Pajamas Media

120 Comments

1. David Thomson:

What in hell is going on? When is Barack Obama going to be investigated for campaign financing fraud? Serious criminal activity occurred on a massive level in the Obama campaign. Why is this being essentially ignored? When is the U.S. Justice Department going to take action? Is Obama above the law?

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:13 am 2. The Historian:

IS THIS A GREAT COUNTRY OF WHAT?

The great American experiment continues to move forward, the beacon for Democracy in this troubled world.

http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2008/11/is-this-great-country-or-what.html

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:15 am 3. David Thomson:

“The people of the United States have spoken.”

— http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2008/11/is-this-great-country-or-what.html

Only the people of the United States have spoken? Not quite. Excuse me, but it’s time for a reality check. Countless foreigners illegally contributed money to the Barack Obama campaign. They were able to do so because top people within the campaign broke the law. It’s time to arrest and convict these people. And there is highly likelihood that Obama should be going to prison and not the White House!

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:25 am 4. Finrod:

Nice questions, but you will never get an answer anytime soon. If he doesn’t do well, will you even know? Its not like the MSM is gonna tell us or even report it. I would be willing to bet that for the next 4 years he will be the second coming if you watch the MSM, regardless of what he actually does. We are undone and strangley enough, I’m cool with that, but I live in South Carolina where we’re accustomed to being worked over.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:33 am 5. Anton:

Sorry to anybody who has seen this already but here I go:

Carter 2.0 ( a.k.a. the reign of O )

My predictions for the coming four years;

1. A deepening of the coming recession due to feckless tax increases and a failure of economic policies driven by redistributionist ideas.
2. Rapid expansion of the Federal government in an attempt to “create” jobs.
3. Retreat and retrenchment in all matters of foreign policy, appeasement of aggressive dictators, fawning on the U.N. for permission to act in self defense
4. Fairness Doctrine
5. Disastrous Supreme Court appointments that rule against the Constitution and in favor of “fairness’, “justice” and “economic equality”, a constant invention of new rights or powers not to be found in the Constitution.
6. A relentless attack on the Second Amendment.
7. National Health Care on a par with the U.K. (do please try not to die whilst waiting in the aisle)
8. Collapse of capital markets due to punitive taxation.
9. Reparations
10. Iran gets the bomb.
11. China gets Taiwan.
12. Korea still has nukes.
13. Lebanon abandoned to Hezbollah.
14. Russia continues to creep back into its old empire, holds Europe hostage via control of energy supply lines.
15. Iraq left to twist in the wind.
16. Afghanistan abandoned.
17. Pakistan falls to the Taliban.
18. Chavez visits the White House and gives O pointers on how to run a “fair election”.
19. O visits Iran.
20. Israel gets nuked or nukes Iran (or Syria) preemptively.
21. Terrorists deploy nuclear assets.
22. New energy initiatives fail to come close to promised levels of output, still no drilling off California’s coast and oil prices skyrocket.
23. Kyoto Treaty signed. US economy suffers while trying to meet carbon caps.
24. U.S. military suffers reduced budgets while forced to act as the U.N.s policeman.
25. Mexican invasion continues unabated. Voting rights given to many of them.
26. Social Security still not fixed (or even patched) retirement age raised to 72.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:41 am 6. tanarg:

Obama – The first American president of unknown citizenship.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:43 am 7. David Thomson:

At this moment, I feel like the only sane man in an insane world. Where is the demand for a criminal investigation of the Obama campaign? Does anybody believe that a Republican presidential candidate would not be facing criminal charges if this occurred in their campaign? Come on, somebody needs to help me out. What am I missing?

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:45 am 8. Paul From Hamburg:

My question is this: When is Good Friday? We will have Palm Sunday on the day Obama is inaugurated. How long will it take his supporters to realize he isn’t the Messiah? It is inevitable that some large portion of his supporters will decide that he is not who they thought he was.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:45 am 9. David Thomson:

“Obama – The first American president of unknown citizenship.”

That is nonsense. Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii. He is an American citizen. We must be cautious with our rhetoric and extremely careful with any charges of criminal misconduct by Barack Obama and his top campaign people. And that’s exactly what I am doing with calling for an investigation into criminal behavior because Obama’s campaign raised illegal money from non-American citizens. The facts are on my side.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:54 am 10. JMS2008:

Nice article. As awed as I feel that finally we have a black president, I am still extremely worried. I am a registered democrat who voted for McCain. I was, frankly, quite confused by the Obamania in this country. What made people think he was qualified to lead us? I never could figure it out, and all my Ivy-league-educated Obama-voting friends whom I asked couldn’t tell me. So, I’m pretty lost now. Obama is a smart man, no doubt. He might have made a great President in 10 years. Will he make a great President now? I just don’t know. I think John McCain would have made an extraordinary President to lead us through our current crises. We needed him, and he was ready on “day one” to serve. And I was not one of those who felt Governor Palin was unqualified. Yes, she was new, and she had a lot to learn, but she was no less qualified to be Vice President than Barack Obama was to be President. What really are his qualifications? Does anyone have any idea what he will actually do? If “Hope” and “Change” constitute sufficient specificity of agenda to get someone elected President of the United States, then we are all treading very murky waters. I guess for me, I just “Hope” that Obama will “Change” his past leanings and govern in the center. But no one can tell me if he will because no one knows.

As for the rest of the world, should we be glad that Osama Bin Laden got his choice? Will we be safe? Will he spare the world more terrorist attacks now that he has finally gotten his wish for a non-republican U.S. President? How about Chavez and Ahmadinejad? Is Obama ready to handle the problems that these people pose to freedom and democracy around the world? Does anyone actually think Joe Biden has something to offer? I desperately hope that I am wrong, and I hope that history shows that Barack Obama was a great President and that all who come after him will have a positive legacy to follow. The first thing Obama can do to quiet my fears would be to ask John McCain to be his Secretary of Defense. I know that is not going to happen, but it would be a step in the direction of helping some of us cope with the uncertainty and apprehension we feel today.

I, personally, wish Barack Obama all the best in tackling our difficult problems at home and abroad. I hope that he can stand up to the extreme left of Pelosi and Reid to govern with his intellect and with an understanding of what the people of our great country have told him they want. You have the power now, President-elect Obama, please use it wisely, for the benefit of all Americans, and with an eye toward preserving democracy and freedom for all people.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:56 am 11. Anton:

So very right Paul,
There is absolutely no way for the “O” to come anywhere near making good on all his promises, or even a respectable fraction of them. For starters you can’t cut taxes for 95% of the people in the country when only 70% actually pay any taxes….it gets worse from there.
I think the Greenies will go after him first, he won’t be able to get anywhere near his promises on carbon-cutting, the technology simply does not exist. And if he really does “bankrupt the coal industry” then the masses will rise up from their cold, darkened homes and go seeking the Pharisees.

Nov 5, 2008 - 9:57 am 12. 888:

Before he can fix the economy and get this country going, he needs to watch these two Canadian made YouTube videos and acknowledge the truth they show about the cause of the housing/banking collapse.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMnSp4qEXNM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:10 am 13. Irish Alex:

@David Thomson
“What am I missing?”
The part where anyone with authority cares. The Democratically Correct Decision has been made. The details are irrelevant. All that’s left is for those who openly supported the Democratically Correct Decision to gloat and those who failed to support the Democratically Correct Decision to scramble to curry favour.

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:16 am 14. view from afar:

Finrod: on the Orange information pages this afternoon (France Telecom’s internet service), the media has already started defending the O, as the markets fell all over Europe (ok CAC, Uk and Germany), and the dollar dropped nearly .02¢ of a euro through out the day, but that had nothing to do with the US elections because the markets have already adjusted to Obama’s being elected over a week ago,(what?) plus the dollar initially went up(not on my desktop)…and these arguments were totally backed up by someone in NY on Wall Street… I mean come on.

Frankly I think those questions will surface only if the O doesn’t march totally instep with the MSM’s worldview, you know, you scratch my back I’ll scratch yours just DON’T STOP Scratching! I keep hoping that the eg-O tied to this man pushes him to the center so he can be re-elected popularly…

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:26 am 15. Sleepless in Chicago:

I was curious to view the dialog on this website after an Obama victory. I am sorry to say it is so disappointing. How little faith you have in the United States to believe that a possible 8 year term of office by anyone in our government of checks and balances could destroy our democratic republic. I want to thank you, in that your insane hyperbole and slash and burn divide and conquer politics helped insure Obamas victory. Americans were concerned with real issues of life. With your crazy McCarthyism, as long as a combination of Charles Manson, John Wayne Gacy and Godzilla did not show up for the debates, your credibility would be destroyed. Americans saw an intelligent articulate level headed guy in now President elect Barack Obama. If you stuck to inexperienced you might have had a shot. You moved away from the center where the majority of the American people live. You did’nt speak to the Reagan Democrats. In the end a majority of Americans did not want to be identified with the likes of you. You win an American election by seeking the center. The fringes of your support have no where else to go. Articulate your vision for America and let the people connect the dots. Americans want a true second opinion in the two party system. You need to be that.

P.S. Now you know what a community organizer does.

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:30 am 16. David Thomson:

“The part where anyone with authority cares”

This attitude virtually guarantees that the Obama administration will be unbelievably corrupt. What has been the norm in Chicago politics for decades—will now be the norm for our nation’s capitol. The fear of being called a racist is likely behind the reluctance to investigate the finance fraud within the Obama campaign. A white Republican presidential candidate would definitely be facing a prison term. This reminds me of the O.J. Simpson trial. “Men of color” are seemingly above the law. There is now tacitly a law for white men and another one for those of color. We are entering a very dangerous period in our nation’s history.

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:32 am 17. Marc Malone:

David Thomson – “Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii.” Almost? That’s what they call a very big IF! Geez! If it gets proven that he is not a natural-born citizen, or if he is legally an Indonesian, do you not preceive the extent of the Constitutional crisis that would engender?

How would that get resolved? Would Biden then become Prez?!? Or would it invalidate the ticket, thereby making McCain Prez? Such an argument would go on for some time. So, would Bush remain in office until it’s resolved? Or, (horrors) would Pelosi move into the office as there would be no Prez?

Chaos would reign. Rioting in the streets. Cats sleeping with dogs…. (gallows humor)

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:40 am 18. David Thomson:

“Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii.” Almost?”

Too much time has been wasted on silliness like the myth that Obama is not an American citizen. We must stay focussed on real issues like campaign finance fraud.

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:58 am 19. Terrence:

“Will the left manage to let go of all of the bile and hatred that has been festering within them for the past eight years?”

Bile and hatred has been a two-way street — the right is as guilty (and sometimes more guilty) as the left. In fact, if you’re really interested in civil discourse, you might want to rethink the tone with which you wrote this post. Many of us have been turned off by years of Rovian low-blows and cheap shots, as you can see by Obama’s election. It doesn’t help you to continue them.

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:10 am 20. Clyde:

Sleepless in Chicago

You are right about Obama’s intelligence and speaking prowess. But are way off on why he won and McCain lost. Obama in no way is a centrists or in the middle, like McCain. Yes, his policies quickly moved to the middle after he defeated Hillary. But his voting record, associations and ideas are as left as they come, and this article states that he will now return to the far-left. Obama won because he brought out a huge black and under-30 voter turnout. In true lawyer fashion, he said anything to convince the jurors (voters) who he is not.

You are also right in the fact that we should shut-up and let him be president. But be warned, if he does in fact do an about-face and return to his liberal-left: No tax cuts, a weakened military, unchecked Russia and Iran, redistribution of wealth, national health care, and the resurrection of Al Qaeda. Let it be known, the public will roar back and conservatism will make a return greater than 1994 when a true moderate democrat named Clinton let his ego and liberal advisors take control of his policies.

And P.S. – Unfortunately all our brave men and women in the military will find out what a community organizer does.

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:13 am 21. mishu:

Sleepless in Chicago:

Yawn! Once again you trot out the horse that’s been beaten for about 55 years. Since Obama’s your guy, do you have *any* answers to the question Ms. Meister’s posed?

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:19 am 22. tom:

his energy policy no drilling, no coal emissions, solar and wind 10 years out and no relief, study don’t build nucleur

look like $5+ gas prices when the dollar falls even more

Israel / Iraq will go big
Russia as well

his health care program will get beat down in the senate

spending will be out of control

no investigation of fannie/freddie cause it’s all dems
they’ll go after a few golden parachutes

the handout mentality mob will be very disillusioned when their checks don’t pan out to much

small business screwed, hard working people taxed big time

this is a major problem
Carter will look like a saint in comparison

God help us

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:22 am 23. Sandy Salt:

Tom,
You hit it on the head. As an American I will stand behind my President, but that doesn’t mean that I will blindly follow him. I took an oath to defend the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic, so I am prepared to do what is necessary to fulfill that oath.

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:38 am 24. Tom H:

Dave Thomson – I’ve really appreciated your thoughts the last couple months, but if you think the MSM has been negligent up to now, wait…these issues will never materialize, anything from the right will be laughed off, anything from the left will be idolized if good, ignored if bad, and please don’t spend the next 4 years working on your ulcer…someone somewhere from the right will have a scathingly brilliant idea and it will catch on eventually

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:54 am 25. Boris:

Anton: You forgot

27. Dogs and cats, living together.

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:57 am 26. David Thomson:

There will also likely be no arrests of the big bosses of ACORN. Only a few $8.00 an hour street people will be punished. Once again, this entirely due to the fact that it is perceived to be a black organization—and we now subtly have a politically correct legal system that refuses to punish these “people of color.” Some fifty years ago white racists knew they could get away with breaking the law. Now we have the situation where black political criminals go unpunished. When will this nonsense cease?

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:58 am 27. Boris:

Sorry, I see marc already reached that level of paranoia. Continue please….

Nov 5, 2008 - 11:59 am 28. JED:

What is the O and the MSM going to do when they don’t have George to blame? Add to that the Greenies who blamed George for global warming? The new presidency cured Bush Derangement Syndrome, now how are they going to take the heat? The campaign was based on repulsion to change. Who owns the O?

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:03 pm 29. Writer Girl:

Bloggers are set to blog for peace November 6, 2008. Don’t miss it!
BlogBlast For Peace ~ How To Participate!

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:05 pm 30. David Thomson:

“but if you think the MSM has been negligent up to now”

This is why we must do everything feasible to bankrupt the MSP (main street propagandists)—and support alternative media outlets like Pajamas Media. The old media is beyond hope. It must be allowed to fade away as quickly as possible. We have a lot of control over the MSP’s future. Our part of its overall audience total is very large. We do have clout if we wish to use it.

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:08 pm 31. HARDBALL:

USA—1776-2008 RIP

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:18 pm 32. HARDBALL:

IT TROUBLES ME AS AVETERIAN WHO GAVE UP FOUR YEARS OF MY LIFE TO DEFEND OUR COUNTRY AND CONSTITUTION, TO SEE IT WAS ALL IN VAIN. HOW LONG BEFORE WE DISTROY OUR CONSTITUTION TO MAKE OTHER COUNTRIES HAPPY?

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:23 pm 33. HARDBALL:

AT THIS DAY AND TIME, IF I HAD TO DO IT AGAIN IWOULD NOT. I WILL NEVER AGAIN. I HAVE ALWAYS BEEN PROUD TO BE AMERICAN. LET THE UNINFORMED VOTERS, LET THE OTHER COUNTRIES REJOYCE. USA-1776-2008.

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:30 pm 34. Joke:

Obama gets elected and the stock market is dropping towards 500 down.

/its all Obamas fault

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:43 pm 35. fear Obama:

Russian troops with 250 mile range rockets and nuke capability’s are positioning themselves for engagement around Georgia.
Israel is preparing to kick Iran nuclear ass with possible Russian retaliation.

all those young people weeping and crying for joy at Bambi’s election party will Shiite when their young fuhrer has to reinstate the Draft.

Nov 5, 2008 - 12:55 pm 36. misanthropicus:

“Medvedev announces in a speech the deployment of rockets in Kaliningrad” (formerly Konigsberg, the little enclave in Germany at the Baltic Sea) – Reuters, 12:45 PST.

Hurrah! Obama won and we’re liked! Hey – wait a second! Rockets in Kaliningrad? (Konigsberg, an eclave in Germany, for the geographically challenged Obamaphiles). Bush’s gone and the Russians are still at it? So are the Iranians? And all others?
I am confused, I thought that Bush caused all these! We are not liked again? THAT fast?
Confused in California

Nov 5, 2008 - 1:01 pm 37. Will Becker:

It was a corrupt campain,so why would it not be a corrupt presidency?

Nov 5, 2008 - 1:07 pm 38. 888:

Jed, they will say that they ‘inherited’ the economy and the housing collapse from Bush. Of course, the below videos show that the Administration and Republicans repeatedly tried to regulate F&F, but were derailed by Barney Frank and several black Congressmen — yes, BLACK Congressmen whether you want to hear that or not. It’s not a racist thing; it’s a truth thing. And, I’m a female of color, too, but I’m sick and tired of the racist African-Americans in America who think they can get away with anything and just blame America’s problems on the ‘white man’. It is not right that there’s a set of laws and standards for one race, and not for another. White people have to tiptoe everytime they speak their mind because others might consider their statement ignorant, disrespectful, insensitive or racist.

I’m married to a white man, and our mixed-race 11 year old son one day was walking around a grocery store and he was joking out loud with me about something and he said, “There’s goes the neighborhood.” No one heard the first parts of his story, which had absolutely no racial undertones whatsoever, but once the caucasians and blacks heard that one sentence about the neighborhood, everyone looked at my son like they were going to kill him. And I have to admit, I was embarrassed that my son said that sentence, too, even though he didn’t mean anything racial about it.

And that is where this country has come. The white man or non-black has to walk on egg shells, but the black man or woman can scream anything they want and even perpetrate fraudulent voting acts, and the law and their neighbors will protect them. But not the white man. Reverse discrimination, reverse affirmative action died decades ago. And that, my friends, is just downright unfair, unconstitutional and goes against civil rights and what Martin Luther King wanted as a color-blind society.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMnSp4qEXNM

Nov 5, 2008 - 1:08 pm 39. malclave:

“Bile and hatred has been a two-way street — the right is as guilty (and sometimes more guilty) as the left. In fact, if you’re really interested in civil discourse, you might want to rethink the tone with which you wrote this post. Many of us have been turned off by years of Rovian low-blows and cheap shots, as you can see by Obama’s election.”

I’ll believe that you might have a point when and if the left stops criticizing Palin for being a woman who doesn’t toe the leftist line. At least as of this morning, the insults are still going strong.

If you were turned off by “low-blows and cheap shots”, there is no way you would have voted Democrat.

Nov 5, 2008 - 1:25 pm 40. Shef Rogers:

What I’m wondering right now is whether all the pundits who promised us the election would turn out just fine will man up and admit they were either lying or just plain stupid. Roger Kimball, you want to go first?

Nov 5, 2008 - 1:47 pm 41. Cheesehead:

Ha ha ha ha ha!!!!! You guys a priceless. Do you honestly take yourselves seriously???

Obama has been the most vetted candidate in recent history. Bewteen the Clinton’s and the Rove machine, nobody was able to make anything stick.

Remember your own teflon president? The man who sold weapons to a sworn enemy of the state? Funded illegal groups in South America and got away with it??

Payback is a pain in the rear ain’t it !

Nov 5, 2008 - 2:06 pm 42. Войска ПВО:

David Thomson writes:

“That is nonsense. Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii.”

..almost certainly? Get serious, you mean even a disciple like you is not sure? I mean, the man and his campaign just released oodles and oodles of documentation to prove this, did he not?

..oh, he didn’t? I’m confused.

Nov 5, 2008 - 2:55 pm 43. Войска ПВО:

David Thomson, forgive me, I just read your other posts and mistook your sentiments. Your point is taken.

Sorry.

Вилиам Финизый,
капита́н авиа́ции

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:04 pm 44. Joseph Marshall:

When you have an Electoral College defeat of these proportions there is only one word to describe your candidates, your party, and your cause:

Failure.

McCain needed to sell himself to everyone else but you, and he really didn’t have anything to sell, except what happened to him 35 years ago in a prison camp. There was no reason on earth to believe that such a salespitch would work with anyone who was not already a convinced supporter.

Here are the seven crucial mistakes that cost John McCain this election:

Mistake Number One: McCain decided to campaign to elect Nobama rather than McCain.

McCain tried to campaign against Obama in exactly the same way as Clinton did. Hillary Clinton lost because Nobama wasn’t on the ballot. So did McCain. Throughout this entire election, no one seemed to notice that it wasn’t working. The self-indulgent and addictive appetite among conservatives for slash, trash, and burn campaigning eats away your judgment to the point that it destroys the political feedback loop.

Mistake Number Two: McCain failed to define his vision for the country as soon as he had clinched the nomination.

Because of the long struggle of Clinton with Obama, McCain had three full months to establish his campaign message. McCain could have spread his message widely and well–if he had had a message to spread. He took absolutely no advantage of this. McCain consistently acted as if he were an incumbent President who already had a public track record. He wasn’t.

Mistake Number Three: McCain was not ready to campaign aggressively against Obama after Obama had clinched the Democratic nomination.

Hillary Clinton suspended her campaign on June 4th. Obama’s national numbers then proceeded to take off like a rocket through June, easily reaching a 9% lead.

McCain’s campaign wasn’t prepared to do anything about it. They just sat and let it happen. Obama’s lead waxed and waned, but he never substantially lost it from that point forward. In many ways, McCain actually lost the election on that first week in June. From that point forward, Obama’s poll numbers never fell below 46% and McCain penetrated above 45% only once for the rest of the campaign.

Mistake Number Four: From beginning to end McCain’s negative ads failed to present him as a clear alternative to Obama, and were also poorly timed.

McCain’s ads had nothing to say in support of his own candidacy—all they did was give people progressively nastier reasons to vote for Nobama. Success at this stems from seizing the opposing candidate’s image from him before he has had time to define it for himself. Obama already had full control of his image by the time Hillary Clinton had retired from the field. The time to field such advertising was, at the very latest, mid-May.

The polling evidence indicates that only one of these ads was effective: the “celebrity” ad with Paris Hilton and Brittany Spears, which appeared about July 1.

Moreover, this ad actually had far more effect on the “toss up” states than on Obama’s popular vote lead; consequently, the lack of serious follow up was easily blunted by the DNC bounce. Also, the campaign made another major mistake fielding the Hillary Clinton ads during the DNC, when Hillary herself could effectively reply to them, rather than after the RNC to push McCain’s bounce.

Further. McCain violated the two most imporant rules of the master of attack politics and wedge issues: Karl Rove. First, before you put up any attack ads, you have to unequivocally establish a positive view of your candidate and your brand. Second, you must never let your candidate’s name appear on the attack ads. They always must appear to come from a source outside the official campaign, such as the Swiftboat Veterans.

At the end of every ad what we always heard was, “I’m John McCain and I approved this message.” And, frankly, that’s just about all he let us know that he approved of or that he thought. He’d put his own name on them, so he had to own the tactic. That, with his uneven performance–and barely controlled temper–through the debates poisoned his brand for exactly the people he had to reach to win—the wavering and undecided.

Mistake Number Five: The McCain campaign was slovenly, unfocused, and disordered at the ground game level.

Obama’s campaign manager, David Plouffe, put together the best volunteer campaign organization and the best fundraisng machine of the last 50 years. Close-up here in Ohio, it was amazing to watch. It was as if Karl Rove had been coaching the Howard Dean campaign and had put them on steriods.

McCain’s grassroots efforts were laughable in comparison: closed or empty offices, small knots of volunteers shooting the bull about how bad Obama is instead of manning the phone banks, and nobody knocking on neighborhood doors.

Mistake Number Six: McCain’s campaign did not handle Sarah Palin properly, turning her from an asset into a liability.

McCain’s VP choice was a startling tactical manuver and a potential game-changer, and his staff wrote a bang-up speech for her to read off the teleprompter at the RNC. The choice of Palin actually gained McCain a very brief 3% national lead for the space of about a week.

This was absolutely the best time to share his vision for America–when he had everybody’s attention on his acceptance speech—and, again, he didn’t use it to sell himself. Nobody else who spoke for him had anything to sell him on either, except for his POW stint and “drill baby drill”.

The drilling issue won him 3-4 news cycles and that was it. Anyone with eyes could see that it would soon vanish like a stone into water. Every other tit-for-tat point [such as the “lipstick” silliness] fared exactly the same way. Without something substantial behind them, they were mere pointless pinpricks.

But, after investing the entire campaign in Palin, McCain and his staff should have realized two things: that Palin was not ready for prime time, and that she would become a large target if she made a single misstep.

They let her interview without effective preparation, and she blew away the entire advantage McCain had reaped from choosing her. McCain’s slide down, and Obama’s climb up began from the middle of the McCain lead and never ended.

And, despite the pontificating of the pundits, the Wall Street meltdown had no discernable effect on the popular vote numbers. Where it did matter was the EV totals in the “toss up” states.

After the first debate, every prior loss by Obama, and every prior gain by McCain was completely wiped out. McCain’s campaign was starting from scratch with Palin as a liability instead of an asset. McCain absolutely was toast from that first debate forward, though no pundit had the nerve to call it.

As a footnote, Obama’s informercial actually appears to have had some effect, perhaps an increase of as much as 1.5%, on the final poll totals.

Mistake Number Seven: In the last weeks of the campaign every tactic used by the McCain campaign did nothing but communicate their desperation and alienate a majority of voters.

The open concession of Michigan, and Palin’s disagreement with it, devastatingly appeared on the front pages across the United States. The ads and appearances should have been scaled back quietly, and without fanfare.

Also, at the end, he and Palin wasted too much time, effort, and money in states such as PA where the odds of winning were small, and didn’t pay enough mind to the states that were both clearly within his reach and absolutely crucial to an EV victory: OH, NC, MO, NV, FL, CL, MN.

Your encouragement of him to “take the gloves” off about Ayers doing something that happened almost forty years ago also was foolish. Nobody but you cared about it. It raised McCain’s numbers only two points from his nadir of 42% and impeded Obama not at all.

Because interacting charges of “stolen elections” have become routine in our politics, the whooped up outrage over ACORN barely touched the public, either. Remember Sore Loserman? People care, but when it is brought up so late in the game, it merely reads as a last ditch tactic, which it was.

George W. Bush and the Republican led Congress of 2002-2006 have so badly damaged your brand that any of your candidates now have to start completely over with persuading non-Republicans of anything. Unfortunately, you have nothing to persuade anyone about.

John McCain started nowhere, went nowhere, and finished nowhere. And you really did nothing to help him along the way. But then the global story is that Conservatism as a whole is intellectually bankrupt, and largely reduced to hawking an anti-intellectual class war between “real Americans” like Joe The Plumber and the Eastern Elites & MSM.

It’s all good clean fun. But it’s no longer effective politics.

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:09 pm 45. Anonymous - San Francisco:

I live in SF and I haven’t moved so I didn’t think there would be any problem with my registration but I called on the last day to register just to make sure – they told me they canceled my registration and when I asked why they said I’m registered in several different places and when I give him by address he said that my address had been changed. They never sent me a notice about it in the mail so I didn’t know.

About a week before that I received a phone call but they didn’t leave a message – I didn’t recognize the number but when I looked up the area code it was Ohio and I don’t know anyone there but they left a message asking if I had registered to vote there. I just tried to call the number but it’s been disconnected. I think they might have been looking for people who don’t usually vote in elections and they vote for us. It could be Democrats or Republicans – I don’t know but something seems very wrong with Obama’s campaign. They won’t give people information – McCain provided all the names of his donors but they refuse. He won’t provide complete medical records so we could have a President who is crazy. He won’t provide his senate records.

I’m a Democrat and feel this is a very frightening time to be in this country – I don’t think Obama is evil or horrible. But I do think people surrounding him are horrible and we don’t know who those people are. Also Valerie Jarrett was born in Iran, could some of his foreign donations come from Iran? Maybe I just have too much time on my hands and should stop thinking about it so much.

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:13 pm 46. Terry Gain:

“Rovian low-blows and cheap shots”

This is the product of self-deluded pure fantasy. List these low blows and cheap shots or STFU.

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:31 pm 47. Cheesetundra:

If the McCain who gave that concession speech had been the one on the campaign trail he would have won.

However, the GOP lost, BIG TIME, and the first step to recovery is to admit you have a problem. When the GOP admits it has only themselves to blame they’ll take the first step.

The next is for conservatives to take back thier party from the neo-cons. The neo-con philosophy is that it’s best to keep the country deeply divided and suspicious of each other. No issues, all fear. The people get tired of that, and they did.

A few names the GOP would be wise to get behind now and give a more prominant nationwide role to; Paul Ryan (WI), Tim Pawlenty (MN), Booby Jindal (LA).

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:31 pm 48. Cheesetundra:

Sorry!! I MEANT BOBBY JINDAL!!!!

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:31 pm 49. Terry Gain:

David Thomson

As someone who is on the same side as you in the left/right struggle I am mystified why you want to dismiss legitimate inquiry into Obama’s birthplace?

Given your strong statements in other comment threads I thought you had actually investigated the issue and had seen conclusive evidence that he was born in Hawaii. That is, until I saw your statement that he was almost certainly born there.

That he would run even if not aligible seems no more preposterous to me than he would disable the AVS system on credit card payments and thus open his campaign coffers to illegal contributions.

No one should make allegations without evidence but asking for proof of citizenship in all of the circumstances is not inappropriate.

And your demand for an investigation into whether there was campaign funding fraud is most appropriate.

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:41 pm 50. Billy Yank:

@Anton

27. Stepping up measures against global warming as we slip into a “little ice age”. solarcycle24.org

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:43 pm 51. Peter the Sub Guy:

15. Sleepless in Chicago wrote:
P.S. Now you know what a community organizer does.

Peter responds:
They commit election fraud and steal elections?

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:44 pm 52. Terry Gain:

“I’m a Democrat and feel this is a very frightening time to be in this country – I don’t think Obama is evil or horrible. But I do think people surrounding him are horrible ”

Please. Why does he get a pass? Is he a child? Why isn’t he responsible for the actions of his campaign?

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:45 pm 53. Terry Gain:

Number 12 888

A campaign which failed to repeatedly draw these videos to the attention of the public is, by any reasonable standard, grossly incompetent.

McCain had no trouble telling lies about Romney but couldn’t bring himself to tell the truth about Obama.

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:48 pm 54. Jeff Tyler:

Obama has received only 52% of the popular vote, despite all of his investmets and media bias. So as long as we learn from this election and use it as opportunity to rebuild the conservative movement and actually turn into something much more meangful than it is today, we can still prevent he worst things from happening.

http://drslogan.wordpress.com/2008/11/05/its-over-or-is-it/

Nov 5, 2008 - 3:54 pm 55. Anonymous - San Francisco:

Joseph Marshall:

The reason Obama’s campaign was more effective is because he had more money than any candidate in American history and he had the media focusing on the cost of Palin’s wardrobe instead of asking questions about him. They had a thousand reporters in AK searching for dirt in Palin but nobody can find anyone who knew him at Columbia or has seen copies of his college transcripts or found out who wired Rezko the money to buy the empty lot next to Obama’s home. If McCain had that much money he wouldn’t have had to leave MI, he could have spent more money getting his message out, he could have had a commercial – that is the reason we have public financing. So that corrupt politicians can’t buy elections just because they have more money. If you think Americans donated almost $700 million to him during a horrible economy then you believe in the tooth fairy also.

He also had a team of lawyers threatening people – that is why the FEC refuses to make him provide names for everyone who donated money to his campaign. He did not win because he had a better team – he won because he had more money – case closed.

The media made sure he was elected – they spent more time on the amount of money Palin spent for her wardrobe then trying to find out why nobody knew him at Columbia or how he never been involved with a women prior to his wife – either those women had been told not to talk to anyone or his is hiding something. It might seem trivial to you but these are all MAJOR WARNING SIGNS that someone is hiding something.

Also they told us Ayers isn’t important but I believe Obama knew Ayers when he was at Columbia – Ayers was in the SAME neighborhood and so was Dorn although Dorn had some “time off” when she went to prison because she wouldn’t testify about what she knew about a robbery where people were killed. His wife worked at the SAME firm as Dorn in Chicago – Obama worked there also. Are you really telling me these people didn’t know each other before he was on a board with Ayers?

You can stop congratulating Democrats – they didn’t have a better team. They used money, intimidation and the media to get their candidate elected.

Nov 5, 2008 - 4:04 pm 56. Chip:

“fear Obama wrote:

Russian troops with 250 mile range rockets and nuke capability’s are positioning themselves for engagement around Georgia.
Israel is preparing to kick Iran nuclear ass with possible Russian retaliation.

all those young people weeping and crying for joy at Bambi’s election party will Shiite when their young fuhrer has to reinstate the Draft.”

I was thinking much of the same…………

I’m afraid that if you look at the voting block that put Obama in the lead for good, you will find a bunch of women who were livid about 4,500 casualties in Iraq. The same women who drive around with cell phones strapped to their ears and have caused over 87,000 traffic deaths since 2003 simply due to negligence while driving with a cell phone.

Pre-WWII Germany was the same. Women voted for Hitler in much higher numbers than did the men. Those women wanted security, in the form of gun control, and socialism in the labor force.

If you looked at the crowd last night cheering for Obama, the only difference between speeches that aroused Nazi Germany and the speech in Chicago was the racial makeup of the audience. People falling all over themselves without a clue as to how destructive the policies of their leader might turn out to be.

Sig Heil…Yes We Can…Sig Heil…Yes We Can…Sig Heil…Yes We Can…

Now comes the reality!!!

Nov 5, 2008 - 4:09 pm 57. Cheesetundra:

Excuses.

“You can stop congratulating Democrats – they didn’t have a better team. They used money, intimidation and the media to get their candidate elected.”

Which is exactly how Bush won twice. Time to get over it.

Obama has been vetted probably more than any other candidate in modern history. Just becuase the process didn’t support your conspiracy theories doesn’t mean it didn’t work. Between Clinton and the Rove protege’s in McCains campaign do you honestly think there was anything not looked into?

Give me a break, The GOP will NEVER recover as long as this kind of paranoia controls them.

Want to know how the GOP can recover? http://www.americanroadmap.org They can start putting people like Rep Ryan in leadrship positions.

Nov 5, 2008 - 4:14 pm 58. Anonymous - San Francisco:

I didn’t vote for Bush – I have never voted for a Republican so I don’t care how they won their elections. The point is Obama was SUPPOSED to represent CHANGE although now that Axelrod say they will allow lobbyists in their administration and he made a former lobbyist his chief of staff we know the CHANGE he was talking about.

Although Clinton did find out some information about him, the media didn’t report on it. I actually know people who have never heard of Ayers, don’t know exactly what Wright said and thought that we did have copies of all his college transcripts and senate records.

Instead of making excuses why don’t you answer the question – why do you think he won’t let anyone see his medical records, college transcripts or talk to anyone who knew him in college? I won’t expect an answer.

I won’t insult him for making foolish choices in college – we all did that. I won’t insult him if he had bad grades.I don’t mind any of that – what I mind is the HIDING and that makes me think there is more we don’t know.

Nov 5, 2008 - 4:38 pm 59. susan:

cheesetundra, if you are not worried that someone hangs out with political terrorist and racist individuals it’s your personal lack of morals.

I guess black people are ok with racism when it’s directed to whites.

Nov 5, 2008 - 4:39 pm 60. Marc Malone:

Joseph Marshall – Actually, I think you made many good points. There were a few underlying flawd to some of them.

McCain is required by law to put his name after any campaign ad he runs. He had no surrogates to run these for him. There were some independent groups, but the campaign laws forbade McCain from coordinating with them. McCain played by the rules.

There was some real evidence that Obama’s campaign manager and his promotion company actually made a lot of the videos that went viral on the net. No claim was made as to who created these spurious, nasty videos, but tracking back the URL’s eventually showed whence they came. Illegal, but it kept Obama’s skirts clean.

As for message, he had a message, but it simply didn’t resonate in these times. The Pub message is always the same: Those things that are good for the long-term (values). Obama lied his face off. The media refused to call him on it. When McCain tried, he gets blasted for “negative ads”. Besides that, the Pub message didn’t resonate this time, because people have become responsive to populist messages. McCain tried to out-populist Obama… an impossibility.

McCain was fighting with two arms and a leg tied behind his back: the media giving Obama a free pass; an unpopular Prez and wars, ’cause Bush refuses to defend himself; and fighting fair.

Nov 5, 2008 - 4:44 pm 61. malclave:

“Obama has been the most vetted candidate in recent history.”

Problem is, the people who should have been looking into his background on behalf of the voters (the media) were mostly functioning as part of his campaign. Those that weren’t were unable to gain any traction.

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:18 pm 62. Anonymous:

“cheesetundra, if you are not worried that someone hangs out with political terrorist and racist individuals it’s your personal lack of morals.

I guess black people are ok with racism when it’s directed to whites.”

So did McCain. What’s your point? Those are all overblown anyway. Which is another reason McCain lost. Obviously many Americans don’t care either. Even in Rep states like IN, NC, OH, CO, NV……

You can keep clinging to that all you want, but it’s a red herring. It’s been fully vetted and investigated for a year and a half, and it has amounted to nothing.

Like it or not, Obama is your president. So either you can accept it and move on, or as so many of the GOP said in 2004 to Kerry supporters, move to another country. i suggest you move on and work to get the party back to actual GOP values instead of dwelling on manufactured “problems”….

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:28 pm 63. Anonymous - San Francisco:

Although many people probably won’t agree with me, I think this is going to the worse thing to happen to black people in a long time. First of all, the life of most blacks won’t improve in this country – there have been studies done in cities that elect black politicians and they have found that the black community often isn’t better off after they’re elected. This is what I think is what is happening and I don’t mind if people think I’m wrong. There are a tiny number of black people who will benefit from AA including Obama and his wife who got degrees from the most expensive colleges in the world and although they claim they only recently paid off their college loans, when journalists asked Michelle for proof she wouldn’t give it to them. We don’t know their grades so it’s impossible to know if they were accepted over more qualified candidates but since neither of them will release their transcripts then I can assume they did. But many other black people will never escape inner cities, that horrible poverty where it’s almost impossible to get out. Only a few people benefit from AA – it doesn’t change anything for most of the other people.

But imagine you’re at a company interviewing candidates.

Candidate #1 – qualified, many years of experience, has worked in the industry before, older white woman.

Candidate #2 – probably qualified although refuses to provide references from previous job, only a few years experience, not that much experience in the industry, black man.

Who do you think gets the job and what message does that send to employees at the company? Candidate #1 is Clinton and Candidate #2 is Obama – if you loook at their policies they’re the same. I once read an article with their policies listed side by side and they were EXACTLY THE SAME. If Obama was white he would never have been elected because people would have been more critical and Axelrod knew this – it’s why he knew he could win with a black candidate.

I think people will begin to resent the fact that Obama got a free pass because of his race and this will manifest itself in very subtle ways when people companies are hiring people.

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:29 pm 64. Cheesetundra:

“cheesetundra, if you are not worried that someone hangs out with political terrorist and racist individuals it’s your personal lack of morals.

I guess black people are ok with racism when it’s directed to whites.”

That story has been dragged out by the GOP for a year and a half, has been vetted and investigated more than any other, and guess what, it failed miserably. Obama won states like IN and NC for pete sakes. He polled over 40$ in Texas! The people of America obviously don’t care about these manufactured “problems” This is politics. It’s not like the GOP doesn’t have it’s fair share of criminals and racists…

Obama is your president, so you can either accept it and move on, or move to another country.

I suggest if you actually want to help restore the GOP you start working to pick up the pieces and get the GOP back to it’s core values.

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:33 pm 65. Cheesetundra:

One big suggestion for the GOP too. Get over the media thing.

When y ou run such a negative campaign, not focused on issues, and lie your butts off, the media is gonna pay more attention to you. The media didn’t give Obama a free pass, the GOP just made a better target.

They gave Bush a free pass through his whole first election and term, and into his second.

The media thing is just another manufactured excuse for the GOP not to have to take resposibility for itself.

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:36 pm 66. sean birnie:

Once he’s president the media, after the honeymoon phase, will become interested. He will be the only target in town that the useful idiots in the msm have left to attack. Assuming, with hopeful audacity, that he won’t be able to pull a Lenin and put them up against the wall or send them to a Gulag, we can expect, suddenly, all sorts of brave investigative reporting cos after all, the President represents the Man and it’s always “Down with the Man”.

Expect big fun and hey, let’s help them.

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:44 pm 67. Bob:

There will be no answers to the tough questions, even if you can ask them without MSM (aka, Obama’s Ministry of Propaganda) investigating you.

The people of America have spoken – they have said they are afraid of liberty and don’t care who will lead them so long as he is not GWB

A lousy reason to vote for anyone, let alone a Marxist.

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:52 pm 68. proud elitist:

Obama was born in Hawaii. His birth certificate was released in May and authenticated. If this was truly the red herring you want it to be, the Republicans would have uncovered it. As would Hillary et al.

Sadly, none of the 4 candidates released full medical records (McCain and Biden released some; Obama and Palin had doctor’s notes). I still believe we should have full medical histories for our President (candidates) and VP.

susan — your words are always disheartening to me. your bigotry, racism and misguidedness…

Out of curiosity, susie, do you agree with Palin’s backtracking when in breath 1 saying Ayers was a terrorist and in breath 2 not applying that term to those who bomb abortion clinics? do you think colin powell was a liar when he said that he chose obama because of who he was instead of his skin color?

why are YOU bringing race into this? And, for that matter, why can’t African Americans (former SLAVES, former 3/5 persons) be proud of voting for Obama? Why can’t they be happy that after starting in this nation as SLAVES, an African American has ascended to the presidency?

And he’s not the first A-A who has run for President as a Democrat. Sharpton, McKinney, etc.

Republicans, on the other hand, do have an A-A problem. How many prominent A-A republicans are there? Why is that?

How can a white congressman from Georgia use the word “uppity” and try to deny its connotation? Ask a person from Georgia what “uppity” means. Ask them what the FULL phrase is.

Ask yourself why George Allen could lose a Senate seat to Jim Webb after his “Macacca” moment?

Nov 5, 2008 - 5:58 pm 69. susan:

cheesetundra, i couldn’t care less, he’s not my president, i am not american, you will have to live with the consequences of your actions. I am saddened that the president of usa is a full blown racist that is ashamed to be american. Strange also that he’s got such low esteem of white people considering his black father left him for polygamy and booze in kenya, and he had to be raised by a grandmother he despised except when it suited him.

Black people in america really needs to get a grip and face the fact that they cannot use the whites as victimhood card. They are responsible for their own faults.

If his voters doesn’t care, that says a lot about the people voting democrat. All the people on the left bring up the subject of morals only when it suited them, but this is not necessarily a good thing.

As far as vetting, your objectivity is equal to zerobama capacity to articulate far from the teleprompter. Null.

Truth is that any white person from the GOP with the same background would have been disqualified even for running as mayor of a small town but you want to believe the hype and be as deluded as possible.

You will find out the hard way, that the people running america aren’t the ones with the open hand asking for government handouts or the drugged celebrities in hollywood.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:11 pm 70. misanthropicus:

Re David Thomson Re “Obama – The first American president of unknown citizenship.”
“That is nonsense. Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii. He is an American citizen. We must be cautious with our rhetoric and extremely careful with any charges of criminal misconduct by Barack Obama and his top campaign people. [...]”

David Thomson, HOW do you know that Barry Soetero IS a naturally born US citizen? The only line of proof here is Howard Dean and the DNC as vetting party – hardly a trustworthy crew.
Then – why Soetoro doesn’t put the matter to rest by allowing his papers be examinated by an impartial legal team? The cost of this, financially AND! politically is surely less than the incoming political cost of this un-resoved matter – and be sure that Soetero’s citizenship status will appear soon as an legitimate issue. Or, in case you do believe that the Daily Kos is a credible, impartial forensic analyst – I beg to differ here.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:17 pm 71. susan:

and “They gave Bush a free pass through his whole first election and term, and into his second. ”

if you think that any democrat president (who? gore? LOL) could have performed better than bush after 9-11 with better ways on how to survive the crisis you are seriously deluded.

Remember that at the democratic convention, those twats performed a standing ovation for Ingrid Matson, a muslim representative that usually calls for the murder of jews.

I bet zerobama has no problem hanging out with this kind of people.

If it makes no difference for you, point taken, I suppose some germans in the 30s thought exactly the same.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:19 pm 72. malclave:

“has been vetted and investigated more than any other”

Repeating it doesn’t make it true.

“The media didn’t give Obama a free pass.”

True. The were actively promoting him. I read enough “news” articles in the newspaper to convince me of that. Even if they tried not to be too blatant about it, you could tell by their choice of words… and choice of words is their business.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:20 pm 73. cedarford:

Marc Malone:
David Thomson – “Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii.” Almost? That’s what they call a very big IF! Geez! If it gets proven that he is not a natural-born citizen, or if he is legally an Indonesian, do you not preceive the extent of the Constitutional crisis that would engender?

The election is over. Anyone still pushing a “Truther” story that Obama is not a real citizen should have an “IDIOT ALERT!!” tag on their post.

The most kindly thing that can be said is that they are not pushing a partisan lie about Obama they know is a lie to scare the ignorant = but are actually ignorant of US citizenship laws.

For the ones still ignorant of citizenship laws:

1. jus solis citizenship of the happenstance of birth on US soil. Conferred on children of people legally on US soil without countervailing diplomatic arrangements . Some legal questions have yet to be concluded in court about children born of illegal aliens. In Obama’s case, there is no question about his birth on US soil in Hawaii, except with Truthers. Confirmed by birth certificate, by records showing marriage cert. and then school attendence by Obama’s parents when born.

2. Even if he was born on a UFO that had kidnapped Mrs Obama, he STILL would be a full, unquestioned citizen because he had jus sanguinis citizenship. He was born of blood relation to at least one US citizen. That issue has long been resolved legally, and past Presidential candidates have been born in foreign countries or outside any State in US territories to at least one US citizen. (George Romney, Mexico/Barry Goldwater, Arizona Territory).

3. Citizenship can be renounced, but only when a person legally a US citizen personally goes through a process of renouncement with the US State Department after they reach age 18. Quite obviously, there was never any past story of Obama doing that, and no State Dept records show Obama attempting to renounce citizenship.

Just a caution for pajamasmedia – any poster attempting to deny President Obama legitimacy as a citizen are stupid, dishonest, or both.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:22 pm 74. misanthropicus:

Re Terry Gain RE Number 12 888:
“A campaign which failed to repeatedly draw these videos to the attention of the public is, by any reasonable standard, grossly incompetent. McCain had no trouble telling lies about Romney but couldn’t bring himself to tell the truth about Obama.”

Excellent point, Terry, and while I voted for McCain, since last spring (after McCain disavowed the N. Caroline Wright ad), I had the premonition that I march with Ross Perot – another big low was a month ago, when on ABC on “View” Whoopy Goldberg aggressively asked McCain: “Should I fear that I will be put in chains again?”
And he sat there, completely paralyzed, insted of WALKING OUT from the studio – yes, walking out, that would have been the right answer for this continuous racial blackmail.
But… here we are in the rain, much resembling the Perotiens in 1992.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:31 pm 75. Lynn:

UH OH, there are already rumblings in “the party of unity”. It seems “The ONE” or “that one” has the leftists in an uproar. He’s gone too far to the center. Today Pelosi made the same statement, governing from the center. HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:38 pm 76. Anonymous - San Francisco:

I believe he is a citizen but obviously he is hiding something – even you have to realize that. His birth certificate isn’t been looked at by an impartial person yet and there are lawsuits about it. There has never been a lawsuit in the entire history of this country because a President won’t let anyone see his birth certificate so why don’t you think he will let people look at it? At my company if people try to email or fax us a copy of their birth ceritificate we won’t accept it – they MUST bring it to us in person. Why do you think Obama is requesting the courts keep the records sealed? I really want to know what his supporters think the reason is for this.

He obviously is a citizen – I think he is hiding something but it’s not that. Maybe he isn’t related to the people he says he is – although that is a really trivial issues it would be a major problem for him because his image is based on it.

Can any of his supporters tell me why they think he wants the records sealed?

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:40 pm 77. misanthropicus:

RE Cheesetundra: “[...] Obama has been vetted probably more than any other candidate in modern history. [...]

Cheesetundra, what kind of cheese you eat in your lovely Yakutia or Verhoiansk I don’t know, but it sure works better than peyote – keep hallucinating, buddy, about Obama being vetted, keep hallucinating.
And for in case you might re-enter reality – the Soetero and many other pertinent matters are far for being resoved – they are just BUC (Bulging Under Carpet) and eventually will come to closer scrutiny. Then you’ll need more peyote – apologize, cheesetundra.
P.S. A tip: check with Oliver Stone, he’s always got super peyote – you two are a great match, maybe you write together a script about Frank Marshall Davis and Sydney Dunham-Soetero.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:48 pm 78. susan:

cedar ford, I too think that obummer will make so many disasters that his birth certificate is the last thing we need to search but at a certain point he travelled from indonesia to pakistan, in a time when you could only do it with an indonesian passport.

having double citizenship is not permitted.

BTW, his other aunt or grandmother in kenya confirms he was born in kenya and she was present during the birth.

Make of that what you will, I might agree that the obama family is made of compulsive liars.

Nov 5, 2008 - 6:51 pm 79. misanthropicus:

RE cedarford RE Marc Malone/David Thomson:

“[...] The election is over. Anyone still pushing a “Truther” story that Obama is not a real citizen should have an “IDIOT ALERT!!” tag on their post. The most kindly thing that can be said is that they are not pushing a partisan lie about Obama they know is a lie to scare the ignorant = but are actually ignorant of US citizenship laws.
[...] Just a caution for pajamasmedia – any poster attempting to deny President Obama legitimacy as a citizen are stupid, dishonest, or both. [...]

Mighty impressed Cedarford – and also your (and your Daily Kos & HuffPo fellows) irate tone when this issue appears makes me believe that there is more than a rotten cedar cheese stinking under the Soetero issue.
By the way, you are the second Daily Kos troll on this PJM thread with a cheese name as “nome de guerre” – cheesetundra and cedarford! Can you explain why they code you in the The One’s Trolling Depot before departure with deli names?
Confused in california -

Nov 5, 2008 - 7:06 pm 80. Anonymous - San Francisco:

I spent about a year on HuffPo because of massive boredom at my job and lack of motivation to a get new one and these are my observations.

The most hateful, nasty, misogynistic, offensive, vindictive people I have ever encountered anywhere. It was clear during the primaries that they were promoting Obama and not Clinton but the hatred towards Clinton was shocking – it got so bad that they claimed Republicans trolls were responsible for it. But I knew they were not because I have lots of time in my boring job so I kept track of about a hundred people there. If they were Republican trolls they shouldn’t have been having other discussions there about how important recycling and the environment is and also celebrating when Obama got the nomination. They were obviously Obama supporters.

Also they have to approve anything you post similar to here – they would delete anything negative towards Obama yet consistently allowed people to say the most horrible things about Clinton and Palin – I’m really just shocked at how misogynistic they were. Even if the place was filled with Republican trolls they decided to publish insults towards other politicians and not Obama intentionally.

I knew almost immediately that Obama had staff working there and although I will never be able to prove this to anyone I believe HuffPo is part of Obama’s online campaign and people were being paid to post there. Although that might not seem important, it really is because if they were using that place for campaigning then they’re responsible for all the offensive, hateful behavior there. I finally couldn’t take it anymore so I left but about a month ago when it was clear Obama was going to win they added a tab for Chicago but not any other city so I asked people if Huffpo was part of Obama’s campaign and they told me it was. If his campaign had people working there they should have told people that – it’s a place that is frequently quoted by the media both in print and TV and it’s the responsibility of newspapers to tell people “we’re quoting something from Obama’s online campaign” so that people know that it’s not objective.

I’m not a Republican and I’ve heard they can be just as bad but if this is the future of the Democratic party, then I have lost all hope for our future.

Nov 5, 2008 - 7:36 pm 81. The Wide Awake Cafe » “The Longest Wet Kiss in American History”:

[...] was more of an invention of the media, a hollow man with a [...]

Nov 5, 2008 - 7:42 pm 82. misanthropicus:

TO Pam Meister: “President-elect Obama. It’ll take some getting used to”
Nice piece, Pam and I agree with your views on things. As far as the above lead, a little, anticipative comment:

Rick Moran, a few days ago, had a deeply felt piece in his blog about the inner turmoil a Republican/conservative has to contend with when confronted with the prospect of Obama/a liberal being his/her president, and tearfully concluded that since Obama would be his president, he would support him… etc. etc…
Very touching and engrossing piece and probably many readers of republican persuasion of his blog felt (I mean FELT!) the same way, which is very noble. However, I think Ann Coulter has a better grasp of reality – here is the conclusion of her latest:

“[...] For now, we have a new president-elect. In the spirit of reaching across the aisle, we owe it to the Democrats to show their president the exact same kind of respect and loyalty that they have shown our recent Republican president. [...]”

Q: Whose anticipation will materialize in the next few months, Moran’s or Coulter’s?
Answer: _____________________ .

Nov 5, 2008 - 7:52 pm 83. Al Fin:

Who will follow this narcissistic screwball through hard times to come? Who is confident that this child-mind understands the tough decisions that have to be made to keep America strong for the sake of its citizens and the citizens of the free world?

When this budding tyrant gets Americans into a war a hundred times bloodier than Iraq and Afghanistan combined, who will stand up first to answer BHO’s call to do something he has never done–risk his life for the US?

Nov 5, 2008 - 7:58 pm 84. cedarford:

Let’s add another citizenship lesson for the Truthers, the sincere ones at least:

Lesson #4 – Americans are permitted dual passports, even dual citizenship. A girlfriend I had in the 90s had 3. She was born in Brazil to an American father and a Greek mother. Had citizenship in all 3 countries. My personal preference is that the US eliminate jus solis citizenship or restrict it’s benefit to only children of foreigners legally resident in the US, and we eliminate dual citizenship. Dual citizenship, be it by Jews, Brazilians, Irish, etc. with claim in other lands as well as America will always raise the question of loyalties to country being in conflict. But then, as now, it’s legal.

Conspiracy points for Truthers – You sound like you are brainlessly parroting 2 fanciful stories.

One, Obama somehow got an Indonesian passport, that was somehow valid 10 years later, to travel out of NYC as an American to a country that Americans were quite free to visit in the 80s, under an Indonesian passport and a name he never used in America.

Two, despite him being born in Hawaii, having a birth cert from Hawaii, to parents documented as being fulltime students in Hawaii…his mom was somehow magically transported to Kenya, perhaps by UFO, on a quite expensive TransPacific round trip if it was by air, not UFO, so he could be born in 3rd rate African medical care.
All on the story someone “heard” of a story someone “credible” posted on a fever swamp blog saying it all happened!

Do you know how stupid both assertions sound to an objective person?

And even if every element in your preposterous tales were true, it would have no effect on Obama’s elegibility to be President. Something everyone but the ignorant and/or the deceitful understand.
****************
misanthropicus – Your post is incoherent speculation. Par for a Truther. Also, you are stupid. Cedar is the name a tree species, not a cheese.

Nov 5, 2008 - 8:05 pm 85. Marc Malone:

misanthropicus – In defense of cedarford, he is clearly NOT a troll. He posts his own opinions, often long, with an occasional good point. He’s been posting here quite awhile. His is simply loyal opposition, and he’s due some courtesy.

cedarford – The issue of citizenship is not settled. Just the salient points:

1) At the time of his birth, allegedly in Kenya, his mother was only 18. His father was Kenyan. Per Kenyan law, he is Kenyan. Per our law, he is NOT American, because at the time, the American parent had to be at least 19. Ergo, if he were indeed born in Kenya, he is disqualified from the Presidency… and even from being a U.S. Senator.

2) The short-form copy of his birth certificate posted online has been discredited by three (!) different experts. It matters not, because he is simply required by the Constitution to provide proof positive of his qualifications to be Prez. The online, short-form doesn’t cut it. He has failed to offer the necesssary proof.

3) He was sued. The court required that he answer the suit and offer his proof. He failed to do so in the requisite 30 days, thus by law, conceding the point. The case was later dismissed by reason of jursdiction, and has been refiled. The point of law concession is not invalidated.

4) Even if he does prove it, he was adopted in Indonesia as a child, becoming Barry Soetoro, and a legal citizen of Indonesia and no longer American. He need not renounce his citizenship in that case, as Indonesian law aplies, and is recognized by the U.S. He could reacquire his citizenship, setting things right, if he later took an oath after his 18th birthday. There is no record of him having done so.

So, he denies release of his vault copy of his Birth Certificate, which he legally cannot do, because he is required to produce it. Further, records of his Indonesian status has also been denied to us. He refuses to provide passport records of his trip to Pakistan, as it will show he used his Indonesian citizenship status to gain access. The same goes for his refusal to release his college transcripts, as he seems to have used his Indonesian status to gain preferential access to the schools. These each would be damning evidence of his disqualified status, so they are concealed.

The Constitutional and legal requirements are clear, but people just shrug their shoulders, because they want him to be Prez, but we can’t just overlook the Constitution and laws in this. Even if you support him, these facts and allegations should leave you very concerned as an American.

For my part, do not ask me to support him as my next President until he has settled these simple requirements of proof of citizenship.

Nov 5, 2008 - 8:47 pm 86. Douglas:

The last time the Democrats stole a national election, it cost 58,000 American lives in Viet Nam.

Nov 5, 2008 - 8:55 pm 87. McSame:

You people still don’t get it. You lost on the issues. Its simple no matter what comeback you have to that it is a losing argument. Just like you, loser. The American people spoke. You are wrong, your ideas suck. Now sit back and watch Obama be president. And while your at it PJ Media can add Obama’s name to the spell check. Did I say Obama? I meant President Obama….suck it!

Nov 5, 2008 - 10:49 pm 88. vivo:

9. David Thomson:

“Barack Obama almost certainly was born in Hawaii.”

We have a Hawaiian President!

Nov 6, 2008 - 12:01 am 89. vivo:

85. Marc Malone:

“1) At the time of his birth, allegedly in Kenya, his mother was only 18. His father was Kenyan. Per Kenyan law, he is Kenyan. Per our law, he is NOT American, because at the time, the American parent had to be at least 19.”

We have a Kenyan President!

Nov 6, 2008 - 12:13 am 90. vivo:

According to Obama at Al Smith’s dinner

We have a Kriptonian President!

Nov 6, 2008 - 12:19 am 91. david:

In Muhammad we trust

Nov 6, 2008 - 2:05 am 92. susan:

we have a vivo demented obamatron!

ceddarford, can you name at least one other elected president that has double passport?

Nov 6, 2008 - 3:05 am 93. Alan Rockman:

we keep the proverbial powder dry, the proverbial ammo ready.

we tried it the way of McCain, even in the face of a mean-spirited fascist left who called Bush, the most pro-Israel President since Reagan, a Nazi, yet gave a Left Nazi lover, Barry Hussein, a pass. we won’t be inclined to go that route next time.

he will be given a chance. but if he raises taxes on the middle class, if ILLEGALS are given an open border pass; if American boys come home in defeat; if our enemies attack us and he, the coward who never served does nothing, then there will be hell to pay.

this is the second day in the beginning of the fight to reclaim OUR country, not the country of the hateful fascist Left.

Nov 6, 2008 - 4:48 am 94. misanthropicus:

RE 84/cedarford: “[...] misanthropicus – Your post is incoherent speculation. Par for a Truther. Also, you are stupid. Cedar is the name a tree species, not a cheese. [...]”

Cedarford, apologies for my Cedar/Cheddar confusion – and its cause comes from the fact that on this thread we already have “cheesehead” and “cheesetundra” whose discourse, interestingly enough, is on a line much resembling yours, so I simply felt that such an onomastic conspiracy should be placed on a group, cheese shelf. Apologies, cedar is a beautiful tree, and you are a good and beautiful person, and if you still need moral vindication feel free to further insult me, call me Goudahead or Swiss, or Kashkaval – be cruel, superficial people like me deserve correction.
Having said this, you are still off mark in the Obama citizenship matter, as Marc Malone #84 well showed.
Have a good one buddy -

Nov 6, 2008 - 6:48 am 95. tanstaafl:

This “historic election” is over. It’s time to start demanding answers to the tough questions that Obama has thus far eluded.

Nothing really stuck during the campaign, the history of Chicago assns. like Rezko, Ayers & JWright, coming up within the incestuous machinations of the Chicago machine, having no observeable record of achievement/accomplishment…

So why would Barack Obama feel constrained to answer any “tough questions” now ?

Time will tell with Obama’s selection of close confreres (Rahm Emanuel as Chief of Staff seems an extension of the Chicago thing), when movements in the world, particularly outside our borders, force the Aloof One to some hard decisions, the kind of decisions that Joe Biden indicated a few weeks ago might be “unpopular” with Obama’s base many of whom are completely brain dead when it comes to reality.

Nov 6, 2008 - 6:50 am 96. misanthropicus:

RE Marc Malone #84 -
Thank you for the thoughtful intervention in this Obama citizenship matter – this is a serious thing, and while the Obamacans can obfuscate it for a while, eventually it will hit the fan.
I will quote my post #84 here: “David Thomson, HOW do you know that Barry Soetero IS a naturally born US citizen? The only line of proof here is Howard Dean and the DNC as vetting party – hardly a trustworthy crew. Then – why Soetoro doesn’t put the matter to rest by allowing his papers be examinated by an impartial legal team? The cost of this, financially AND! politically is surely less than the incoming political cost of this un-resoved matter [...]”

Obama could solve this affair easily by producing the paper in cause and close this for ever – why he’s not doing so, we don’t know exactly (so far – your inventory of potential reasons explores this), but what is obvious is that Obama is not at all forthcoming, so all suspicions are warranted.

Nov 6, 2008 - 7:05 am 97. AnninCA:

Obama has shown me enough to figure out what to expect. He’s very non-transparent. The notion that he’s honest with people is laughable, given his track record in the primaries and the GE. Sorry, but that is a reputation earned, and when you run ads lying to old people about their SS benefits being slashed by the “other” guy, you lose your honest badge.

I can predict he’ll hide behind others. Obama will rarely initiate much. Let others take the heat. He’ll manipulate to make sure it appears that he must go along with Congress when passing legislation that is sure to bother moderates.

I can predict he’ll install a number of WA insiders, who will continue the practice of cultivating lobbyist money for candidates. Anyone who blasts others for their lobbyist ties and then hides their own in bundles is, clearly, not about real change.

I predict he’ll mostly dish out photo ops and pictures of the children and wife. Nice soft stories….headed your way.

Nov 6, 2008 - 7:53 am 98. The Historian:

WHO IS PRESIDENT-ELECT OBAMA?
We have a President-elect but do we have even the remotest idea as to how he will govern:

http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2008/11/who-is-president-elect-obama.html

Nov 6, 2008 - 10:03 am 99. nick:

1 allowing anon for under $200 is not fraud , is not illegal
but you sir, are a Dunce.

biggest change – the Wealthy will get tax rates set back to 1990s levels. das tut mir leid.

Nov 6, 2008 - 11:49 am 100. Terry Gain:

Despite the brain dead Cult Of O the United States is still a country of laws and not men.

Until Obama’s birth certificate is produced and verified by independent experts it is quite legitimate and responsible to question his eligibility for the highest office in the land. Indeed it is outrageous to be insulted for raising this very legitimate question.

These intimidation tactics have no place in a country governed by laws.

The use of the word truther to describe people who ask these legitimate questions is not merely stupid and arrogant but frankly deranged.

Now on with the investigation as to how much of Obama’s 150 million in donations were illegal, or is everyone who asks why they turned off the AVS system also a truther?

Nov 6, 2008 - 12:58 pm 101. Robert Hurley:

I love these comments about Obama’s citizenship. Keep it up and you will loose even more credibility with the independent voters. They don’t tend to be very supportive of looney bloggers. Better yet tell you empoyers about your looney theories

Nov 6, 2008 - 1:45 pm 102. cedarford:

I imagine the “Truther” charge that Obama is not a “real American” will persist on the Blogs as other conspiracy theories do. Grassy Knollers, Mossad did 9/11, 6,000 men and women in the USA Navy know of or watched the Aegis missile that downed TWA Flight 800 and are a conspiracy of silence…..And Obama is alien!

You can only do so much with Truthers. They live for the attention they get. You can engage them a little, but it is essentially a waste of time to debate them because they claim the preposterous then demand that the burden is on the other side to provide “all the evidence!!” to debunk them.

“Barack Obama was abducted by aliens on a UFO who are allied with the islamofascists and programmed by alien mind control technology to destroy America”

Bullshit.

“OK, then provide proof to dismiss our lawsuit:

1. That documents Obama’s whereabouts every day from June 1st, 1977 to October 15th, the time range a Honolulu wino remembers seeing a skinny black boy abducted by little green men.

2. Provide evidence that little green men do not exist and that their philosophy is not consistent with Islamofascists.

3. Explain your confidence that aliens do not possess mind control technology. What evidence can you provide in court that a distant civilization hasn’t invented means far beyong our own?

4. It’s simply common sense that a secretive alien race abducting people may be hostile, so them using Obama to destroy America isn’t a stretch at all..but something for our lawsuits to uncover the true depth of the deadly conspiracy afoot.

Which always ends for the Truthers with a judge, saying “no standing” – but really meaning: “Get out of my court, you f*cking loons!”

*************
Still, it is fun to remind the Truthers, or the more malicious sort that try and spread disinformation to tar candidates of more facts so their efforts amass even more ridicule (all richly deserved).

1. Obama holds a US passport. There is no factual basis for claims he is dual citizen anywhere else.
2. Obama’s parents marriage, his birth on Honolulu is documented in Hawaii’s vital records.
3. Obama’s mother finished her spring semester in 1961 at U of Hawaii. At the time, women were strongly discouraged by doctors from being abducted by a UFO or taking expensive plane flights to abysmal 3rd World medical facilities while in the mid to late 3rd Trimester of a pregnacy.
4. Rantings of an old Kenyan aunt that she was present at the Birth of the One, and she had more stories to sell, nonwithstanding.
5. Those claiming some 3rd world law would cancel US law and involuntarily strip a child with US citizenship of that citizenship before the child reached majority age and consented – are nuts.
6. He was sued. The court required that he answer the suit and offer his proof. He failed to do so in the requisite 30 days, thus by law, conceding the point.
Bullcrap. The court did not compell – in fact they dismissed because the loon filing the lawsuit had no standing. People that think any crank complaint requires suspension of privacy and submission to involuntary discovery of person records handed over to the crank – without solid evidence a breach of law exists or injury – are also nuts.
7. At the time of his birth, allegedly in Kenya, his mother was only 18. His father was Kenyan. Per Kenyan law, he is Kenyan. Per our law, he is NOT American, because at the time, the American parent had to be at least 19.
Nope. You assert he is Kenyan without any evidence he was born there. Nor do you understand just sanguinis law. Then as now, a married US citizen giving birth in a foreign land, not just Panama, of any age, gives birth to a “Natural-Born” US citizen. A good thing, too, because especially back then, many enlisted soldiers in Europe and Asia had wives aged 15-18 that had many, many new citizens. Like my cousin. Who followed the normal practice of having his parents at Ramstein AFB get a “Certificate of Birth Outside the USA” from the consular office. No 2nd-class citizenship for children of our troops on the frontline!
8. Too many people are ignorant of citizenship by blood of at least one American parent being as valid, if not more so, than jus solis citizenship by happenstance of location of birth (something the country still has to resolve because of illegals creating instant-citizens, while the just of the world has largely junked jus solis as unworkable in a time of great human movement across borders and dissimilar benefits that had whole jetloads of pregnant Egyptians and Nigerians attempting to get into Europe complete with a cache of labor-inducing drugs). Remember, jus solis never existed in the USA before 1868, and it didn’t replace the OTHER path to citizenship available before 1868 and since.
9. People need to have their Truther radar going – there seem to be even more of these whackjobs and character assassins like Berg abusing the tort system these days than when the “JFK was killed by the CIA” fruitloops were in full force.
10. Remember too, that a lot of people say such stuff on blogs because it is their only outlet – they fear being laughed at if they say it to friends or colleagues.

Nov 6, 2008 - 1:49 pm 103. susan:

“I love these comments about Obama’s citizenship. Keep it up and you will loose even more credibility with the independent voters. They don’t tend to be very supportive of looney bloggers. Better yet tell you empoyers about your looney theories”

Last time I checked Andrew Sullivan is still trying to demostrate that Trig is not PAlin’s son.

You gotta have some nerve to talk about credibility.

But still what can you expect from robert hurley. Objectivity? self-criticism?

naaahhh

he’s an obamatron

Nov 6, 2008 - 2:30 pm 104. Terry Gain:

Cedarford

Your hysterical obfuscation contains 901 words but not these.

“Obama’s birth certificate was authenticated…”

I have no idea whether Obama was born in Hawaii or Kenya and neither do you so stop pretending otherwise. The difference is you assert as fact something which you believe. I don’t . I merely question. The questioning will continue until the evidence is produced. Then it will stop.

Have the good sense to approach this issue with reason rather than emotion.This subject is too serious for your arrogant pretensions.

Nov 6, 2008 - 2:50 pm 105. misanthropicus:

Re Cedarford & Hurley –
So you guys went back to the SoetoroDepot, got some fuel and now you’re back on assignment trying to bully anyone who rightfully doubts Hussein Soetoro’s citizenship standing.
And considering the dimenssion of your hysteria, it seems that this citizenship issue is quite a vulnerable spot for Hussein Soetoro.
Now stop ranting and answer this simple question: why Soetoro doesn’t put this situation to rest by allowing his papers be examinated by an impartial legal team? The cost of this, financially AND! politically is surely much less than the incoming political cost of this un-resoved matter. Hussein Soetoro could solve this affair easily by producing the paper in cause and close this for ever – Hurley and Cedarford, answer this, why Soetoro doesn’t produce the document in cause?

’till he’ll produce the proper evidence, all suspicions are warranted: remember the Franziskus School/Djakarta registration page photo showing Barry being registered as name= Soetero, citizenship= Indonesian, religion= Muslim? It’s an AP discovery and AP stands behind the story, and it’s everywhere on the web.

So, maybe you can start figuring out a defense for Hussein’s deportation procedures, that would be nice.

To: Susan, Marc Malone and Tery Gait: Hurley and cederford are some Obamatrolls assigned to patroll PJM, and their hymn page is an old one. A couple of months ago, if you remember, we had the Soetero/Franziskus School scandal which scared the bejesus of the Obamabots and all of them were out, trying to extinguish the flames. Here on PJM, Owens had a piece about that, and all Obamatons were swarming over the place, exactly like Hurley and cedarford now – I remember one of those creatures, dba “Se” who had 32 posts about that issue in 12 hours! Now, that was an active ‘ton, not like Hurley and Cederford who just do a few posts every six-seven hours – I heard that The One has became kind of tight with the $30 debit cards lately, maybe this is the explanation.
Anyway, you can find in the PJM archive Owen’s piece & posts and check “Se”-s talking points – they are identical with Hurley’s and cedarford’s.

Nov 6, 2008 - 5:31 pm 106. cedarford:

Terry Gain – I merely question. The questioning will continue until the evidence is produced. Then it will stop.

Have the good sense to approach this issue with reason rather than emotion.This subject is too serious for your arrogant pretensions.

Sorry to say it, but after 3,000 RNC opposition lawyers and investigators “passed” on Obama’s citizenship legitimacy to run for President your “questions” are the height of arrogant presumption.

And contrary to your pretense at reason, you are the sort who will be so emotionally caught up in yourselves, that folks like you, or you yourself, are the sort that show up at events with unwashed hair and stinking from lack of sanitation. Screaming for “evidence” that Clinton was not a rapist, Bush was not a Guard desrter, Lincoln was not a secret homosexual, Jews did write the Protocols, and President Obama is not a secret Muslim.

Your moment to discredit Obama, and you “oppo” partisan propagandist’s time to discredit McCain has passed. Passed and subject to derision as assuredly as people that fail to provide adequate evidence that a crook should be found guilty and think they are entitled to bitch endlessly about the non-guilty verdict.

My advice?

Chill..Go back to whatever other parts of your life give you meaning and satisfaction.

Nov 6, 2008 - 6:10 pm 107. Terry Gain:

Cedarford

Quite the list.Nice diversion. Isee that asking you not to be emotional was counter-productive. Do you normally draw sweeping conclusions about people you know nothing about?

In any event, if you have any evidence to support your 3000 RNC lawyers assertion, post it.

Nov 6, 2008 - 8:39 pm 108. Who's Sane:

cedarford -

You make good points, but I fear you have used too many large words and presented an argument like an intellectual — probably lost on this crowd. Luckily there are some republicans that are so tired of the negativity that they will give the best president elect we’ve had, possibly ever, a chance to show them just that. Even those who can’t see the obvious will still reap the rewards of lower taxes, better health care, improved economy, better schools, less war, and improved world relations that we are all in for. The time of bigotry, oppression, and corporate brainwashing of the ignorant minority is coming to an end — thank God!

Nov 6, 2008 - 10:23 pm 109. susan:

misanthropicus

yes, I find utterly pathetic that those jobless obamatrons come here to stir us controversy.

I believe dissenting voices are banned in their blogs and forums. I came here to read the commentary of like-minded, I would never wander around their marxist infested blogs, I have no idea why they are doing this, other than having too much free time on their hands, being paid for it or being simply losers.

They are not convincing anybody, and if they think we will change our minds about zerobama just by reading they they call us warmonger, rednecks and such, they are even more stupid than I think.

Nov 7, 2008 - 3:54 am 110. david - vietnam vet:

What is coming to an end is the country that millions have died for. Read these examples; listen to comedians as crowds of people set and laugh at the sickest stuff. Popular TV shows and movies that make me want to through up. This stuff tells the story of the quickening decline in our country, the next time you indulge in this think of what you doing. It was only a matter of time for the lowest scum on earth became the majority in our country. Get used to the phrase “IN MUHAMMAD WE TRUST”, the end of our Christian nation, that made us great, comes closer to it’s end, “as the pigs play in the mud”. I have been studying Spanish, think I will move to Austria and tell everyone I am from Spain, ashamed to be American. I am going to do what I always considered the lowest scum on earth did, “burn all my flags, burn my hats, and everything I own with the flag on it. I think I will give a fake e-mail, I am sure anyone expressing free speech rights will be imprisoned. We built the greatest nation on earth, I am sooo sorry.

Nov 7, 2008 - 5:11 am 111. Not a Fish » Blog Archive » Okay, stop that right now:

[...] just read in two places predictions that Israel is going to be involved in a nuclear war in the next four years. Mr. Den [...]

Nov 7, 2008 - 5:29 am 112. misanthropicus:

Re susan/ #9 Re misanthropicus:
“[...] I believe dissenting voices are banned in their blogs and forums. I came here to read the commentary of like-minded, I would never wander around their marxist infested blogs, I have no idea why they are doing this, other than having too much free time on their hands, being paid for it or being simply losers. [...]‘

One of the many facts that contributed to Soetero’s victory was the control of the media, and I am sure I don’t need to produce any evidence in this direction regarding CNN’s, NYT’s and MSNBC’s, etc. wretchedness.
This situation was amplified by Soetero campaign’s well organized, aggressive presence on the Internet, where squads of trolls kept patrolling, hymn page/ answers for the topic of the day at ready, trying to confuse and discourage people of nonbama convictions, either by jumping at a beginning of a thread and trying to set-up the tone of the discussion, or by deflecting the matter, clogging the space with irrelevant facts or non-sequiturs – and as you can anticipate, this actions will not stop at this point in Obama’s career).
I studied how this Internet assaults occur on CNN, on their political/electoral news ticker – INVARIABLY, THE FIRST six-ten posts were STRONGLY PROBAMA, either as an laudative choir or executing pre-emptive strikes against the others who might have come later with different views. This, together with the fact that critical views towards Holograma were unlikely to be made public anyway, gave Holograma’s campaign a significant sway over cyberspace – the same situation was present on NYT, LAT, Chicago Tribune as well (since an outsider can’t really know when the next ticker post pops out, I think that in CNN’s case we had also an inside job, someone calling an Obama Dispatch Desk to give them the timing and the topic of the next post, so they could jump at it – or, since often truth is simpler than suspected, we had the old time censorhip at work, CNNN simply not publishing anything inconvenient about Obama).
Voluteers or paid, Cedarford, Hurley, Se and others like them are part and parcel of this Internet desinformation process – hardly an honorable activity, and an alarming omen about the views and practices of the reign to come.

But, wrecking balls alawys return: exactly like in the liberals’ skipping the electoral public funding, the consequences of that, and of this Internet situation will strike back, sooner or later – we learned the lesson, and we shall return!

As far as Hussein Soetero, what can we do so far but look forward to hear about his post-deportation choices in Kenya or Indonesia – cedarford and Hurley will sure keep us informed.

Nov 7, 2008 - 6:24 am 113. Joseph Marshall:

Hi Mark! Sorry it took me so long to get back. The election night left me completely exhausted and I have spent a good part of the time either asleep or with my brain turned off.

“Values”, without specification, is exactly my point. Such abstraction is politically meaningless. So is “being a maverick”.

Ronald Reagan didn’t run on “values” in the abstract, he ran on a specific agenda of more aggressive engagement with the Soviet Union, aggressive pursuit of law enforcement, and an explicit philosophy of deregulation of the free market.

George H.W. Bush was mildly hostile to “the vision thing”, so he ran on a specific platform of no new taxes, and then couldn’t pay off on it. The mere fact that he had won a war was not enough, any more than it was for Winston Churchill.

In 2004, George W. Bush ran on a promise to “keep us safe from terrorism”. It won him that election.

Nobody can run on “values” in the abstract, and no party has a copyright on values in the abstract. You have to run with specific values brought to the fore: opposition to abortion, restricting marriage to heterosexuals only, an increased public role for church charities, and so forth.

Despite the general belief to the contrary on PJM, Obama did not run just on his good looks, or his campaign money, or merely on “change”.

He had specific, if sketchy, proposals to offer: a united and comprehensive approach to energy self-sufficiency within a decade modeled on the specific, if sketchy [and it really was sketchy], proposal of John Kennedy to put a man on the moon.

He proposed a trade of national service for money for college support. And he proposed a quite specific restructuring of the tax system. He also offered a gradualist approach to universal health care coverage. And, he finally proposed a more stringent regulation of Wall Street in the public interest [ie "main street"]

Folks over here may not like these proposals, but they are something not nothing in particular. McCain ran on nothing in particular and brought up different, and sometimes incompatible, proposals every week in response to the news cycle.

Obama, on the other hand, started the campaign with a specific message and stuck to it like glue. It was sufficiently “progressive” to unite politically active Democrats behind him, and it was sufficiently consistent and coherent to be directly sold to a majority of voters.

It was a particular brand, and the Republican Party no longer has a particular brand. It, like its leader in the White House, has degenerated into mere political opportunism.

You simply cannot expect the general public to understand what you mean by “values” even though all of you here comprehend this. You have to tell them what you mean, and persuade them that they should want it.

Nov 7, 2008 - 6:46 am 114. joe:

Once again it seems everyone is living in a fantasyland. Just who do you think is going to ask the questions? It surely is not going to be the media. They have already proven they are nothing more than the propaganda organ of the left in America. Besides why would Curious Barry answer them anyway? He will just say this part of the big change he promised and our hopes will become real in time.

Nov 7, 2008 - 9:09 pm 115. dave:

To Joseph Marshall:
Wow! You should be a campaign director for someone since you have it all figured out. I would suggest you start with the campaign for the local dog catcher.

Nov 8, 2008 - 9:57 pm 116. dave:

The political and media elitists of our day were all educated in the most leftist institutions of our country, the public schools as well as the universities. You can thank the godless school system for the way the “cell-phone” generation thinks. America has become a nuthouse ran by the inmates. This country will be destroyed by the Democrats while the nuts that voted them in sit around and watch American Idol and Dancing With the Stars.

Nov 8, 2008 - 10:03 pm 117. Marc Malone:

cedarford – Nothing changes the fact that the vault copy of his birth certificate was demanded and has not yet been produced. It is required to establish his natural-born credentials. Deflect, spurn, rationalize, and ridicule all you want. That basic fact stands alone, unassailable. He either provides proof or is disqualified.

INS should be involved, because the evidence says he’s an illegal alien. The court case is still pending, btw.

Nov 8, 2008 - 11:51 pm 118. mnotaro:

In my opinion, Obama did not win the election…McCain did not lose…Bush lost. Obama was fighting against Bush the entire time and there was no way he could win against the liberal illuminati after the devastating economic turmoil that has been going on for the last 6 months…couple that with a weak, gimicky, impassionate campaign by McCain and the liberal MSM…there was no way we could have won this battle.

Nov 10, 2008 - 9:14 am 119. Dave:

“Even those who can’t see the obvious will still reap the rewards of lower taxes, better health care, improved economy, better schools, less war, and improved world relations that we are all in for. The time of bigotry, oppression, and corporate brainwashing of the ignorant minority is coming to an end — thank God!”

Wow, the coming reality check for this person is going to be a dozy – assuming they are capable of living in the real world that is.

Nov 11, 2008 - 10:34 am 120. Ms. Know:

Now that the election is over, and the inexperienced left-wing illuminati are in control, can we think about our troops at war?

Nov 14, 2008 - 12:21 pm

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