under Castro): The poor loved Robin Hood because he took from the rich. But they soon realized that Robin Hood knew only how to steal wealth, not how to produce it.

Oct 12, 2008 - 10:54 pm 46. Fausta’s Blog » Blog Archive » The Colombus Day Carnival of Latin America & the Caribbean:

[...] BOLIVIA Bolivia Spirals Toward Crisis [...]

Oct 13, 2008 - 4:15 am 47. Mary:

I am an American whose family history in Santa Cruz spans over 150 years. My family was one of the key founders of this city. I also lived in Bolivia (La Paz)during some of the more tumultuous years,from 1962-1976. Despite the chaos that has transcended Bolivian politics for as long as any of us can remember, I recently received word that most of my family in Santa Cruz, including my 92 year old grandmother, have fled the country. This is testament to how serious and dangerous the situation has become there. She was born and raised in the house and her children (including my mother) were also born there. What had propelled my family to make this drastic decision to leave was the knowledge and the certainty that Morales, aided by not only Chavez, but Putin AND Ahmadinejad, intend to rid Santa Cruz of any threat to their “socialist” ideology–I put this in quotations because Morales and Chavez do not advocate true socialism–they simply want to have complete control of wealth (land) and resources which only they decide how can best be exploited. The one certainty here is that Morales and his cronies will end up with the vast majority of the wealth in their own bank accounts. WAKE UP AMERICA!! With Obama as president we will be led down this path…only more insidiously. The U.S.A. as we have known it will NEVER be the same and will have striking similarities to other socialist countries, where there are major disincentives to earn wealth (which has been given a negative connotation in this election)and where more and more of the middle class are burdened with subsidizing the poor. The very wealthy will do what they always have done during times of high taxation…they either move their companies overseas or they halt their expansion. This is what will happen if Obama gets his way with increasing taxes so dramatically for the 5% of the population (who already pays a disproportionately high percentage of the overall U.S. federal income tax) and with increasing the capital gains tax (which affects more Americans than they themselves realize)…the growth of our economy will be stifled. Bolivia’s future is a grim one. It has never been a prosperous country, but it has now become a dangerously poor nation. By the way, I enjoyed the Cuban blogger’s statement referring to the Robin Hood analogy…how true!

Oct 13, 2008 - 6:23 am 48. deguello:

A corrupt camarilla of Wall st.plutocrats,left-wing demagogues,and Americans who wanted to get something for nothing just blew up our financial system.The public wants to hand over control to the same people who caused the outrage(democrats),and to a manifest incompetent Obamana,who wants to bring back the discredited 60’s spending ,and Bolivia is considered a third world nation? It’s about time you gringos realized that the biggest,most obscene, most mercerenary,most destructive collection of third worlders live right here,in the U$A.What will happen here will make Bolivias problems seem like a ladies garden party!

Oct 14, 2008 - 12:14 pm 49. Buffy:

(MARY) WAKE UP AMERICA!! With Obama as president we will be led down this path…only more insidiously. The U.S.A. as we have known it will NEVER be the same and will have striking similarities to other socialist countries…

Amen! There are those of us who HOPE that the USA will NEVER be the same as before? Eight years of Bush was enough for any thoughtful person. Ironically he and his ilk are now having to use Socialist economic policies to shore up the bankrupt Republican financial crises. Ah, for the times of economic surplus when Clinton and his party were in office.

Buffy

Oct 14, 2008 - 5:10 pm 50. deguello:

Buffy: Obama is an affirmative action sock puppet for left-wing plutocrats like Soros. The great society, like all socialist attempts at social enginnering,was a disastrous failure ;repeating it will only drive this country to its destruction. Like I said, we’ve become a third world nation.

Oct 14, 2008 - 6:10 pm 51. CambaUberAlles:

Ana and Carlos Aliaga: any connection with Ronald Aliaga?

Oct 17, 2008 - 9:34 am

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