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Is ‘Obamamania’ Waning in Europe?

There's a general trend toward a return to more negative reporting about America, its people, and its president.

July 1, 2009 - by Soeren Kern
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On the campaign trail, Barack Obama promised that he would “reboot America’s image” around the world. Indeed, many Americans who voted for Obama believed that his global popularity would somehow reverse the tide of anti-Americanism that so vexed his predecessor. Echoing this sentiment of Obama as savior of America’s image abroad, presidential advisor David Axelrod recently asserted that “anti-Americanism isn’t cool anymore.”

In Europe, where anti-Americanism was elevated to the status of a religion during the presidency of George W. Bush, the “chattering classes” have, by and large, toned down their criticism of the United States since Obama was elected. In general, European media coverage of Obama has been quite favorable and the vehemence of the anti-American rhetoric has been notably more muted than in recent years. But now, five months into the age of Obama, the highly vaunted transatlantic honeymoon may be coming to an end. During the past several weeks, European media have started publishing stories that criticize Obama and once again cast the United States in a negative light. Could this be a harbinger of things to come?

What follows is a brief selection of European news stories that typify what seems to be a general trend toward a return to more negative reporting about America, its people, and its president.

In Britain, the left-leaning daily newspaper The Independent asks: “Has Obama been exposed as an innocent abroad?” It continues: “Barack Obama’s foreign policy honeymoon may be petering out as events around the globe, whether in Israel, Iran or North Korea, conspire to expose some inconvenient realities about his vaunted olive-branch approach to international relations. A nicer America does not a nicer world immediately make. It would help if the ‘Obama Effect’ could be demonstrated actually to exist, even just a little.”

In Germany, the news media have been especially angry over Obama’s failure to close the prison for terrorist suspects at Guantánamo Bay in Cuba. The Financial Times Deutschland, in a commentary titled “World’s Hopes Dashed By George W. Obama,” writes: “This decision [to revive military trials for some Guantánamo Bay detainees] isn’t a belated insight, but the pathetic faltering of a man forced to confront a disastrous legacy. … No one who defends these institutions ought to criticize Islam’s Sharia courts.” The Munich-based center-left Süddeutsche Zeitung, in an editorial titled “Obama’s Great Mistake,” writes: “Obama’s people certainly imagined things differently. But reality has caught up with them. … Bush light, so to speak. …  Obama is discrediting both himself and the United States.”

German newspapers have also been fiercely critical of Obama’s refusal to release more photos of alleged torture at the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq. The Berlin-based left-leaning daily Die Tageszeitung writes: “With his decision to prevent the publication of the photos, Obama, who promised transparency … is practicing opacity. … That the president is abdicating leadership on this question is a tragedy.” In another commentary, Die Tageszeitung writes: “Whenever [Obama] takes a step forward, he stumbles backwards as well. That will likely be enough to disappoint all those Europeans who had expectations that Obama would be an almost messiah-like healer. It was expected that he would demolish all of the ugly monuments from the Bush era and then, together with Al Gore, plant a Garden of Eden over the top, through which he would drive fuel-efficient compacts from Chrysler.”

The Financial Times Deutschland writes: “Obama promised that, under his leadership, politics in the U.S. would be both more ethical and more transparent than ever before. The dark chapters of the Bush era would be illuminated as quickly as possible. But since Obama assumed a position of responsibility, it has become increasingly obvious that he cannot live up to these promises.”

The Hamburg-based left-leaning Der Spiegel, which was one of the most hyperactive purveyors of anti-Americanism during the Bush presidency, has lately been back in full form. In recent weeks, the magazine has published a series of articles that are unusually critical of Obama. Some titles include: “From Mania to Distrust: Europe’s Obama Euphoria Wanes,” “Torturing for America,” “American Gays and Lesbians Feel Betrayed by Obama,” and “GM Insolvency Proves America’s Global Power is Waning.”

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Soeren Kern is Senior Analyst for Transatlantic Relations at the Madrid-based Grupo de Estudios Estratégicos / Strategic Studies Group.

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86 Comments

1. Meryl:

I question the logic of the Europeans who assume they will end up disliking obama just because they have a perennial and uncurable hatred of America.

So does he.

So where’s the problem?

Jul 1, 2009 - 1:39 am 2. Ed Wallis:

“A return to more negative reporting”?!!?

Having lived there until recently for many years, I notice no let-up in the negative, quasi-communist-TV-style reporting.

The hype of “positives” about SOBama were as superficial as those over David Hasselhoff…

…his just lasted longer.

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:26 am 3. Roger Godby:

Too many still love 0bama in Japan. Perhaps he’s just a welcome distraction from debt, demographics, and deflation.

I must say I’ll have warmer feelings toward 0bama if he closes nearly every US base in Europe, even if he does so apologetically for “colonizing” Europe for 54 years.

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:28 am 4. Spinoneone:

Frankly, I’m surprised they are waking-up so soon. Our own lovely MSM most certainly has not!

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:48 am 5. Snorri Godhi:

It would be too hasty for me to say “I told you so” … but I’ll stick my neck out and say it anyway. Over one year ago, I wrote this comment on a blog at The Economist:

Barack Obama plans to close America to trade and push Europe for more military action in Afghanistan. He also made it clear that he would never threaten retaliation for a nuclear attack on an ally. That my fellow Europeans hope for his victory says something about their intellect which I did not particularly want to know.

source:
http://www.economist.com/blogs/certainideasofeurope/2008/05/america_a_force_for_evil.cfm?sort=desc&page=1#list-comments

Maybe, just maybe, my fellow Europeans are waking up to reality.

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:04 am 6. Mike L:

Gee Europe is back to hating America? Just goes to show how tough it is to break those 230 year old habits.

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:27 am 7. tommygun:

Any American living in Europe and subject to their left leaning, propaganda spinning, radical wack job media elites would be anti American too in a matter of days. It is time for the sheep citizens of Europe to rise up agains their true oppressors which is not the bogeyman USA but their own media. I would favorably compare GITMO to almost any prison in France as just one example of their bull dung hyporcrisy. Why should America give a flip what these useful idiots think in the first place.

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:28 am 8. Snorri Godhi:

Reading this article more carefully, it strikes me that the articles cited by Soeren Kern are a mixed bag: some criticize Obama “from the left”; others “from the right” [including the "left-leaning" Independent]; others simply complain that Obama does not appear to be keen to listen to Europe [which is factually accurate but should not surprise anybody].

Left out is that Der Spiegel, at least once, criticized Obama “from the right” on the economy:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,632494,00.html

Then there are some articles which have nothing to do with Obama, and amongst these, at least the article from The Telegraph is not anti-American in any way: it is simply a report on American news.

What I find most interesting is that most of the articles mentioned are from the German press. Reading English-language media, I got the impression that most anti-Americans in the Western world are either American or British, but apparently I am wrong.

Still, I take note of the fact that one of the two absurd moral comparisons reported in this article comes from the American Flynt Leverett.

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:52 am 9. Mike Murray:

Hmmmm. That whole “Apology Tour” thing didn’t work out so well for Obama? Shocking.

Maybe it had something to do with his seeming abandonment of America’s staunchest allies, and his embrace of those who wish us ill.

Any ground Obama gained in Berlin was undone in Cairo. Taken together, the speeches can be summed up as Barack proclaiming: “Ich bin ein Islamist.”

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:54 am 10. "progressive"watch:

The world “chattering class” supported Obama for the wrong reasons and are cooling on him for the wrong reasons. They are goats calling themselves lambs and kittens. Why are we so concerned about having the good opinion of people whose good opinion can only be earned by being wrong and self-destructive?

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:59 am 11. Brian:

As a young American living in Germany, socializing with highly educated Germans, one of the first questions I am ever asked is what I think about Obama. This is generally a set up to informing how much they love him, find him refreshing because he wants to talk to them, and that they “saw” him in Berlin.

Yet despite being highly educated and often specialists in politics or international relations, their knowledge of actual US policy or Obama’s positions on policies is very, very shallow and superficial. When I tell them, for example, that he has continued many of the Bush policies that made them despise Bush as an enemy of humanity they refuse to believe me even if there are a few articles in the German press that can confirm what I say.

If the press is turning on Obama–and I would not call it as a definite shift until we start seeing libelous Der Spiegel covers on a regular basis–it will take some time for it to trickle down into the common CW. Just as in the US, a few far leftists are intellectually and philosophically consistent, but with little effect on their watered-down compatriots. The people here are so heavily invested in Obama that only something really major would break the spell.

Jul 1, 2009 - 5:27 am 12. vb:

tommygun,

I live in Europe and have been exposed to its media for many years. It hasn’t made me anti-American. To the contrary, I have lost respect for Europeans whose self image seems dependent on putting others down. There is something rather pathetic about a place that drools over our third-rate celebrities while attacking us for our shallowess. I can read the comment sections of some of my favorite blogs and find better, more insightful thoughts about world affairs than I find in the expert opinions coming from Europe. The blather from the elites doesn’t work on everyone.

Jul 1, 2009 - 5:38 am 13. rocketeer:

I must admit I lie awake at night worrying about what the Europeans are thinking about this country. What does it matter? They’re going to be an Islamic Califate in a matter of a few years anyway, then they’ll definitely hate us.

Jul 1, 2009 - 6:24 am 14. Mongoose:

Well, the problem with “disengaging from Europe” is that we just might get a nuclear-armed Germany out of it all. This would be a bad thing.

But as “Pax-Americana” fold, if that is indeed what is happening, the world may find that they got a lot more than what thy bargained for.

Apropos of that, here is an interesting note from Spengler:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/KF30Ak02.html

(hat tip: Belmont Club)

Jul 1, 2009 - 6:25 am 15. The Shadow:

SG – Nice trick – quoting yourself saying something stupid

Jul 1, 2009 - 6:25 am 16. Ms. Attitude:

Mongoose, great link. Thank you!

Jul 1, 2009 - 7:46 am 17. Hotpatch 6:

After living in Germany, Italy and Greece for eleven years, I really do not give a flip what any given European country thinks of us. My comments to carping Europeans is from my favorite bumper sticker: “which part of Europe are you from, the part we saved or the part whose butt we kicked?”

Jul 1, 2009 - 8:18 am 18. Erik:

Thanks for your comments Brian and vb. I’m also an American living in Europe at the moment (first Norway then Sweden). But instead of getting dragged into the cesspool of America hating, appologetic self-flaggilation it’s made me realize what a bunch of crap people get fed and which they consume with gusto. It’s really sad what state run media does to a country but it motivated me to get informed about some of my host country’s dirty laundry as well, I figured if we’re going to air grievences we might as well be fair about it. Swedes hate it when you mention that they’re the #9 small weapons exporter in the world or that you think their health care is less that great. At the same time they lap up a great deal of our entertainment, music, fashion and culture. The British author Will Self said it best in the PBS documentary “The Anti-Americans” by qupping “it’s like sucking on one tit while punching the other one… you can’t do that.” My only problem now is not turning into a knee-jerk Europe basher; the polar opposite of what I despise.

Jul 1, 2009 - 8:38 am 19. Steve:

I personally could care less than what those in Europe think of our country, if they liked what was going on in America they would most likely come here. It seems they are just fine with the country they live in regardless of how life might actually be there.

Isn’t this beside geography one of the reasons there are so many different countries, each one deciding how its citizens live in their, even choosing a language that is shared by that country.

Jul 1, 2009 - 8:39 am 20. Marie Claude:

I am rather in use to read anti-french english and american p

Jul 1, 2009 - 9:08 am 21. Marie Claude:

uh, my laptop is silly

what I wanted to say, was that the balance (at a lesser point nowadays for the Americans though) for anti-french rants is much heavy on the Anglo-American side than the contrary

we are concentrated on Sarkozy, than on to any country else

Jul 1, 2009 - 9:13 am 22. Dbjack46:

Americans are becoming disenchanted with Barack Hussein Obama because they are realizing that is farther left philosophically than most of the citizenry. Europeans, on the other hand, are disappointed that, in their ideological view, the man is too conservative.

Jul 1, 2009 - 9:13 am 23. Delia:

C-span was VERY enlightening this morning. Russian officials think 0bama is all ‘charisma’ and no ’substance’. Big surprise, non?

Jul 1, 2009 - 9:30 am 24. Hoob's Nature:

As days pass by I am more and more horrified as to how Barack Obama could have been elected as an American president. It has shattered my trust in the American nation. Obama has inflicted irreversible damage to the stability of the USA, to the point that the USA may fall apart into the individual states. I sadly say, Obama? What a looser!

Jul 1, 2009 - 9:39 am 25. Steve:

24. Hoob’s Nature:

Actually it is more like Obamas win is America’s loss. Let’s see what happens in the 2010 elections and hope for an awakening of those that both did and did not vote in the last election.

Jul 1, 2009 - 10:07 am 26. e:

Small note in regarding decline of anti-Americanism, Sarkozy and Merkel were both elected while President Bush was still in office.

Supposedly Obama has improved relations somewhat, but the changes have been a Europe that is slightly Pro-American, while still mainly against or neutral to American Foreign Policy.

The making fun of Americans for being fat or stupid or whatnot (when the real difference between the American and European people in weight, intelligence, etc. is actually rather small) its more about making the Europeans feel better about themselves. Most of the world is acutely aware about how much nicer it is to live in the USA than anywhere else on the planet.

Jul 1, 2009 - 10:35 am 27. Moogie:

Why do Europeans, in general, look their noses down on us Americans (except for Marie Claude, of course)? Because they are the remnants of the ones who didn’t escape serfdom, and we are the remnants of those who did. It’s cultural – generally speaking.

Obviously the slaves didn’t come over here voluntarily, and yet, culturally, American blacks have much more in common with America than they do with Africa.

What is it that creates a culture in any given place? It’s the common identity of those who live there. The original, common identity of Americans was the desire to find something better, for independence, and a certain maverick spirit is what brought them here.

What is the culture of Europe, in general? It’s a culture of people ruled either by monarchy, tyranny, or some form of democratic socialism. Those who stayed behind, rather than take the chance to come over here, were either very complacent and accepting of their role as serf, or they were too frightened to take the risk.

America is a land of freedom, not serfdom, and this is what sets us apart, culturally, from most of the rest of the world.

As to why the Europeans are so enthralled with Obama, I would have to agree with #11 Brian: it’s superficial. I’d also add that they, like many Americans, glommed onto Obama simply because he wasn’t Bush.

Jul 1, 2009 - 10:52 am 28. Steve:

I understand that this might be off topic, but right now for the first time in my life I am not proud to be an American and am a Vietnam era vet that served six years in the U.S Navy. I am now a Franco American that speaks little French due to living in this country for so long. Merci beaucoup Obama,embarrassant pour moi et pour mon pays.

Jul 1, 2009 - 11:19 am 29. Marie Claude:

Why do Europeans, in general, look their noses down on us Americans (except for Marie Claude, of course)? Because they are the remnants of the ones who didn’t escape serfdom, and we are the remnants of those who did.

whodo we send in America ? not our nobleness, not our bourgeoises, not our priests… but people of prisons, poor starving population were aiming to emigrate, I wouldn’t say that globally the population were aiming to escape their serfdom, they preferred to make the revolution here to abolish it !

Well I understand that your reflexion comes from the parallelthat you make with your Blacks

Jul 1, 2009 - 11:51 am 30. Marie Claude:

I am quite happy of my serdom, the freedom country never made me dream, except for a few books, moovies and musics

Jul 1, 2009 - 11:57 am 31. kenny komodo:

I personally don’t give a rats ass what the Euro trash think about our country, about George Bush or even, much to my surprise, Barack Obama. I would just prefer if they would come here, spend a boat load of money, have a good time, then go back to europe and shut the hell up.

Jul 1, 2009 - 12:02 pm 32. Sebastian Shaw:

The European press–particularly the UK press–has certainly be far more critical of President Obama than our sickly lapdog media in the domestic press.

Jul 1, 2009 - 12:28 pm 33. Marie Claude:

kenny komodo:

I personally don’t give a rats ass what the Euro trash think about our country,
CLARO LMAO

Jul 1, 2009 - 1:14 pm 34. Bohemond:

Marie Claude:

“I wouldn’t say that globally the population were aiming to escape their serfdom, they preferred to make the revolution here to abolish it !”

I generally enjoy your posts, MC, but here’re you’re blowing smoke. Your Revolution led nowhere but the Terror and thence to Bonaparte’s crowned dictatorship. By the time France evolved a genuine Republic (1875), poor France had fallen into literal Bureaucracy, Rule by the Bureaus: paternalism with a grey-suited face but nonetheless merely Serfdom 2.0, a jobsworth-ridden society where everyone is regulated within an inch of his life.

No, thank you. The man who wrote of ‘life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness’ also wrote ‘that government governs best which governs least.’

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:29 pm 35. SukieTawdry:

Listen, I’ve lived on this planet for over 60 years now and I can’t remember a time when there wasn’t a “tide of anti-Americanism” somewhere in the world, particularly in Europe where they so resent being dependent on such an inferior culture and people. Anti-Americanism comes with the job and trolling for universal love is not a worthy foreign policy goal for the USofA. If the “chattering classes” in Europe are back to taking potshots at US leaders, it merely means we’re back to situation normal. The scary thing for us is that the Obamites were naive enough to think it would be otherwise gratis a few flowery speeches and the sheer dynamic force of Obama’s personality, charm and charisma. Mr. President, you may be The self-proclaimed One, but you’re not all that.

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:34 pm 36. Stephen:

Alright, in the interest of peace, it sounds like all here can at least agree on one thing: Europe and America hate each other.

Carry on.

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:39 pm 37. Steve:

Marie Claude-vous de la France ou parlez-vous français? Il suffit de se demander, si elle n’est pas canadienne-française?

Marie Claude are you from France or do you speak French? Just wondering, if not French Canadian?

Jul 1, 2009 - 3:53 pm 38. Marie Claude:

Bohemond, our revolution wasn’t that much negative, it abolished serfdom, it gave citizenship to the Jews, it made France more cohesive behind republican principles, that are still our best arms against the attack of foreign laws and religions. Now terror was an epiphenomenum of it, and only harms us as far as the frames of our navy, less for infantry, people were promoted on the ground while on oceans you need professionals. Imagine if the revolution had spared them, ENgland would have been beaten and you would speak french at the very moment. But I imagine that you’re very happy to speak english and to spit on our revolution. LMAO

Be aware that you have as much burocraty than us, and long before avenment of O. But you’re too proud to acknoledge it

Now my response was in the vein of the post to which it was destinated

Though I see that you’re on the same wave LMAO

Jul 1, 2009 - 4:58 pm 39. Marie Claude:

Steve I’m a bastard French :lol:

Jul 1, 2009 - 5:00 pm 40. The Skizzerd of Waz:

Anti-Americanism has never troubled me since I really don’t care what other nations or peoples think about my country. As for Europe, to them we Yanks will always be the barbaric yokels who never cease to assert that we saved their a$$es twice while lusting after their women. While to us, the Europeans will always be the snooty gay boys who talk a good game but can’t fight their way out of a paper bag without our help, and Lord knows what they lust after!

Jul 1, 2009 - 5:30 pm 41. David W. Lincoln:

With good reason the bloom is fading quickly from Obama-mania. Watch as he dithers for dissidents, either in the greater Mid East, or Central America.

Who else is expecting more bottom-dwelling scum sucking in regards to Honduras from the Oval Office?

Jul 1, 2009 - 7:25 pm 42. misanthropicus:

RE # 21, 2/Marie Claude: [...] my laptop is silly [...] whodo we send in America ? not our nobleness, not our bourgeoises, not our priests… but people of prisons, poor starving population were aiming to emigrate, I wouldn’t say that globally the population were aiming to escape their serfdom, they preferred to make the revolution here to abolish it ! Well I understand that your reflexion comes from the parallelthat you make with your Blacks [..]”

Mais non, ma biche! Ton ordinateur, cette ordure is not silee! C’est vous qui etes sileee! Et ivre! So, mai bishe, stop boozin’ when postin’!

And since this dignified context allows for more francophilia, I’ll quote a PJM’s occasional poster (??? is there a consensus as to how you describe someone posting on Internet? Poster? Posterer? Postee? Help!) -
… da cappo, a post of an occasional PJM poster dba “~Paules”:
“Slap her, she is French!”

Jul 1, 2009 - 8:30 pm 43. Peter0000:

Obviously not enough American taxpayer money deposited into IMF. A clenched fist sounds appropriate to this American.

Jul 1, 2009 - 9:10 pm 44. Marie Claude:

misanthropicus, see, sillyness makes adepts :lol:

Jul 2, 2009 - 1:30 am 45. susan:

everytime you read a post from marie claude your IQ lowers. That’s why it’s safer to skip them. All the english teachers are all on holiday now around you? still no english class? not even a dictionary?

Anyway, why is it so hard to understand that the european press is LEFTIST too? you complain about yours, yet you expect ours to be fair and balanced?

About the press allegedly turning against zerobama. Even the lowest leftist scum knows that our economy depends on the good state of US economy. Someone is coming out saying that in spite of his coolness and color (fundamental pre-requisite to be liked) he is like a child in the control room.

This doesn’t mean that the european press turned right or achieved some sense.

Jul 2, 2009 - 5:33 am 46. Marie Claude:

hello my favorite harpie, I suppose it’s hot by yours, that you’re showing of your envy to display the excedente venom

Jul 2, 2009 - 7:35 am 47. Steve:

Que s’est-il passé à la question, est Obamamania déclin?
What happened to the topic, is Obamamania waning? I hope it finally is because I am so tired of this guy and his horrid spokesman Robert Gibbs (a freak) constantly on television or in the news or radio and yes even the internet that I am not wanting to do anything that exposes me to this insanity day after day.

If you did not vote in the last election then you now have an opportunity to fix this country by voting out these pests that are killing this country.

My family came from France in the early 1700s because of the idiot from England that convinced our king to print money to pay off a war debt that we had lost and when people found out that there was not the gold or silver to back up the pieces of paper used in lieu of hard currency they had the first bank run in history and also the first depression due to monetizing the debt. It is happening here right now and is getting worse.

The current president is a poor excuse of what is happening as well as the majority running the congress and senate. VOTE THEM OUT

Jul 2, 2009 - 8:14 am 48. Marie Claude:

susan, at http://pove_conne.com you’ll find the good translation for you subtility

Jul 2, 2009 - 8:31 am 49. sjc-tx:

e.
“”Most of the world is acutely aware about how much nicer it is to live in the USA than anywhere else on the planet.”"

That is an incredibly generalized, narrow-minded and grossly false statement. How many ‘others’ in the world have YOU spoken to??!

Jul 2, 2009 - 8:47 am 50. Marie Claude:

Steve can you give more precision about the historical fact that you’re quoting, I can’t find any equivalence on the net

Jul 2, 2009 - 8:48 am 51. Abu Infidel:

My mother is European and she hits the websites of her homeland daily. Negative news about the US is dominant, rarely is anything positive posted. You’d think American unemployed were reduced to begging in the streets, that racism is just as bad as it was in 1950, that medical care is atrocious is every way, etc …

I really do think it’s related to basic envy. Europe may have it’s problems, but WAIT! Look over there at the wealthiest country in the world – it’s not really that good.

Jul 2, 2009 - 9:26 am 52. susan:

what is subtility?

I just hope that the people here don’t think all europeans are dumb as you are. Barking nonsense on an american forum and not even paying attention to spelling, grammar and syntax. What a disgrace!

Jul 2, 2009 - 9:35 am 53. Snorri Godhi:

Steve:
My family came from France in the early 1700s because of the idiot from England that convinced our king to print money to pay off a war debt that we had lost

I assume that you are talking about John Law. He was SCOTTISH not English; and he was not an idiot, he just did not know the limits of his own intellect.

Anyway aren’t you glad that you are in the USA now?
It is happening here right now and is getting worse.
… oh, never mind!

Jul 2, 2009 - 10:34 am 54. Delia:

53. susan,

I’m not sure why you’re making fun of someone who can speak another language other than their own [even if it isn't 'perfect'].

I took French class in school and even though I had the ‘accent’ down pat, I just couldn’t ‘think’ or ‘communicate’ in that language.

I’d say Marie Claude deserves some kudos for learning to communicate in English because I sure as heck could not reciprocate in kind en Francais.

Jul 2, 2009 - 10:46 am 55. Marie Claude:

Delia, I’m going to love you :lol:

Jul 2, 2009 - 12:25 pm 56. Delia:

57. Marie Claude

“Delia, I’m going to love you”

What? You mean to say you don’t already by now? :shock:

I *DO* make a mighty fine batch of homemade croissants but I’ll skip the escargot. ;)

Meanwhile, Barack 0bama lives the ‘high’ life. Must be nice. “Let them eat cake?” :lol:

Jul 2, 2009 - 12:59 pm 57. Steve:

#51 Marie Claude yes here is a link to John Law (sorry he was from Scotland, but did speak English of sorts).
http://homepage.newschool.edu/het//profiles/law.htm
and here
http://www.mapforum.com/05/law.htm also here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Law_(economist) and shortly here http://hubpages.com/hub/John_Law

Jul 2, 2009 - 1:03 pm 58. Steve:

susan what is subtility? The definition for subtility is here http://www.thefreedictionary.com/
Subtility although archaic it is a real word.

Jul 2, 2009 - 1:32 pm 59. Marie Claude:

Delia, of course I did, but I’m a bit shy to express my true feelings, it’s abit like to be no more free :lol:

Jul 2, 2009 - 2:01 pm 60. Marie Claude:

Steve, tank you so much for the links, It’s funny that I can’t find them on the french google, and that our history doesn’t say much about what we could call a Madoff story. For Louis XIV, it is much emphasised that Fouquet, the great argentier, wasn’t in the king’s favoritism

Jul 2, 2009 - 2:15 pm 61. Steve:

62. Marie Claude: This is why my family came here almost 300 years ago and lived with the Indians (native Americans). John Law wrecked the French economy and now we have Obama doing the same, so the question is now where do I and my family go?…Is a revolution on the horizon.

Needless to say I speak little French but reserve the right to do so and mai Dieu vous bénisse et votre famille.

Jul 2, 2009 - 2:26 pm 62. Daphni:

We spent a few months in Europe last year and came to realize that Europeans have no concept of liberty that we had and are losing and they don’t realize the tyranny that they live in. I expected them to be more knowledgeable, as that is what I have always been told. Instead, they have lots of propaganda on their news, even more than us, but they believe what they hear. The ruling class is totally deaf to anyone’s complaints. I had hoped relatives would come back to America before I visited, but now, I think they should keep their communist ideas in their own countries. We should shut our borders to European immigration unless they can demonstrate they want to become Americans, not just live here. To emphasize that point, I met a couple of British women at a party that espoused very unamerican ideas, yet they live here! We don’t need that kind of people here, as they will be used to undermine our values. This is heaven and plenty of people are dying to get here. I hope more Europeans don’t see that way and stay out, and keep their political correctness, hate and envy at home. That way when we begin to question where to live when we disagree with the way things are going politically, we can visit backwards Europe and get our attitude adjusted.

Jul 2, 2009 - 2:56 pm 63. Marie Claude:

Daphni wake up, you haven’t been out of your bigotted book !

Jul 2, 2009 - 4:25 pm 64. Oscar the Grump:

Marie Claude
Are you going to take that from susan? Get in there and get her!

susan
Are you going to take that from Marie Claude? Get in there and get her!

I just love it when two women get in a fight! I can just see them ripping off each other’s adjectives and adverbs. Soon they’ll just be down to their verbs and consonants. Get in there girls, get going!

Jul 2, 2009 - 4:28 pm 65. Oscar the Grump:

Girls you’re in real trouble now. You’re really going to get it. Here come the nouns!

Jul 2, 2009 - 4:31 pm 66. Marie Claude:

oscar t’es un con !

Jul 2, 2009 - 5:26 pm 67. Marie Claude:

Oscar, you need entertainment ?

Jul 2, 2009 - 5:48 pm 68. Ramnier:

I can’t speak for other European countries, but here in Germany the media and most public discourse has a left slant. Anti-Americanism is one of the fashionable attitudes resulting from this. I can confirm what others have pointed out: The over-generalizing jokes and rethoric (to the effect that Americans are all stupid, uneducated, superficial, fat, imperialist hillbillies who get a kick out of destroying the environment) is often a deflection tactic, or plain envy.

As a young German, I’m often ashamed that so many people here mindlessly still stick to this type of talk that became fashionable in the late 60s. When I point out the discrepancies in their reasoning or the little fact that America played a key role in liberating Germany from Nazi rule and transforming it into a democracy, I’m often met with hostility. It can be pretty infuriating. However, all’s not lost. There are enough people who have a more realistic view on things. The main problem remains the media, which fortunately can’t be said to accurately represent the views of the general public.

On the other hand, it is interesting to see that it appears to be a two-way thing, judging by the equally idiotic, uninformed and generalizing comments here against “Euro trash”.

Jul 2, 2009 - 6:06 pm 69. Fla Chuck:

I was on a business trip in Germany during the last week of October of the ‘08 election. I remember sitting around a table in a restaurant in Bexbach, Saarland, Germany when the German project manager asked me how I liked Obama. This was asked with a big smile and was supposed to be a drawing-together point. I still chuckle over the way the conversation got very, very quiet and uncomfortable when I said I hated him, I thought he was at the best a Socialist and at worst an absolute Communist, and that I feared he would wreck my country. (Queue the crickets now…)

While there were occasional one-on-one light political chats after that, nobody asked any more political questions in group settings except one time shortly after the election when I went back again. They asked me what I thought about Obama now. I quickly shut down *that* line of conversation by assuring them he still sucked, maybe even worse than I had thought before. lol

@ 17. Hotpatch 6: LOVE the bumper sticker! “Which part of Europe are you from, the part we saved or the part whose butt we kicked?” rotflmao, too funny! I gotta print that one out…

Jul 2, 2009 - 11:50 pm 70. Meryl:

70 Ramnier

“As a young German, I’m often ashamed that so many people here mindlessly still stick to this type of talk that became fashionable in the late 60s”

Aw, don’t feel too bad. That’s the kind of conversation that fills the halls of the White House these days, in between skate board runs.

Jul 3, 2009 - 1:43 am 71. susan:

oscar, I don’t waste my time with a fwench retard who can barely speak english.

I find surprising that you all are upset of your minorities when they refuse to speak proper english yet, you allow a FWENCH destroy your language so freely. On top of that, she comes here to push FWENCH GRANDEUR, so it’s all self-celebration (of FWANCE, remember).

I bet there are other non american writing on this forum, yet NO ONE brags about their country (which is NOT the country in question in the far majority of topics, USA) but her own silly and irrelevant fwance.

It takes attention and focus to write in another language (such as MYSELF, DELIA), and I see very little spelling mistakes from anybody, then her stupid ramblings are barely readable.

Don’t you feel offended?

Delia, do you usually go to fwench blogs bragging about USA in poor french? then why you welcome someone doing it here?

I will report the insult to the moderators, stupid FWENCH. BTW, even the italian insult is spelled wrong. Frog, you are just pathetic.

Jul 3, 2009 - 3:42 am 72. susan:

delia, your “friend” used an insult to me at 54.

Beside the utter stupidity of calling other “racists” in whatever context, as she did several other times, she is so coward to write it in another language (that she doesn’t know, hence the grammar mistake) to avoid the censorship here or the moderators deleting her post.

Typically fwench cowardice.

Do you “admire” this person just because she’s a good ass kisser? I believe american people deserve better than a stupid and illiterate ass kisser.

Jul 3, 2009 - 3:46 am 73. Marie Claude:

I got a jaelous stalker LMAO, Susan are you a fat spagetti eating Leech ?

Jul 3, 2009 - 7:46 am 74. Paul:

DAPHNIA: While you’re absolutely right on the wonts of Europe’s ruling class (or almost all ruling classes for that matter), you’re wrong on Europeans having no concept of liberty. Actually, most Europeans do, but are quite complacent living under their tyrannies (of nice)as long as they feel their regimes are harder on other people than themselves. In other words, they are fine with never having a shot at owning a private jet, if nobody else can get one either. They (Germans in particular) call that social justice, a concept so paramount that it vindicates almost any bullcrap. Also, while envy is definetely the most important ingredient of the glue that keeps European societies from simply imploding, I doubt that too many people leaving Europe for the US appreciate socialist ideas. To the contrary, the vast majority of European immigrants is probably right-leaning. I, for one, am.

Jul 3, 2009 - 7:55 am 75. Marie Claude:

Paul,

“they are fine with never having a shot at owning a private jet,”

where do you take this info from ?

cuz I live in province with many small airports, and I regulary get customers who come with their own (or co-bought) jet for friendly meetings

“I doubt that too many people leaving Europe for the US appreciate socialist ideas”

umm, of course they go for getting an experience of different work concept, but they come back and they usely make a synthesis of the 2 both continents ways

The very european immigrants are from eastern Europe

Jul 3, 2009 - 8:17 am 76. Paul:

Marie Claude, “they” means the overwhelming majority not the few that actually do own a plane or at least pilot one every once in a while. Just ask them how “they” feel about banning general aviation, let’s say in the face of “climate change”. You’ll be amazed. Of course “their” answers have nothing to do with the climate hoax, it’s all about taking perceived “priviliges” that “they” do not have from others who do. As to the typical mindset of European immigrants, I didn’t mean expats but folks who leave Europe for good (and for a reason). I think that is also the group that Daphni was referring to.

Jul 3, 2009 - 9:39 am 77. Paul:

Sorry, it is “privileges”, of course.

Jul 3, 2009 - 9:41 am 78. Marie Claude:

Paul, I don’t think so, these persons are not from the upper class, but of the middle’s

Jul 3, 2009 - 9:44 am 79. Marie Claude:

umm, never heard that “climate change” were their worries, lot’s of them are former pilots of the air force

Jul 3, 2009 - 9:47 am 80. susan:

fwench baboon it’s spelled “jealous” and “spaghetti”

and about being a leech, fwench people shouldn’t talk about leeches.

BTW, I am barely here so I cannot reply to your useless 1,000 posts a day. After all I have a job, while, on the other hand you are on the fwench state’s payroll, so you have plenty of freetime to waste about fwench grandeur. What a pathetic lot. Bragging about your country in a forum where nobody really gives a damn, in broken english.

Again, I ask, who here goes on fwench forums bragging about USA in broken fwench?

Jul 3, 2009 - 9:51 am 81. Paul:

Marie Claude,

who said that anybody is really worried about that climate stuff ? I’m afraid you didn’t get my point. At any rate, there are plenty of good reasons to leave Europe for good, ESPECIALLY if you’re not “upper class” for it’s the middle class that gets to pay for all the good doers’ crab. Granted, most middle class people in Eutopia do not want to believe (yet) that they will have to pick up the tab. But those who do and leave are definitely not delusional about socialist policies.

Jul 3, 2009 - 10:09 am 82. Marie Claude:

OK Paul I can’t get your point case it is erroned at the very basis, you seem very bitter, I have no reason to feel the same

Jul 3, 2009 - 10:33 am 83. Berlusconi:

Susan, What post was deleted ? not yours apparently.
I am ashamed that you count yourself as an smart person

Jul 4, 2009 - 9:00 am 84. Ramnier:

Meryl at 70.:

I don’t know what converstations take place at the White House, I was referring specifically to the ideas of the so-called ‘68 Movement in Germany ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_student_movement ) that, apart from actually doing a few positive things, included many nutty ideas about the “restructuring” of the world, and thought that a new kind of socialism would be the solution to all problems. The ironic thing is that many of those ideas are/were just as absolutist as any faschist worldview. History is witness to the fact that these ideas simply don’t work, and especially Germans should know better (by looking at how miserably East Germany failed) than to stick to this utopian stuff today. I’m too young to have been part of that original movement and it annoys me that my generation has to deal with this crap.

Jul 4, 2009 - 1:41 pm 85. AnnieB:

Who cares what Europe thinks?

The future is America, the Anglosphere, and Japan.

Jul 5, 2009 - 11:50 am 86. Ramnier:

AnnieB @ 85.:

“Who cares what [insert region you obviously have no clue about]?

The future is [insert three countries/regions randomly chosen, without giving reasons].”

Wow, what an enlightening contribution.

Jul 7, 2009 - 6:07 pm

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