Pajamas Media

50 Comments

1. yagmurunsesi:

Consider just one example: the entertainment industry, which, according to Southern California-based economists, contributes nearly $30 billion annually to the L.A. economy. Actors, writers, producers, directors, studio executives, stagehands and everyone in between are able to get up and go to work in the morning because someone is tending to the home-front. And it doesn’t stop there. When these people leave the movie lot — and go to breakfast, lunch or dinner — it is usually immigrants who park their car, take their order, cook their food, clean their tables and wash their dishes before sending these creative types back to work.
Thanks

http://www.renovationdoctors.com

Apr 29, 2008 - 12:59 am 2. Sean Burke:

Anyone who has worked at a company like Microsoft or Intel
knows that Will and Zakaria are both right – immigrants are
a huge part of Los Angeles’ high-tech professional workforce.
It is simply a crass stereotype to depict all immigrants as
low-skilled workers.

Apr 29, 2008 - 1:39 am 3. JS:

Bogus premise. We need immigrants to watch our kids and cut our grass? That’s a weak arguement. The issue is illegal persons in the country. If they were legal immigrants, the arguement becomes null, they are here legally and presumably doing legal work. To suggest that “high tech” work wouldn’t happen without “illegals” is not clear thinking. If we believe in a fluid free market demand side economy, the need for someone to watch our kids, cut the grass and wash the cars would create the supply.

Apr 29, 2008 - 2:33 am 4. David Thomson:

Ruben Navarrette Jr. is right to point out the value of low skilled immigrants. However, he conveniently overlooks the late Milton Friedman’s warning that you cannot have both open borders and a welfare state. These people must not be allowed to get on the dole. This unfortunately is almost impossible to prevent because many immigrants give birth to children born in the United States who automatically become citizens—and eligible for welfare benefits. One can mostly agree with Navarrette’s central argument without justifying illegal immigration. This most important distinction cannot be ignored. He also fails to even mention the pervasive anti-intellectualism, growing illegitimacy rates, and high criminal involvement of the more recently arrived immigrants. An incredibly high number of them are contemptuous of education.

Victor Davis Hanson, Heather Mac Donald, Steven Malanga, and Myron Magnet wrote, The Immigration Solution: A Better Plan Than Today’s. This book should be on your must read list. Pajamas Media may even want to contact Heather Mac Donald and have her write an article concerning illegal immigration.

Apr 29, 2008 - 2:49 am 5. Ed Wallis:

Ruben Navarrette Jr.’s words here merely mimic the elitist “arugula” nonsense and moral-relativism of The Obamboozler.

Look, am I really supposed to be persuaded that e.g. silicon valley never would have happened or would not still be thriving if some folks had to wash their own laundry? Mow their own lawns?! Cook their own breakfast?!!? And, that this, in some convoluted way, should “justify” illegal immigration?! As Bill the Cat once most articulately stated, PHHHHHHHHT.

This author’s perspective is a shill-apologia for racist MEChA and LaRaza mentality, and his words need to be condemned in the loudest and harshest manner.

Apr 29, 2008 - 3:37 am 6. OmegaPaladin:

Mr. Navarette,

You are linking two issues that are not really the same. Immigrant labor may or may not be useful, but it is really a matter of how they arrived here.

Legal and Illegal immigration are separate issues. One is an exercise of our sovereignty, the other is a violation of our sovereignty.

Legal and Illegal immigration are separate issues. One is an equal opportunity system, the other is dominated by one nationality above all others.

Legal and Illegal immigration are separate issues. One simply supplies labor and new citizens, the other creates an exploitable underclass cut off from the government as well.

Legal and Illegal immigration are separate issues. One brings in new Americans (many of whom have fought and even died for their adopted land), the other leaves our southern border undefended for terrorists to utilize.

Apr 29, 2008 - 3:41 am 7. Chap:

The discussion these days isn’t about *immigrants*, it’s about *illegal* immigrants and assimilation.

Which sorta makes this article a red herring…

Apr 29, 2008 - 4:13 am 8. mishu:

If the *legal* immigration process was easier to navigate, there would be less illegal immigrants. The reason some immigrants use the immigrants choose the illegal route is that despite the dangers of that process, it id far more efficient than the legal process and demand for quality low-skilled labor exceeds supply.

Those who complain about *illegal* immigration *never* accept any solutions to reform the legal immigration process. These “conservatives” suddenly quote Paul Erlich stating that there are too many people here. Or, they become elitist arugula eaters claiming we only should accept engineers, doctors or those with advanced degrees.

Apr 29, 2008 - 4:51 am 9. Ed Wallis:

Sorry, “mishu”…strawman you’re raising there.

Just ’cause “it’s too tough” to “get in” legally…that’s supposed to make it OK for some to violate immigration, residency and employment laws?! …or, that’s supposed to make it the “fault” of the U.S. government having tight restrictions?! PHHHHHHHHT.

Making excuses for deviant and illegal behavior, you are, “mishu.” Disgusting.

But, gee…what do I know…I only went through the process myself. LEGALLY.

Apr 29, 2008 - 5:10 am 10. AJ:

Living in Indiana, where the Hispanic population is now over 200,000 (in a state of six million) and growing, I notice a totally different mindset and attitude among Hoosier Hispanics. Firstly, they want to be here. Secondly, they live amongst the whites and blacks. Thirdly, they all seem to work. Fourthly, they do not commit crimes. And fifthly and most importantly, since Indiana residents aren’t PC wimps like in LA and refuse to give up our language (English), the Hispanics all speak English.

LA clearly wants to bend over backwards to accommodate and give up what it means to be an American. Well, not all residents, but their terrible leaders like Mayor Villa Reconquista.

Indiana does not.

Apr 29, 2008 - 6:24 am 11. uburoi:

I live and work in LA, and the business I work for is probably 50% illegal. The illegals absolutely keep wages at a bare minimum in several departments, as they make job security almost nonexistent. Thankfully, I work in IT and am not terribly susceptible to the wage crunch, but I would hate to be without advanced skills in LA; you’d be living in a bunk with 3 other men in a one-bedroom apt to make ends meet.

As for the preposterous claim that without illegals, the elites couldn’t get along in life, I say Mr. Navarrette and Mr. Zakaria are full of it. I wash my own car, thank you, and I take care of my own plants, garden, lawn, and I fix my own meals. I also do my own laundry, sew and repair clothes, and pick up after myself. I also perform all the basic cars repairs I have the tools to fix. There is precious little that I cannot do for myself, and I still have plenty of time left to attend concerts, plays, the opera, and walks in the foothills. I consider fixing meals and cleaning the car and ironing my clothes to be a part of modern adult life; they are not some chore or drudge, but a integral part of getting along. What’s so impossible about ironing while watching a Laker game?

Here in LA, there is in fact a class of people who claim they can’t get along without illegal labor, even though most of these people are certainly capable of doing all the things that the illegals do for them, they just figure, with the low cost of illegal help, they can subcontract all the things that parents used to do for themselves to low wage surrogates. We have friends of ours who do nothing for themselves; who have illegals to do everything for them so they don’t have to. They claim to have more “leisure time” to sit around and watch TV or have wine tastings, but I think a close examination of their day would show just how much time they actually squander on doing not much at all. I find these “elites” are one part lazy and one part vain. Most of them think that washing your own car, or bringing a meal from home in Tupperware is beneath them, they want to be thought of as being able to afford hiring other people (here is where the illegals come in again) to do it for them.

Apr 29, 2008 - 6:41 am 12. chuck:

But one of the major reasons they are in a position to do so is because, while they and their spouses labor in their white-collar world, someone is home taking care of the kids, mowing the lawn, making dinner, and cleaning the house.

This statement assumes all (or at least the vast majority of) white-collar workers have a bunch of immigrants running around as their personal servants taking care of them. This assumption is pretty silly. I’m a programmer (i.e., white-collar worker) and I take care of my own kids, cook my meals and clean my house. I have my lawn professionally mowed, but not by an immigrant … it’s cut by small business owner who does lawn service.

Apr 29, 2008 - 7:25 am 13. Michael Canzano:

Navarrette ,is obviously an advocate of LaRaza and MEChA (subversive organizations hell bent on turning the southwestern states into Mexico).
Why anyone crossing the border would like to turn America into the crap hole they left is beyond comprehension ?
“Assimilation refusal is the first seed planted to overthrow a Nation. Any Nation accepting “Assimilation Refusal” as politically correct will eventually no longer be its own Nation”.
Americans are tired of “Illegals” draining our tax base. Fifty percent of California’s deficit can be traced to Illegals. The ‘08 election will show America is fed up with the “CHIMI CHAMI” and “Allahu Akbar” !
American Christian Infidel
Michael Canzano

Apr 29, 2008 - 7:37 am 14. Harry:

What a bunch of BS. the only reason they want the illgal immigrants is because of the cheap labor….the illegal immigrants will leave when they start demanding more wages and are denied.

Apr 29, 2008 - 7:43 am 15. AJ:

Firstly, yes, Navarette, is a leftist from San Diego. Thus, his views are what they are.

Secondly, to the point that we don’t need illegals, you are correct. Most American “do it themselves” and thus dont need illegal help at slum wages.

You know uses illegal labor? The left wing elite? They dont know how to do anything on their own, so they hire people at terrible wages. Nancy Pelosi, Streisand, Spielberg et all NEVER use American labor/union, and always cheat their illegals out of $. Typical that Ruben ignores that.

Apr 29, 2008 - 7:44 am 16. mishu:

But, gee…what do I know…I only went through the process myself. LEGALLY.

Congrats. With a name like “Ed Wallis” I’m sure you set off a ton of red flags. It must have been tough waiting for the chance in your block apartment in the old country. I bet it must have taken you YEARS before you could set foot in this country to work. I bet you came here with nothing but suitcase full of clothes, $25 in your pocket and a bunch of hope and dreams.

Let me guess. Some corporation sponsored you because you have “skills” that no one else could bring to the US corporate office. Me too. I’ve had that same privilege of getting a work visa in Switzerland and Germany thanks to the corporation I work for.

Our immigration laws are out of sync with the laws of supply and demand when it comes to low skilled labor. Back in 2006 when conservatives decided to try the Pete Wilson strategy of maintaining Congressional majority (that worked real well didn’t it?), unemployment was at 4.6%. My econ 101 teacher told me that’s considered full employment. Where are the other workers going to come from?

Apr 29, 2008 - 8:02 am 17. Dark Helmet:

Allow me to set this into proper a frame, there is no such thing as an “illegal immigrant”.

It is an illegal alien.

Illegal aliens are criminals. Regardless of what toilets they scrub, they are criminals.

The jobs that the criminals are taking are jobs that AMERICAN kids normally do.

Make no mistake, this has been and is an invasion of our nation. The North American Alliance ( Mexico, Canada and the now non soverign United States ) will be one union with the mile wide highway cutting the US in 2.

Your ass has already been sold down the Rio Grande.

Apr 29, 2008 - 8:08 am 18. Ed Wallis:

“mishu”,

Thank you for being so open with your racist and bigotted assumptions about me – ALL of which happen to be WRONG.

On the topic of “low skilled labor”…well…gee…I reallly didn’t think it was the objective of this great country – or its government – to target and aspire to seek out the best qualified “low skill” workers. One attains that level which one seeks – since your goals seem so low, so seems your outlook.

This article (as your argument, “mishu”) is horsehockey.

Apr 29, 2008 - 8:38 am 19. always right:

NO MORE debate on the law. We’ve passed it ~ 20 years ago.

It is TIME to enforce it. PERIOD.

Apr 29, 2008 - 9:15 am 20. mishu:

OK Ed Wallis, if that is your real name. This country is great because it presents opportunities for people that they would not have elsewhere. That “shining city on a hill” thing. I’m glad you were able to navigate through all the crap the INS put you through. I’m sure it makes the trip to the DMV seem like a cakewalk. I just don’t think ordeal should be necessary. I bet it burns you up about the Cubans who can just float here or my girlfriend from Bulgaria who got a green card because she won a lottery.

Apr 29, 2008 - 9:55 am 21. asdfs:

Yes, its not like they are taking the jobs high school kids used to do along with the summer jobs that are not there anymore or the fact that so many are trying to live off of minimum wage that they are crying to raise it even thought it was never meant to be a living wage. Yes the more people we can get breaking the laws the better right Ruben? What a tard. So since its too hard to earn money the legal way like going to school then you will surely support me when i rob banks to feed my family right?

Apr 29, 2008 - 10:02 am 22. Night Owl:

First, I agree with those who feel Mr. Zakaria’s response has the whiff of elitism to it. An IBM professional can’t go to work if the lawn isn’t mowed; or the house is dirty? Microsoft computer geeks can’t function at their jobs if there isn’t a hot meal waiting for them when they get home? Please. In the world outside the elite bubble Mr Zakaria inhabits, there are a lot of households, (dare I say the majority?), that get by, and have always gotten by, w/o a maid, gardener and au pair.

Second, I haven’t seen (I apologize if I missed it) mention of the fact that the reason the leadership in this country has been able to largely ignore the illegal immigrant issue, is because in a wealthy, growing economy, the availability of a cheap labor force is a plus. Far easier to ignore the growing issue of illegal immigration during times when their labor is in demand- i.e. large segments of the population are rich enough to afford maids, gardeners and au pairs- that to actually set to work creating a more sensible immigration policy that would legally allow more low-skilled workers be available when demanded by a growing economy. Facing the issue would mean politicians would risk clashing with unions and other labor groups who would (correctly) see this cheap labor pool as a threat to their wages.

It is true our economy would stagnate during boom times w/o the existence of a labor force to do the low-skilled jobs we won’t do because we can make more money doing something else. The real problems associated with large populations of low-wage subsistence level people, whether legal or illegal, immigrant or not, will become apparent if our economy tanks, wages drop, and Mr. IBM can no longer afford the luxury of a lawn guy and and goes back to cutting his own lawn.

In a classic supply/demand model the decrease in demand for cheap labor should cause the supply to dry up, meaning less immigrants will be tempted to enter illegally, the unemployed illegals would go back home, and the problem would solve itself. However in the real world, people who risked life and limb to get here illegally, and who have subsequently had children here, are not going to pack up and leave if the economy goes south and they can no longer find work. Many will stay, and many more will still come illegally, if the economy in our country is still better than in their home country, and entering illegally is a viable option.

If our so-called leaders don’t seriously prepare for this scenario, and face the reality of the strain that a continuing influx of low-skilled poor people will put on a slow or contracting economy, they will be forced to deal with it when it has already become a crisis, and some inner cities really do start to resemble the third world scenario alluded to in the title of the piece.

Apr 29, 2008 - 10:23 am 23. AJ:

One last rant:

This really is one of the stupidest articles I have read—so simplistic it is almost laughable. Not everyone relies on immigrants to raise their children, cut their lawn etc. People have gone to work for generations before and do it now and somehow do it themselves or––how Neanderthal in 2008, esp in LA–have their wives stay at home. People go to work everywhere in he country and eat out at restaurants where there are no illegal waiters/busboys. Correct me if I am wrong but In the Heartland and Big Sky country, they are functioning fine with legal workers at the gas stations and the restaurants. The illegal laborers just provide a cheaper source of labor for the restaurant industry—more profits. The prices probably wouldn’t be higher if legal citizens did their work—just fewer profits and I am sure everyone would be glad to pay 50 cents more for a burger to avoid having a huge medical bill for illegals and huge education costs to educate third world people who cannot and will not speak English or the huge police costs involved in arresting illegals for all kinds of crimes.

His checkmate sentence was one of the most illogical conclusions I have read.

Apr 29, 2008 - 11:12 am 24. gcblues1:

D thompson, u, and milton 100% correct. simply look at what france has created with a welfare minority. we are copying them with foreigners. Marx was wrong, it is welfare that causes alienation, not capitalism.

to the people that diminish the work illegals do, your idiots. without illegals we would import all agricultural products, and at least chicken if not all meat products, construction prices would soar, and hi tech firms would continue to have to outsource to get brain power. all across the education and intelligence spectrum product and service prices would rise, or more likely leave the country to produce elsewhere.

to the border and la raza obsessive compulsives. get a grip, almost everyone here started illegal. so what. law and order and the rule of law are not even close to equivalent, read Hayek. stupid laws trying to control a societal need, labor, deserve to be disrespected just like you disrespect the cop handing out tickets for traveling a reasonable speed because he got the town to post a stupid slow sign. maybe you get a permit for everything you do on your house. i sure do not. i try to hire illegals any chance i get. its the right thing to do. you ant farmers that think you can dial in a culture with immigration laws are self deluded.

Apr 29, 2008 - 12:27 pm 25. gcblues1:

AJ

the heartland and big sky country are full of illegals. your not looking. besides, last i checked their economy is a wreck.

Apr 29, 2008 - 12:43 pm 26. Joe:

> Correct me if I am wrong but In the Heartland and Big Sky country, they are functioning fine with legal workers …. illegal laborers just provide a cheaper source of labor for the restaurant industry—more profits.

Okay, I’ll correct you since you’re wrong. I’m from the Midwest, and now live in LA. The “heartland” is losing population for all the reasons I left, and they’re moving to areas in the South. So why is it a good argument to tell us we’d be “functioning fine” if we’d just be more like this “heartland”? They are losing population and economic vitality. I know many of those “heartland” areas, and many of those areas are dying economically, and as a consequence culturally. What are they doing wrong?

Joe

Apr 29, 2008 - 12:58 pm 27. gcblues1:

thank you joe, man i am jealous. i speak spanish just fine now, i live in central america retired, but i would just kill for a plate of pastor, or abowl of menudo or siete mares, not to mention a good coktel de camrones etc. America is lucky to have Mexicans. they should thank God that they still wish to come here and work despite the racist talk and action of the anti immigration crowd. just cut the welfare connection, make it legal to enter freely to work and all would be fine.

Apr 29, 2008 - 1:16 pm 28. mylai:

1. free medical care for san diego’s illegals have been vastly responsible for the closure of our hospitals.
2. “taking care of our children while we work?” the vast and large segment of single/childless men and women do not need childcare, cooks, cleaning ladies. So what exactly is the benefit to them except the ridiulously high rate of income tax that goes toward illegal immigrant entitlements.
3. The education debockle which is Los Angeles, dare I say the entire state of California due to the dumbing down of our schools for the influx of illegal children whose own country does not teach them english in the public schools as just just about every other country. California public education in the wonderful areas of high illegals produces high rates of high school dropouts and kids that are losing ground with respect of competitiveness against the private schools.

There are so many problems to saying off-handedly that more unskilled labor is what Los Angelos and to greater extent the State needs. Inovation and skilled workers are what any city, state, country needs MORE of to prevent sending either this state or this country into service-industry/welfare state stagnation hell.

Apr 29, 2008 - 1:23 pm 29. Heather:

What are the positive economic benefits of the gang warfare and organized crime that come with illegal aliens trafficking drugs?

How about the humans who are trafficked by coyotes and others who don’t care about the lives of the humans they smuggle? What’s the positive economic effect of enslaving and prostituting children from other nations?

Apr 29, 2008 - 2:33 pm 30. Mommynator:

I just LOVE how the quoted article tries to gloss over the differences between LEGAL immigrants (more power to them, may they live long and prosper) who love this country and work hard, and the ILLEGAL immigrants (who are BREAKING OUR LAWS and teaching their children to do so and have no interest in becoming American).

Why is it so important to muddy the waters?

Apr 29, 2008 - 3:34 pm 31. Fidel, MD:

Thanks to the increased income taxes and social security tax that the second wage earner causes to be owed, plus the frequent need for “professional” clothes and a more stylish auto, the net benefit of the second earner to the family is usually pretty close (or below) zero.

So, it’s not a stretch to say that these immigrants are causing a loss to the families they pretend to help.

I’m an emergency physician. I don’t get paid for about 40% of the people I see, and many (not most, but well over 50%) are clearly illegals. They help cost Los Angeles County over $1-billion a year in health care costs that are not reimbursed by the feds, so we taxpayers have to pony up the cash via taxes (mostly property taxes).

And before anyone claims that I’m a cold heartless bastard, let me tell you that you’re right. I’m also the first born of the first generation in my family, born in the United States, from Central America. My grandparents (both sides) came to California after WWII, and had quite a bit of trouble getting visas to stay permanently. I still remember my grandmother telling me how she and her side of the family (my mother and uncles, my grandfather had died before the war) had to leave the US and go to Mexico City to get another tourist visa (several times) before they were able to get first visas, then green cards, and finally naturalization. My grandmother was able to follow the law, and make certain that her children got an education and contributed to the US (all had graduate degrees, the two males also served in the military and earned doctorate degrees), and all the members of my generation have contributed as well.

We may not be typical immigrants, and I resent like hell the apologists for criminals telling me that it’s too hard to be legal. It’s hard, all right – but it’s better than being a criminal, and a thief.

Apr 29, 2008 - 4:09 pm 32. richard ponce:

heres what i don’t understand. ok, all these elites are having their shit work done by all these immigrants, right? then whos doing mine? theres a disconnect here, i think. the top 5% is being serviced by the bottom 30% ok with me but what about the remaining 65%? you know, the working class.

Apr 29, 2008 - 4:37 pm 33. ddc:

Excellent comment Fidel.

And yes, a lot of people would call you any number of names, including a racist had you not been of south american heritage.

What THOSE people would be guilty of though is racism in another way.
Against the 1000’s of OTHER immigrants NOT of south American heritage. Russians, Czechs, Chinese, Korean, Turkish, French, Spanish, English, Irish and every other immigrant who want in this country just as much, work just as hard yet wait as is the LEGAL way to become american citizens. Who don’t parade through the streets of California’s cities waving THEIR flag telling San Diegans residents that WE should leave and screaming discrimination that American citizens would dare even dream of saying that English ought to be the offical language, or that people at least be citizens to vote. How our politicians disgrace themselves by pandering to such ideologies and demands should be treated as treason.

My great-grandparents came her too, from Europe and had to wait to become citizens just like everyone else during their time of immigration. They learned english, built a business and hired american citizens. They added to our country as yours did. There was no medicare/aid/welfare/entitlements for them.

Citizenship is a privledge NOT a right to be given like so many entitlments given illegal immigrants today.

It is disgusting the way our politicians are giving this country away, for a vote.

Apr 29, 2008 - 4:47 pm 34. not obama:

As if Hollywood was the entirety of Los Angeles County. Haha!!

Rubin, you need to get out more. You think anyone in south central, or east LA, needs cleaning ladies, gardeners? They clean their own houses as do most americans. they mow their own lawns as does the majority of americas. Unskilled americans all across this country have to compete with your illegals for jobs. restaurant workers, etc? or cooks? If you want to hear the truth, the legal unskilled residents in middle america in THOSE towns are having their jobs taken away from THEM by your illegals.

Where on earth do you get your ridiculous information?

Apr 29, 2008 - 5:03 pm 35. Mikielikes:

Mishu

The fact is that we need to require illegals to “keep” the “law” for one good reason! Once they get here breaking the law – they’ll continue to do so! Do you get it? On May Day we’ll have millions marching demanding things they have no legal right to – yet they do it because they are free-loaders of the worst kind. If they cared so much they should make demands upon their own countries before breaking the law and demanding of others what they fail to do for their own – you get it? I agree that our immigration system is busted – but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s still illegal – it’s an excuse. I don’t want these people here because they have the wrong mindset to be “good” for America – you get it? If not, you’re a true dunce

Apr 29, 2008 - 10:50 pm 36. Joe:

> My great-grandparents came her too, from Europe and had to wait to become citizens just like everyone else during their time of immigration. They learned english ….

Oh yeah learning English would silence this whole debate wouldn’t it? Not even. It’s great your grand parents weren’t Irish. It sucked to be Irish and most thought the Irish would never assimilate. And criminals? What do you think they call them Paddy Wagons? But now they are ….. Peggy Noonan (Irish immgrant descent) who cries about immigrants (illegal & legal) who aren’t assimilating.

Raise the native birth rate and we won’t need immigrants. Don’t hold your breath.

Apr 29, 2008 - 10:54 pm 37. Marc:

Who cut people’s lawns and watched people’s kids before the 1990s? Seriously. People who travel in elite circles seem to have this strange belief that everyone in America is a news journalist or high powered attorney. Please. Just because people don’t choose to recognize working class Americans doesn’t mean they don’t exist.

Apr 30, 2008 - 5:33 am 38. not obama:

raise the public education standard instead of dumbing it down. the US was ranked 17th in the world a few years ago. pathetic. haven’t checked what it’s ranked now.

employers who are hiring illegals at cheaper rates, don’t do so to “keep prices down” they do it to fill their pockets. illegals while dumbing down our public education also dumb down wages by accepting below minimum wage pay – which is still considerably higher than wages in their own south-of-the-border homelands. then they take that money BACK to those homelands.

entitlements galore. would an american get the same in mexico? no, an american cannot even own land in mexico. america has many of its own problems with the citizens it has now which are not being addressed. the mindset that thinks we need more cheap “cleaning ladies” does nothing at all to help the VAST majority of americans who DON’T need “domestic help.”

Your arguements are meaningless.

Apr 30, 2008 - 8:26 am 39. mac:

Navarrette’s a lefty fool and one of the reasons his newspaper is dying.

Immigration is flat-out broken. We need to end it for five years, do a complete revamp, and then allow in ONLY people who have skills and abilities WE as a nation decide we want. That means ABSOLUTELY NO MORE POOR, UNSKILLED ILLITERATES FROM MEXICO!

During that five year moratorium we also need to tell all illegals that they need to leave immediately. We should also enact laws stating that failure to comply with immigration procedures will result in draconian punishment followed by confiscation of all assets, deportation to country of origin and a permanent ban on U.S. entry.

Add two more laws stating that all employers must verify all employee SSNs with the USG and that employers utilizing illegals will be fined $10000 per day per illegal employee and you’ll see a quick end to the illegal immigrant problem. If the parasite can’t live on the host, it will move on or die. It’s that simple.

Apr 30, 2008 - 2:32 pm 40. newguy40:

I am not really sure what kinda point Joe is trying to make about Irish immigrants?

My “great greats” were all Irish too AND did experience prejudice AND did live among other Irish in Chicago.

The difference between them and the illegals is that they came in LEGALLY. And, they got an education, joined the Army/Marines became Police Officers, paid taxes, joined the city government AND assimilated. Don’t see to many signs for “No Irish Wanted” anymore do you? Of course, we still dye the Chicago river green

Apr 30, 2008 - 2:35 pm 41. Fidel, MD:

Marc: Los Angeles had a long tradition of Japanese gardeners up to the early 197o’s. They were mostly second or third generation, in some cases the internees at Manzanar and other camps during WWII.

That all changed, the old Japanese-Americans retired and the young native Americans of Japanese heritage decided to become engineers and doctors and lawyers.

Apr 30, 2008 - 8:44 pm 42. T. J. Babson:

People who work their entire lives at low wage, low skill jobs are a net drag on the system. They pay almost no income taxes, and will receive far more in social security & medicare benefits than they contributed.

May 1, 2008 - 3:45 am 43. Dark Helmet:

T.J.,

People who work their entire lives at low wage low skill jobs are as an improtant a part of the system as those more dedicated and often fortunate and wealthier. The point being that it is a system, one system. One country and one language. The problem is that people break our laws to come here. The biggest problem of all and yet to be addressed is why the US Government has done nothing about it. The very job of our governemnt is to provide security to our borders, not telling us how many french fries we can eat. The people that we ALLOW to govern us have not done their job and acted out of interests other than the United States of America,

May 1, 2008 - 4:58 am 44. Mike Fresno:

This country is built by mowing lawns, feeding the children, and cleaning the toilets of the real workers. Someone from such a logical place as Fareed Zakaria’s home world should laugh at how preposterous that sounds.

This is talking point. Illegal immigrants *built* the United States by doing this. Laugh at them.

May 1, 2008 - 8:31 am 45. Valjean:

“… while they and their spouses labor in their white-collar world, someone is home taking care of the kids, mowing the lawn, making dinner, and cleaning the house. And, often, that person is an immigrant — sometimes legal, sometimes illegal, but an immigrant nonetheless.

Checkmate.”

My arse. I lived in the LA area 23 years and took care of my own kids (with my spouse), mowed my own lawn, made my own dinner and my wife cleaned the house. Thousands, if not millions, do the same. Oh, and I worked in “the industry” to boot.

That being said, I fully recognize the value that illegal workers bring; I’m actually for a very open immigration policy (pace Milton Friedman) provided new workers can’t collect government benefits for a set number of years.

Mr. Navarrette’s arguments are weak and anecdotal. He needs to retrench and explain the fundamental reasons for a liberal immigration policy — not just take potshots at stereotyped white-collar industry executives.

May 1, 2008 - 12:13 pm 46. Nahanni:

“Is Los Angeles Becoming a Third World City?”

No. it already is a third world city. San Francisco is worse, in some areas the “alternative housing”…errr…homeless people have turned the streets of San Francisco into the streets of Calcutta.

May 2, 2008 - 9:10 am 47. Increase Mather:

is LA becoming a third world city…? You mean, like Detroit?

May 2, 2008 - 10:10 am 48. J.J. Sefton:

What do you mean ‘becoming?’ It is! This is a town where money is an illusion. People drive around in $250,000 Lamborghinis by day, and then sleep in them by night because they can’t afford an apartment. I wasted almost 10 years of my life there and can’t figure out what makes that place run. Glad to be back in the madness of Manhattan.

As for immigration policy – what part of the word ILLEGAL don’t people understand? So, I’ll pay more for my lettuce. Gladly, because I will pay far less in taxes to support these criminal border jumpers. Pay itinerant workers who allegedly won’t do the jobs that illegals do better money, REPEATEDLY ENFORCE stiff fines to anyone who knowingly hires an illegal. Eventually, they can’t work and will jump the border back to Mexico. I am not racist and this is not a racism issue. I’m the child of an immigrant and it is our diversity that makes us great. But if you want to live here? Get in line like everyone else. Having to constantly explain this is just ridiculous and effin tiresome.

May 2, 2008 - 3:26 pm 49. Thomas-in-Newport:

Is Los Angeles Becoming a Third World City? I have seen LA and it is already a 3rd world country. They have the rich and powerful and the poor and downtrodden. They have the mansions and the slums. I have no idea why anyone would want to live there.

If someone is in this country illegally then catch them and send them home. If they come back illegally then send them to a punishment work camp for 1 year then send them home again. I am not sure they have any legal rights if they sneak into this country. And when a large group of them from the same country do it isn’t that normally called an invasion?

If they are here legally, then … Welcome! Newcomers are a refreshment to the life blood of this country. We will accept what is good about their culture and toss out what is not. Do not expect the nation as a whole to follow, accept or allow all of your culture. If that is what you wanted, then you should have stayed home.

AND we need to change the law so the children of people that are here illegally are NOT citizens.

May 4, 2008 - 9:16 am 50. Dry Salami:

What a pound and a half of baloney that article is. I suggest Navarrette take a ride around an area of town where multiplexes have produce trucks parked in front of them night and day. The cash only third world Los Angeles economy has sidestepped our own. I’ll never forget driving around Van Nuys on an early Saturday morning looking for an open store. At 7AM all the stores were still closed, but long lines had already formed at two places. One was the money wiring joint, and
other at the free clinic. Tax dollars and helping the local economy my butt. Climb down out of your ivory tower and take a look around Navarrette! LA is *already* a third world city. The real problem is no one wants to admit it.

May 15, 2008 - 10:18 pm

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