Pajamas Media

231 Comments

1. Moultrie:

SO GHWB trusted the Iranian Mullahs?

Jul 8, 2008 - 4:54 am 2. dan:

I wonder if Mr. Khalili would comment on the issue of Russian involvement with the Khomenist regime, and not just its well-known support for Iran’s nuclear regime. Not only does Russia supply Iran with many weapons systems, including ballistic missiles and tactical gear for its military, but it also provides military and logistical support for Syria, and through these Hezbollah. Russia has also welcomed HAMAS to the Kremlin. Amir Tahiri has also reported that Russia and Iran quietly reaffirmed what amount to mutual defense treaties original signed during the early 20th century, apparently with an eye to US or Israeli operations. And I think I’m leaving some things out.

But the more I pursue my interest in Soviet behavior up to the present - as much as I am able to do so - the more I am alarmed at the public silence with respect to Russian geostrategic and regional maneuvors, all of which seem to be treated with an air of “Oh that incorrigible Russia, they’re just dicking around there out in the Asiatic hinterlands.” If even half of what I read among defectors and recently vindicated historians of Russia/USSR is true, there is absolutely no way Russia isn’t ultimately (weapons, coordination) behind a lot of this south-Asiatic (and North Korean) nonsense.

If you could comment Mr. Khalili we’d be grateful. Thank you for your courageous service sir.

Jul 8, 2008 - 5:22 am 3. Mike:

Russia is having its own troubles with Islamic expansion into its southern provinces….its continued politice niceties with Iran, as well as continued arms sales to Islamic nations, must come from the same deep well of human stupidity as that of various US administrations.

Jul 8, 2008 - 6:33 am 4. Pam:

At what point does the MSM pick ANY of this up? This is chilling and very scary.

Jul 8, 2008 - 6:47 am 5. Ardeshir Dolat:

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Exactly! The mullahs’ true intention is to obtain nuclear bomb. That is the only thing that will ensure their survival. Nothing else will do.

Jul 8, 2008 - 7:16 am 6. dan:

“must come from the same deep well of human stupidity as that of various US administrations”

soviet control over its southern islamic regions was established and maintained relatively easily, not least by coopting the instruments of administration and controlling cultural expression in the usual way. moreover, even reviewing a history of the soviet-afghan war demonstrates the success the soviets had in exploiting the real mechanisms of tribal, Asiatic societies - that is cupidity and venality - despite the claims of mullahs (whose motives are the same). many warlords were easily purchased; subsequent moves funded and armed anti-masud forces. there is some question as to what exactly the chechen leaders represent - a strategic bluff? an islamic movement? a nationalist movement forced by russian onslaught to adopt an islamic appeal? the odd dictators of the former central Asian SSRs could not but be Communists and former KGB apparatchiks in other clothing. is there no provision of weapons and other aid to the Pashtun tribes destabilizing Pakistan, frustrating Afghanistan’s tentative rebirth, providing al Qaeda and its various (e.g. Uzbek) allies with support? that would be utterly unlike russia, where the kgb reigns just as it did for at least 40 years prior to Soviet dissolution, if not more.

what of the shanghai cooperation organization? what of provision of nuclear technology, ballistic technology, and valuable diplomatic cover for Iran?

and then what about Europe’s incredible, and increasing, dependency on Russian fuel? what about European NATO’s almost complete, and certainly unprecedented, disarming? what about its demonstrated dysfunction, not least in afghanistan? what about its demonstrated diplomatic dysfunction in relation to Iran negotiations over the past 4 years - precisely when it was given the chance it so loudly declared it never had regarding iraq, whose proceeds have so deafeningly vindicated the evil american neocons expectations of such an engagement?

and in all this, silence, really, about russia and its intentions - except about its horrible demography and health, which of course have always been the case, from time out of mind, and so counts for little, strategically.

and so on.

the russian strategy may look self-defeating in some of its aspects - why would it want a nuclear iran on its southern border? - but americans and many of the “innocents” on the left seem to underestimate the organizing power that certain murder can provide. i mean, c’mon, it’s practically the governing principle in the asiatic political sensibility - what, for example, is the penalty for apostacy in islam, again?

so i’m curious if mr. khalili could provide some more specific pinions to all this speculation.

Jul 8, 2008 - 7:19 am 7. It’s An Ideological Thing « Heidelblog:

[...] July 8, 2008 in Uncategorized I’ve been reading Mark Bowden’s (2006) Guests of the Ayatollah. He argues that Iran has been at war with the West since 1979 and this story confirms that nothing has changed. [...]

Jul 8, 2008 - 7:22 am 8. Still doubt that Iran is at war with us? « Airspeed:

[...] doubt that Iran is at war with us? Filed under: 1 — buttle @ 15:55 Word from the inside should erase all doubt. It is not an exaggeration to claim that the radicals belonging to the [...]

Jul 8, 2008 - 8:55 am 9. rob:

And none of this would be happening were it not for the behavior of Israel & the USA.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:01 am 10. Traven:

This sounds like a lot of B.S. Reminds me of “Curveball” and his made-up nonsense. The Iranians downed PanAm 103? C’mon — that was the well-socumented works of the Libyans. This guy is blowing smoke. Too bad you fell for it.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:06 am 11. Roger L Simon:

Traven, B: I have no idea to extent he is “blowing smoke,” but I suggest you examine the transcript of my interview with him linked above.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:14 am 12. Iranian Terror: The View from Within [Dan Collins]:

[...] Former CIA mole in Iranian military speaks out on what he knows, at Pajamas Media. [...]

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:23 am 13. emeka:

rob: are you kidding, Isral and the USA??

Ok so i have been hearing about how evil the war monging neo-cons are.

But heres what i really think.

As long as we continue to Import Oil from the mid-east, WE WILL CONTINUE TO INVADE AND BOMB NATIONS for oil. I don’t care who’s in office. Unless you work for code pink or you are Dennis kuscinich.

The US imports 1/3 of its oil from the mid east. Other places like china import as much 50% or more from the mullahs. In case you have had your head in the ground, you would understand that China IS the US economy. From t-bills to trade deficits to importing poison in place of toys to food…in other words they have us by the balls.

Iran’s exports to China grew 16 percent in 2003, making it the latter’s No. 2 oil supplier after Saudi Arabia, according to Chinese government figures.

China’s economy expanded 9.3 percent last year and is growing at a 9 percent rate this year, according to President Hu Jintao. The country’s oil needs could almost double again, to 11 million barrels a day, by 2010, according to a report by Merrill Lynch & Co.

WE HAVE NATIONAL INTERESTS IN THE AREA.

Why should we stop stop stop Iran??
um.. well, If you have been listening to Iranian president Achmadinajad*, you would understand that this guy is a lunatic.

Apart from wanting to wipe the Israelis out, they want to bring back the 12th Imam.

the question is when is the Imam supposed to return?
Twelver Shi’as cite various references from the Qur’an and reports, or Hadith, from Mahdi and the twelve Shi’a Imams with regard to the reappearance of al-Mahdi who would, in accordance with God’s command, bring justice and peace to the world by establishing Islam throughout the world.
“During the last times, my people will be afflicted with terrible and unprecedented calamities and misfortunes from their rulers, so much so that this vast earth will appear small to them. Persecution and injustice will engulf the earth. The believers will find no shelter to seek refuge from these tortures and injustices. At such a time, God will raise from my progeny a man who will establish peace and justice on this earth in the same way as it had been filled with injustice and distress.”

If Iran gets the nukes, they will put the whole middle east in check. the mullahs intend to plunge the world int chaos. when that happens the west will fall to its knees.

How will they bring the west to its knees?
China ownes out T-bills(over $1 Trillion)
China almosts feeds the US
Apert from Russia, wstrn europe also gets oil from the mullahs. If there is a problem, IT WILL AFFECT CANADA real bad. now what does canada have to do with this?… the UK is one of the big players of the EU. the UK also shares a very special relationship both politically(the queen) and economically(trade). In 2007, Canada and the US traded over $500 Billion of stuff with each other. Imaging if there is a sudden halt to the current remedy.. the Stock market will drop by like 5k in one day, we would be looking at like $300 per barrel. at home here, we would be looking at like $8per gallon or more.

I know some of you would say AIPAC, the bankers and the Military complex are lobbying the US into Iran, but try looking at the bigger picture.

I DON’T KNOW HOW MUCH MORE I CAN SAY THIS, BUT WE CAN’T LET THEM HAVE NUKES.

Well some of you non-interventionists could say umm well Israel has nukes.. Israel is yet to promise to wipe out any of its neighbors.

OR

you could say eh.. the founding fathers were non-interventionists, then i will have to remind you that back then, the Founding Fathers didn’t have interests in other nations. In other words, they were quite self-reliant. There was no need to import oil, they didnt depend on china for toys, and weren’t in debt at the rate at which the US is no right now.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:33 am 14. Bubba:

Our tolerance for intolerant nations will be the end of us. Christians are slaughtered over there but we bend over to put booties on the dogs in airports to not offend the muslums. Atoms for electricity in Iran is crazy. Do you believe that? Simple, we nuke them before they nuke us. But we won’t we’ll negotiat with those liars until they have the bomb, then we’ll say please don’t, then the mushroom over Manhattan. Why wait? It’s going to happen. But we won’t. The tipping point is months away. Israel will not wait. They are smart, pragmatic, realistic and best of all not stupid like us.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:34 am 15. gb8898:

Yep. “Curveball Part. 2.” Traven’s got it pegged.

Wake up, folks. Nothing makes less sense than building a rationale for war on one guy’s testimony. But I can already see plenty of people are eating this stuff up. Again.

Exactly as planned.

“And they want to destroy you.” (*insert sinister laugh*) Yeah, I’m convinced. Come on, people!

This is one angry Republican whose patience is wearing thin. You all can be willing dupes again if you want, but I’ll be sitting this one out.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:50 am 16. Jon:

>> And none of this would be happening were it not for the behavior of Israel & the USA.

Did you even READ the article? The ENTIRE article states very clearly that the MOTIVE is NOT based on Israel’s or US’s foreign policy but to bring about the 12th Imam.

According to the article you didn’t read, YOU are a successful dupe of their propaganda.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:51 am 17. Sheilah:

Everything written here is allready publicknowledge .

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:52 am 18. KoKo:

If all of this is true, then history will probably show that the move to become involved in Iraq was courageously strategic and not so ‘cavalier’ as most beleive. It may also show that despite the great cost, it acheived a high degree of effectiveness.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:52 am 19. rphillips:

I’m not surpirsed that this article would get CIA approval, if not outright collusion.

It fits right in with the -ramping-up-to-war–with–Iran the Bush administration is presently orchestrating.

What I doubt is how factual the article is.

Spreading misinformation to achieve government objectives is certainly not new in our country now. It was practiced by the JOhnson adminstration in the “cointelpro” program exposed during the Nixon years. The practice was supposedly ended in the 1970s, along with assasination plots on foreign political figures, but the Bush adminstration has undone all those protections.

He is determined to attack Iran before Jan. 21, 2009, and will do anything to convince the american public it is necessary.

Congress has already biven him some of the authority he needs, just like in Iraq, with democratic support.

Jul 8, 2008 - 9:59 am 20. Mikey:

This has been reported for 15 years on http://www.thetrumpet.com.

I consider this the single most important news site on line regarding current events.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:05 am 21. Joshua:

Mr. Khalili describes the political and military strategy of Iran in the context of their religious escatology - end times prophecy. In my opinion, his clear description of the powers that now rule Iran point to a theology that cannot and will not be stopped unless the entire country of Iran is turned in to an ash heap sooner rather than later. I do not say this lightly. This is a very sober statement that I’m confident only the Israelis take serious enough to implement.

Here in lies the problem, we are fighting a global religious war and the civilized world is pretending it is a war on terror(ism). The proof is in the methods that these fanatical religious killers are willing to employ while cloaking their intentions in lies, deception and “negotiations.”

America and Europe have become post-christian societies that are governed by people who can’t and won’t think in theological terms while Muslim nations have become hyper-theocracies. Even our so called moderate Arab friends in Saudi Arabia are the #1 promoter of radical Wahabism in the very fabric of their land and beyond.

I’m sad to say the world as we know it is on a collision course with the most radical, destructive theology the world has ever seen. Mr. Khalili is right, while we’re preoccupied in Afghanistan and Iraq the perfect storm of death is brewing that will make 9/11 look pale in comparison.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:05 am 22. P Cooper:

Hey Rob….. guess what…. it is not the US or Israel. They would be doing this regardless. The Quran stated goal is to subject the middle eastern govenments under Islamic Law, then they turn their sights on the rest of the world. Read the Quran and Haddiths and find out what their battle plan is all about. Don’t go to the PC Press to get your knowledge…. read it for yourself.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:11 am 23. dan:

A yes - Curveball, the “only source of information” that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. Nevermind that not even Hans Blix could declare Saddam compliant with UN resolutions on the very eve of the 2003 invasion - no no, mustn’t remember that. Nor the preceding decade’s worth of drama. Never happened - all Curveball! And since we haven’t found the stockpiles, they must not have ever been there - never! The entire US military-industrial complex was staked on the word of one Iraqi double-agent. And since he was wrong (he duped us, but also, we wanted to be duped!) - since he was wrong, intelligence can never prove the malicious intent of any enemy! Never ever ever! Waaaaaaaaaaah!

You guys are sincerely f-cking moronic. You have absolutely no idea about other countries or their governments, do you? All of you - ALL of you - useful idiots for people who absolutely despise you and hold you in contempt. And I am not, of course, referring to Republicans, who you seem to believe are your only enemies. What disgraceful pieces of crap you all are.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:19 am 24. Fred X:

Ever since Jimmy Carter UnDemocrat extrordinaire cowered in indecision in 1979 I have felt it is only a matter of time before there is war between us and Iran. Liberals always put off the hard work to responsible adults. In this case they seem determined to deal with Iran only when they have a nuke. We really should have just bludgeoned them to death in the 80’s. The day will come…appears they just can’t leave well enough alone.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:22 am 25. hass:

Ummm…”end times prophesy” are the stuff of right wing evangelicals and not Shia. Don’t be a hater.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:32 am 26. Static Union:

I’m not buying this for a second. This is the same bull they tried to feed us before the Iraqi invasion. Do you guys remember that? The media was given stories by the CIA from Iraqi refugees that helped to push public opinion in the direction they wanted… problem was, those refugees had FAILED lie detector tests. It was a ruse, plain and simple and so is this. I’m not drinking the Kool-Aid, not this time. Search for a very famous quote from Herman Goerring about how easy it is to manipulate the masses into fighting a war that will not benefit them at all. It’s all about making money for the Bush Administration’s friends, period. That’s what it’s always been about and that is what this is about, too. They want to build a pipeline and they need Iran to do it. Problem is, it’s a fool’s pipe dream, no pun intended. There’s NO WAY the people of the middle east would let it come to fruition.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:34 am 27. Revoir:

Rob,
Islam and it’s practioners have been “at war” with Infidels for 1500 yrs. Long long before the US and Isrial existed. Our actions have nothing to do with it.
Read “Epicenter” by Joel Rosenburg. He feels that the US will be nuked with scud missles launched from container ships. Imagine 4 container ships 200 miles off the US coast. Once launched, it would take 5 minutes to hit coastal cities such as Seattle, DC, LA, & NY.
Sound far fetched? (1)Hezbollah HAS the ability to launch a scud missle from a container ship. (2)In Pakastian last month a scientist was placed under house arrest for providing advanced plans for a nuke warhead that WILL fit on top of a scud missle.
Why do you think they want to do this? The same reason that some mullah gave to T. Jefferson when he asked why our unarmed merchant ships were being stolen and our sailors were being imprisoned: “The Koran gives us permission to attack Infidels where ever they are”. (think “shores of Tripole”)
These are evil people that must be dealt with for they can not be reasoned with.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:42 am 28. McCann:

baloney. Where were you 5 years ago when the US was deciding who to attack after Afghanistan? Obviously Iran would have been a better target than Iraq, no? Personally I don’t believe you, because I can just as easily claim to be a spy in the Revolutionary Guard, it’s just words, but I digress.
Let’s say you are telling a kernel of truth, so what? Mutual Assured Destruction still exists. If Iran ever attacks the US or Israel our nuclear retaliation will be so massive that Perisan civilization will cease to exist, people will tour Iran like they do Pompei, glimpsing into a world and people that no longer exist.
Don’t buy into the religious dogma the Iranian leadership spouts, it is only meant to control their people and scare their softer enemies. Iran has a ruling elite which hold the same ultimate goal that all ruling elites do- power, wealth, and control forever. Launching a nuclear war would be suicide and they’d lose everything they hold dear.
Stategically speaking, nuclear weapons are not offensive weapons, they are defensive weapons. If you possess nuclear arms, other countries will be afraid to attack you, thus you stay in power. In a (MAD) world, nuclear offense is suicide if you are the one initiating it.
Iran’s primary enemy is neither the USA nor Israel, it is Saudi Arabia, its religious, political, ethnic, and regional competitor. Their models of an Islamic state are both at odds, the existance of one contradicts the other. Iraq is a open battlefield between these states, and the conflict there is a proxy war between the Saudis and Iran.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:42 am 29. gb8898:

Keep believing the big lies, Dan. I’m still a Republican (barely; the LP is starting to look pretty good…), and I’m mad as hell at my party and my government.

The biggest problem I have with Mr. Bush’s presidency–aside from the Iraq fiasco and his love of executive power–is how he has managed to convert the entire Republican party into a mass of quivering, unquestioning fools, ninnies who can’t form an opinion without first consulting Rush or Hannity, who in turn can’t form an opinion without first receiving talking points from government “officials.”

And what are those talking points? “Be afraid! Be afraid! Be afraid!”

Most Republicans now reflexively believe EVERYTHING coming out of Washington. Ten years ago was a completely different story. Questioning the federal government was the very foundation of Republicanism. You can blame 9/11 for “changing everything,” but you’re being dishonest.

Republicans have come to love big government power every bit as much as liberals. And now that we’re in control, some Republicans think we can use that power “better” than the liberals–particularly when it comes to foreign affairs. What a joke. Especially all the folks like you, Dan, who love to play armchair general, the “keyboard warriors” who talk tough while others bleed for their mistakes.

In case you people haven’t noticed, your government LIES TO YOU. A lot. But keep on believing the big lies. That’s what “true patriots” do, right? Never question the government?

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:55 am 30. Dave:

If it’s true, there is no doubt we will have to attack them but we must demand full inspections and then a blockade first. It should be done as a coalition as it will take weeks and thousands of air-strikes to destroy all their sites. As for Dan, you’re the moron because 520 TONs of “yellow cake uranium” were just removed from Iraq to Canada.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:56 am 31. Billy Bob:

The Western Societies and Politicians are apathetic on any type of contraversy with the Islamic Nations. They are aware of their intent just as they are aware of the fragile economy within their own country. Most of the civilian society doesn’t want to know or believe that these are true and will close their mind to such thoughts. People basically want to live for today and worry about tomorrow when it comes. Part of this is the complex lifestyles we all have today and another is the refusal by the MSM to tell the public what is really going on throughout the world.

Jul 8, 2008 - 10:59 am 32. slider:

Two years ago, 8/8/06 to be exact, Bernard Lewis wrote a riveting op ed in the Wall St. Jrnl. I urge you to find it and study it because it explains in chilling simplicity what the Islamists believe and why they know that they will be the winners in a global confrontation.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:06 am 33. Ben:

The CIA agent Name? My bet he is Mossad and is making it all up. His name could be Avi Goldstein. All B.S

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:10 am 34. Joshua:

hass - You sir are the height of ignorance! Is escatology too big of a word for you? Do you really do think the whole world revolves around your Fritos and a six pack, 4th grade mentality? Or are you the classic liberal socialist elitist that looks down their nose at those of us “who cling to our guns and religion and have antipathy for those that are not like us” - Barrack Hussein Obama

I rest my case against you and the political hacks like you! Post-christian, secular, liberal socialists that respond like the dog that barks to feel his tail jerk.

Well, the world of Islamic theocracies have news for you and the message is - “You are just the kind of dog that is worse than a disgusting pig that we want to exterminate while your family watches and send you back to the pit of hell where you were born!” Who’s the hater now?

Now if this sounds like right wing evangelical end times prophecy to you then I must say you may very well deserve the consequences of your ignorance. You obviously won’t stand up and defend what is good, honorable and constructive so don’t stand in the way of those who will.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:11 am 35. Mike:

This information coming from a former CIA agent? I wonder, was he on duty with all the thousands of other agents on 911? America has not been threatened, only Israel. And remember, they have God on their side, so why are any of you out there worried about them? Government was designed to work for the people, not the other way around. For those out there who do not question your government, you would then believe anything they tell you. And one wonders why we have so many idiots in this country.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:12 am 36. Doc:

Folks, you can stop worrying! Obama is going to negotiate with these nice people, and then we can all just get along with each other.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:15 am 37. chuck:

dan said it best….”useful idiots”.

I guess 550 metric tons of yellow cake uranium transferred out of IRAQ just isn’t enough to convince the code-pinko-commie types. Idiots. Where is the coverage from the MSM on all of this? Oh-yeah…they are too busy covering for Hussein Obama.

and then hass said:

“Ummm…”end times prophesy” are the stuff of right wing evangelicals and not Shia. Don’t be a hater.”

Dude…pick up a book before you open your stupid trap. Read the quran for a while and then get back to us when you’ve smartened up a little. Oh and by the way….they are the haters….not us dimwit.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:17 am 38. Lefty:

rphillips- If the Bush administration is ramping up for war with Iran they’re doing a pretty crappy job. Probably not a good idea for the NIE to report they have no evidence of Iran creating nuclear weapons. Not to mention their lousy job of publicizing Iran’s role in international terror and Iraqi insurgence.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:25 am 39. Larry:

wow - this article really got me thinking about the strategies involved in carrying this all out. i want to ask the question as to whether or not we were even listening to reza during his involvement. what is scary to me is that really, this all goes back to the iron curtain. i think russia has much more involvement in this than they would be willing to take credit. it seems possible that they would arm a region with weapons, money and proliferation in order to sit back and watch us deal with it. why fight your enemy when you can passively watch at the sideline? now, this assumption could be way off, but it just seems logical. it also seems scary.

i know the rest of the world has entirely different and drastic views that differ from mine, but personally, i’d really just like to build a wall around our country and keep everyone out. let israel act on its own and let the middle east burn. for thousands of years, nothing but oil and turmoil have come out of there it seems anyhow.

however, i’m part of a world wide community and i respect each countries individual sovereignty. if this is true, we need to force others to stand beside us and tell iran ’shame on you’.

if not, armageddon couldn’t come sooner as the true state of this worlds’ existence is in true peril.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:30 am 40. Roger L. Simon » Of Ayatollahs, the CIA, Pajamas Media and Drudge:

[...] and some of its sites slowed down this morning because of a Drudge link to our article from “Reza Khalili,” a former US intelligence agent inside Iran’s Revolutionary Guard.  I also [...]

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:30 am 41. you don't get it:

It does not matter what the United States or the Israelis do. The Iranians will do anything and everything to advance their stated and unstated goals, just like the former Soviet Union. I would suggest that some of you read Kissinger’s memoir. You may learn something?

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:30 am 42. Karl:

I say this not to enflame or insult, but sincerely what I believe will be best for all the people of the world — Israel, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, and Pakistan, should all be nuked into utter glass-parking-lot extinction, and the sooner the better.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:30 am 43. Jon:

>> Government was designed to work for the people, not the other way around

Which is WHY despite your stupidity, a Republican President has done his job and worked FOR YOU, instead of listening TO YOU and worked AGAINST your well-being.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:31 am 44. Joshua:

McCann - “Launching a nuclear war would be suicide and they’d lose everything they hold dear.”

McCann your reasoning is a logical fallacy. It looks good on paper but during your intellectual slumber Ismlamic hyper-theocracies rule the Middle East and have flipped your MAD - mutually assured destruction THEORY out the window of Islamic reality.

What they hold dear my friend is not what you and I hold dear and is one more reason why they despise you & me. What they hold dear is their self appointed monopoly on god (little G)and his intentions for Islam to rule the world.

gb8898 - And what are those talking points? “Be afraid! Be afraid! Be afraid!”

This may sound good to you and your friends but I’ll bet you a plane ticket out of this country you can’t sight one example of even one time where “Be afraid! Be afraid! Be afraid!” were used as talking points. You put this phrase in quotation marks so go ahead give me the source of these talking point comments.

You can base your entire reality on the best last thing you heard from your liberal socialist friends but that doesn’t make it true.

According to your flawed reasoning, police departments and fire departments exist to instill fear in the gullible right wing, crime & destruction mongers who are controlled by the Bush family!

I’ve got news for you… bad people happen!

So according to your infinite wisdom

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:36 am 45. J House:

Who honestly believes the Iranian regime can be trusted? They are a sworn enemy of the US and have committed numerous acts of war against the US since 1979.
America’s leader’s reluctance to deal harshly with Iran the past 2 decades will be our downfall.
As did NK, Iran will get the bomb without us firing a shot, then we will be at their mercy as they use proxies to foment chaos around the world.
Israel is the trump card.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:40 am 46. GMC:

Iran is a very closed society and if you recall Clinton shutting down many of our existing CIA operatives in 95′, the quality of our information(”intelligence”) has declined, which partly makes me question the credibility here. If you read Doug Feith’s Book: ‘war and decision’ - you’ll see that our response tp 9/11 was well thought, not rash. Saddam was shooting at our planes constantly over the no fly zones. He had the capacity to make nukes. He was a sponsor of terrorism throughout the world. He was ripping off his own people with the oil for food program. He whack job sons liked watch dogs mawl innocent people. He used Chemical weapons against the Kurds. Should I go on? Russia was a higher priority before 9/11 b/c they HAVE nukes. I doubt whether Israel will attack Iran before the election. Iran is a threat. They knowingly have proxies set up carrying out murder. Tougher sanctions or a blockade would be a way to weaken the regime, but we can and should agree that their regime is not healthy for the world.

I liked the points made that we are dependent on many nations - China(T-Bills) and OPEC(oil). maybe we could pull a Russia or Argentina and default on all our debt? Just hit the reset button, declare Bankruptcy. There goes our superior status, but we get a clean slate. Oh wait, the world would collapse as we know it. China would rise up to number 1 status as they inevitably will - pop. of 1 Billion, thriving economy, growing military,… What would that be like? I speculate we will see a North American Union before that happens.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:40 am 47. J. Alejandro:

What the ignorant, geo-politically and military history illiterate Americans(IGPMHIAs)of the MoveOn.org, “Bush lied people died”, DailyKos paranoiacs, do not know, and are incapable to understand is that the present involvement of US forces in Iraq has everything to do with the Russians. Afghanistan and Iran are, and have been the southernmost periphery of Russian interests. Unfortunately, because of the IGPMHIAs, and international implications no president of the US whether it was Clinton, Bush, and Obama (Obama will join them soon wait ’till he gets that CIA briefing if he gets elected)is free to tell the American people that we are involved in a war of geo-political magnitude of which Afghanistan and Iraq are just fronts in a theater of operation. Obamaniacs are going to be so disappointed, if he goes to the White House, when he will pull a JFK on Iraq as JFK did on Vietnam and Cuba. The problem will be if Putin reads Obama as a weakling just like Kruschev read JFK.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:40 am 48. J House:

BTW, the US Iran NIE DID NOT conclude Iran had stopped its nuclear weapons program-there are 3 elements to the program- developing bomb fuel, the warhead and the missile delivery system.
The NIE only concluded they stopped development on the warhead. Iran itself publicly admits continuation of the other 2 elements of the nuke program.
And, incidently, Iran already has a proven, workable bomb design, so the question is moot.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:42 am 49. Fat Tone:

gb8898:

Yep. “Curveball Part. 2.” Traven’s got it pegged.

Wake up, folks. Nothing makes less sense than building a rationale for war on one guy’s testimony. But I can already see plenty of people are eating this stuff up. Again.

Exactly as planned.

“And they want to destroy you.” (*insert sinister laugh*) Yeah, I’m convinced. Come on, people!

This is one angry Republican whose patience is wearing thin. You all can be willing dupes again if you want, but I’ll be sitting this one out.

R U kidding me ? This is not a partisan issue. Iran saw the Iraq invasion to stir the pudding just as this CIA guy says……it’s not opion, it IS fact. Iran has lied to the world 5 times about nuclear intentions, so we are to now believe it’s just to power the lights in ” jihad Soccer stadium “…That’s naive.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:43 am 50. Reza Kahlili:

It is great to be living in a country where everyone is free to express their opinion without being subjected to prison and torture. I thank every one who has commented on my article regardless of their position. My article states the facts about Iran as I see it and every word has been sincere and true as I have experienced it with my life on the line.Also,I went through much hardship to be able to publish this article (Risking my life again, knowing the Islamic agents will be looking) as there are responsibilities with what you say in relation with the agency. Now what most fail to understand is the mentality behind radical Islam, that failure includes the past four U.S. administration and many other in the world. Each of these governments look to Iran and the mullahs with their own interest in the Middle East and I am disappointed that the U.S. policies including the invasion of Iraq has played in to the hands of the Russians and the Chinese. The questions one needs to ask is, who would benefit from higher Oil&Gas prices, instability in the region, a weaker America both financially and militarily? The reason the Russians and the Chinese are happy with the mullahs is exactly that but they too have failed to understand that what applies to most dictators (They merely want to survive and rule) does not apply to the mullahs and I believe this miscalculation will cost every one dearly. While every one relies on the logic and believes that no one will be interested in their own destruction since if the mullahs acquire the Nukes and use it against the West then they surely know they would be wiped off the map but what do you do where logic does not apply, try talking logic to a suicide bomber.

God Bless.

Reza Kahlili(Correct spelling)

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:43 am 51. ff11:

I’m sure Reza Chalablili is entirely beyond reproach. He sounds totally reliable. We certainly wouldn’t be taken in by yet another lying dissident with his own agenda. No sir, we have learned our lesson.

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:46 am 52. Mike:

Jon,

You come across as a typical American. I see that you are then unable to see the big picture. I can also tell by your comment, that you would bow down before a man, and in the front of that man, and praise him. More power to you. When you awake one day from behind the barbed wire fences, you will then see the big picture. Enjoy your moment in the sun!!!

Jul 8, 2008 - 11:52 am 53. Chris:

Hey look, it’s Curveball v2.0.

Just in time too.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:02 pm 54. revhatchell:

forgive me if i missed something crucial, but i refuse to plow through this hsit.

this guy was so deep undercover but he comes out NOW…before bush’s next conquest and on top of that publicly releases his findings with everything but his home address attached?

impeach this utrd before he starts world war iii.

i will not have to explain my complicity one day. let history be YOUR judge.

LIBERTAS AB CHAO!

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:02 pm 55. IranianStudent:

Apparently terrorism works very well with you Americans, which terror is intended to do through debating, arguing, and stalling you into inaction. All the while Iranians are splitting atoms in no less than 84 research reactors. Oddly, no reactors whatsoever have generators, or power lines coming from them. Whether Iran already has a few nukes, I don’t know, but if they did, it is not enough to start the chaos that the Mullahs desire.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:03 pm 56. Catherine:

This has all been prophecied in the Bible. It may be of interest to some of you to read Joel Rosenberg’s book EPICENTER. It is strange to see comments of how this is all Israel’s and America’s fault. Granted, our American Government has blundered horribly and has provoked a lot of hatred, but Israel’s crime is simply existing! When Hitler threatened world domination very few took him seriously. Thankfully, Churchill did, inspite of great ridicule and scorn. His sobermindedness and dogged determination to look at the threat with both eyes open literally saved Western Europe. Israel has been threatened with total annihilation and only has one option, and that is a preemptive strike for self survial. Enter the Apocalypse of the ages, the time the Bible describes as “men’s hearts failing them for fear”. The great judgement is at the door and life in America, in the very near future, will cease to exist as we know it. As everyone knows, the only deterent to nuclear war has been each nuclear nation’s desire for self preservation. Iran has no such desire. Their sincere and fervent religious belief, as restated in this article, is the need to create global chaos to bring about the appearance of their 12th Imam. The deire to push the red button is fervant, deliberate, and desperate to bring this figure onto the world stage. It matters not that you or I believe this is completely delusional. It only matters that those whose life’s goal and stated destiny is to fulfill this objective, believe it.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:06 pm 57. J House:

BOTH presidential candidates have stated flatly that Iran must not be allowed to obtain nuclear weapons…Obama, during his AIPAC speech, even went so far as to say he will do “everything’ to prevent it (he said this 2 times to applause)
Now is this a Republican-Democrat issue?

Iran will have enormous leverage with a nuclear capability but more important, it will use it if it believes it is in Iran’s best interest.
It will kick off a massive ME arms race which will eventually lead to war.

Everyone assumes the US will nuke Iran if it tests a bomb- hogwash. NK tested one…no US reaction.

Israel isn’t going to sit around and let this happen without a fight…their existence is at stake, nothing less.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:06 pm 58. Myron:

Hey Mike. If one of your friends was threatened by a bully, would you stand up for them? What if that bully threatened to wipe your friend off the face of your neighborhood map? Based on your previous posting about Israel being the only country threatened by Iran, it is quite clear that you are one of the idiots living in this country. Where do you think the IEDs in Iraq are coming from? By the way, they aren’t just killing Americans, they’re also killing Iraqis. Questioning your government is okay and even good. Unfortunately you aren’t questioning. You just believe the government is lying to you automatically without questioning. It would beneift you and this thread if you spent at least 5 minutes researching before posting again.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:13 pm 59. Doc2:

Doc had it right.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:15 pm 60. Vince P:

To all you asinine Leftists who have your fingers in your ears while singing like little girls “I can’t hear you”, why don’t you do a little googling.

Everything this guy has reported is public information and should not surprise anyone who knows anything about Shiia Islam and the IRI.

In particular, look up “Twelver” or “Twelvers”. That is the sect of Shiia Islam that the regime in Iran holds to.

You idiots are so adsorbed with your petty American politics. Are you completely incapable of taking people from other cultures at their word? Well of course you don’t.. you are the moral superiors of everyone.. and since you think religion is meaningless you project the same view onto everyone else.

Well the folks in charge of Iran take their religion very seriously.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:17 pm 61. Un-lincoln:

Clearly there is a percentage of Americans that want to try to militarily dominate countries that do not conform with US directions. This percentage–mostly Republicans–should select several states within the Union and move there. Then they should form a new country and raise their own taxes to pay for their ambitious war plans. The other states with the majority should not have to pay (through taxation or inflationary deficit spending) for the expensive plans of the few.

If the 12th Imam comes and invades the mainland US, at least there will be two Americas the Imam will have to face. One will probably be completely destitute from deficit spending to fight bizarre, pre-emptive wars; and the other will be wealthy and should be able to afford to repel the invasion of the 12th Imam.

Let us divide for our own good, warmakers to their few selected states and peacemakers to the other states…I obviously will move to a peacemaker state and hopefully God will hold to his promise to bless the peacemakers.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:22 pm 62. Neil:

None of you people who disbelieve this guy get it: Islam vs. West makes the ideological battle between Communism vs. Capitalism ideological battle look like a game of 6 year olds playing T-ball. Economic ideology can’t hold a candle to the virulence of religious ideology, esp when it comes to eschatology (the end times). I believe this guy 100% because it makes sense from a religious perspective. But the West is basically a post-Christian society, so we don’t really understand religion anymore (except for Environmentalism, that’s our new religion, and it’s just as virulent), and so we don’t believe it when Islam says it wants to destroy the West. We’re so narcissistic, we think our preoccupation with poverty and equality is everyone’s preoccupation as well. But it isn’t. It has absolutely nothing to do with anything fundamentally economic. Economics is just an excuse. The religious poor could care less if they’re poor, so long as they’re going to heaven, and will do anything necessary to ensure that they are going to heaven. For Islam in general (but esp. Shia), that means destroying Israel and the West. And they will never stop until that is accomplished, because they can’t get to heaven if they don’t.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:22 pm 63. Mike:

Myron,

You were told/read that the IEDs are coming from Iran and you apparantly believe that. I question the government all the time. I just do not believe the propaganda that comes out of the mouths of our elitists leaders as you do. If you are one of those who goes to church on Sunday, then why fear Iran? You would know that they cannot wipe Israel off the face of this earth. Blind faith in man will get you no where. We kill more of our own in this country than they are killing over there. So, who is the mightest, and most brightest nation of people on this earth? Why, it is us, the smart and intellectual Americans. We have the answers to everything and are never wrong about anything. Just like you Myron. Read the actual words about the comments about wiping out a Zionist state/government as opposed to what the MSM reported about wiping Israel off the face of the map. You might be surprised that you were lied to, but then again, you might not know the difference.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:28 pm 64. BEK477:

MAD only works if both sides are unwilling to accept the catastrophic damages and destruction that follows a nuclear exchange. If one side won’t accept the damage and the other side will accept the damage then the balance of MAD fails and an exchange becomes probable.

In this case the side that strikes first usually prevails if all other vectors and variables are equal.

My assumption here is that Iranians are willing to acecpt outrageous casualty rates arising from a nuclear exchange. even if it means the defacto end of Persian civilization.

Given that the Iranian Revolutionary Guards and the mullahs are willing to accept the terrible losses of a nuclear war; one must conclude based on their many actions and statements that they are preparing to fight such a war and that when their preparations are completed they will launch. Delay only weakens their chance of launching an effective surprise first strike and delay allows their foes the opportunity to start preparing a defence.

Besides, they are acting on a devine mission so they can not keep God waiting. The sooner the catastrophe starts then the sooner we can get to paradise.

Please remember that the Iranians are also struggling to establish their ” street cred” with the Arab street. Launching a successful first strike against Tel Aviv would force every Arab government to seriously consider coming over to the Iranian side. The Gulf States would face intolerable pressure to accept Persian hegemony as aresult of an attack on Isreal.

Therefore destroying Israel becomes an almost irresistable lure ot the mullahs. Since a single nuclear bomb detonating over Telaviv would effectively destroy Israel as a modern state, the Iranians have a vested interest in striking first before Isreal can react.

I really don’t think that the Iranian leadership is fazed about the costs of a total Isreali nuclear retalliation. Even if they Isrelis kill off 20 million Iranians that leaves 60 million Iranians who are mad as hell and who are out for blood.

Logically, the best case from Isreal’s point of view is to arrange a diplomatic compromise. Such a compromise is unlikely. Iran’s need to bring forth the 12th Iman is so deep and so insistent that all other considerations are secondary. Any result that does not lead to the distruction of Isreal is an uacceptaable outcome to the mullahs.

I suspect that the leadership has spent the last 30-40 years building redoubts and survival centers for its most trusted minions. They may trust in God but they are unlikely to take silly chances. The leaders, the military, key political functionaries, key opinion-makers, key knowledge workers, the rich and servant class will be given access to these redoubts. They will ride out the storm.

If so then I think that the chance of such a war is very great.

Once Iran has sufficient fissible material - say 500 pounds - then they can proceed with building a cluster of bombs in the 10-50 KTW range. They will need at least 20 nuks to be considered a creditable nuclear force.

I am divided as to whether or not Iran will detonate a nuclear device at some sort of test range. Detonating at a test facility makes some sense in order to demostrate their achievement and to terrify the MSM. After all where nukes are concerned credibility is key.

I tend to think that Iran will do one test because it multiples the fear factor. But Iran could decide to just go for broke and launch an attack immediately.

If Iran has not broken out into hostilities with the USA before it launches an attack on Israel then I think it will launch an attck on the USA at the same time.

The USA attack may be nuclear or it may just be a wave of terror bombings.

Once we start down this path it will be very difficult to stop or change course.

The Israelis will launch all of their nukes if Tel-avive is destroyed. Presumamblly the targets will be militarya nd political with in Iran. The difficulty is that many of the Iranian political and military (target) sites are located in or immediately adjacent to major urban areas. Consequently , they may end up destroying major population centers by proximity and un-intentionally rather than by design. Twelve million people live in Terheran. two or three 30 KT nukes would effectively kill or maim most of them. Iran has no b urn center infrastructure to deal with the horrible wounds arising from nuclear combat. As such many of ht ewounded would soon die of their injuries.

I expect that the Iranians will have distributed their entire inventory to secret depots so that they can continue to opperate for years to come.

In doing so the Iranians may be condeming their citizens to becomming pariahs. Iran’s victiums will hav eto assume that every Iranian is a potential .

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:28 pm 65. Ohioan4truth:

Has anyone thought out that if a nuclear war was to break out hetween Iran and Isreal/U.S. that what oil is in the ground will be rendered “useless” for some time to come? Either way, we’re all screwed in the end. Insanity rules this crazy world. Perhaps it is inevitable that we humans are destined to destroy ourselves. No one, I repeat, no one, will escape the the horrors to come. Except the few survivors throwing their fishnets from a canoe far away from civilization that will look up at the sky and wonder where all those “silver” birds went that they sometimes would see flying overhead. A new beginning for Mankind? I doubt it.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:29 pm 66. J House:

But Neil, Lara Logan is having an affair and the new summer blockbuster line-up is so exciting!
The MSM is out to lunch on Iran and the threat it represents to US interests.
Don’t you know this kind of news doesn’t pay the bills at the networks?

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:29 pm 67. fred:

A few of the responses on this thread are not surprising at all: they could be anticipated, right on cue. And you know the ones I mean. They lurk in the reeds awaiting topics like these so they can lob inane comments, or practice Muslim taqiyya, kicking sand in our eyes about Israel, U.S. imperialism, etc.

Mark my words. The Unholy Alliance of the Left and Islam is evolving and strengthening. We are facing not only a very sanguinary confrontation with Iran down the road, but also maybe even an internal civil war with the Islamic allies: the socialists, Marxists, Communists of all stripes, anarchists, and their train following dopes. We will have to deal with both, and circumstances will dictate who we have to fight first. I am far from alone in this perception. However, the Leftists have absolutely no clue that this confrontation is coming, and they are not prepared for it one iota. They think most Americans will just take it lying down, but they are in for a big surprise. They will lose militarily; they will be lined up against the wall. And the gallows await their leaders.

Faced with a choice of appeasement of the Islamic enemy or surviving as a free nation and a free people, most Americans will turn hard on the Left. The Left has no idea of the coming storm about to swamp them down the road.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:32 pm 68. Un-lincoln:

Neil,

Please start your own country apart from this man’s America. When Islam was founded circa 500 AD. Israel didn’t exist as a country. Neither did the United States or Britain (the West). Therefore obviously the basic tenets of the religion could not have anything to do with destroying Israel or the West (which didn’t exist at the time of the founding of the Religion.

Also, Jesus (God) never tells Christians to attack Muslims yet He came to Earth to teach us how to live in a manner pleasing to him. Don’t you think if Jesus wanted you to focus your life on destroying Muslims that He would have at least mentioned it or taught a warlike mentality? Maybe Jesus (God) didn’t speak any words on fighting and combat operations, because He is all about forgiveness and not National Security.

What if we do nothing and the worst happens: The 12th Imam emerges as a nuclear power and nukes several US cities and Israel? How does that impact your ability to follow the verbatim teachings of Jesus?–which by the way is the only thing that matters.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:39 pm 69. Jon:

Well I guess its true, Mikey WILL eat anything

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:41 pm 70. Myron:

Mike,
I feel sad for you. Your world is so lonely and disillusioned. First, the ‘right-wing’ government, the ‘left-wing’ media, and just about every half-intelligent person knows that the IEDs are coming from Iran. If you trust no one Mike, then where do you get your information from. Secondly, I haven’t killed anyone so I would like some facts and evidence about how ‘we’ kill more people over here then over there. I require these facts and evidence since I don’t trust you. Lastly, there have been many statements from Iran about wiping Israel off the map, but the only words that matter come from the Mullahs not Mahmoud. I will repeat again, more research is needed on your part before you post.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:42 pm 71. Ed Smithe:

Curveball anyone? Just the question that he poses about the reason why the Iranians won’t take the “deal” offered to them by the Europeans. How about this for an answer…BECAUSE THEY KNOW THEY CAN GET MORE. The minimum deal would be a drop of U.S. sanctions and full resumption of diplomatic relations–neither of which has been offered by the U.S.. Unfortunately, now that they’ve mastered the technology, there probably isn’t a deal to be had any longer.

This guy is another Chalabi, duping dim-witted neocons into believing that Iran is suicidal. This despite the fact that they had never used CB (WMD) weapons until they were ATTACKED by Iraq.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:45 pm 72. fred:

When the armies of Allah fanned out from the Hijaz in the mid 7th century, there were indeed communities like those “Un-lincoln” advocates who were butchered by the Muslims. Some of those communities collaborated with the Muslims before the coup de main, allowing terrorists to ravage the state and taking action to undermine the state’s ability to resist the invaders.

The last thing people like “Un-lincoln” will see in this world, if they got their way and undermined our will to resist, would be the scimitar above their heads plunging downward.

That is how their erstwhile friends and allies intend to treat them.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:47 pm 73. Un-lincoln:

Fred,

I assume you mean that round-ups and concentration camps will be necessary to subdue the anti-war crowd. Once cleansed, the remaining US population can then persue the war without reservations. As it drags on though, and becomes a financial/economic strain for the few remaining Americans, those in the concentration camps will be given less and less food. Ultimately, those in the concentration camps will be gassed, simply to take them out of their starving misery. For hygenic reasons, the bodies will then be burned, possibly in ovens. Hopefully, for you, the war will be won. Otherwise, at your war crimes tribunal you will plead that you were doing what you thought was best for your country. But the victor’s history books will write you off as a monsterous war-criminal.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:48 pm 74. Myron:

Mike,

I feel sad for you. Your world is lonely and you are disillusioned. First, both the ‘right-wing’ govt and the ‘left-wing’ media (not to mention the military on the ground and in Iraq) all agree that the not only are the IEDs coming from Iran but that the military is actually intercepting shipments on the border. Secondly, I require some actually facts and evidence that ‘we’ kill more people over here than over there. Do you actually believe what you shovel out? Oh, that’s right, you only believe yourself. Well since I don’t have a blind faith in you, please provide some facts or evidence to back up your claims. Lastly, much has come out of Iran about wiping Israel off the map, but the only words that mater are those of the Mullahs, not Mahmoud. I repeat, do some research before you post. I can keep handing you your own butt all day buddy! By the way you didn’t answer my questions. Would you stand up for your friend?

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:50 pm 75. gb8898:

Joshua: Every single day we’re reminded of how we’re constantly at risk of an attack that could come at a moment’s notice. Do you not pay attention to the news? Fear is the single greatest tool any government has at its disposal. It works phenomenally well in Iran and other parts of the Middle East, and it’s no different here in the U.S. It’s always used to gain more centralized government power, and the approach has obviously worked well on you and others on this blog. With regard to Iran’s nuclear ambitions, I keep waiting for the government to trot out the “We don’t want the smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud” statement. I’m sure there’d be plenty of people willing to parrot it around cable news and the blogosphere–all over again.

Remember the scary voice that taunted our ships in the Gulf a few months ago? Remember how everyone went ape-sh*t wanting to attack Iran because we were told it came from their boats? It turned out to be some loony with a CB having a laugh at our expense. We can think it’s funny now, but a lot of people took what the government told us at face value, without question, and they were ready to go to war that instant. A sad statement on gullibility.

You guys mock Obama (so do I, but for different reasons), saying we’ll be invaded and put under Sharia law if he’s elected because he wants to “talk” to the enemy. Can you not see how duped you are?

Oh no! Talking! We can’t do that–because we’re supposed to be AFRAID of “them.” Why did Reagan talk to the Soviets then? Why wasn’t “ATTACK!!!” the first and only option on the table when it came to the commies? Was Reagan a naive lib? Also, invasion of our nation from Islamic militants simply CAN’T HAPPEN. Ever. Unless you honestly think a flotilla of camels with IEDs strapped to them constitutes an invading Iranian naval force. Is your confidence in our armed forces and defense capabilities really so low as to suggest radical Islam is a greater threat to us than the Soviet Union was?

Police and fire departments don’t bombard us with daily “threat assessments” and terror levels. They don’t ramp up the hyperbole machine and then say they need more power to “protect” us from the bad guys. Our government, on the other hand, works incessantly to make sure we remember another terror attack is just around the corner. This tactic–instilling fear in the populace–has existed just as long as the concept of formal government, and that’s because it WORKS. It drives people to close their minds to anything but what the government tells them to do. You seem to feel comfortable living that way, Joshua, in which case you might actually enjoy a home in Iran. Feel free to call me a “bad Republican” or anything else if you wish, but I’ll choose reason and logic over blind submission to authority any day.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:51 pm 76. Myron:

sorry about the double post, my comment didn’t show at first

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:54 pm 77. Chris:

It is pathetic the way all of you Chicken Littles live in fear of the scary brown people, buying into this obvious propaganda. Did he see any aluminum tubes during his stay in Iran?

Intervention is a total failure. The big question should be: Who cares?

You act like OBL and Friends are going to overthrow the US, yeah right. Let me know how it works out for them when they try and conquer over Texas.

The only people currently conquering our country are old world neoliberal communitarian banksters and their puppets, and they are moving right along while you hide under the covers from scary people on the other side of the planet.

Jul 8, 2008 - 12:58 pm 78. Chris:

@Myron

“I feel sad for you. Your world is lonely and you are disillusioned. First, both the ‘right-wing’ govt and the ‘left-wing’ media (not to mention the military on the ground and in Iraq) all agree that the not only are the IEDs coming from Iran but that the military is actually intercepting shipments on the border.”

Prove it. If there was real proof it would be all over the news nonstop 24/7, but there isn’t any. Most of the weapons in Iraq are being made, get this, in weapons factories inside Iraq. And the Dog and Pony show that Petraeus tried to put on doesn’t count. You know, the one where he was to show the world “evidence” that the IEDs were being manufactured in Iran, but when the time came for the Press Conference, it was observed that none of the weapons were, in fact, from Iran, but were from Iraq. They merely canceled the Press Conference and went about trying to find new ways to spread their anti-Iran propaganda.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:04 pm 79. Mike:

Myron,

I would stand up for a friend. Israel is not a friend of the US. Wake up. I don’t get caught up in all the left/right talk. It divides the people, as I clearly can tell on these posts. Look at your daily homicide rates in the country that you feel is One Nation Under God. Look at the daily statistics of all the abortions that are committed daily in this country and in Israel. You honestly believe that God will continue to Bless this country? It should still amaze me that the people of this country still act as thought they can do no wrong, but it doesn’t. The law I believe in is delivered at the end of a Glock. That is the law, if you happen to stand on the right end of it. I’m not sure what planet you are from, but it would be in your best interest to wake up and get it right. Iran is a half a world away and yet we have people like you running the streets, right here in America that are more of a threat to me than Iran is.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:06 pm 80. Chris:

@Myron

“I feel sad for you. Your world is lonely and you are disillusioned. First, both the ‘right-wing’ govt and the ‘left-wing’ media (not to mention the military on the ground and in Iraq) all agree that the not only are the IEDs coming from Iran but that the military is actually intercepting shipments on the border.”

LOL. What a pack of lies. Iran is providing the IEDs? People are still trying to use that Propaganda? Shouldn’t you be warning us about “Special groups” now, since that is the new propaganda line?

But like I asked before, Iran is providing the IEDs to Iran? Prove it. Real proof, not he said/she said lies. You can’t. If there was real proof it would be all over the news nonstop 24/7, but there isn’t any. Most of the weapons in Iraq are being made, get this, in weapons factories inside Iraq. And the Dog and Pony show that Petraeus tried to put on doesn’t count. You know, the one where he was to show the world “evidence” that the IEDs were being manufactured in Iran, but when the time came for the Press Conference, it was observed that none of the weapons were, in fact, from Iran, but were from Iraq. They merely canceled the Press Conference and went about trying to find new ways to spread their anti-Iran propaganda.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:07 pm 81. Mike:

Myron,

What part of Israel are you from?

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:07 pm 82. gb8898:

“Naturally, the common people don’t want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country.” –Hermann Goering

Several posters, most notably Fred, seem to be ardent fans of Herr Goering’s work.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:13 pm 83. robotech master:

For those that even have a hint of understanding of how MADD works know that MADD for the most part is useless in the case of Iran.

BEK477 has put of good points and I’m going to keep going in that line.

For iran its a huge win to nuke either/both the US and israel. MADD for anyone that understand current politics isn’t a major deterrent. The reasons are many.

First many in the US and the euro trash will say we can’t use nukes in return and if we do we must use Tact nukes and reduce/not use them on cities. Which means they pretty much can’t be used.
Many peace niks will say things like “think of the children” or its just irans leadership. These arguments will hold get sway and will heavily effect MADD response.

These things are know to iran… they know that MADD will be weakened against them.

Second no matter how justly the US or israel is in nuking iran and/or how limited those nuking are iran use it as a huge propaganda win for them. Their will be imagines of women and children dieing to the bombs and the radiation. Its also highly likely that many of these ppl will be staged and killed for the only reason to make video’s to show how the evil US/israel etc are and how the middle east must raise up against them.

Using these factors they believe that they can turn the whole of the middle east and muslims/arabs/middle easterners everywhere to raise up and attack the US, europe, etc.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:19 pm 84. Joshua:

gb8898 - Our government, on the other hand, works incessantly to make sure we remember another terror attack is just around the corner. This tactic–instilling fear in the populace–has existed just as long as the concept of formal government, and that’s because it WORKS. It drives people to close their minds to anything but what the government tells them to do. You seem to feel comfortable living that way, Joshua, in which case you might actually enjoy a home in Iran.

gb8898 you’re sounding more than just a little paranoid there buddy! If the government was out to get you they would have gotten you by now!

And based on my comments your opinion of me is… gb8898 said “It drives people to close their minds to anything but what the government tells them to do.”

Well BRAVO gb8898 you’ve figured me out. Now you and all of your America hating, U.S. Govt. hating, blame U.S. first friends can pat each other on the back since you’ve clearly solved all the worlds problems with your supreme intellect.

While you and Obama are having a cozy chit chat with Iran about “Why can’t we all just get along?” the rest of us simple minded, government controlled fear mongers will keep stirring up the hornets nest ’cause we’re all out to get ya!

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:23 pm 85. Joshua:

gb8898 - You outslicked yourself on this one pal!

All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country.” –Hermann Goering

Remember 9/11? We were attacked you fool!

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:28 pm 86. JeffA:

I have no doubt Iran is heavily influenced by crazy religious extremists. I want to believe my government as well as those of stakeholders in the region will do the right thing in preventing those leaders from acquiring and using nukes. Consider that just like in America, there are many factions within Iran which don’t subscribe to the extremists. The Persians were once a great, even secular, nation. They can be again.

What is really in question here is the reputation of our leadership, their trustworthiness. Bush has so over-stepped executive powers, so infused the government with lackies because they are loyal, not because they are competent, that anything he proposes now is going to be scrutinized or simply disregarded out of hand. It’s maddening to me to know the Senate & House supported his FISA indemnity for the telecoms. I’m flabbergasted at how little debate occurred before they gave him great latitude to pursue a confrontation with Iran. What has he done to earn those wins other than offer us examples of subterfuge, propaganda, and fear-mongering.

And for the record, the USA overthrew the Iranian leadership in the 50’s. 1979 was blowback. Don’t pretend history with Iran started with Carter. It began with Eisenhower, just as Vietnam did. American hands are dirty and bloody on numerous occasions throughout history. Shall we also recount how after Saddam used chemical weapons in the 80’s, that the UN tried to pass a resolution condemning it..and that one of the nations with veto power kept that resolution from passing? And who was this leading nation that would dare to block the condemnation of Iraq/Saddam? Yep, America the Beautiful.

Don’t you get it people? The American government is as manipulative and power hungry as any on earth. Only We the People have a snowball’s chance to restore America’s prestige and trustworthiness. We haven’t been doing it for quite some time now. Without the high ground, even what appears to be the right thing to do gets pulled down into the muck. Obama, McCain, Clinton - it won’t matter which one is in charge. None can reform on his/her own. Until another major party arrives on the scene, or one of the two we have is gutted, the direction of America in the 21st century will stay off course from the ideals laid forth in the Constitution by the Founding Fathers nearly 225 years ago.

Stop playing superpower and just be a nation that seeks open trade and defends liberty for its people. Many scoff at the Russians and their attempts to become a superpower again-to be relevant-to have a seat at the table. Well folks, look in the mirror. What would America’s identity be if it was simply another Great Britain or France or Brazil rather than the world’s lone superpower? Could our egos live with not being the big dog?

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:28 pm 87. gb8898:

Joshua, you and the government are not necessarily out to get me. I’m not that paranoid (yet!). But the government’s actions abroad are often deeply stupid, with unintended consequences for us here at home and for innocent people around the world. These actions are almost always the end result of an agenda meant to benefit the few with power at the expense of the many without it.

Calling attention to this is not “blaming America” (possibly the most overused phrase in our nation today), it’s blaming OUR GOVERNMENT. Mark Twain said “Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.” That’s what I adhere to, but it’s a belief which seems to upset a lot of my fellow Republicans now (even though we rarely supported the government during the 1990s; does anyone remember that fact?).

I realize it’s disconcerting to not trust the government 100%, but that is what is required of us as American citizens–at least if we’re going by what our Founders taught us. Abiding faith in the benevolence of government is always the foundation for tyranny.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:38 pm 88. ff11:

“I feel sad for you. Your world is lonely and you are disillusioned. First, both the ‘right-wing’ govt and the ‘left-wing’ media (not to mention the military on the ground and in Iraq) all agree that the not only are the IEDs coming from Iran but that the military is actually intercepting shipments on the border.”

Interesting, since both our military and media have reported that we found workshops MAKING those very same IEDs IN IRAQ!!!

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:41 pm 89. gb8898:

Joshua, I didn’t “outslick” anything. Did Iran attack us on 9/11? No, extremists from Afghanistan did–which is why I supported and continue to support the war in Afghanistan.

Do you believe Iran attacked us on 9/11? I certainly hope not.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:42 pm 90. ff11:

“Remember 9/11? We were attacked you fool!”

So what you are saying is “enough with unnecessary wars against people who had nothing to do with 9/11, let’s go get Bin Laden”, right?

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:46 pm 91. J House:

Jeff A,

If it were only so simple…just cover our heads and have the world leave us alone…now that is a solution to Iran’s obtaining nuclear weapons. What century are you living in?
Our ’superpower’ status is all our fault? The world is the way it is because the US made it that way? Iran has been a corrupt, terrorist regime the past 30 years because of US manipulation?
Someone here earlier had it right…Iran will go on doing what it does, regardless if US/Israeli actions.
They are going nuclear, whether you think the US govt is fearmongering or not.
Nearly everyone in the US govt believes that is a clear and present danger to US national security.
Now, deal with it.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:48 pm 92. Reza Kahlili:

Any one read the news out of Tehran:

Tue Jul 8, 6:12 AM ET

TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iran will hit Tel Aviv, U.S. shipping in the Gulf and American interests around the world if it is attacked over its disputed nuclear activities, an aide to Iran’s Supreme Leader was quoted as saying on Tuesday.

“The first bullet fired by America at Iran will be followed by Iran burning down its vital interests around the globe,” the students news agency ISNA quoted Ali Shirazi as saying in a speech to Revolutionary Guards.

“The Zionist regime is pressuring White House officials to attack Iran. If they commit such a stupidity, Tel Aviv and U.S. shipping in the Persian Gulf will be Iran’s first targets and they will be burned,” Shirazi was quoted as saying.

Shirazi, a mid-level cleric, is Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei’s representative to the Revolutionary Guards.

“The Iranian nation will never accept bullying. The Iranian nation is a nation of believers which believes in jihad and martyrdom. No army in the world can confront it,” he added.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:49 pm 93. rvastar:

Most of the weapons in Iraq are being made, get this, in weapons factories inside Iraq.

No one, ANYWHERE, has argued that Iran is shipping fully-assembled IEDs into Iraq, like a truckload of new Hondas. They are, GET THIS, supplying MATERIALS and LOGISTICAL SUPPORT, asshat.

Or maybe you care to tell us all where the materials that are being used in constructing these devices are REALLY coming from?

Maybe the insurgents have a magic lamp that they rub, eh?

And the Dog and Pony show that Petraeus tried to put on doesn’t count. You know, the one where he was to show the world “evidence” that the IEDs were being manufactured in Iran, but when the time came for the Press Conference, it was observed that none of the weapons were, in fact, from Iran, but were from Iraq.

That was “observed”? Really? Where? Links please.

They merely canceled the Press Conference and went about trying to find new ways to spread their anti-Iran propaganda.

Wow! How damning! I’d love to see a link that corroborates that claim!

But no one will be holding their breath.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:52 pm 94. Myron:

First to Chris, where have you been for the last year-and-a-half? The IED-Iran connection was proved over a year ago, not from a Press Conference that should have happened this week. And yes it was in the news. Also, I can’t prove without a doubt that they just like you can’t prove their not. I find it funny that people like you will blame Bush for not listening to the Generals on the ground but yet you do the same. By the way Gen Abizaid has also confirmed Iranian IEDs in Afgan and Iraq.

Second to Mike, American born and bred pal. I love all of this throw it up to God BS. Yes I’m Catholic. And yes, homocide, abortion, etc are tragic, but if you just believe God is going to do something about, your wrong. It’s people like you who believe that God will just take care of them no matter what. You probably don’t believe in dinosaurs and that the Earth is only 6,000 years old. If you want change, you have to be the change, not some blogger who just talks about God.

By the way to both of you. I have not called for war or fighting in any of my posts. Nor do I run around the streets calling for war. But I also take people at their words and watch their actions. It’s unfortunate that you don’t. It’s people like you who run around wondering what happened after you’ve been attacked. By the way, even though Iran is half a world away, all they have to do is keep up the rhetoric, shut the Strait of Hormuz, or disturb oil the slightest bit to hurt us. They don’t have to come here.

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:56 pm 95. Myron:

Oh yeah Chris, there’s real proof the surge is working. What isn’t that all over the media 24/7?

Jul 8, 2008 - 1:57 pm 96. Myron:

Oh and one last thing Chris. I didn’t say all IEDs are made in Iran. When I say ‘coming from Iran’ that also includes factories in Iraq supported by Iranians.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:04 pm 97. ff11:

Isn’t that convenient?

When we find it on the ground, it must have come from Iran.
When we see it made in Iraq, it must be made with Iranian support.
How do we know the arms are supplied by Iran? They are used by Iranian backed insurgents.
How do we know they are Iranian backed insurgents? Because they use arms supplied by Iran.

A bit circular for my tastes.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:14 pm 98. Myron:

ff11

You figured it out ff11. You’re a freakin genius. General Petraus and Gen Abizaid. Check it out.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:20 pm 99. J House:

All of the comments here about it being’ GW’s fault’ or ‘America is to blame for Iran’ cannot simply deal with the fact that Iran is determined to have nuclear weapons, and will have them within 12-36 months.
That is a reality, not debated history, the future US leaders will have to tackle. NOT GW. ( I partly blame him for not dealing with it, given his state of the union speech when he said ” I will not leave gathering threats for future Presidents to deal with”, or, to that effect…well, he’s left Iraq, Iran and NK to deal with)
It is not America’s fault a messianic regime wants to smite their enemies with the world’s most destructive weapons, however, I’m sure you’ll find some way to blame it for defending itself from these lunatics.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:21 pm 100. ab:

rphillips, Traven, etal:

I would think that 9/11 would’ve been sufficient evidence of radical ideologues out there who will go to extraordinary lengths to see you dead. But I guess it’s easier for you to believe that 9/11 was a government orchestrated,controlled demolition. Your skepticism stems either from your profound mistrust of your government or your egocentric notions concerning human nature. Incredible as it may seem, there are people out there who rejoice in the sacrifice of their own children, who murder their own daughters, who regard you with the same revulsion they have towards pigs. As much as I may dislike some of our country’s policies, I believe that our elected officials have more in common with me than those islamic fundamentalists. And it would take a LOT more to convince me that they would deliberately kill 3000 of their fellow citizens simply to advance a cause.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:22 pm 101. Mike:

Myron,

I see that you are Catholic, which explains a great deal. Sorry for you, but as long as you are breathing, you have an opportunity to get it right with God. You have the problems with dinasours, not me. Besides, tell me where it says in any book, to include the Bible, just how old the earth is. You quote 6,000 years, what verse? Genesis doesn’t provide that number. But that must be what you where told in CCD classes. You can continue to go to confession on Saturday and confess to a man, and not God, and I would like to see how that is going to help you. And in any case, if the Straits of Hormuz were closed due to some attack of agression by Iran, don’t you think that all of the super educated and articulate people/leaders that we have in this country would have done something about just this type of scenario back during the Oil Embargo in 1973/1974? If this is what it takes to get you liberals/catholics to wake up and realize who is causing the problems, then I say bring it on, if it were not for the fact that millions of others would have to suffer as a result. We should concentrate on the problems here in our country, but, that would not be true to the way all the God fearing people of this country do, they judge others so as to take the focus off themselves. Myron, hope is still out there, you just have to want it.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:24 pm 102. dan:

My favorite trope of the anti-Bush crowd is the one that goes

“All this jihadi terrorism is nonsense, it’s propoganda! They’re trying to manipulate you with fear, fear! Don’t you know they’re really trying to loot the American government and take over other countries to plunder their oil for the sake of their friends and the Jews that control Congress??”

You people really demonstrate the demoralization of America is indeed far along.

Have you guys ever heard of World War 2? Do you have some sense, at all, of the security arrangements that followed as a consequence? And have you acquainted yourselves at all with the avowed enemy of that system, the Soviet system, and who its friends were? Are you aware that this lovely system of international commerce and globalization, as well as very limited wars, is precisely the goal of that system, and that the US underwrites it with her economy and military? Can you possibly guess that Iraq and Iran are part of a continuum of fuel production, as well as an enduring strategic soft underbelly, that must constantly be shored up because of its anti-modern and generally illiterate and hysterical tendencies - which make it prey for, for example, Soviet manipulation, even more readily than your soft ignorant brains do for you idiots?

It’s also hilarious to me that many of the people currently going apeshit about $4+ gallon of gas also undoubtedly include many many people who subscribed to the It’s An Illegal War All About Oil!!!! theory. Gee, you think maybe there’s some relationship here it might be interesting to know more about? And hey what is this whole “Islam” thing here anyway and all this headchopping and ululating and blackbagging women and whatnot…

Really you fools claim to be so sophisticated as to penetrate the vaunted Bush Administration propoganda offensive and yet what - are you all hanging around the borders of Iraq and Iran and snuggling up with the members of the Majilis at night? Where do you get your information, then - from moveon.communists?

Lastly, STOP quoting Goering and Goebbels. These are not original thinkers. These ideas are self-evident to anyone who’s spent a week reading the history of politics and of war. You’re only demonstrating your ignorance, Again.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:35 pm 103. Myron:

I don’t know where to start. Almost every line in your post is wrong. First of all, you obviously don’t have any idea about the Catholic faith. Secondly, not liberal. Wrong again. Thirdly, what problem do I (or the Catholic faith) have with dinosaurs? Great argument, “No your the one with the problem.” Are we still trapped in Junior High? I know your argument still is. Lastly, confessing to a priest is actually confession. Not the I’ll keep it between God and me confession that most of the rest of the Christian world follws. There’s no accountablility in that. And by the way the Catholic Church is the only direct link to Christ any religion has. Everyone else (historically) has to come through the Catholic Church to get to him, so don’t worry about me, I’ll be fine.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:42 pm 104. J House:

Re some of the inane comments about Iranian-made weapons used against US forces in Iraq.
The facts are-
*Hundreds of rockets and mortars found in Iraq weapons caches WERE MADE IN IRAN in the past 1- 2 years, and markings identifying them as Iranian-made clearly make the case.
*Members of Al Quds force are IN JAIL IN BAGHDAD today, charged with commanding, training and coordinating attacks against US forces
* Several of these personnal freely admit they came from Iran to conduct attacks and train Sadr’s forces
* The technologies, techniques and procedures in the design of IEDs clearly points to Iranian origin
Of course, this all means nothing to the 9/11 conspiracy crowd that believes our govt/military lies to us every chance it gets…they would believe the world is flat if Nancy and Harry told them it was.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:45 pm 105. WillofLa:

The mullahs and immans here in the US are planning to do the same thing that Iran is planning to do over there. When the word is given we will experience what Bin Laden has termed “America’s Hiroshima”. Get it? Liberals who are led by their agenda of creating utopia in the whole world cannot think of Muslims as our enemy. They are. But it doesn’t matter because our government has got itself tied up with leftist foreign policies that have nothing to do with our safety. It is the purpose of the liberal Democrats, notice I said liberal Democrats and not just Democrats, that means that there are Democrats who can see the truth and the rest are out to lunch; to put America in a weaker position with the other countries in the world that don’t have the things we do, and aren’t as well off as we are. The liberals religion teaches them that anyone who thinks that there are people in this world that want to do us great harm are racist and haters of people who may believe differently from us. Their judgement is flawed and it is a HISTORICAL FACT that their line of thought has gotten more people killed over thousands of years that those who want to approach talks with their enemies from a position of strength and power. That way they will be more willing to actually change their ways and honestly be less dangerous to their neighbors, and us.

Jul 8, 2008 - 2:46 pm 106. Saddam’s Nukes, Bush’s silence, MSM incuriosity | The Anchoress:

[...] they’re too busy covering vaginal fitness spas. UPDATE - slightly related: an interesting piece from an Iranian insider perspective at Pajamas Media. by TheAnchoress @ 12:25 pm. Filed under America, Bush Good, The Fourth [...]

Jul 8, 2008 - 3:04 pm 107. gb8898:

Good grief, people.

“Run for your lives! They’ve already got mullahs and imams here, just waiting to attack! We’re all gonna die! They’re gonna eat our babies and rape our women! If you don’t recognize the threat you’ll get us all killed! Traitors!”

Take a deep breath, folks. When did you guys decide to become cowards? I mean, the best definition of a coward is a man who sends someone else to complete a task he himself is too afraid to perform. Are you serving?

If we’re in such dire straits, maybe you should enlist and get yourselves into battle. Otherwise, stop calling people traitors and unpatriotic.

Jul 8, 2008 - 3:06 pm 108. Vince P:

These lefties , with their idiotic statements about brown people and the rest, are exactly who the Iranians are counting on to tie our hands.

The Lefties were the tools of the NV