The People Are Angry? You Don’t Say
Nancy Pelosi's reprehensible "un-American" statement took a lot of gall.
The word has come down from the leaders of the U.S. House of Representatives. Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) and Rep. Steny Hoyer (D-MD) have sent a message: “We are not amused.”
Or was it “let them eat cake”?
Lots of ink and bandwidth have been expended on those rowdy town hall protesters. As PJTV’s Steven Crowder illustrated, most aren’t that angry. But those whose tempers are flaring are igniting the type of faux outrage that distracts from the real issues underlying the ObamaCare boondoggle.
Relatively little press has focused on angry Democrats like Senator Arlen Specter (R-PA) and Rep. David Scott (D-GA) losing their cool and shouting at constituents. Nor is the media debating whether the many Democrats dodging town halls can take the heat.
The focus is on the citizens, who are mostly amateurs in the area of public dialogue.
I don’t condone incivility of tone, but neither will I join in this media-induced hand-wringing over it. Most of the people who attend town halls aren’t reading this column. They don’t view themselves as part of a cause. They’re speaking for themselves, for perhaps the first time.
No one can control them and it’s foolhardy to try.
Speaker Pelosi calls those who are rude at town halls un-American. Her statement ignores how ordinary Americans typically behave. Those of us who have worked customer service know well that many Americans get quite nasty when things go wrong. Those who are getting out of hand at town halls have likely gotten out of hand over not getting tomatoes on their salad.
But it never occurred to me to tell a customer irate about his computer warranty that he was being un-American.
Most customers kept it under control and often said: “I’m not mad at you. You didn’t create this problem.”
At town hall meetings, however, voters are talking to some of the people who helped create the problem. Yet our members of Congress think they are the public’s masters, not their servants. Customer service representatives from every industry in this country may have to field the wrath of people dissatisfied with the product, the service, or the company policies, but members of Congress apparently should be immune from such wrath by virtue of them being members of Congress.
At least according to Speaker Pelosi.
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Adam Graham is a contributor at Race42012.com and host of the Truth and Hope Report podcast. His personal site is Adam's Blog.
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152 Comments
1. Calvin Ball:What’s a San Franciscan know about being an American?
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:09 am 2. Calvin Ball:Instead, they figured out how to call it a “wetland”, and tell us it needs to be protected.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:12 am 3. jharp:“Speaker Pelosi calls those who are rude at town halls un-American.”
And she’s right. The teabaggers sole goal is to disrupt the town hall process. And to disallow and halt any debate.
“But it never occurred to me to tell a customer irate about his computer warranty that he was being un-American.”
Maybe because it’s not. Getting irate over a warranty problem is not disrupting the democratic process.
Go Nancy! Call it like it is. Don’t back down from bunch of ignorant redneck teabaggers trying to disrupt the town halls.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:18 am 4. Sherab Zangpo:FROM
power to the people
TO
obey with discussions, or else
in forty years.
The sad, repetitive, old story of ALL the communists all over the world.
Thank you for the opportunity to comment
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:18 am 5. Fairbanks99:This MUST be understood by the Republican Party in selecting candidates. All contenders to office should be submitted to a rigorous background investigation, the kind the military uses for Top Secret/SCI clearances. Any dirt found that would look bad in print (infidelity, bribes, non-failure to pay taxes, etc), should be cause for dismissal. In fact, the Party should start running ads on TV that all candidates will pass a background check, and only those men and women who possess integrity will be allowed to run. The future of our Nation depends on presenting a valid alternative to Statist tyranny. Failure to present this alternative will lead to third parties drawing away votes and diluting the effort to unseat the criminals in power.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:18 am 6. billslayer:Get out the guillotine! Lets make sure its nice and sharp…
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:19 am 7. billslayer:Fairbanks99: Brilliant idea! They should also have to take a pledge under penalty of expulsion from the party to not ever vote in favor of any form of deficit spending.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:23 am 8. Paul off the beach:“Republicans should choose people who will increase the stature of Congress in the eyes of the public rather than..”
Oh yeah Republicans as the Mommy party to the abusive Democrats. To ‘clean up the mess’, ‘reach across the aisle’, be ‘bipartisan’.
Like, as in the fiscal discipline of Bush/Fat Hasteret/Lott era?
The parties switch back and forth in their Good Cop, Bad Cop work over of the American public.
Please. The WWF is more honest.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:24 am 9. blotto:jharp: Tool.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:24 am 10. Fairbanks99:I meant “failure to pay taxes”, aka Turbo Tax Timmy.
Comrade Jharp – isn’t the careful selection of who is permitted to attend the so-called Town Hall meetings “disallowing and halting any debate”? How can there be debate if only slack-jawed Obots are in the audience? Sure wish we had you on our side when ignorant redneck Moveoners were disrupting GW winning the Iraq War.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:25 am 11. joe buzz:This “dialogue” is getting zanier by the day. After madame speaker complains that folks are showing up at town halls dressed as nazis, a gent is noted carrying a O-Hitler poster generated by followers of Lyndon LaRouche then later handing out Rep Dingell fliers. Then on cue the MSM blames talk show hosts and Conservatives for the posters here.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:26 am 12. Bryan:Does anyone else feel as if they are living in a very bad Monty Python’s Flying Circus movie with some very humorless actors…?
A SIMPLE REQUEST:
Please email your representatives in congress the following:
~~~
~~~
I am requesting that you sponsor the following amendment to the health care bill.
If you cannot support the below amendment then you cannot in good conscious vote to approve this bill.
1) UPON THE PASSAGE OF NATIONAL HEALTH CARE BILL IT IS RESOLVED THAT ALL MEMBERS OF CONGRESS AND THEIR FAMILIES ARE REQUIRED TO BE SOLELY COVERED BY THE GOVERNMENT PROVIDED HEALTH CARE PLAN.
2) CONGRESS AND THEIR FAMILIES MAY NOT HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL INSURANCE PLAN OR PRIVATE HEALTH CARE SYSTEM APPLIED TO THEM EVEN IF THEY PAY FOR IT THEMSELVES.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:27 am 13. Jared:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This health care plan does not look so good when YOU and YOUR FAMILY are forced to live by the same rules you are planning to force on the rest of us.
Nice article. You swerved tantalizingly close to the real nut of the disconnect that Pelosi etal are missing.
To them, taking gross amounts of your income, passing laws that restrict your freedom, invading your privacy, etc is their job and the proper role of government.
However, if some thug on the street were trying to take the money and freedom from me that congress is contemplating, I’d shoot them in the face. They just do not get that. They see their activities as just some minor imposition that we should tolerate if we’re not out right thankful for. We see it as quite literally, their end of our lives as we know it, and as is our natural right under the constitution. The second amendment is not about hunting. It is about “recalling” politicians that are not responsive to the will of the people and who have insulated themselves from the electoral process. The former seems true today, and we’ll see about the latter in 2010.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:30 am 14. Sherab Zangpo:#12 BRYAN
BINGO !
I absolutely, totally, completely agree.
Thank you for the opportunity to comment.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:34 am 15. Paul M Hupf:The biggest change in Washington since January has been nothing less than hostility on the part of the Democratic majority of both Houses of the Congress and the President toward any dissent. The Speaker of the House and the Senate majority leader (Pelosi and Reid) continually characterize protests as Nazi like; unAmerican; goon squads or using words of similar import. The President characterizes dissent as misguided and inaccurate; he insists that there is no merit to any position other than his and that he has the truth whereas others are misled.
The reality is just the opposite. The pro administration squads aim to intimidate everyday ordinary citizens and are bussed to the site of the protest, whereas the protesters must use their own means of transit. The hired protesters bring professionally made signs; the protesters bring hand made signs. A Congressman in Texas will not admit anyone to his “town hall’ meeting without supplying a “proper” ID. He has in the past voted against legislation which would require an ID (driver’s license e.g.) in order to vote. Neither the President, Nancy Pelosi nor Senator Reid know the content of the so called “health care bill” which is not in its final form with drafts exceeding 1000 pages.
Yet they insist that we are unAmerican if we disagree with them.
The situation is serious. Our rights as free citizens are at stake.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:39 am 16. jharp:Bryan:
“This health care plan does not look so good when YOU and YOUR FAMILY are forced to live by the same rules you are planning to force on the rest of us.”
No one is forcing anyone onto anything.
You can keep the insurance you have now, you fool.
Or are you a liar? Which is it?
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:41 am 17. GLASS:If George Bush was stupid and a disgrace to America then Pelosi must have been his maker. This botox babe is beyond stupid, arrogant and condescending in her comments and policy announcements. A reality hick of the first order, a hermaphroditic pit bull peeing at the wrong angle on everything and anything without a thread of common sense.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:46 am 18. jharp:“Comrade Jharp – isn’t the careful selection of who is permitted to attend the so-called Town Hall meetings “disallowing and halting any debate”?”
So now allowing the ignorant teabag disrupters to speak is somehow a careful selection of who is permitted in?
“Sure wish we had you on our side when ignorant redneck Moveoners were disrupting GW winning the Iraq War.”
Really? How so? Bush was getting advice on how to lose the war from citizens at Town Hall meetings?
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:47 am 19. billslayer:JHARP; are you a fool? are you a liar? or are you willfully ignorant? Your messiah is a man that got his start getting his knees dirty in front of a SLUMLORD. Seriously. Picture it, because you’re gonna get reminded of it every single day.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:49 am 20. jharp:How about this folks? Is it OK to label these folks unAmerican?
Another Democratic Congressman now says he has received threats over the health care bill: Dennis Moore of Kansas.
Moore told the Fox affiliate in Kansas City that he has received two separate threats in the last ten days. Moore also said that because of the threats, and because of the examples he’s seen from other members’ town halls, he won’t be hold any town halls himself.
Moore is the third Democratic member of Congress to publicly acknowledge receiving these threats, not including the swastika found at a Georgia Democrat’s office this week, or the Maryland Democrat who was hanged from a noose in effigy in front of his district office.
At the same time, at least two Democratic lawmakers have also received faxes that depict President Obama as the Joker and warned of “Death to All Marxists! Foreign and Domestic!”
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:56 am 21. AThinkingPerson:Nancy Pelosi is one hot mess. I find it rather amusing that even the President is now distancing himself from her. I have a feeling that with the health care tragedy she helped co-write and trying to sneak through 500 BILLION for new jets to ferry her wrinkled butt around the world, her name is pretty much mud even within her own party.
When Camille Paglia, Democrat writer and activist, calls for Nancy to step down, the writing is on the wall. http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2009/08/12/town_halls/index.html
Buh Bye Nancy. Don’t let the door hit you on your way out.
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:58 am 22. Bill:jharp:
“No one is forcing anyone onto anything.”
Citizens are being forced to give money for other peoples’ insurance. Are you a liar, or a fool?
Aug 12, 2009 - 11:58 am 23. David Thomson:“Citizens are being forced to give money for other peoples’ insurance. Are you a liar, or a fool?”
Please don’t feed the trolls. It is best to simply ignore a silly person like Jharp.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:10 pm 24. Sherab Zangpo:Yes,
don’t worry folks,
the Supreme Leader and his comrades assure us that this is what is going to happen:
the government will be
1) a competitor with private insurance
2) and, at the same time, it will dictate the rules of what the private insurances must provide and at what cost
AND
the private insurances, in this IMPOSSIBLE condition, will survive PERFECTLY.
ICE will be hot water and hot water ice.
The truth is that they want to nationalize 1/6 of the American economy with one bill,
and this is the second blow to a free-market economy (the first being the attack against the dollar carried on by spending America into oblivion).
The third move will be cap and trade and at that point we will live in a socialist country for good.
These guys are determined to destroy American Freedom.
The lies and the aggressivity of the trolls tell you the whole story.
Thank you for the opportunity to comment.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:11 pm 25. Ed Wallis:Bill #20,
No, “jharp” is a troll to be ignored. Agitation propaganda, whether paid for or not, is an unfortunate nuisance here at PJM.
The House bill – which “jharp” clearly has either not read or is unwilling to accept – has limitations/constraints on current private providers such that, within roughly 5 years or so, they will be unable to compete with the so-called “public option” (yeah…right…just like “taking a shower” was an “option” in the death camps…).
To repeat: “jharp,” among too many other cretins who take up space among the more sincere and intelligent posters here at PJM, is an agit-prop troll to be ignored.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:12 pm 26. Robert V:“How about this folks? Is it OK to label these folks unAmerican?”
Yes. Why? The First Amendment. The same Amendment which always these people to attend these meetings and say what they feel needs to be said. See, both are protected. Not that I agree with Nancy; it was a pretty stupid thing to say IMO.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:15 pm 27. Sebastian Shaw:The Leftists have contempt for the American people, Republicans, & anyone else who stands in their way to “rule”–not govern; therefore, Negative Nancy & Stymied Steny’s USA editorial calling the town hall protesters un-American fits the rigid template of the Communists who seek to our overlords.
In the meantime, President Obama has overexposed himself to shine the turd called his narcissism & trying to sell it off as platinum award of honor.
The Democrats are coming apart at the seams. By all means, I’ll stand by & watch as they fall to pieces from their own greed.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:15 pm 28. AThinkingPerson:If, like me, you enjoy seeing Nancy Pelosi exposed for the lying disgrace that she truly is, I submit this “Nancy Pelosi’s first 100 days” video. Truly made my day. Enjoy!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_zZKEtoPpM&feature=related
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:16 pm 29. The Shadow:I coul not resist sharing this
Jonathan Weisman argues that President Obama knows too much:
In briefing President Barack Obama one day this spring, White House economist Jared Bernstein delved into such arcana as the yields on different forms of credit relative to the risk. Later, Paul Volcker pulled Mr. Bernstein aside. “Why would the president want to know that level of detail?” asked the former Federal Reserve chairman.
“That’s what he wants,” Mr. Bernstein replied.
A couple of things.
1. This paragraph is gibberish. What are “yields on different forms of credit relative to the risk”? I don’t know. I suspect that Jared Bernstein was talking about risk spreads — corporate debt versus Treasuries. You might excuse Weisman for getting this garbled — except that Weisman has specialized in reporting on economic issues.
2. If Jared was talking about risk spreads, this is very important. It’s one of the key gauges everyone is using to try to figure out whether the financial rescue policies of the Fed and the administration are working. It’s not at all arcane.
The same goes for Obama worrying about U6, the broad measure of unemployment. We know that the standard unemployment measure understates the real suffering going on; it’s totally reasonable that the president might want to know about broader measures.
I mean, we’ve tried the experiment of having the White House occupied by someone with no intellectual curiosity whatsoever. How do you think that went?
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:24 pm 30. Brian:As an independent, it is refreshing to see a piece which admits both parties have massive credibility problems. I also saw on the telly this AM that something like 60% of congress are skipping having town hall meetings about healthcare during the break. A representative from Pennsylvania went as far to say that he was voting for the package DESPITE admitting that the bulk of his constituents don’t want it! When asked if he has a duty to represent his people, he basically said no because they don’t know what’s best for themselves. And all with a straight face!
I thought the Paglia piece was remarkably well reasoned and level headed. The problem is that all politicians are by definition in business to lie and replacing Nancy wouldn’t solve the greater problem of government trust. But hey, it would be a start.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:26 pm 31. AThinkingPerson:Oh MY GOD! A Congressman got a (gasp) threat????? Alert the media! (Oh wait, apparently he already did). Call the CIA! (Oh wait, the Democrat leadership already declared them to be liars).
I definitely think it’s time for Obama to call out the Black Panthers on their next official mission….PROTECT THE CONGRESSMAN FROM THEIR CONSTITUENTS!!
I only hope Rachel Maddow hears about this! Oh the horror! More purple shirts will definitely need to be rounded up! More kook-aid! More tax-payer dollars for mental health counseling for the poor Congressman to overcome this tragedy!
When will the horrors ever end? Somebody call Nancy, she’ll know what to do!
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:31 pm 32. Rob in LA:You want to talk about fishy? It is quite clear now that Obama prefers his followers’ mindset to be not that of a patriotic American, but rather, a Manson girl. We look at America today and we see the lacquered-on spell slowly washing away, revealing one ugly truth after another.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:34 pm 33. Anonymous:Obama has done more to encourage hate than any president I can remember. If the bloom wasn’t already off THAT rose last Fall, a part of me concludes that these well dressed losers enjoy the unrest caused by their health care reform. The only thing these town hall meetings seem to accomplish is furthering the division between us. Perhaps one day a riot will break out and then we can all have a beer and the O-man can yell at us for riding the waves he creates.
A relationship built without the foundations of trust is tomorrow’s rubble. Reality is the court of final appeal.
Soros chump change paying for trolls.
the democrat party is a criminal enterprise
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:39 pm 34. AThinkingPerson:Want to see your DEMOCRATIC Congresspeople at work listening to their constituents about health care?
Here’s a gem of DEMOCRATIC Congressperson Sheila Jackson TALKING ON HER CELL PHONE while someone is asking her a question at a town hall meeting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-L3FnWNkIzU
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:46 pm 35. no fear Obama:Don’t you just love the Pres. town hall meetings where everybody is shouting
“YES WE CAN- YES WE CAN.”
They just know we are all little dumbA$$es and red neck willy will be happy to pass his Dear Leaders agenda.
You can fool all the people some of the time,
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:52 pm 36. Anonymous:but you can never fool-
16. jharp: “No one is forcing anyone onto anything.
You can keep the insurance you have now, you fool.
Or are you a liar? Which is it?”
It would appear that our local ‘tool’ has not bothered to read the plan. If he had, he would realize that no, we won’t get to keep our present plans and yes, we will be forced to take on the public plan.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:56 pm 37. bobbcat:16. jharp: “No one is forcing anyone onto anything.
You can keep the insurance you have now, you fool.
Or are you a liar? Which is it?”
It would appear that our local ‘tool’ has not bothered to read the plan. If he had, he would realize that no, we won’t get to keep our present plans and yes, we will be forced to take on the public plan.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:57 pm 38. vb:Obama might be good at learning buzz words, but he doesn’t seem to have any depth of understanding about how people, especially Americans, work. If his idea of community organizing is getting people to protest for more government, he doesn’t know much about America.
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:58 pm 39. Sue:EXCUSE ME – NOW the Freedom of ??? Medals??? What the HECK is happening in this country? Freedom medals for ??? and PEOPLE can’t speak at meetings!!! I am not a meeting person OR a speaker BUT I am appaled!!! at this incongruous difference in Peoples Rights!! FREEDOM Medals on the agenda – when the PEOPLE can’t speak???
Aug 12, 2009 - 12:58 pm 40. Anonymous:Tell the Truth – this country has gone to the Dictatorship Regime!!!!
And this is NOT a rabid comment – so you better state it – UNLIKE CNN who asks for comments – but does NOT post any that state ANYTHING against the present ???regime??? whatever it is right now. WE are people – give us OUR rights, not just the new favored few!!! And CNN is NOT Fair – I am ashamed that they are a top newsleader. Where the HECK is Ted Turner. BRING HIM ON BACK. TED, where are you????
Bill:
jharp:
“No one is forcing anyone onto anything.”
Citizens are being forced to give money for other peoples’ insurance. Are you a liar, or a fool?
_________________________________________________
Yes, it’s true. Since 1965. It’s called Medicare.
Yet no one is forcing anyone onto the public insurance plan. The subject that we are debating.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:03 pm 41. billslayer:SHADOW: I hate to say this but you’re incorrect. Obama is not more intelligent than Bush. I’m very sorry, but you’ve been misled. Bush was a bad president, Obama is worse.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:04 pm 42. jharp:bobbcat:
16. jharp: “No one is forcing anyone onto anything.
You can keep the insurance you have now, you fool.
Or are you a liar? Which is it?”
It would appear that our local ‘tool’ has not bothered to read the plan. If he had, he would realize that no, we won’t get to keep our present plans and yes, we will be forced to take on the public plan.
________________________________________________
I’ve read the plan. And it’s as clear as can be. You can keep the insurance you have.
How about this? Please cite me the language in the bill that says you are forced to take on the public plan.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:06 pm 43. jharp:Bill:
jharp:
“No one is forcing anyone onto anything.”
Citizens are being forced to give money for other peoples’ insurance. Are you a liar, or a fool?
_______________________________________________
That is true. Since 1965. It’s called Medicare.
However the subject at hand is forcing you onto the public insurance option. Which, of course, no one will be forced onto.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:10 pm 44. AThinkingPerson:Obama IN HIS OWN WORDS saying he WILL eliminate private insurance.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-bY92mcOdk
Pay close attention to his careful use of the words “transition process”.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:14 pm 45. AThinkingPerson:Obama IN HIS OWN WORDS saying his Obamacare plan WILL eliminate private insurance “over time”.
http://blog.heritage.org/2009/08/11/obama-in-2008-obamacare-will-eliminate-private-insurance-over-time/
I guess some liberals won’t believe Obama even when he says it HIMSELF.
PRIVATE INSURANCE WILL BE GONE UNDER OBAMAS PLAN. Why don’t you believe Obama if you don’t believe all of us? Very curious.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:20 pm 46. Ed Wallis:Bobbcat #37,
Don’t bother engaging “jharp” in discussion. Diverting, distracting and deflecting are the tools of the trade of an agitation propaganda troll.
“jharp” is simply a troll to be ignored. Agitation propaganda, whether paid for by the government or not, is an unfortunate nuisance here at PJM.
The House bill – which “jharp” clearly has either not read or is unwilling to accept – has limitations/constraints on current private providers such that, within roughly 5 years or so, they will be unable to compete with the so-called “public option” (yeah…right…just like “taking a shower” was an “option” in the death camps…).
To repeat: “jharp,” among too many other cretins who take up space among the more sincere and intelligent posters here at PJM, is an agit-prop troll to be ignored.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:20 pm 47. Roderick Reilly:So, what did anyone expect from Madam Helter/Skelter, the Crazy Cat Lady on Meth, and the daughter and grandaughter of the two most corrupt mayors in Baltimore history, and whose other family members have jail records and other brushes with the law?
OK, OK, I’ll say something nice about Queen Nancy: she did manage to forge a very succesful political career while raising six kids. Oh, hey, didn’t some other female politician of recent memory get raked over the coals for trying to do the same thing?
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:23 pm 48. TOhio:One sure way to get rid of Nancy Pelosi is to NOT vote for any Democrat in 2010. A vote for a Democrat is a vote to keep her propped up in power. No Way! This woman is a disgrace.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:26 pm 49. AThinkingPerson:I’d like to see the language cited from the ObamaCare bill that GUARANTEES you will be able to keep your private insurance from any liberal that’s “read the plan”
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:31 pm 50. biblio44:“The focus is on the citizens, who are mostly amateurs in the area of public dialogue.”
Yes, amateurs with detailed scripts from FreedomWorks and other right wing and Republican groups.
“Speaker Pelosi calls those who are rude at town halls un-American.”
Outrageous! Shouting down speakers, getting in their faces, and following them to their cars while shouting profanities is as American as apple pie.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:32 pm 51. The Shadow:Teh Wingnuts think we should definitley move towards a system of government whare decisions are made by those who shout the loudest. Facts will not matter. Maybe we should run busnesses the same way and medicine. Whatever any nut says is the truth – There will no longer be any objective standards.
Actually, in the long run what is happening could lead to rational discussion as the majority of people start to see what happens when the nuts run wild
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:35 pm 52. The Shadow:I think Sue is off her medication again. She should be front and center at the next townhall meeting.
And Dopeyperson – I wonder how you will keep your plan when your company fires you?
Enough frivolity back to work for me
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:39 pm 53. goy:@50. biblio44: – Yes, amateurs with detailed scripts from FreedomWorks and other right wing and Republican groups.
Last time I checked, this straw man was only getting traction within the left-wing echo chamber bounded by Congress’ alleged braintrust, the entrenched, Fifth Column media and a rag-tag consortium of angry socialist bloggers.
The rest of the country is seeing (a) Red.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:41 pm 54. AThinkingPerson:biblio44, please give a link to a few of those “detailed scripts” you mentioned so we’ll know what to shout at Nazi Pelosi if she ever gets brave enough to face an angry public.
I’m just glad the democrats have stayed out of the fighting (although it is strange that SEIYU members wearing the same silly purple shirt just happen to bump into each other at those horrid town halls, hopefully nobody noticed).
I’m just glad those smart democrat congress people realize they are above the average citizen. How dare those stupid conservatives think they can SPEAK directly to their congress.
It’ll serve them right to make them stand in line when they’re sick.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:42 pm 55. Michael:It is the old story, Do as I say not as I did… Only people who agree with them are good Americans. Shut up while we order our personal airliners. We are all about bipartisanship and transparency, here the bill is now just sign it. Don’t pay attention to the person behind the curtain.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:48 pm 56. Peter the Bubblehead:50. biblio44 wrote:
Yes, amateurs with detailed scripts from FreedomWorks and other right wing and Republican groups.
Peter writes: No, amateurs who have taken the time to actually read through the bill proposals that have been posted on-line and are horrified by what they are seeing.
Reading the bill… something these professional politicians don’t even bother to do, and are thus at a loss when asked to explain simple elements of this horrendous theft of liberty.
Is it any wonder citizens are getting mad?
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:50 pm 57. AThinkingPerson:Support for Obamacare has dropped to a new low. Will Obama or Pelosi listen to America now or are they too narcissistic to care what a majority of Americans want?
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/august_2009/support_for_congressional_health_care_reform_falls_to_new_low
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:55 pm 58. bibio44:#54: ‘biblio44, please give a link to a few of those “detailed scripts” you mentioned so we’ll know what to shout at Nazi Pelosi if she ever gets brave enough to face an angry public.’
Always glad to throw a line to a Sinking Person:
http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/townhallactionmemo.pdf
The signer of the memo is a FreedomWorks volunteer.
Aug 12, 2009 - 1:58 pm 59. College Know-It-All Hippy:Blah blah blah WINGNUT blah blah blah WINGNUT blah blah blah WINGNUT blah blah blah WINGNUT blah blah blah WINGNUT.
Profanity!!!11
I sure told them,
CKIAH
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:01 pm 60. AThinkingPerson:I’m still waiting for ANY liberal at all to give us language cited from the ObamaCare bill that GUARANTEES we will be able to keep our private insurance.
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:02 pm 61. Rich:Let’s let Obumbla lead by example:
Nominate a tax cheat to head the IRS … brilliant!
appoint an overweight out of shape individual to Surgeon General .. brilliant!
appoint a career non-achiever to Secretary of State … brilliant!
Back legislation that no one reads and then trying to …
Rahm it thru a lap-dog’nress while sending unemployment to double what is was in the previous administration … brilliant! .. and then tell the Governors to …
GET OUT OF THE WAY and let ME fix it? … ummmm ….
what in the REAL WORLD would suggest to a mimimally aware individual that a liberal who has lived an entirety of their adult life in the liberal fantasy bubble would KNOW anything about coping with the real world?
repeat …
THE
REAL
WORLD
… not the narrative.
an example perhaps or just …
engineer more legislation that no one reads?
How are those extra luxury jets we ordered for the Culture Club of corruption coming along?
remember there is a massive socialist “NEVERMIND” hanging over this country just waiting to drop.
I wonder who will be blamed in 2010 mid term election?
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:10 pm 62. AThinkingPerson:anyone care to take a shot at that one?
bibio44…Wow, you’re right! I am ashamed that FreedomWorks sent out a memo asking people to get there early to get a good seat and to question their Congresspeople if they continued to use Bush as an excuse instead of talking about Obama’s Health care plan.
I am so embarrassed right now to be an American. What does wanting to get to a town hall meeting to meet with my elected officials and wanting to get there EARLY say about me??????
You’re right bibio44….The union purple shirt mob are so much more civilized. You win. Please don’t forward the memo onward to DNC headquarters or they’ll surely thwart our evil plans to “get there early to sit in the front”.
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:13 pm 63. Leatherneck:If you work, and your company has Insurance you pay into, you can keep it if your company does not discontinue it.
If your Insurance is discontinued, you will have to buy into the Government Insurance plan at that time. So, we do not really know if we are going to keep our Insurance.
According to what I have read, all Americans, sick, young, old etc… will not be turned away from Insurance. Therefore, why should I buy Insurance until I am sick?
Are Illegal aliens included into this Healthcare nightmare? It appears so. They don’t pay, They suck money like a tick on American tax payers. Healthcare, jail costs, housing,etc…
Tort reform? It appears no.
All the above are reasons to vote out those in office now who have sold out to special interests.
San Fran Nan is an agent for Mexico. She does not support inforcing American laws. Treason.
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:31 pm 64. John Marshall:The so called protesters at town halls are simply asking three straightforward questions: 1 why are you increasing the price of my health care through increased taxes; 2 why are you taking liberty away from me; 3 why are you suggesting that there will be rationing of care at end of life?
To these simple, straightforward questions, they are getting no answers. They have a right to be enraged. Each and every congressman who supports Obamacare or some version of it has a strong moral duty to post his answers to these questions on his official website.
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:33 pm 65. The shadow:Dopeyperson – Since you are a birther, we all know that facts do not matter to you. No sense in discussing anything with a person who makes things up and lives in a fantasy world
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:42 pm 66. Anonymous:Have you ever noticed how sillslayer is obsessed with homosexuality
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:44 pm 67. Now and Then:60. AThinkingPerson:
“I’m still waiting for ANY liberal at all to give us language cited from the ObamaCare bill that GUARANTEES we will be able to keep our private insurance.”
It’s there, right next to the provision that guarantees we won’t be subject to illegal search and seizure under the Patriot Act. So rest easy. The government wouldn’t lie to you.
Aug 12, 2009 - 2:46 pm 68. Now and Then:Sheep . . .
http://mediamatters.org/research/200908120031
Aug 12, 2009 - 3:10 pm 69. Conservative1:Jharp:
You are disgusting.
Aug 12, 2009 - 3:11 pm 70. Spider79:60. AThinkingPerson:
I’m still waiting for ANY liberal at all to give us language cited from the ObamaCare bill that GUARANTEES we will be able to keep our private insurance.
While your at it, get them to explain the paradox in these two statements:
“if you like your insurance and the system you have you can keep it” -
Aug 12, 2009 - 3:29 pm 71. ConservativeWanderer:“the present system cannot stay the same or costs will spiral out of control”
Hey, Bibio44, if you’re so exercised about those folks offering suggestions to conservatives who want to attend townhalls and ask questions, how do you feel about a “progressive” group putting up ads on Craigslist offering to pay people to show up at townhalls in support of Obama’s plan?
Or is it perfectly OK with you for the left to organize, but not for the right?
I anticipate an echoing silence from you on this topic.
I do hope The Powers That Be here will forgive the self-plug here, but that’s where I post the results of my own research.
Aug 12, 2009 - 3:49 pm 72. john from cinncinatti:doggonnit just when i thought i was gonna get to be American-American, that’s a hyphenated American, i am now relegated to being Unamerican-American. if you are African-American,Irish-American, what if you are a Native of America and an American citizen. that’s an American-American? that lady most definitely has a forked tongue. whether it’s in the constitution or not i have a god given right to my opinion. if the big O can claim his narrative, i can call it anything i like. buffalo biscottis!
Aug 12, 2009 - 3:49 pm 73. malclave:jharp, I realize that your boyfriend is probably out of town or something, but your desire to be teabagged is apparently interfering with your ability to communicate.
Go down to whereever the trannie prostitutes are in your town, and pay to have some guy teabag you… then maybe you can make sense.
Aug 12, 2009 - 3:52 pm 74. scythe:Nazi Pelosi can’t STAND her tactics blown back in her rigid face. Blowback is a bitch (named Nazi Pelosi). How deliciously ironic that she and her creepy band of crypto fascists should level this charge at we on the right. We stand for LIBERTY and ALMOST NO GOVERNMENT. How does an authoritarian like she say with a cosmetically straight face that WE are the fascists when everything about she and her criminal enterprise want to control you from the moment you are born (that’s if you are deemed a person) to the time you are ordered to pass away. That is the political prestidigitation of the left. They are the ones who love freedom and liberties. We are the fascists. This has been a blessing in disguise for political discourse and education in this country. We have learned how much ObamaCare resembles the Nazi tactics and programs and many people realize now the fascist label leveled at the right was merely a vicious attempt to deflect attention from the doings of the real fascists. ObamaCare is a fascist bill and Nazi Pelosi should try a funny little moustache. It hides those pesky age lines on the upper lip.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:02 pm 75. Mike Murray:“Un-American!” Socialists Pelosi and Hoyer cried. Somewhere, BOTH Josephs — Stalin and McCarthy — are smirkin’.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:16 pm 76. steveg:If you have listened to Pelosi over the years you will have noticed she throws out the un-american bomb quite often. Only a couple of months ago she called the raids on illegals as un-american, and last October she called republicans who voted against the bank bailout un-american.
It would not surprise me if she thought all capitalist are un-american. This is one screwed up broad.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:17 pm 77. HONEST ABOUT IT:we have the khmer rouge (red states) and the khmer blue (blue states) pols in charge of our government. ruthless and unfeeling, the khmer go about their business of destroying our country by fiscal ruin, with the goal of reducing the people to subsistence farmers and business people totally dependent on the khmer for their very lives.
the khmer live in a fantasy land where nothing matters unless they say it does. a land where you are with me or against me and the facts matter little. a land where a charismatic leader of no substance in out of touch with his subjects.
as arrogant as the day is long, the khmer are willing to impose upon others what they will not have imposed on themselves. this may be their very undoing, as the definition of arrogance is seeing things as you want to see them, not as they are. many subjects now understand what is happening here and are really pissed off.
the khmer feel it absolutely necessary to control every aspect of their subjects lives. some khmer exercise control through the security apparatus (e.g. patriot act), while other khmer use overt more subtle methods (e.g. health care) to starve the subjects of needed care. either method makes the khmer powerful enough to take from you everything you have.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:17 pm 78. kdell:Jharp – to call you a dolt would be an insult to dolts everywhere. but your are a dolt. on your best day.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:20 pm 79. Peter the Bubblehead:57. AThinkingPerson wrote:
Support for Obamacare has dropped to a new low. Will Obama or Pelosi listen to America now or are they too narcissistic to care what a majority of Americans want?
Peter writes: Are you kidding. These ‘Elites’ don’t care what the ‘common folk’ think or want. As long as it’s filling their own pockets or those of their donators, they’ll vote for anything they want, the ‘little people’ be d@mned.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:28 pm 80. Peter the Bubblehead:63. Leatherneck asked:
Are Illegal aliens included into this Healthcare nightmare? It appears so. They don’t pay, They suck money like a tick on American tax payers. Healthcare, jail costs, housing,etc…
Peter replies: Not only that, but if you, Leatherneck, decide NOT to buy into the public option when your employer offers nothing else, YOU get fined, but the illegals do NOT!
Nice, fair system, huh?
(sarc on) The only good Marine is a Submarine!
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:33 pm 81. Hans Moleman:Well said! Let us review some facts. First, Pelosi and her colleagues are legislators with unlimited access to the public ear. Their constituents who gather at town-hall meetings are not. So the burden of listening must fall more heavily on the legislators.
Second, these meetings are not intended to be “dialogue between elected representatives and constituents” or “talking with their constituents about reform”, as Pelosi claims. These, like all “town-hall meetings” these days, are political campaign rallies to build and (hopefully) demonstrate support for the legislators’ proposals. A large part of Pelosi’s distress is that these scripted events are being hijacked and turned into counter-rallies.
Third, complaints that angry voices “drowning out opposing views is simply un-American” sound hypocritical coming from a fierce partisan who (as far as I can remember) never wrote an editorial about the thugs who spent eight years attempting to “drown out” President Bush, Vice President Cheney, and anyone who supported his policies or administration. “Bush lied”, No Blood For Oil”, “BushHitler”. These were the cries then, and Pelosi knew full well that the protesters (remember Code Pink?) were trying to “drown out opposing views”. She didn’t object because she agreed with the protesters.
To paraphrase the words of Winston Churchill , We in this country have a perfect right to exalt the principle of listening respectfully to opposing ideas, but it comes ill out of the mouths of those who ignore this principle as it applies to their opponents.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:34 pm 82. Peter the Bubblehead:70. Spider79 wrote:
While your at it, get them to explain the paradox in these two statements:
“if you like your insurance and the system you have you can keep it” -
“the present system cannot stay the same or costs will spiral out of control”
Peter writes: Good question, Spider.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:35 pm 83. NC Mountain Girl:Any answers, libs? After all, you’re the experts on this whole healthcare thing, right?
I have begun to call her not Madame Speaker, but Madame Deficit. That was Marie Antoinette’s nickname and it fits Pelosi to a tee.
A search on the term Queen Pelosi will turn up a photoshopped picture of Pelosi in a crown that makes a fine poster when combined with the slogan Let them take painkillers.
Aug 12, 2009 - 4:55 pm 84. Douglas White:The last time the federal goverment had tried health care reform, Clinton let the states sue insurance companies and the tobbaco companies for health care money and when all these states and local goverments got a big settlement that suppose to went to health care, Most of these states and local goverments took the settlement money and spent it paying off their bills and the american people got nothing as for health care,
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:00 pm 85. MikeD:I have come to realize that jharp is very much like Nancy Pelosi and Barack Obama. Can I have a show of hands from those who have been convinced to change their thinking because of the profound wisdom of any of these three? All of them keep talking and insist, increasingly, on proving themselves to be failures. But they are successful only in becoming objects of ridicule and derision. Yessirree, things just get better every day.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:07 pm 86. AThinkingPerson:So Now and Then (#67), you’re basically saying there ISN’T any wording in the ObamaCare bill that GUARANTEES we will get to keep our private insurance? Just wanting to be clear.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:08 pm 87. Leatherneck:#80 Peter the Bubblehead,
LOLROTF!
I had a lot of good friends in the Navy. If you are a Squid, Thank you for your service to our nation.
Over.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:26 pm 88. AThinkingPerson:Well said MikeD (#85)! Bravo! The more they talk, the less sense they make.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:29 pm 89. Anonymous:jharp, would it be asking too much for you to sacrifice yourself on the altar of malignant statism and leave the rest of us alone? Can you not absorb the penalty of centralized, naked power on your own narrow back and cease to assist in it’s application to normal people?
Given it’s virtues as your myopic vision sees them why not be a volunteer, put your own neck in the noose and suffer like all the other fools in the 20th century, using State power as avenger for their own frailties, frustration and anger, and discovering it backfires on them.
Why wait? You believe in in this crap. lead the way believer. Other then that find another outlet for your hate.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:35 pm 90. johnt:jharp, would it be asking too much for you to sacrifice yourself on the altar of malignant statism and leave the rest of us alone? Can you not absorb the penalty of centralized, naked power on your own narrow back and cease to assist in it’s application to normal people?
Given it’s virtues as your myopic vision sees them why not be a volunteer, put your own neck in the noose and suffer like all the other fools in the 20th century, using State power as avenger for their own frailties, frustration and anger, and discovering it backfires on them.
Why wait? You believe in in this crap. lead the way believer. Other then that find another outlet for your hate.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:36 pm 91. Now and Then:86 athinking person . . . Show me anything anywhere that says you get to keep your health care now. Show me anything that says you’re guaranteed coverage when you apply for it. Equally clear.
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:41 pm 92. Now and Then:OK, let’s look at the simple truth, by example, about the benefits of counseling and end of life planning.
In LaCrosse, Wisc., the Gundersen Lutheran Hospital system is, according to the Dartmouth [Atlas of Health Care], the least expensive place in America for the last two years of life. They have an advanced directive program, and over 90 percent of their patients have an advanced directive. They have electronic health records, so everybody on the staff knows what the advanced directive is. They have a very strong palliative care program for using drugs to manage pain. They have a hospice program.
The result is today, the last two years of your life in costs are about $13,600. The last two years of your life at UCLA are $58,000. Now, why should Medicare pay $58,000 for the same outcome if it could pay $13,600? You can say, well, Los Angeles is more expensive; they do a couple of more complicated things. So fine. So let’s say it ought to be $20,000 at UCLA. That’s still [$38,000] less than it currently is. …
And we also know — this is the great irony — the best places in America are always less expensive than the worst places. Health is not like jewelry and automobiles. In jewelry and automobiles you pay a lot more to get a lot better. In health, because the best places do it right the first time, they do it very efficiently, they pay real attention to quality, they’re actually less expensive than the places that are bad.
Now, what’s the problem again?
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:47 pm 93. Joseph Tafra:Well this is all very interesting, I’m not from the US so I don’t feel as strongly but I can’t help but notice the hypocrisy on both sides. Getting annoyed (rightly) at Pelosi’s attempts to shut down opposition then telling everyone to ignore jharp by labelling him/her as an “agitprop troll”. Also I have noticed that there is no discussion on these conservative blogs (which I like by the way) about genuine disgraceful behaviour at some of these meetings, I’m thinking specifically of the tearing up of a poster of Rosa Parks by an angry protestor…any thoughts?
Regards,
J. Tafra
Aug 12, 2009 - 5:58 pm 94. Anonymous:The Left and their ideas suck. Always have. And they wonder why the people are angry.
Aug 12, 2009 - 6:09 pm 95. Richard:Sorry, but people don’t re-elect incumbents based on an attitude of “better the devil you know”.
The fact of the matter is that both parties have increased the advantages for incumbency to a historical high. Running as a challenger puts you at a significant disadvantage and both parties have helped make it that way on purpose: to protect their privelege. This is just another extension of their culture of corruption that has run through both parties.
Aug 12, 2009 - 6:28 pm 96. Justcurious:The thing about goverment heath care is the goverment if it’s passed, They may only allow each person to spend so much money each month on health care to keep the cost down,
Aug 12, 2009 - 6:50 pm 97. Samizdat:And if Obama’s health care program going to be ran like a social welfare program to where a person has to fall under certain guide lines, Such as a person applying for health care is only allowed to make so much money each month before being accepted in to these programs, And if a person has to have an expensive operation done, Does that person have to have an opinion from 3 other doctors before the goverment allows that person to have sugery done,
I think before anyone buy’s in to this healtcare program. Obama needs to explain everything that he is wanting to do with this program,
Jharp,
Prevoiusly you stated that we would be able to keep our insurance under Obamacare. This repeated assertion by you is false. 88 million of us will not be able to keep our insurance because of the proposed employer tax, employee tax, and mandated coverage that will be different from what we have now. People need to understand this point. Your credibility is slipping,Jharp.
Pajamas readers, please start reading HB3200! You will be in for an eye opening experience. Do something a Democrat Congress person can’t be bothered to do. Read the legislation. Then make sure you email or personally write your Congress person and let them know respectfully what you think of Obamacare. If you send a personal letter send it to a field office and not their DC address. They hold the mail in DC for weeks to check for anthrax. After the events of 2001, you can’t blame them for that.
Aug 12, 2009 - 6:51 pm 98. Paul of Alexandria:Several talk shows today went over a recent article by John David Lewis, a professor at Duke University: The Health Care Bill: What HR 3200, ‘‘America’s Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009,” Says.
Prof. Lewis doesn’t claim to be especially qualified on the subject, other than he had the time to actually read and analyze the bill. Now of course we have yet to see what the Senate will come up with, but this is a good starting point for criticism.
Rush Limbaugh synopsized the bill rather well on his show; please read his comments (and the original article) I’ll just summarize a few points:
And that’s only about half of the analysis.
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:01 pm 99. fafnir:This is not a reform of health care, it’s a socialist power grab.
You think that stuff shows anger? You want to see real anger by a black PhD?go to: http//la-gun.com/email/manning/ Your hair will curl
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:03 pm 100. Paul of Alexandria:86. AThinkingPerson:
You have to be careful here. Sure, technically you can keep your current health care. Unfortunately, the conditions under which you can do so are so stringent as to be technically impossible. See point #3 above.
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:17 pm 101. WJA:Jharp proves my point.
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:18 pm 102. gracie:Liberals are taught what to think, not how to think.
funny to see how jharp keeps you guys jumping to answer his stuff…
just sayin’…
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:19 pm 103. Amy:Before I read any further, just wanted to point out that Specter is now a “D”(and will soon no longer be a Senator at all).
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:20 pm 104. Paul of Alexandria:Joseph Tafra (93):
1) Civil discussion and debate requires that both sides agree to and abide by certain conventions (see the PajamasMedia guidelines at the top), and that both sides agree to honestly analyze and consider the points made by the other side. People like jharp and other trolls have frequently and blatently broken these conventions. What else is one to do with them? You can’t keep arguing the same points forever.
2) From all of the reports that I have seen, the disorder at the “town hall” meetings is due to one of two factors: A) the deliberate disruption of the meeting by agents brought in by the Democrat party (usually via union auspices). Occasionally these are disguised as conservative voters. B) The deliberate ignoring of constituents who hold conservative opinions by the congress-person involved, either directly or by “stacking” the meeting with people who support the Progressive point of view.
While the US is a representative republic and not a pure democracy – meaning that the Congress should use its expertise and not merely follow the will of the majority – members of Congress should nonetheless at least listen politely to their constituents. Especially when they are as disturbed and riled up as the conservative voters are presently.
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:29 pm 105. max power:http://www.pbase.com/bveara/image/111808418
…it says it all
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:38 pm 106. Eric:The worst offenders in Congress are those that are in ’safe’ districts and simply cannot be defeated and will likely be in office until they die there. People like Pelosi, Kennedy, Frank, Markey, Waxman, and a host of others who have been in power for decades and decades. Their tenure has not only distanced them from those that elect and reelect them it has given them a belief in their infallibility, superiority, and a belief that they are our rulers.
We desperately need term limits to get rid of these parasites and to help us purge career politicians and return to a citizen legislature.
Aug 12, 2009 - 7:53 pm 107. ConservativeWanderer:If I might follow on to Paul’s answer at 104 to Joseph’s query at 93…
3) Given the media’s well known preference for stories that make “good television,” described quite accurately years before Obama as “if it bleeds, it leads,” it’s quite possible that the only town halls you’re seeing are the ones where something untoward is happening, and that there are many more town halls where everything is civil, and therefore they don’t make the news.
Also, 4) Please remember that the a large number of the people speaking out are almost certainly not professional (or even semi-pro or experienced amateur) public speakers, therefore a bit of nervousness (which can lead to speaking louder than one intends), and poor choices of words.
In short, please don’t judge all American town halls by what gets shown on the news, and remember to take into account the people speaking.
Aug 12, 2009 - 8:03 pm 108. Calvin Ball:102, yup. Trolls are like mosquito bites. The more you scratch, the more irritating they become.
Aug 12, 2009 - 8:12 pm 109. ConservativeWanderer:Oops! I goofed on #4 above… it should say something like, please remember that a large number of the people speaking out are almost certainly not professional (or even semi-pro or experienced amateur) public speakers, therefore a bit of nervousness, which can lead to speaking louder than one intends, and poor choices of words, can be understood and forgiven.
That’s what I get for trying to write coherently this late when my day started at 0430 this morning.
Aug 12, 2009 - 8:21 pm 110. Steve Sampson:Pelosi and Reid are two powerful campaign advertising methods for the Republican Party, we owe them a debt of gratitude. Reid will probably lose his Senate Seat unless Obama’s Stimulus Slush Funds and Soros’s money bail him out: of course, we should never underestimate our Rinos and their limp wrist attacks on Obama’s obvious Marxist Agenda, if they are typical of the men we nominate the people of Nevada may reelect Reid out of hopelessness.
It is possible we may need to elect Independents, apparently there is no real leadership at the helm of the GOP. There were many articulate people at the Town Hall meetings who showed more ability than most of the members of Congress. Finding our own nominees may be an option, our men are just treading water, hoping to not make waves and build up that government pension while hoping to get some of the spoiled bacon from Obama’s Stimulus Slush Money. They are definately not on the attack to prevent this Marxist Health Care Revolution
Pelosi will represent San Francisco until she attains room temperature. Her constituency love her absurd behavior and senseless remarks: she also has the political sense to lead the Gay Pride Parade and bring Pork home by the semi load. However, she has not only become an embarrassment to the Democrats, but a dangerous liability as well. Every time she opens her mouth to spout some witless remark, the Democrats lose votes. We should all send her Thank You notes, other than Obama, she is one of our most prolific and enduring assets.
How many GOP Congressmen have challenged her stupidity? Unless you know something I don’t, there are none and it’s not like she doesn’t leave herself open to ridicule. So don’t be too hard on Silly Nancy, try to enjoy her stupidity and get your Progressive friends to enjoy her simpleminded dedication to the science of incompetence.
Aug 12, 2009 - 9:13 pm 111. Войска ПВО:7. billslayer writes:
“Fairbanks99: Brilliant idea! They should also have to take a pledge under penalty of expulsion from the party to not ever vote in favor of any form of deficit spending.”
Billslayer and Fairbanks99, you should look into GOOOH — short for “get out of our house” which is an organization started by a gentleman in Texas who proposes a novel way of developing a number of candidates through a vetting process involving ordinary citizens like ourselves.
I attended a talk on this and participated in a short demonstration of his vetting process and came away very impressed. It ain’t multi-level marketing and it ain’t get rich quick and it ain’t partisan. It’s just geared towards getting good, honest, decent citizens into office and keeping them there SO LONG AS THEY HONOR THE PLEDGES THEY MAKE.
..check it out.
Aug 12, 2009 - 9:50 pm 112. sodacrackers:Nancy and her cronies totally misundstand what is happening here. I have never seen or heard so many people angry at the government and politically involved, calling on their congressmen to listen to the views of the electorate. I do not believe that our forefathers meant for public service to be a career or a family business. We need to vote these criminal bums out of office. We are not one bit amused Nancy by your implying that we are so stupid that we are affected by what is said on talk radio. We are affected by what we see you doing, and by what we read of this massive bill you are trying to ram down our throats whether we like it or it because you arrogant people think you know better than the wisdom of the ages.
If this passes, how many more government employees will we have? Unemployment is at an all time high. What is going to happen when more people work for the government than for private enterprise? Read my lips: WE DO NOT WANT OR NEED GOVERNMENT TO TAKE CARE OF US. Yes we are angry with just cause.
Aug 13, 2009 - 4:23 am 113. don:Jharp, one can see party line is the only way you think and vote, why not just write “Speaker Pelosi is right in all things and any difference of opinion with her is reprehensible if not criminal”. Obviously the people who think the way you do are abject followers who accept the statements of their betters with awe and absolute fealty. I don’t know, to people like me leadership is not competent from someone who says “do as I say not as I do”, but is exemplified by people who say “follow me” (Republican and Democrat).
Ms Pelosi exemplifies the former, you must be very proud!
Aug 13, 2009 - 4:48 am 114. RightwingHippieChick:Paul of Alexandria: My guess is that this attempt to use the payroll as a blackmail tool will have a side effect of destroying regular jobs and replacing them with contracting one-man companies who will have to sort out their own book keeping instead of burdoning the employer with their paperwork and costs.
In fact, I’m amazed that companies still bother with oldfashioned employees and payrolls, so many problems are solved with one stroke by hiring easily disposable contractors — no unions, no complex equality laws, no maternity pay and so forth, what is not to love?
There seems to be no logical reason for perpetuating the old way of employing people — in fact, nowadays if you run a business where a workplace costs thousands per month to provide, there is a definite potential for renting that space (and the right to work there) out to contractors, since when they fail to turn up, you still have the cost of providing them with a workplace — and get the idea in people’s heads that an employer is not some kind of god-like parent figure but simple someone who offers you a service that gives you the opportunity to earn money! Yep that’s right, giving you a job is a service, why should you get it for free and not pay your way fairly?
Maybe the health bill is just the motivation businesses need to rethink their basic assumptions and come up with a new, much better and fairer way that no longer renders them hostage (and nanny) to their workers.
So peoples, don’t get angry, but have a look at what is possible (and what isn’t) and use that to sabotage their pipe dreams with reality.
Aug 13, 2009 - 5:00 am 115. Jeff Weimer:92. Now and Then:
….Now, what’s the problem again?
Well, for one, it has no business in the legislation. It goes beyond merely reforming how health care is funded and coverage and goes into the actual content of health care – specifically instructing what is to be discussed.
There is no problem with a system having this program. It’s a good idea to be aware of options. BUT…if you don’t like it for one reason or another, currently you can go somewhere else that doesn’t require it. If this provision becomes law, then you CAN’T – by definition.
Just because it’s a good idea doesn’t mean it should be compulsory.
Aug 13, 2009 - 5:37 am 116. arby63:I believe the only option we have left is to stop feeding the “beast” at all levels. We have a government out of control–wildly out of control. It starts local and goes all the way up to the president.
This crazy bureaucracy at all levels can be tamed: Stop feeding it. Avoid products that feed it even further. Watch your taxes and avoid as many as possible. We can starve the beast of its lifeblood: MONEY.
On a related note: The single most important ingredient to fix what ails us is true campaign finance reform. Limit expenditures to a ridiculously low amount and watch the number of candidates running increase dramatically.
Aug 13, 2009 - 6:11 am 117. sodacrackers:I forgot to mention all perks those new government “health care” workers are going to need, not to mention figuring out ways to double dip at the expense of the few Americans who will actually have a real job with no take home pay. Can you tell I am angry?
Aug 13, 2009 - 7:00 am 118. Paul -Indiana:Just one thought about term limits. In addition to the number of terms that can be ’served’ we should also have a provision that there will be no sequential terms. That way, they have to run for office on their own time rather than being paid while running for their next term. It also gives us a chance to look for a better option even before the maximum number of terms is met.
Aug 13, 2009 - 7:49 am 119. Brian Richard Allen:” … angry Democrats, like Senator Arlen Specter (”R”-PA) … losing (Herr) cool and shouting at constituents … ”
Finally, someone got that evil barsteward’s measure.
Thank you, Mr Graham.
Brian Richard Allen
Aug 13, 2009 - 7:57 am 120. Tournefort:Lost Angels – Califobambicated 90028
And the Far Abroad
“And she’s right. The teabaggers sole goal is to disrupt the town hall process. And to disallow and halt any debate.”
Apparently it is necessary to be a bit “disruptive” to get both this administration’s and the media’s attention.
Literally hundreds of thousands of “teabaggers” gathered in cities across the country between March and July. The media basically ignored them and, at first, President Obama refused to even acknowledge their existance:
“The White House says the president is unaware of the tea parties and will hold his own event today,” ABC’s Dan Harris said on “Good Morning America” on April 15.”
When he DID finally acknowledge them, two weeks later, he was condescending.
”Those of you who are watching certain news channels on which I’m not very popular, and you see folks waving tea bags around, Obama said, “let me just remind them that I am happy to have a serious conversation about how we are going to cut our health care costs down over the long term, how we are going to stabilize Social Security.” “
The President then focused his energies on getting Congress to pass healthcare legislation before Congress adjourned in August, EVEN though members of Congress had not READ the bill or understood it much less those same “folks waving tea bags around”.
(What happened to that “posting on the Internet for five days” promise? What happened to “transparency”?)
Now that the Administration and its minions are FINALLY responding to “tea baggers”, it is with ridicule, lies and, in some cases, downright thuggery.
And the MSM? Well, it’s finally starting to pay attention, isn’t it?
Aug 13, 2009 - 8:27 am 121. bibio44:From the Jewish Daily Forward:
“Anti-reform bullies invent imaginary crimes and call them Nazi-like. Critics of the mobs complain of tactics that were, in fact, a calling card of fascists in their march to power. No one has described this better than commentator Bill O’Reilly of Fox News.
“This is exactly what the Nazis did — they disrupted rallies, they came in and shouted people down,” O’Reilly said. He was speaking in 2005 about Connecticut students shouting down a right-wing lecturer. His words are still true.”
Aug 13, 2009 - 8:58 am 122. Peter the Bubblehead:118. Paul -Indiana wrote:
Just one thought about term limits. In addition to the number of terms that can be ’served’ we should also have a provision that there will be no sequential terms. That way, they have to run for office on their own time rather than being paid while running for their next term. It also gives us a chance to look for a better option even before the maximum number of terms is met.
Peter writes: I whole-heartedly agree. One of my biggest problems with the 2004 election was that one of my Senators spent the better part of two years doing nothing but running for the office of President, but was still being paid his entire salary + perks. (Not that I care for him much, but he WAS elected to represent the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, and it would be nice if he actuially did the job he was ‘hired’ for.) Wouldn’t it be nice if all you ‘regular’ people could spend a year looking for a better job while still being paid your full salary from the job you are trying to leave?
It has always been my contention that any politician trying to run for a higher office (Governor running for Congress, Congressman running for Senate, Senator running for President, even something State-related, like State Senator running for Governor) should be required to resign from their current position before making their bid for new office official. That way the people will get the representation they voted for in the first place ALL THE TIME, and it might keep a few politicians from seeking higher office if they know they’re going to lose their cushy current job if they do.
Aug 13, 2009 - 9:00 am 123. Hektor:120. Tournefort: “And the MSM? Well, it’s finally starting to pay attention, isn’t it?”
Sure, the MSM is starting to pay attention, for the same reason the MSM pays attention to any other group of circus freaks – bizarre and ridiculous antics get high ratings.
But don’t ever confuse getting media attention with actually having an impact or changing public perceptions.
Most of America is looking at you guys – bringing guns to public forums, carrying signs with swastikas, threatening public officials with death, distributing racist images of your president – and basically having a big collective, jaw-dropping, “who the hell are these people, what rocks did they crawl out from under, and why are they so bat**** insane?” moment.
Between the teabaggers, the birthers, the town hall screamers, the deathers, and the rest of the Glenn Beck-worshipping nutcases, you guys are really doing the Dem Party’s work for them by chasing away the last few remaining moderates in your party.
Aug 13, 2009 - 9:05 am 124. Peter the Bubblehead:Another suggestion one of my co-workers just made was this;
No professional politicians at all. No elections. Ordinary people get called up to serve in office, like jury duty, for a period of 2 years. When the two years are up, they go back to whatever they were doing before, but whille in office, they actually REPRESENT the districts for which they serve!
How’s that for a concept? A public servent actually representing those he/she serves!
Aug 13, 2009 - 10:22 am 125. Don:Even better Peter, NO RETIREMENT except what their constituency approves (and pays for). So the incompetents get what they deserve a quick slide into obscurity, poverty and NO HEALTHCARE, they can sign onto Gubment healthcare and Gubment cheese.
Aug 13, 2009 - 12:07 pm 126. wrg:http://docs.house.gov/edlabor/AAHCA-BillText-071409.pdf
Such interesting reading. not.. A page turner guarantied to pi$$ you off.
• Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)
• Page 42: The “Health Choices Commissioner” will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.
• Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.
• Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Health card.
• Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer. (Love this one)
• Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)
• Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.
• Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)
• Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens
• Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-runHealth Care plan.
• Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No “judicial review” is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.
• Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them).
• Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records.
• Page 253: Government sets value of doctors’ time, their professional judgment, etc.
• Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries.
Aug 13, 2009 - 12:38 pm 127. Paul -Indiana:I have already told my two senators that a YES vote on this bill is a career ending choice.
Aug 13, 2009 - 1:30 pm 128. steveg:#123.Hector……And if we start breaking out windows, and burning down cities like the american left, will you finally show us some respect?
Aug 13, 2009 - 3:17 pm 129. bibio44:From the Jewish Daily Forward:
Anti-reform bullies invent imaginary crimes and call them Nazi-like. Critics of the mobs complain of tactics that were, in fact, a calling card of fascists in their march to power. No one has described this better than commentator Bill O’Reilly of Fox News. “This is exactly what the Nazis did — they disrupted rallies, they came in and shouted people down,” O’Reilly said. He was speaking in 2005 about Connecticut students shouting down a right-wing lecturer. His words are still true.
Aug 13, 2009 - 3:22 pm 130. Independance-kid:I agree with all the arguments.
So at least 98% of us agree we need change.
*to do nothing, is the worst thing of all*
I pray we change, thats all… cuz the status quo over the past 40 years dont work anymore.
take care
Aug 13, 2009 - 3:23 pm 131. goy:@123. Hektor: – Most of America is looking at you guys … and basically having a big collective, jaw-dropping, “who the hell are these people, what rocks did they crawl out from under, and why are they so bat**** insane?” moment.
Eh… not… exactly. No.
Maybe spend more time paying attention to current events. Less time memorizing DKos fantasy. Could mean less embarrassment for you. Just sayin’.
Aug 13, 2009 - 4:19 pm 132. goy:Looks like the People are about to get… a little angrier.
Let’s see BHO’s entrenched, Fifth Column media shills ignore this as it’s being openly dissected online by both ends of the blogosphere.
Aug 13, 2009 - 4:30 pm 133. Abi:126, OMG!! I hated reading that!!!! thanks…
Aug 13, 2009 - 4:37 pm 134. JackT:Angry about what, I don’t get it. It’s not that big a deal, you just setup some kind of system that will help 50 million uninsured americans gain access to quality medical care. The discussion is about everything on the planet except “what are we going to do about the 50 million americans that can’t afford the high insurance rates, not to mention to astronomical cost of prescriptions”. That’s the question. Can the Republicans answer that one?
Aug 13, 2009 - 4:38 pm 135. Peter the Bubblehead:134. JackT wrote:
Angry about what, I don’t get it. It’s not that big a deal, you just setup some kind of system that will help 50 million uninsured americans gain access to quality medical care.
Peter writes: And why cant the loony libs get past the 50 million uninsured myth. It’s been debunked for MONTHS!
Almost a third of those are illegal aliens. ILLEGAL! They don’t need US health insurance, they need one-way tickets back to whatever country they came from. If they want to become US citizens, let them do it the legal way, like my grandparents did.
Almost another third are people who are young and have better things to spend their money on than health insurance, at least in their own opinion. This is a free country (at least it was until recently) and these people have a right to decide how to spend their own money.
Almost another third are the poor who already qualify for government programs, but for some reason have not applied. These people do not need a new health insurance bureaucracy to get them the care they need, just someone who can help them file the proper paperwork.
So now, from your much bally-hooed liberal talking point of 50 million, we actually have only 5 million or so that need health insurance and can’t currently afford it. Why not write a bill that helps these people AND ONLY THESE PEOPLE, instead of creating a monster bureacracy that will ruin the other nearly 400 million people’s insurance?
So can we please moveon (sarc) from the moronic libtard talking points and actually look at the real facts?
Aug 13, 2009 - 7:03 pm 136. HonestJon:Personally, I do wish that the “patriotic dissenters” who are going to these town hall meetings would disagree in a civil manner. They begin to look unhinged if they start shouting at Reps and Senators-which reflects badly on the conservative movement. I understand that emotions are high and that a large proportion of the electorate is frustrated with the inefficiencies and overreach of our government, but shouting down a congressperson at a town hall meeting is something more akin to a liberal’s Modus Operandi. It reflects poorly.
It is a godsend that the liberals were on board with and jammed through the stimulus package and that the budget deficit is $1.3 Trillion this fiscal year. (That equates to about $4,500 for each man, woman, and child.) Those two facts have brought out activism in conservative circles even among people who never before were participants in the poitical discourse. Imagine how easily the liberals would have jammed this ill-considered legislation through if it weren’t for the public fear generated by staggering debt. We got lucky!
135. Peter the Bubblehead: If an illegal goes to a doctor, hospital, etc. he should be reported immediately to the INS and deported forthwith. If that person has received any care that has not been paid for, the country of origin should be billed.
I read Animal Farm the other night and can say with authority thet Jharp reminds me of the Boxer character with regards to Obama, to wit: “Napoleon is always right.” (Easily converted to “Obama is always right.”)
regards
Aug 13, 2009 - 8:02 pm 137. goy:@134. JackT: I don’t get it.
Obviously. Not enough “nuance” in violating federal law, right? The President is not allowed to enter into secret deals with corporations. And then lie about it.
I’m sure the lying bit doesn’t bother you, ends justifying means and all that.
- The discussion is about everything on the planet except “what are we going to do about the 50 million americans that can’t afford the high insurance rates, …
Is that counting all 57 States? Or only the conventional 50?
The “50 million” figure – actually, 47 million – has been pretty thoroughly debunked as pure B.S. BHO has lied about it and even the media noticed.
Aug 13, 2009 - 8:57 pm 138. Pragmatist:Before stupid Americans ‘libtards’ allow the Obamanation and his Socialist/Communist clique to spend any MORE of the money you have not got you need to take a good look at this and be afraid be very afraid.
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
Aug 13, 2009 - 11:47 pm 139. tommy gunn:Hey Gang:
I hope everyone knows by now, except the liberal media of course, that this uprising is NOT about health care or health insurance. Our representatives have PROVOKED this response by being reckless, stupid, careless, free spending, and insensitive incompetent fools. They air drop this 1,000 page bill on us, don’t read it, and it contains a socialist manifesto that will destroy our health care system and double our national debt. After seeing our outrage, they start to whine, insult us and call us un-American. You have to be either from California or Outer Space not to be offended by these imbiciles.
Mark my words we are not out the woods yet. The socialists will NOW start to negotiate a deal based on a flawed document. In other words this document is a SOCIALIST MANIFESTO, no matter what you think you are getting from these coniving twits, you still end up with Nationalized Healthcare. The only RIGHT thing to do is to Start OVER. We need a new draft bill that starts off as a free enterprise approach to health care reform. Otherwise we will end up with the camels nose in the tent and ultimately Obama will have his single payer system.
Keep up the fight.
Tommy Gunn
Aug 14, 2009 - 4:05 am 140. Peter the Bubblehead:136. HonestJon wrote:
Personally, I do wish that the “patriotic dissenters” who are going to these town hall meetings would disagree in a civil manner. They begin to look unhinged if they start shouting at Reps and Senators-which reflects badly on the conservative movement.
Peter writes: Maybe the attendees to these town halls wouldn’t need to yell if the representatives they are there to speak with would stop taking phone calls in the middle of the discussion or stop telling the people they work for to sit down and shut up.
Can you blame anyone for getting angry? These people work for us! Not the other way around!
Aug 14, 2009 - 4:21 am 141. Paul -Indiana:Medical care is available to everyone – right now! You just have to PAY for it and not have some other taxpayer pick up the tab.
Aug 14, 2009 - 5:06 am 142. HonestJon:140. Peter the Bubblehead: Sir, I don’t blame anyone for getting angry (I’m angry as a sumbitch), but I cannot condone shouting down a rep or senator at a town hall meeting. They all legitimately got elected. They know that we elected them.
Here’s what it boils down to, sir: we’ve been bamboozled by the American Idol crowd. The folks that just “love Obama” (no matter what) outnumber us-those of us who think before voting,- those of us who make informed decisions before voting.
And also, you can’t lay all of the blame at one representative’s feet. Sure, Mrs. Jackson Lee was arrogant and dismissive, but she is in a secure district. Do you think for a moment that her black constituents would ever vote for somebody that isn’t black? She’ll be a representative until she dies if she chooses-because of racial gerrymandering. She’s one of the “newspeak” politicians.
regards
P.S. They don’t work for “us” anymore…They steal from “us” and give to “them”!
Aug 14, 2009 - 9:04 am 143. HonestJon:I hate to belabor the point, but noone should yell at a town hall meeting. It’s a forum for civil discussion.
I concede that it looks bad for a conservative to shout, while it’s apparently okay for a liberal to scream. But we must adhere to our standards!
regards
Aug 14, 2009 - 9:19 am 144. Laurie Thompson:This is what Adam Graham says:
“What’s becoming apparent to the American public is that we have an imperious Congress full of big egos and little minds, greedy, near-sighted people who are drowning future generations in debt and have the gall to demand that people calm down.
To fix their image, Congress would have to lower its tolerance for corruption and in a purposeful way make itself worthy of the public’s respect. But it’s almost certainly too late for that now. What was seen as benign corruption is now properly viewed as a danger to the health, safety, and happiness of ordinary Americans. Democrats should brace for an electoral bloodbath a year from now.”
Now you’ve heard their side.
This is what Laurie Thompson says.
Since when does strong medicine taste good?
Private health care is sick as a dog in that it’s been unable to provide decent coverage for illegal aliens, which by conservative count, accounts for the bulk of people Democrats use when they quote statistics such as the 44 million in America being uninsured.
Notice Obama doesn’t say 44 million Americans.
If we didn’t care about the health of illegal aliens, Obama says, we could keep our present health system in its private form with a tweak here and there.
But, Obama says, (and this was even confirmed by “Daily Kos”) private health care must go. It’s got to be done away with. Effectively killed so people don’t keep clinging to it.
In the end, the President has reiterated to his staff that simple but high taxes on everything from Coke and Pepsi to lipstick and computers to even elevator rides in high rise buildings, (only ten cents a floor) will more than pay for the cost of healthcare even if, as many expect, the final annual cost will likely actually be 9 times higher than projected.
Michelle says it at dinners over and over when talking about the public, “Like a parent”, she’ll explain, “President Obama knows what’s best for the masses. Americans who voice their disagreements at town meetings don’t have their facts or their heads on straight.”
Michelle isn’t being snide. She’s just being honest.
Aug 14, 2009 - 9:53 am 145. Berlet98:“I’m From the Government and I’m Here to Help.”
Dateline: April 30th, 2016
Freddy the Fly on the Wall remembers this scene well and, amazingly, was able to type it all out.
Mrs. Jane Average, age 84, was sitting alone with her cat, Boots, in her darkened living room on a pretty spring day in April, 2016. For the past few years, Jane had found that bright lights hurt her aged, weary eyes.
The doorbell rang. She slowly got to her aching feet and made her way toward the door and opened it to find her smiling, young, new physician, Dr. Leon Jones, on her doorstep.
“Hello, Jane! How are you?”
She had never liked him ever since she had been forced into Obamacare after Metlife had raised her private insurance rates and thereby made government insurance mandatory.
However, being a refined lady to the end, she feigned pleasantry and said, ”Dr. Jones! This is a surprise! I didn’t know you were making house calls now.”
“Well, Jane, my office left a number of messages on your machine but you never called back. There are some things I have to talk to you about.”
“Well, Doctor, you know I usually can’t get to the phone on time and I find it difficult seeing the numbers so I don’t make many calls. But, do come in. I can’t imagine what’s so important that you had to come all the way over here, but come in!”
She tottered over to her favorite chair and gingerly sat down. “Please sit. Ever since my last, umm, problem, which you said wasn’t all that bad, I always seem tired. Sit.”
“Jane, that’s really what I wanted to talk to you about.”
“Oh, so you think I really should have the surgery?”
“No, no, no. I wouldn’t want to put you through all the pain and discomfort of another surgery. In fact, just the opposite.”
“I’m confused, Doctor, why are you here?”
“Umm, Jane, well you do know about the provision in the 2009 Health Care Law . . .”
“I know, I know, you explained all that in the chat we had just last year. I made my will and I have my living will and proxies and all those things you insisted I get. You said we wouldn’t have to talk about all that stuff for another 5 years.”
“No, Jane, I was referring to the provision, they call it, I think it’s in section 1233, the part that deals with what they call “Advance Care Planning Consultation. ” . . .
(Read the rest at http://genelalor.com)
Aug 14, 2009 - 10:00 am 146. Anonymous:104. Paul of Alexandria: “From all of the reports that I have seen, the disorder at the “town hall” meetings is due to one of two factors:
A) the deliberate disruption of the meeting by agents brought in by the Democrat party (usually via union auspices). Occasionally these are disguised as conservative voters. “
Firstly, the union members only started showing up at town hall meetings after the right wing agents of the health care lobby started their incoherent screaming campaign. Apparently the right wing is just indignant to be made to taste its its own medicine.
Secondly, nobody is buying your pathetic bull**** about the racist-sign-wielding, gun-carrying conservative nutcases being “liberal plants”. What a joke. Why would anyone other than a delusional right wing nut risk getting arrested and jailed by the Secret Service?
This just speak volumes about the GOP and Conservative movement. They lack any capacity whatsoever to take any responsiblity for the violence they’re helping to foment. Instead, they just blame everyone else for their own disgusting behavior.
“It’s not us who are the problem, it’s these liberals who are dressing up like us!”
Really, how would a liberal “disguise” one’s self as a conservative voter? Hit him/herself repeatedly in the head with a tackhammer until the phrase “Keep your government hands off my Medicare” starts to make sense?
Aug 14, 2009 - 12:15 pm 147. Anonymous:From #142. “Here’s what it boils down to, sir: we’ve been bamboozled by the American Idol crowd. The folks that just “love Obama” (no matter what) outnumber us-those of us who think before voting,- those of us who make informed decisions before voting.”
Aug 14, 2009 - 12:57 pm 148. Paul -Indiana:======================
Actually Obama was elected by 31% of the electorate. Those who were lazy and thought that their vote didn’t matter are the ones we should thank.
From #142. “Here’s what it boils down to, sir: we’ve been bamboozled by the American Idol crowd. The folks that just “love Obama” (no matter what) outnumber us-those of us who think before voting,- those of us who make informed decisions before voting.”
Aug 14, 2009 - 12:58 pm 149. bobby bb:======================
Actually Obama was elected by 31% of the electorate. Those who were lazy and thought that their vote didn’t matter are the ones we should thank.
So, am I understanding that there is no problem with health care, or that yall just don’t like these plans? And do most of yall think that the gov’t plan, medicare is horrible? Am not being a smart ass, honestly want to know. Glad to see that most of the discussion here did not center on the falsehoods being spread about the plan( death panel stuff). I sure do not know what the answer is..this plan has serious flaws, but I am not one who thinks nothing should be done. It is somewhat comical though, to see the insurance companies defended so much. Their goal is one thing only: their profits. Rationing( not called that, of course) exists in all insurance policies. Folks do lose everything because of getting sick..doesn’t seem right. If you have been sick once, you often can’t get insurance again or it is unaffordable. The unamerican stuff…guess I wouldn’t call it that, but I think the hate filled talk from both sides does nothing to help either side. Some of the rhetoric is pretty despicable, and when we have nutjobs calling for the assassination( or abortion) of the President..things have gone too far.
Aug 14, 2009 - 7:52 pm 150. nut chaser:Wish reasonable people from both sides could sit down and write a bill that would eliminate fears of both, but unfortunately, both sides are waay too beholden to their special interests. This hate stuff though….needs to stop.
#149 looks like a plant from the left. Give me a break.
Aug 15, 2009 - 4:59 am 151. Henderson NV:I put her in my “how in the world did this person get elected” file long ago.
Aug 15, 2009 - 5:40 pm 152. Wes:If anyne on this board thinks the government can run any type of buisness,
Aug 28, 2009 - 8:35 pmthen you must have been asleep the past 70 years.Look how well they have run SS,the post office,welfare,and just today the fdic says they will
probably need help.Even in its own bureaucratic workforce it takes two to three times as many people to do a job that any worker could do in half the time.