Belmont Club

September 5th, 2008 12:09 pm

And the word was made flesh

The New Republic article on Obama’s time as a community organizer on the South Side of Chicago begins with him telling his mentor why he was quitting. The pay was too low and it didn’t work. “Obama told Kellman that he feared ending up destitute and unhappy like his dad. ‘He wanted to marry and have children, and to have a stable income,’ Kellman recalls.” Obama, to hear tell, stopped being a community organizer because he didn’t want to be a loser.

But Obama was also worried about something else. He told Kellman that he feared community organizing would never allow him “to make major changes in poverty or discrimination.” To do that, he said, “you either had to be an elected official or be influential with elected officials.” … And so, Obama told Kellman, he had decided to leave community organizing and go to law school. Kellman, who was already thinking of leaving organizing himself, found no reason to argue with him. “Organizing,” Kellman tells me, as we sit in a Chicago restaurant down the street from the Catholic church where he now works as a lay minister, “is always a lost cause.” Obama, circa late 1987, might or might not have put it quite that strongly. But he had clearly developed serious doubts about the career he was pursuing. …

Yet, two decades later, to hear Obama the presidential candidate tell it, those years in Chicago as a community organizer shaped the person–and the politician–he has become. Campaigning in Iowa last year, he declared that community organizing was “the best education I ever had, better than anything I got at Harvard Law School.”

But John Judis, who wrote the New Republic piece, claims that another and unstated reason impelled Obama to leave organizing for a career as a lawyer and a politician. Unlike Alinsky, Obama believed that politicians, not community organizers made history. If community organizing had an ideology at all, it was the product of Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals, which as I have written elsewhere, was an attempt to separate the revolutionary impulse from the apparatus and return it to the direct control of the people. Judis summed up the central tenet of Alinsky’s ideology and described how Obama had lost the faith.

Alinsky felt that organizers should draw a clear line between their work and the political world. An organization should forge “no permanent political ties,” declared a guide put out by the Industrial Areas Foundation, which Alinsky created. When I asked former community organizer John Kretzmann–who teaches at Northwestern and writes about organizing–whether organizers saw all politicians as “whores,” he replied, “Even if you found one that wasn’t, it makes no sense to get close to them.” …

Yet there is considerable evidence that … Obama was having doubts about community organizing. By the early fall of 1987–a little more than two years after he had come to Chicago — Obama had decided to apply to Harvard Law School. At some point thereafter, he began to explain his decision to friends and colleagues. The most revealing of these discussions are not reported in Dreams from My Father.

It was not just the walk he took with Kellman through Harvard’s campus. Obama also talked to Kruglik about his reasons for leaving Chicago. In their conversations, he described politics–and winning political office–as the most important step toward achieving change. And, instead of seeing [Mayor] Harold Washington as buffeted by forces beyond his control, he now aspired to be Washington.

One could make the case that Obama was simply “growing up”; that youth is a place where we can’t remain, even if we wanted to. But Obama’s decision to change tracks went beyond the idea of moving on to a higher skilled role in the same struggle. Judis claims Obama wanted to leave the philosophy of CO behind altogether. Working for small, tangible reforms was too limiting for his grand vision. Judis writes, “by late 1987, he seems to have grown disillusioned with the underlying principles of community organizing.” At a meeting of the “Save our Neighborhoods/Save our City (SON/SOC)”, an Alinksy-style community organization, Obama in “a white shirt, tie, and incipient Afro” showed up to make the case against the Alinsky method itself. He questioned the principle or organizing people around immediate self-interest. The people were going to be nothing unless they were enlisted in a greater cause. In short, community organizing didn’t change history; power and leaders with charisma changed history.

Obama put it this way: “The process whereby people in communities … start to get bigger horizons … it seems to me that that strain gets lost.” … But Obama didn’t stop there. He had a litany of criticisms of Alinsky-style organizing that he wanted to put forward. He objected to community organizers’ dismissal of charismatic leadership and of movements. …

Obama also criticized community organizers’ “suspicion of politics.” “The problem we face now in terms of organizing is that politics is a major arena of power,” Obama said. “That’s where your major dialogue, discussion, is taking place. To marginalize yourself from that process is a damaging thing, and one that needs to be rethought.”

Before he was done, Obama had rejected the guiding principles of community organizing: the elevation of self-interest over moral vision; the disdain for charismatic leaders and their movements; and the suspicion of politics itself. But he did so in a way that seemed to elude the other participants. Two decades later, Green couldn’t recall any disagreement over his more positive take on SON/SOC. Joravsky also didn’t remember Obama’s criticisms of organizing. Instead, he recalled thinking how “cool” and “well-spoken” Obama was.

An August, 2008 Belmont Club post, Boyd Versus Alinsky, anticipated Judis’ arguments. It didn’t require much effort to figure out that Obama self-orientation was fundamentally at odds with the ethos of community organizing. I wrote:

despite his claims to the contrary, Barack Obama is not a “community organizer”. Alinsky’s Community Organizing model was above all a response within the Left to the Cult of Personality. Rules for Radicals is founded on the principle of “letting the people decide”, and while it does not dogmatically discount the influence of leadership it fundamentally rejects the idea that a “vanguard” intellectual elite can lead the “masses”. …

No real organizer mints a Presidential seal, describes himself as the symbol of a generation, believes he is the One and makes himself the object of ridicule. No real organizer insults the masses as gun-toting, Bible-clinging ignoramuses at a fundraiser attended by billionaires in San Francisco. Not a single experienced mass agitator would ever dream of extolling the values of arugula and upbraid the workers for their ignorance of tire pressures. What kind of Alinsky-style organizer reminds people of his sacramental nature, repetitively, monotonically and deadeningly? …

A real organizer works in small settings, amplifying, exhorting, putting others on the stage. He doesn’t work in front of large crowds and from the front pages of newspapers. And if it is objected that nobody can become President of the United States that way, the answer is that community organizers don’t want to become Presidents. They want to be organizers.

Obama, however, wanted to be President. So his departure from community organizing is fair enough. What is slightly underhand is his practice of donning the romantic mantle of the organizer, the champion of “lost causes” and using the image of the quixotic loser he rejected in private as his badge of honor. Maybe the contrast can explained by the fact that “community organizer” sounds better than “lawyer” or “politician”. But the differences go beyond the use of misleading imagery. They are philosophical. If the ‘people’ are too weak to seize power in the first place, then maybe they are too dull to understand what is good for them. And maybe they need Obama to tell them that. Judis closes his piece with this paragraph rhetorically wondering whether Obama would ever return to the grassroots:

When Obama came to South Chicago, he believed in community organizing; within two-and-a-half years–by the time he and Jerry Kellman went for their late October walk around Harvard’s campus–he was clearly growing disillusioned. Now, having fashioned a political identity in near-total opposition to the core principles of his one-time profession, Obama’s bid for the presidency may come down to this: Is he willing to rediscover–and put into practice–one of the main principles he followed as a twentysomething activist all those years ago?

Personally I doubt it. Obama won’t rediscover community organizing until some humbling experience brings back to him the reasons why Alinsky’s suspicion of leadership-oriented movements arose in the first place; until he re-learns that the key to becoming extraordinary is to accept in some fundamental way that you are ordinary. John McCain’s convention speech had its own “walk through Harvard Yard” moment in the other direction: the instant when he stopped being an attack pilot and admiral’s son and became something at once lesser and greater: a naval officer.

They broke me. When they brought me back to my cell, I was hurt and ashamed, and I didn’t know how I could face my fellow prisoners. The good man in the cell next door, my friend, Bob Craner, saved me. Through taps on a wall he told me I had fought as hard as I could. No man can always stand alone. …

I couldn’t do anything. I couldn’t even feed myself. They did it for me. I was beginning to learn the limits of my selfish independence … and I missed everything about America. But I turned it down.

You are never too good for those you truly love.

Tip Jar.

211 Comments

1. Raoul Ortega:

So once again we have The One! saying and praising something publicly while his own private words and deeds are completely opposite. The One! seems to have perfected hypocrisy as an art form.

Sep 5, 2008 - 12:15 pm 2. heather:

Somewhere Wretchard has noted that Petraeus has used the Alinsky method in Iraq. I think that is very interesting. It definitely is not a path a man who wants to be The One would take.

Sep 5, 2008 - 12:34 pm 3. NahnCee:

I think Obama is bought and will say and do whatever the entity holding the purse-strings tells him to say and do. He has no core values, so “community organizer” nor “capitalist master of the world” neither have any bearing on how he views his life and the rest of us.

Sep 5, 2008 - 12:35 pm 4. Herb:

There has always been something alien about Obama. Alien in that he has not been the conventional liberal but something more or different. Too internationale. A trifle too cosmopolitan. He is aware of ‘things’ of which we are not. He understands soooo much.

Yet when he is confronted with the unexpected he freezes. If comes from off his radar he is perplexed that his first reaction can be patently wrong.

He is, I think, incomplete. In a really profound way. The inscrutable Spengler has an idea. It’s Obama dreaming of his Father. http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/JI03Aa02.html

I think that this incompleteness is a big part of Obama’s failure to close the sale. Americans can sense something off from a great distance.

Sep 5, 2008 - 1:01 pm 5. wretchard:

I don’t believe that organizers lead lost causes. But their victories never come home under one name. No statues are likely be raised to Petraeus and his men in Iraq. But they did more than win against the enemy. They taught other men, if only by example, how to do it themselves. The victories of organizing are anonymous. There is on a dirty street intersection in Manila a tablet memorializing some of the people who were killed under Marcos. I remember remember thinking when it was newly raised that I knew nearly every one of them personally. But I would be the last to say they and they alone won the war. They are just the ones we remember.

Sep 5, 2008 - 1:08 pm 6. outa my league:

Attended by a good deal of anguished soul searching, I have decided to come out in support of Obama.

Barack Obama for Mayor of Detroit.

Sep 5, 2008 - 1:29 pm 7. Triton'sPolarTiger:

“They broke me. When they brought me back to my cell, I was hurt and ashamed, and I didn’t know how I could face my fellow prisoners. The good man in the cell next door, my friend, Bob Craner, saved me. Through taps on a wall he told me I had fought as hard as I could. No man can always stand alone. …

I couldn’t do anything. I couldn’t even feed myself. They did it for me. I was beginning to learn the limits of my selfish independence … and I missed everything about America. But I turned it down.”

There’s a humility in these phrases that I find extraordinarily appealing. Unstated in the above text is the likely fact that if the man couldn’t feed himself, he probably couldn’t take care of his own common hygiene either…

Watching McCain speak, I couldn’t help note that he carries himself in markedly different fashion that Obama. Obama, on the stump, seems to be constantly tipping his head back ever so slightly - it reminds me a bit of the Nellie Olson character in the “Little House on the Prairie” series… overblown schoolgirl “I’m better than all of you” pride.

Contrast that with McCain, whose jaw is straight and level, except when he tips his head to look at someone (higher or lower).

I have for some time thought of McCain as a bit of a snarky b@stard… quite frankly, I might have been all wrong about the man.

Sep 5, 2008 - 1:39 pm 8. Teresita:

McCain promises to use ideas from both sides of the Great Divide, as long as they work. He promises to hire Democrats and Independents onto his team, which has caused some grumbling from the Party faithful. The funny thing is, until the day he threw his hat in the ring to become President, Democrats always referred to McCain as a “good” Republican (sort of an ironic thing, like a “good” Samaritan or a “good” Indian, I suppose). Now he’s painted as the second coming of Bush. I’m confident he will win because the Dems will retain both the House and Senate this year, and Americans like divided government. McCain has made his base clam up with the Palin pick, so now he can run to the left as a moderate and gather the great American center.

Sep 5, 2008 - 1:49 pm 9. Roderick Reilly:

Obama is getting creepier by the week, and he may still win. He will only lose if a lot more people bring their subconscious misgivings to the conscious level, and then also vote.

While Obama may be a fraud as far as community organizing goes (hey, he’s been a fraud at everything else so far), he seems hell-bent on instituting a top-down form of state-mandated “community organizing” of his own. It’s all those “Corps” listed on his official site that he wants to create: an expanded (from 75,000 to 250,000) Americorps (what the hell do those people do, anyway?), an expanded Peace Corps, a Green Corps, a Senior Corps, and on and on, a Corps of some kind or other for evey conceivable group or type of people. He wants to fund all these Corps lavishly, but the one Corps he wanted to defund while they were still fighting in Iraq is the Marine Corps. I know what the Marines do, and so do the Jarheads themselves. What in God’s name are we going to do with all those freakin’ “Corps” the Annointed One wants to foist on us, and how are we going to pay for them? You know he has talked extensively with Michelle about these, because I know that these breathtakingly freakish/fascist “Corps” plans are what she was referring to when she said that “Obama was going to make us work.”

How many more clues do we need that these two are virtually insane, and so over-the-top ambitious and greedy for power as to knock your sox off?

Sep 5, 2008 - 1:58 pm 10. bobal:

“Organizing,” Kellman tells me, as we sit in a Chicago restaurant down the street from the Catholic church where he now works as a lay minister, “is always a lost cause.”

Obama figured that out. The great leader theory is a lost cause too. The people have to stand on their own two feet.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:01 pm 11. 49erDweet:

McCain, who was not my candidate until he picked a truly conservative VP candidate, is clearly inside Obama’s OODA loop. Unless he flames out in the next several weeks, the dem’s are going down in flames - again - in an election “they should have won” - at least in their minds.

Will they learn anything from this? Like how selling out to the far left loonies puts them so far away from the electorate? I hope not.

Thanks, W, for the history and analysis.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:06 pm 12. sirius_sir:

You are never too good for those you truly love.

You are never alone, even if you fancy yourself The One.

You are never so bad that you can’t be saved.

John McCain has learned these lessons and now knows these things in his bones; it’s not at all clear Barrack Obama can yet claim the same.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:07 pm 13. Charles:

They are ghosts Richard. Something circling back on itself, or a thesis. Or something so well completed that it forces the mind elsewhere. I have heard it said that when something is done perfectly its a sign of the end of an age–or the end of whatever it was that were the component parts of the thing rendered perfectly, a novel, a sculpture, a movie. And you recoil. A community organizer. That was obama’s war. His baptism by fire.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:13 pm 14. NahnCee:

“Contrast that with McCain, whose jaw is straight and level, except when he tips his head to look at someone (higher or lower).”

Watching him speak on TV last night, as he turned in profile I thought, “he reminds me of someone I’ve seen before, something noble.” And then it came to me that he looked just like Charlton Heston in “Ben Hur”. Which I’m not sure how he could do that given Heston’s large Roman nose.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:13 pm 15. Tcobb:

All the myriad forms of altruism:

(1) pure–the family down the street is destitute because the company that both the husband and wife worked for has gone out of business. You take most of the money from your paycheck and leave it in cash in a box on their front door in the dark of night. No one will ever know that you were the one who did it, and you don’t care. In your mind, you did the right thing, even though you can’t afford what you have done and this will cause you hardship in one form or another.
(2) petty–you do the same thing as in “pure” above, but the amount you give is much, much, less. Above all, the amount given must not be such that it would infringe upon your lifestyle at all.
(3) exhibitionist–you give the family
the money, but not in the dead of night or anonymously. The primary motivation isn’t really to help the destitute family, its to demonstrate what a wonderful person the giver is.
(4)voyeuristic–the primary urge is to criticize others for their lack of willingness to help others, even though you have no intention of putting out any of your money or effort to do so. You berate your neighbors for not giving to the family. And by virtue of having vilified others for their lack of compassion, you have been given a pass (in your mind, anyway) that eternally gives you forgiveness for your utter lack of altruism on a personal level.

The thing that has always disturbed me about the left is their penchant for voyeuristic altruism. Compared to the average person, most of the spokesmen for the left are very rich indeed. Obama, the community organizer, doesn’t exactly live the lifestyle of a typical American peasant. If they really believe in what they are saying why aren’t they diverting their money either to the poor or the Cause?

But what can I say–doublethink is as doublethink does.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:35 pm 16. Insufficiently Sensitive:

Democrats always referred to McCain as a “good” Republican (sort of an ironic thing, like a “good” Samaritan or a “good” Indian, I suppose).

And the Economist wailed on last week’s cover, “bring back the ‘real’ - their fantasy of the anti-Bush socialist - McCain”.

Such is their hatred of conservatives in general, and Bush in particular, that they had ignored his conservative side while investing 100% of their hopes in the maverick.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:40 pm 17. JFSanders:

This link explains why Zerobama wants all those “Corps”.

[url]http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=305420655186700[url/]

Jim

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:43 pm 18. JFSanders:

Sorry the title was misplaced somehow.

Michelle’s Boot Camps For Radicals

By INVESTOR’S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Thursday, September 04, 2008 4:20 PM PT

Election ‘08: Democrats’ reintroduction of militant Michelle Obama in Denver was supposed to show her softer side. But it only highlighted a radical part of her resume: Public Allies.

Jim

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:46 pm 19. hdgreene:

The unemployment numbers came in at 6.1 percent. There was an “outreach program” at the Labor Department to let folks know they could get an additional 13 weeks of unemployment — that helps swell the numbers and that is swell for the Democrats in Congress. The offer of “money” will certainly help organizational efforts of the unemployed. If the Democrats lose this one you will have to put the entire party (and the MSM) on suicide watch.

With the choice of Palin and his speech last night, McCain has made a good start as “the outside reformer.” I thought Obama’s choice of Biden was a gift in that regard — and the gift might keep on giving.

Joe Biden talked of criminal investigations for the Bush administration the other day. Then he denied it on Fox — someone must have photoshoped that video tape! Of course the Vice President is the one who delivers the “over the top attacks.” The Presidential nominee must look more “Presidential.” So when Joe Biden talks of criminal investigations, he’s performing his political role — one that goes back to Eisenhower/Nixon if not before. This is “covering campaigns 101″ — and is well remembered in the case of Joe Biden.

But in the case Sarah Palin? Sarcastic Sarah? Mean Sarah? The Messiah Belittling Sarah? That behavior may be OK in male VPs, but woman should behave better. This will come from the Left’s pet feminists — for whom there is only one standard and that is the “double” one.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:50 pm 20. RWE:

A friend of mine, a Vietnam Vet himself, once described meeting with a Vietnam era POW in his hotel room in DC. There was a knock on the door and it proved to be another Vietnam POW.

My friend was astonished when the man in the room hugged the newcomer and kissed him on both cheeks.

The former POWs explained that was how they received a man who had come back to his cell after interrogation. They knew what terrible things had been done to him and what he had been forced to say, to confess. The kisses on the cheeks were to welcome him back and say that all was forgiven. His fellow POWs and his country still loved him.

It is very hard for me to imagine that situation, but I would think that accepting such forgiveness would itself be a very humbling experience, even as it was comforting.

Sep 5, 2008 - 2:53 pm 21. JMHawkins:

There are community organizers and then there are Community Organizers. People who describe themselves first and foremost as a “Community Organizer” or who draw a paycheck under that title are, frankly, odd. It has the same ring as “postdoctoral student.” Couldn’t committ to something usefull, eh?

Now, someone who is a School Teacher, or a Firefighter, or a Grocery Clerk, and does a fair amount of organizing in the community on the side, well, there’s something honorable in that (perhaps - depending on just what sort of organizing they’re doing). But that’s not what Obama was, and that’s not the category of person Palin was skewering.

No, Community Organizers are self-important boobs who think the masses are too dumb to tie their shoes without help. Or else evil manipulators looking for a rabble to help further their own interests.

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:04 pm 22. Teresita:

The whole pro-abort ideology of the Left is driven by the bogus claim that a woman can’t be successful if she is “forced” to bear and raise children. Governor Sarah Palin puts lie to that assertion by her own happy and full life as both a public servant and a wife and mother, which speaks directly to the heart of all American women. The mere existence of a Sarah Palin is unbearable to the Mainstream Media, as surely as the mere existence of the State of Israel sticks in the craw of the Arab world.

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:05 pm 23. bobal:

Community organizers of the world, unite!

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:08 pm 24. Jay:

I have spent a good deal of time reading about the politics and economics of the rise to power of the NAZI party. I can read German but I have lost what fluency I used to have.
Adolph S was a young idealist in Linz, Austria. He was brought up as a Catholic but turned against the Church. He drifted but then managed to become a citizen of Germany and enlisted in the Prussian Army (it was called Prussian not German then). He bravely fought on the front in WW1.
He then became an agitator in Germany and with funding from the Reichwer (the army) he helped organize a bunch of kooks in the NAZI party. He believed himself to be the “leader” which in German history it means something a bit different than just leader.
But if it were not for the political stalemate about taxation issues in the Weimar Rupublic and the stupidity of Hindenburg, The NAZI’s would be an historical footnote in German politics instead of a disaster for Germany and the so many others including the US troops who died and were injured finishing off those beasts that took over that party (not all early NAZIs were anti-semites and gutter types).
What we have going for us is that the Onicks do not control the military nor all of the judiciary and police.
Another thing going for us is that he has energized the black racists. Hitler energized a significant part of the Lutheran political core of the Republic.
Do not read me wrong here, not all blacks are energized in the way the killers are. They want to see a person of brown skin who speaks Chicago talk become POTUS. Same for many white folks. Unless you have some sense of how people of hate function you have not idea about what this person and his wife and core supporters are about.

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:11 pm 25. JFSanders:

Obama said, quote: We have got to have a civilian national security force that is just as powerful, just as strong, just as well funded as the military.

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:25 pm 26. ridgerunner:

Tcobb,
There is merit in your concept of voyeuristic altruism. In the U.S., states that are overwhelmingly Democratic are miserly, whereas those that are Republican are generous. What follows, from a post I placed on a Civil War forum in 2002, documents this difference.

“Barron’s (the investment weekly) recently reported the state-by-state rankings from The Catalogue for Philanthropy’s fifth annual “Generosity Index,” which is a ratio of average annual charitable giving divided by average annual income for each state. “1″ is the most generous and “50″ is the most miserly. Here are the ranks for states which participated in the Civil War. I omitted the border states.

CSA: 1 Mississippi, 2 Arkansas, 4 Tennessee, 5 Louisiana, 6 Alabama, 10 South Carolina, 12 Texas, 16 Florida, 17 Georgia, 18 North Carolina, 38 Virginia. SOUTHERN AVERAGE = 12

USA: 14 West Virginia, 23 Indiana, 26 Iowa, 28 Ohio, 29 New York, 30 Vermont, 31 Pennsylvania, 32 Maine, 34 Connecticut, 44 Massachusetts, 45 Michigan, 46 Minnesota, 47 Wisconsin, 48 New Jersey, 49 Rhode Island, 50 New Hampshire. NORTHERN AVERAGE = 36

So the Northern States, by this measure, are now “three times” more miserly.

Obviously people in the South give more as a percentage of their income, but they also generally have lower incomes. The report also provides a ranking of the states by average annual income. To include this aspect, I divided the state’s Generosity Index rank by the state’s income rank and obtained what I’ll term the “Actual Generosity Index.” Because several Southern states had opposite ranking on these Generosity Index and Income Index, the division to obtain the “Actual Generosity Index” gave them numbers below 1.0. Remember that this represents extreme generosity. A number well above 1.0 represents extreme miserliness. Here are the numbers for my “Actual Generosity Index.”

CSA: 0.02 Mississippi, 0.04 Arkansas, 0.11 Tennessee, 0.11 Louisiana, 0.15 Alabama, 0.26 South Carolina, 0.60 Texas, 0.69 North Carolina, 0.89 Georgia, 1.0 Florida, 3.45 Virginia. SOUTHERN AVERAGE = 0.61

USA: 0.29 West Virginia, 0.72 Iowa, 0.74 Indiana, 0.82 Ohio, 0.88 Maine, 1.0 Vermont, 1.41 Pennsylvania, 2.04 Wisconsin, 2.88 Rhode Island, 3.0 Michigan, 3.54 Minnesota, 5.8 New York, 8.33 New Hampshire, 16.0 New Jersey, 22.0 Massachusetts, 34.0 Connecticut. NORTHERN AVERAGE = 6.47

By this alternative index, the Northern States are “ten times” more miserly.

As with the Generosity Index, I have allowed the results to be skewed against the South by not excluding states that, because of immigration, are not as Southern as they were during the Civil War, e.g., Florida, Georgia, and Virginia. Also note that among the Northern states the least miserly tend to be those which received Scots-Irish immigration into their southern portions during the mid-1800’s, e.g., Indiana.”

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:27 pm 27. Peter Boston:

“We’ve got to have a civilian national security force that’s just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded” as the military, Obama said.

If that doesn’t scare the beejeezus out of you - it should. What comes to mind when national politicians start spouting “civilian national security force” other than the SS, Brown Shirts, and the Red Guard?

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:29 pm 28. 2x4:

Peter Boston, I have a problem with your sentence. Let me try, if you don’t mind:

What other than the SS, Brown Shirts, and the Red Guard comes to mind when national politicians start spouting “civilian national security force”?

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:37 pm 29. trangbang68:

My cousin ,a very sweet and kind woman, married a professional Community Organizer a few years ago. At a reunion I tried to tell him of our efforts at reaching underclass youths through our church. His disdain for what we were doing was palpable. I guess if it wasn’t part of a Marxist dialectic it had no value. We’re still doing what we do. He moved on to organize some other community.

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:39 pm 30. 2x4:

Or:

When national politicians start spouting “civilian national security force”, what other comes to mind than the SS, Brown Shirts, and the Red Guard?

Sep 5, 2008 - 3:40 pm 31. cjm:

it’s interesting at the dem convention the audience was chanting “obama, obama, obama”, while at the gop convention they were chanting “usa, usa, usa”.

when obama loses this election, he can start a snake cult like thulsa doom.

Sep 5, 2008 - 4:11 pm 32. ridgerunner:

If someone wishes to compare State ranks for charitable giving with, say, the proportion of Democrats in the State’s Congressional delegation, the URL below would provide data on charitable giving.

http://www.catalogueforphilanthropy.org/natl/generosity_index/2006/data/

Sep 5, 2008 - 4:14 pm 33. ridgerunner:

Or, to take into account Blue Dog Democrats, compare the State’s rank for charitable giving with the Congressional delegation’s Americans for Democratic Action Voting Record score.

Sep 5, 2008 - 4:21 pm 34. Eggplant:

Jay said:

“I have spent a good deal of time reading about the politics and economics of the rise to power of the NAZI party. I can read German but I have lost what fluency I used to have. Adolph S was a young idealist in Linz, Austria.”

By “Adolph S”, I assume you mean “Adolph Schicklgruber”?

Here’s some Adolph Schicklgruber trivia that I learned when I lived in Germany:

Schicklgruber submitted his application to become a German citizen in Braunschweig (he was originally Austrian). The building where he did this still stands and is now part of the Technical University of Braunschweig.

One of Schicklgruber’s heros was Heinrich der Löwe who is a direct ancestor of Queen Elizabeth. Heinrich der Löwe is buried in the Braunschweiger Dom (Brunswick Cathedral). The Nazis desecrated the Braunschweiger Dom by converting it into a weird Nazi Museum. The Braunschweiger Dom was a prototype for a Nazi Cathedral that Albert Speer was planning to build in Linz, Austria (Schicklgruber’s favorite city). It was Schicklgruber’s intent to have his mausoleum built in this Nazi Cathedral. The Nazi’s had the crypt in the Braunschweiger Dom completely rebuilt with this fancy sarcophagus for Heinrich der Löwe. It’s clear that Schicklgruber saw Heinrich der Löwe as a role model. Supposably Schicklgruber’s plan was to have World War II completed by 1950 and then immediately retire from politics. If you read Albert Speer’s book, you can see all these amazing gradiose plans that Schicklgruber had for Berlin after he wrapped up World War II (like our B. Hussien, Schicklgruber was a sucker for neoclassical architecture). One of the few surviving examples of Nazi style architecture is the Deutsches Museum in München.

Sep 5, 2008 - 4:34 pm 35. Tcobb:

ridgerunner
I mean no disrespect to you at all, but I think you aren’t really comprehending the mindset of the other side at all. To you its about the extent of GIVING that counts, and that, my friend, says a great deal about you, and I see nothing but good in you for it. To them, its all about the extent of TAKING. And that disturbs me. Tremendously.

Sep 5, 2008 - 4:47 pm 36. Teresita:

JF Sanders: Obama said, quote: We have got to have a civilian national security force that is just as powerful, just as strong, just as well funded as the military.

Ah, the security wing of his Community Organizer Corps. I wonder if they will wear nice brown shirts.

Sep 5, 2008 - 4:53 pm 37. nobozons:

Saw bo on O’reilly last night and his reason for wanting to quit Iraq was that the activities in Iraq were errant, to much money was spent and the Iraqis would not stand up. Wars are not fought with perfect tactics, new enemies sometime enter the field and our reputation for cutting and running under Bill Clinton and Bush 40 didn’t inspire the Iraqis to stand up. Given the democrats undermining of Bush’s war effort, I can’t blame them for not standing up. Al Quaeda and Iran also made it difficult for the Iraqis to stand up. Only the dogged determination of Bush and a few republicans and the success of Petraeus convinced them to stand up. BO quit for there is a lot of quit in him. He also doesn’t understand when it is time to stand up. Not the traits that I am looking for in a leader.

Sep 5, 2008 - 5:28 pm 38. Uncle Jefe:

Speaking of abortion, Teresita, I’m wondering why what Sarah Palin did (in choosing to bear a child with Down’s Syndrome) is not one of the biggest examples of what being ‘pro-choice’ SHOULD be…

Sep 5, 2008 - 5:53 pm 39. Elroy Jetson:

I happen to think when Obama tilts his chin upward, he looks like Mussolini. I can picture him assuming that pose as he addresses the first graduates of the training program for his new civilan defense force.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:01 pm 40. Vinny Vidivici:

Teresita:

Crisp shirts would be setting the bar rather high for the sort of mob O has in mind. I’m thinking more along the lines of disorganized, chaotic, occasionally vicious factions of Red Guards, all competing for the mantle of affinity with ‘Mao Zedong thought’, but spending most of their time using the ‘cultural revolution’ as cover to settle various personal and political scores.

Question is, will O be capable of ’sending them all to the countryside’, as it were, once he gets what he wants out of them or they get out of hand? Riding tigers was tough enough for grizzled revolutionaries and ruthless political operators in Zhongnianhai, but for a post-modern metrosexual who’s never seen a day of adversity or hardship in his life . . . ?

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:08 pm 41. Wadeusaf:

so was that …

…Change, Change, Change, Change of fools?

or …, Chain, Chain, Chain?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4ZWAUtWQ1Y

Courtesy PUMA

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:11 pm 42. wretchard:

McCain doesn’t call for anti-Obamism. Not directly. His challenge is more indirect. It’s to look out the window and see it with other eyes; to examine the things taken for granted; to value the things adjudged worthless, with the conviction that if each of us does these things, all else will follow. Even for Obama.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:11 pm 43. Vinny Vidivici:

Elroy:

Mark Steyn has a take on Il Duce’s back-of-the-hands-on-hips chin jut. To paraphrase: Like the bitch waiter at the Coconut Grove who’s miffed because you’ve sent back the curly endive.

Sorry not to include a link — at his site, it would be in an essay containing a vignette of him attending a luncheon that Mussolini’s son also attended.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:12 pm 44. Tony:

The problem with pretending to be a Jacksonian (Andrew Jackson, POTUS #7) is that a majority of Americans are natural Jacksonians, it’s how we grew up.

American Democrats offer us lawyers / life-long government employees like Biden and Obama, Teddy K and Jengis Kerry - and Americans believe THESE GUYS are ‘fightin’ for the little guy’ - ?

The problem with Democratic politicians trying to be old style Americans is that sometimes these Americans rise to the surface like a barracuda.

Sarah Palin breaks the mold, but being a woman’s only the surface part. What gets out of the mold is what counts, and Sarah is more like most Americans than any politician we’ve seen on the national stage in decades.

This is going to be fun. Let the better mmmm Person win!

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:13 pm 45. lc:

Four legs good, two legs be-e-e-e-tter.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:42 pm 46. Lifeofthemind:

Wretchard has I think gotten the key point; military officers are community organizers. The Ensign really is told, “Your troops come first. They eat, sleep, bathe, get their mail and shit before you do. You come last.” McCain was an aviator. Those of us in the Surface Navy worried about the aviators because we weren’t sure if they understood what the khaki officers’ uniforms meant. For those who have worked in a hospital consider the difference between an Anesthesiologist or Head Nurse and a Surgeon. McCain was the glamour boy Surgeon. Pilots like Surgeons can get away with having enormous egos. In the movie MASH they got to call themselves, “The Pros From Dover.” Anesthesiologists and Head Nurses, like Surface Navy or Infantry officers do, manage teams. Civilians, and some of the enlisted, have trouble seeing past the obvious social and material benefits that officers get as well as the officer’s authority to do things such as give unpleasant orders that can get the troops killed.

The animosity that the left has for the military is largely an accident of history and not even really of American history. It is in fact counter-intuitive. Most military officers do not know much about economics and are socially rather than ideologically conservative. Their entire training is in teamwork and achieving predetermined goals through a group. That is a good working definition of Socialism to me. That certainly applies to McCain, who is now totally fixated on teamwork and problem solving.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:44 pm 47. Peterike:

Because for some reason I feel a wave of despair tonight, I was drawn back to reading my underlined passages in one of the great autobiographies of the age, “Chronicles of Wasted Time” by Malcolm Muggeridge. He ends Part 1 with a lament for those lost souls who pimped happily for the Soviet Union, one of the great evils on earth. The passage is shockingly redolent of the Obama partisans and the willful self-annihilation that drives them. Here, for your edification (I won’t say “enjoyment”), is one of the starkest bits of writing I’ve ever encountered. And to think, they might win.

Wise old Shaw, high-minded old Barbusse, the venerable Webbs, Gide the pure in heart and Picasso the impure, down to poor little teachers, crazed clergymen and millionaires, drivelling dons and very special correspondents like Duranty, all resolved, come what might, to believe anything, however preposterous, to overlook anything, however villainous, to approve anything, however obscuratinist and brutally authoritarian, in order to be able to preserve intact the confident expectation that one of the most thorough-going, ruthless and bloody tyranies ever to exist on earth could be relied on to champion human freedom, the brotherhood of man, and all the other good liberal causes to which they had dedicated their lives. All resolved, in other words, to abolish themselves and their world, the rest of us with it. Nor have I from that time ever had the faintest expectation that, in earthly terms, anything could be salvaged; that any earthly battle could be won, or earthly solution found. It has all just been sleep-walking to the end of the night.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:50 pm 48. wretchard:

“military officers are community organizers”

The best of them are. TE Lawrence, for example. The Special Forces are supposed to train locals for insurrection against oppressors. But even in conventional warfare, it the commander who knows how to organize victory; trains his officer and NCO corps to a pitch, and who infuses a common attitude in his troops so that even when they are out of touch they know what to do that more often than not prevails against the autocratic leader. It was not for nothing that Nelson could call his captains his “band of brothers”.

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:52 pm 49. Peterike:

People, after all, believe lies, not because they are plausibly presented, but because they want to believe them. So, their credulity is unshakeable.

– Malcolm Muggeridge

Sep 5, 2008 - 6:57 pm 50. Lifeofthemind:

@Vinny Vidivici,
The metrosexual endive elite believe in their bones that they will be the Party Cadre leading the revolution. They tell themselves that they can be like Pol Pot, whose Mother said his nose was never out of a book, or Inner Party member O’Brien in 1984, reading banned books and wearing better clothes while deciding who to unleash Obama’s Civilian Defense Force on. Of course if the Revolution ever happened I’d put my money on tough survivors like Stalin ending up on top while the soft intellectuals get sent to the wall. McCain is a survivor too. He could eat an Obama in such a situation.

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:01 pm 51. Teresita:

CJM: it’s interesting at the dem convention the audience was chanting “obama, obama, obama”, while at the gop convention they were chanting “usa, usa, usa”.

Let’s be fair. They only shouted “USA, USA” on three occasions at the GOP convention, and two of them were to drown out protesters. The Republicans did indeed chant “Obama, Obama” but it sounded more like “Zero, Zero”

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:26 pm 52. Lifeofthemind:

@Wretchard,
What I meant to focus on is that the least glamorous routine aspects of the job are much like the ideal of the self effacing group motivating Community Organizer that Alinsky wanted. A Junior Officer is given a unit of from 6 to 50 troops with associated equipment and work spaces. In the Army this is called a Platoon; in the Navy it is called a Division. A successful officer takes credit for people who get up every day and spend 14 hours fixing equipment, cleaning their berthing and work spaces, performing assigned tasks such as driving supplies or stringing wire or chipping rust or painting or operating engines and pumps. The work is often in incredibly dirty and noisy conditions, with people you have no choice of being with, and where you have no expectation of respect for your privacy. That is during normal peacetime conditions when people are not intending to kill you. If the troops do this monotonous labor for the wages offered, and with no opportunity of earning either overtime or cash bonuses, while they are also taking extra time to take correspondence courses and otherwise qualify for advancement, stay out of trouble and volunteer additional charitable activity that makes the Boss look good then that part of the Junior Officer’s job is deemed successful. That part of the job is very much like being a Community Organizer. In addition of course the J.O. to get promoted has to leap through all the same hoops, task performance and extra curricular, for their boss that are used to evaluate the work of the enlisted staff.

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:35 pm 53. Wadeusaf:

“look out the window and see it with other eyes; to examine the things taken for granted; to value the things adjudged worthless, with the conviction that if each of us does these things, all else will follow.”…

The thought that the PUMA’s see the same thing even when looking at a different object crosses my mind. Or maybe some are seeing things for the first time.

Softening the lens, the effect is subtle, Harsh lighting can change the result,
more for effect.

Still sunlight is a great disinfectant…,

The Day Begins

‘Cold hearted orb that rules the night,
Removes the colours from our sight.
Red is grey and yellow white,
But we decide which is right.
And which is an illusion?
Pinprick holes in a colourless sky,
Let inspired figures of light pass by,
The mighty light of ten thousand suns,
Challenges infinity and is soon gone.
Night time, to some a brief interlude,
To others the fear of solitude.
Brave Helios wake up your steeds,
Bring the warmth the countryside needs.

(Graeme Edge)

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:36 pm 54. Tony:

RE: “TE Lawrence, for example.”

Bing West describes today’s new Lawrences, and he names names of such heroes in “The Strongest Tribe” - several pages of two-column, single space lists of names - in the paper version at least.

Capt. Zembiec and Sheik Sattar, American and Iraqi hero portraits are featured prominently in Bing West’s book.

The Strongest Tribe: War, Politics, and the Endgame in Iraq

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:38 pm 55. chrisa798:

Ridgerunner,

I used to cite that charitable giving thing by state the way you did, too, but there is an alternate methodology that shows a much more even red-blue distribution:

http://www.forbes.com/realestate/2005/11/23/most-charitable-states-cx_lh_1125home_ls.html

And it’s worth remembering that even my native state of Massachusetts has a lot of Dems who are not liberals.

It’s smarter to use the giving info when people say “oh, republicans don’t give to charity” (just happened to me in August) and cite both studies than to try to paint the blue staters as hostile to charity.

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:44 pm 56. 2x4:

This will knock your socks off:

Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Le1PnWVDfA

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmsP8Nsl4ws

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:51 pm 57. 2x4:

This will knock your socks off:
Part 1

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:53 pm 58. 2x4:

Part 2

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:54 pm 59. 2x4:

Sorry for a dupe, it seemed that it did not post the first time.

Sep 5, 2008 - 7:55 pm 60. wretchard:

But not us. And not today. Not this day.

Sep 5, 2008 - 8:08 pm 61. Charles:

London Times Online

It never ceases to amaze me how the Left falls again and again into the old trap of underestimating politicians whom they don’t understand. From Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher to George Bush and Mrs Palin, they do it every time. Because these characters talk a bit funny and have ridiculously antiquated views about faith, family and nation, because they haven’t spent time bending the knee to the intellectual metropolitan elites, they can’t be taken seriously.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/gerard_baker/article4677799.ece

Sep 5, 2008 - 8:13 pm 62. Charles:

btw anyone here know anyone in the OMB–tell them to let all water research projects go through. Water membrane research especially is about 5-7 years behind solar cell research but with good funding it can catch up. I’ve already seen DARPA funding for the coolest membranes.The results of water desalination research will be just as stunning as the dirt cheap solar cells produced by nanosolar. The effect of cheap solar panels and cheap water desalination & transport will be that the deserts of the world will be turned green and the habitable size of planet doubled.

Sep 5, 2008 - 8:22 pm 63. Doug:

OBAMA READY TO FIGHT: ‘We won’t be bullied’…
The Lady with Cooties is being mean to the affirmative action Messiah.

Sep 5, 2008 - 9:09 pm 64. Doug:

The MSM will let Hillary stand in for Biden.
Two against one is fair, ’cause the other lady is mean.

Sep 5, 2008 - 9:11 pm 65. Ledger:

In a humorous way Iowahawk explains “Community Organizing.”

[Getting started]

“I have also been a proud member of Campaign For a Better Humanity, a non-profit community outreach program I created with a joint grant from Johnson County Community Services and the Iowa State Work Release Program.”

“What do community organizers do?

“…For example I also make frequent visits to Whispering Acres, the senior assisted living center across from Hy-Vee. Like many elderly people across America, the residents there often struggle with forgetfulness and confusion. As a community organizer, I listen to their concerns and boring, meandering stories about the Depression. Then, when they eventually fall asleep, I help by checking their mail and storage areas and medicine cabinets to see what needs organizing. If they suddenly wake back up, I enjoy helping them fill out various legal and financial forms, and voter registrations…”

See: When America’s Communities Need Organizing

http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/2008/09/when-americas-c.html

Sep 5, 2008 - 9:21 pm 66. Benj:

Hope one day Wretch will stop relying on other people’s readings of “Dreams” especially if he insists on casting aspersions - “slightly underhanded” etc. - on O’s motives. While O avoids getting all up into a heavy discussion of the limits of local community organizing paradigm in “Dreams,” he makes it clear how his own way of seeing came to be different from his mentor/organizer. (Race mattered here too and Judis misses that angle and an important dimension of the task that now confronts O.) Wretch has posted on this topic a few times. In response to his July 4th post “Community Organizer,” I suggested that O fully comprehended the moral dangers/possiblities of entering politics…

“If you go into the Game, you KNOW your hands will be dirty. Did O cross the line to become a hack? - was he after that State Sen sinecure? Or was he thinking big. Figuring he might be the One - because of his one-of-a-kind background and sympathetic imagination - to become the tribute of everyday people whose lives will not be transformed w/o a long-term NATIONAL campaign of reconstruction…”

Wretch gives himself a little pat for anticipating the arguments of John Judis.

“It didn’t require much effort to figure out that Obama self-orientation was fundamentally at odds with the ethos of community organizing.”

While it’s true that O’s NEW orientation was at odds with the IAF’s version of the organizing tradtion (which, btw, is not exactly Alinksy’s). It was not really at odds with the older traditions of the Civil Rights Movement that O had been studying for a long time. SNCC’s peak, for example, was the attempt to seat the Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party at the 64 Democratic convention. And, though King didn’t run for office, he certainly worked as a charismatic national figure in harmony (generally) with local organizers. Wretch (and Judis) are focusing on an actual dichotomy - you could even call it an experiential gulf! - but there are historical reasons why O believes the right kind of leader can cross the border, close the gap…

Appreciate your focus how Mac broke it down in his speech and on the place of shame — in O’s life-history and everybody’s. You could do more with that comparison if you’d read “Dreams” but thanks for zeroing in on those ponderable lines…

Sep 5, 2008 - 9:48 pm 67. Dave:

So a young Obama wanted something that paid better and otherwise gave more material rewards. Doing good should not guarantee
deprivation, so there was nothing wrong with his desires.

However, what is this crap that political clout, transfers of income and the like is what ends poverty and discrimination?
With those assumptions in mind, he was off to the devil. To hades in a handbasket.

And the pity is, he does not look like he has ever stopped to examine his premises.

Reminds me of a great line from Thomas Sowell:
“We know from reading the Bible that Lot’s Wife was not a liberal. They never look back.”

Sep 5, 2008 - 9:53 pm 68. NahnCee:

I see Benj is trying elevate himself to an equal footing with Wretchard again. Benj, dear, just because it says “all men are created equal” does NOT mean they stay equal.

I’m surprised that no one has mentioned the East German Stasi when contemplating what kind of a civil corps Obama might have in mind. Doesn’t it seem likely that progressive liberals would like nothing better than the opportunity to rat out their “neocon” neighbors, and maybe even get the chance to gloat if they then become fired or arrested or “disappeared”?

And who better to rat out Republican adults than their school children confined to halls of learning and Marxist indoctrination from kindergarten through college graduation. You just know that Obama would love to get the children early to turn them into card-carrying Democrats. He could put Michelle in charge of the youth program — she looks like she would relish the idea of indoctrinating children into the “proper way of thinking”, just like she’s turned her own children on to the joys of “God Damn Amerikka!”

Sep 5, 2008 - 10:42 pm 69. Doug:

American Thinker Blog What do you mean ‘us’ Kimosabe

Of interest in the Wenner Us Magazine story was the MSM Babe doing a terrific job of outing the sleazeball that wrote the story.
Caught him dead to rights in two outright lies on the air.
—
Joe Biden says he wasn’t around when Truman was President.
…but Biden’s my age, and I sure was.
Didn’t know people that were alive, imagined he knew people that were yet to born.

Sep 5, 2008 - 11:02 pm 70. Lifeofthemind:

Imagine a nation full of monsters like Pavlik Morozov. Someplace I read that Stalin himself privately called Morozov a horrible child for informing on his parents. Readers are invited to look him up, given the sites dislike of links.

Sep 5, 2008 - 11:23 pm 71. Doug:

American Thinker - The End of Boomer Weirdness
ht - al-Bob

Sep 5, 2008 - 11:49 pm 72. Doug:

- In Palin’s Life and Politics, Goal to Follow God’s Will -

Sep 6, 2008 - 12:14 am 73. Doug:

No doubt they’ll do a complete expose of Obama’s Church next.

Sep 6, 2008 - 12:25 am 74. Pascal:

Doug: That The End of Boomer Weirdness does a nice job of contrasting the matter/antimatter relationship of modernism/postmodernism.

I’ve met a few here who have claimed not to understand what postmodern meant. It seemed at the time conveniently postmodern. Your link explains it as “unsanity.”

Sep 6, 2008 - 12:43 am 75. CPT. Charles:

Here’s a better link to the IBD series:

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/series8.aspx

Oddly enough, NONE of it surprises me in the least…

Sep 6, 2008 - 1:20 am 76. Kirk Parker:

Teresita,

That’s “punished with a child”. Get with the phraseology, will you?

Sep 6, 2008 - 1:21 am 77. CPT. Charles:

Teresita [9/5@1653hrs]: Actually no, I visualize them in Green Shirts…with Rainbow armbands; and of course, made from organic cotton (with a union label).

Sep 6, 2008 - 1:45 am 78. Peter Boston:

IBD Editorial

When Obama won the Iowa caucuses, Frank Chapman, a member of the U.S. Peace Council Executive Committee, (Communist) wrote a letter to the People’s Weekly World celebrating the victory of Alice Palmer’s (Communist) former protege.

“Obama’s victory was more than a progressive move,” Chapman wrote. “It was a dialectical leap ushering in a new era of struggle. Marx once compared (the) revolutionary new era of struggle with the work of the mole, who sometimes burrows so far beneath the ground that he leaves no trace of his movement on the surface.”

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:07 am 79. Doug:

“She asked for a biblical example of people who were great leaders and what was the secret of their leadership,” Mr. Riley said.

He wrote back that she should read again from the Old Testament the story of Esther, a beauty queen who became a real one, gaining the king’s ear to avert the slaughter of the Jews and vanquish their enemies. When Esther is called to serve, God grants her a strength she never knew she had.

Mr. Riley said he thought Ms. Palin had lived out the advice as governor, and would now do so again as the Republican Party’s vice-presidential nominee.”
—
Bhutan

“The Bhutanese can get a Dzongkha font for their Microsoft Windows software, even though there are still no traffic lights in the country!”
http://www.bhutanstudies.org.bt/

Other Bhutan Links

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:22 am 80. bobal:

Palin Rumors Debunked List–Past 40 And Counting

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:43 am 81. Doug:

CFP Resume of a Terrorist Obama’s Buddy Ayers

On Friday night, one of America’s top talk show hosts—who happens to be an attorney and worked in the Reagan Justice Department as chief of staff—recited a list of terrorist acts that would elicit envy from Osama bin Laden. Mark Levin had his listeners glued to their radios or PCs as he read the resume of a man who should be serving life in prison instead of enjoying a tenured professorship at a major university and entertaining a possible US President in his home.
—
As I write this “resume of a terrorist,” I find it difficult to understand how a man who is running for president of the United States would even know someone as anti-American and destructive as William Ayers. Plus, Ayers, his wife and their comrades at the Weather Underground are cop-killers. And Obama doesn’t just know him personally—he’s a close friend with Ayers.

Here is the “resume” of an American terrorist:
—
His long list left out UCSB, so I got these links for Kevin James:
UCSB Special Collections Research Isla Vista Resources Guide to KCSB Audiotape Collection

KCSB.2.27.70.1 - [description for Feb. 27 tape series} John Seely (SB Center for the Study of Democratic Institutions )on Chicago and the movement; Nancy Rubin; Kuntsler on Chicago movement; KCSB coverage of IV revolution; statement by Cheadle; National Guard in IV; Statement by commander; National Guard takes posts; IV League statement; minor arrests and friskings; Police sweep movements; bomb threat at Francisco Torres; (ucsb Dorm) Individual arrests

Police To Resume Investigation of ‘69 Campus Bombing - Daily Nexus

Police To Resume Investigation of ‘69 Campus Bombing
Wednesday, April 11, 2007

Before the riots, before the massive protests, before the burning of the Bank of America, an explosion rocked the campus community and took the life of one of its members.

ucsb faculty club bombing - Google Search

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:44 am 82. Doug:

Founding SDS Member attacked in Chicago

“There was a mood among the wider student body by 1970, and not only here, but around the country, that was really kind of a neat reaction to authority - both national and police authority, parental authority [and] university authority,” Flacks said. “All of these seemed … to a lot of young people at that point in time as backward, repressive, uncaring, unfeeling, sending us off to war, not understanding our values as young people.”
—
Shortly after learning of his 1960 appointment to a tenured teaching position at UCSB, sociology professor Richard Flacks made front-page news nationwide. An attacker, posing as a reporter, met him at his Chicago office for an interview and savagely beat him. The unidentified assailant left Flacks, a well-known founding member of Students for a Democratic Society, with a hole in his skull.

Flacks, who would recover at a hospital and arrive at UCSB in July that year, said he has always assumed the attack was political. Students for a Democratic Society was a new-leftist student movement that primarily protested the war in Vietnam.

“When my appointment [at UCSB] was announced, which was like June of ‘69 - that became a controversial issue,” Flacks said. “Governor Regan attacked the appointment. He said a wonderful statement of his. He said it’s like ‘hiring a pyromaniac to be a fuse-maker in a firecracker factory.’”

Prior to the controversy over his hiring, which eventually subsided, and the student unrest that brought chaos to the UCSB campus, Flacks said he had expected Santa Barbara to be more relaxing than the politically tumultuous Windy City.

“So the irony was that with starting in January of 1970, there comes this tremendous explosion of campus protest here, which had been preceded by a year or two of prior actions by black students, and by the student anti-war people, and so forth,” Flacks said. “But first the demonstrations in support of Bill Allen were dramatic, and then came this scene in Isla Vista, which led to the burning of the bank.”

Sep 6, 2008 - 5:05 am 83. Charles:

OT: I mentioned before that its a good idea to keep an eye on Cramer at Mad Money for fed policy moves.
Government may soon back troubled mortgage giants This is the first suggestion I’ve seen that the feds may take over freddie and fannie mac. I don’t understand this biz except that the tax payer will be on the hook for billions. Is there an economist in the house?

Sep 6, 2008 - 6:01 am 84. Doug:

Buddy Larsen will come to the rescue, Charles, I hope.
They are taking over Fannie and Freddie.

Maybe Buddy can also tell us where those weird names came from.

Sep 6, 2008 - 6:34 am 85. Lifeofthemind:

Pressure from the left to bail out Freddie and Fannie does not surprise me. Here is another disaster with Jamie Gorelick’s footprints on it.

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:11 am 86. Aether:

This:

“A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.”

clearly obviates the need for

This:

Obama said, quote: “We have got to have a civilian national security force that is just as powerful, just as strong, just as well funded as the military.”

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:28 am 87. Leo Linbeck III:

W - great post.

Brings to mind Max Weber’s Routinization of Charisma. Weber described the development cycle of human organizations, from corporations to political movements to religions. The outline is as follows:

Crisis leads to the emergence of the charismatic leader
Charisma leads to authority
Authority leads to change
Change leads to success
Success leads to scale
Scale leads to routinization
Routinization leads to tradition
Tradition leads to stasis
Stasis leads to crisis
… and the cycle starts anew.

The cycle can fail at any point, but Weber’s point was that even if everything “works,” it will still fail in the end. So there is no permanent solution to the human condition. We are fallen, and nothing within our power can reverse that tragic fact.

The Christian claim, however, is that with God’s help (and only with God’s help) we can break the cycle. It is the historical fact of “The One,” God’s gift to mankind, grace personified, that causes this break. But the irony is that from the outside, to the non-believer, this too looks like failure because the change is not external. It is a change of heart, an inner transformation that is hidden to all except for Him. And the payoff is not in this life, so it’s devilishly difficult to tell when it happens.

All of these facts conspire to humility the sign of success. We do not save ourselves, so we cannot possibly claim credit for the most important act of our lives, the act of acceptance of His will.

I cannot guess at what is in Obama’s heart. But modern community organizing is fundamentally a human activity, so it must, per Weber, ultimately fail. It is not hard to believe that a young, idealistic, reform-minded man would enter the cycle and become disillusioned. I find such disillusionment, as W does, a mark of maturity, a sign of progress. The question is: having discovered that the path you were on does not achieve your goal, what next?

It appears that Obama’s answer was to restart a new cycle, one that begins with the “crisis” of the GWB presidency and the early coronation of HRC and the apparent failure in Iraq, and leads to his emergence as the charismatic leader who seeks the authority to create change.

There is another path, however: the path of acceptance of one’s limitations, the path of humility, the path of hard work without reward, the path of the missionary who seeks God through man, not vice versa. This is not a path to power, at least temporal power. This is the path of the true community organizer.

We should not fault Obama (or McCain or or myself or anyone else) for not choosing this path. Very few do, and those that do still die alone. But it does seem perverse to adopt the persona of the community organizer while seeking the power that flows from personal charisma. It is a deception that, if successfully deployed, will destroy the hope of many who do not yet understand the true nature of man, and God.

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:49 am 88. JFSanders:

Federal National Mortgage Association

Federal Home Mortgage Corporation

When the letters were spoken “FNMA” it runs together and sounds like Fannie Mae. Freddie Mac was a rejoinder to Fannie Mae.

The “civilian security corp” will be dressed in bright and light colors mostly pastels for parade purposes. But their work day uniforms will most assuredly be urban camo or black with a smiley face patch.

Jim

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:50 am 89. slade:

The next GSE domino to fall will be the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corp (PBGC) which insures defaulted pension plans primarily from the steel and airlines industries, and a few other unfortunates. They’re in trouble right now and it’s only going to get worse.

I’d say 3-5 years out.

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:55 am 90. JFSanders:

Can someone run the quote posted below through Lexis/Nexis. I have let my account lapse…:(
I am looking for the original source.

Obama said, quote: “We have got to have a civilian national security force that is just as powerful, just as strong, just as well funded as the military.”

Thanks

Jim

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:07 am 91. Doug:

We have got to have a civilian national security force that is just as powerful, just as strong, just as well funded as the military
—
Google is Free!
(until they control your life)

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:24 am 92. outa my league:

LL3 - excellent post.

“The Christian claim, however, is that with God’s help (and only with God’s help) we can break the cycle. It is the historical fact of “The One,” God’s gift to mankind, grace personified, that causes this break. But the irony is that from the outside, to the non-believer, this too looks like failure because the change is not external. It is a change of heart, an inner transformation that is hidden to all except for Him. And the payoff is not in this life, so it’s devilishly difficult to tell when it happens.”

I would only comment that:

Contrasting the character, personal history and achievements of Sarah and Obama, it appears axiomatic to me that the “payoff” begins in this life, although it is not completed until the afterlife. Also, as saith Paul, “godliness is profitable unto all things, having promise of the life that now is, and of that which is to come.” - 1 Tim.4:8

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:35 am 93. Revelations to John:

“And I looked, and behold a roaring snowmobile, and her name that sat on it was Palin, and Hell-to-Pay followed with her. And power was given unto her over the red states of the West and the South, and Ohio and Michigan, to injure the Messiah with irony, and with sarcasm, and with plain speaking like those of the red of neck who slay the beasts of the earth and mock the pharisees of Harvard and DC.”

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:38 am 94. M. Simon:

Wretchard,

McCain’s speech was the first shot in the War On the Culture of the Victim. You can read my take by clicking on my name and scrolling down to “The Sermon”.

Very perceptive of you to come to a similar conclusion.

Very few got that. Not even Bill Whittle.

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:41 am 95. programmer:

This is somewhat off topic (and no, I am not ALWAYS off topic, …Oh look there goes a rhinoceros!)

Oh, my point, yes, anyway…

I have a friend who was born to a wealthy educated family in China. Her father was a professor of some sort. She and her family were in China during the Red Guard era. Her family, because they were intellectuals and academics suffered. Her stories of her struggles to finally win through to the freedom of America are stirring. She is not a fan of the left, needless to say.

A quote from wikipedia:
********************
Mao met a million Red Guards formally in Tiananmen Square on August 18, 1966. Many people in realms of education, academic, media, literature and punishment were attacked and labeled by the Red Guards as “capitalist roaders” or “anti-revolutionaries”. The Red Guards ransacked museums and destroyed old books and works of art throughout China.
********************

I won’t take up bandwidth with similar wikipedia quotes about the Khmer Rouge (if not familiar with the KR, please google). But the strong underlying current of all these leftist movements is the destruction of academics, intellectuals and media. Our leftist academics and journalists need to spend some of their vaunted intellectual prowess perusing the history of these leftist movements. Of course, all true believers are strongly convinced that they, smart as they know they assuredly are, will be able to channel the destructive forces to punish only those deserving to be punished, i.e., those that they do not bow to superior progressive intellect. (Hmmm, are my prejudices showing?)

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:48 am 96. slade:

Of course, all true believers are strongly convinced that they, smart as they know they assuredly are, will be able to channel the destructive forces to punish only those deserving to be punished

Yep. Who polices the police? They seem to have trouble with that question.

Sep 6, 2008 - 9:07 am 97. Ricardo:

Obama’s change of heart came not out of some inner philosophical dialectic progression, but because he correctly perceived he failed at what he was trying to do; i.e., motivate people to change their own lives.
Instead of blaming himself, or those he was trying to help, he blames “the system”.
His prescription? Exhorting our youth to do more of what he failed at, and changing the system that works so well for so many others.

Sep 6, 2008 - 9:27 am 98. sirius_sir:

McCain’s speech was the first shot in the War On the Culture of the Victim.

M. Simon, I’ll suggest his selection of Sarah Palin was that, for though she was “punished” with a Down Syndrome child (”functionally disabled,” “developmentally challenged” or whatever the postmodern equivalent would have it) she refuses to see herself or any of her family as victim.

Sep 6, 2008 - 9:36 am 99. sirius_sir:

programmer, intellectuals (other than the grovelling chosen elite) were famously persecuted in the Soviet Union too. Solzhenitsyn recounts numerous examples of Stalin purging engineers for “wrecking” whenever anything went wrong, thereby depleting his society of its most able thinkers and workers.

I wonder at what point, if ever, it dawned on Stalin he was his and his Utopia’s own worst nightmare.

Sep 6, 2008 - 9:46 am 100. cjm:

obama’s new campaign slogan: return to year zer-O

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:14 am 101. Charles:

Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:31 am 102. Cannoneer No. 4:

Pakistan closes Torkham border crossing, shuts down NATO’s supply line

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:41 am 103. Leo Linbeck III:

oml -

Thx for the note. I don’t think I disagree with where you’re going WRT “early payoff,” but the use of the word “payoff” makes me nervous. Here’s why:

In every life, no matter how filled with suffering, there are moments of earthly joy. This was true for Job; it appears it was true in the Hanoi Hilton; and it will be true of Trig Palin. These moments remind us of the fact that we were created in the image and likeness of God, and therefore carry with us part of His essential goodness in spite of our fallen nature.

However, these momentary joys should not be mistaken for marks of salvation. As best as I can tell, earthly pleasure is completely uncorrelated with goodness of soul. (Think Scarface and shudddder.) And even if there might be a slight correlation, maybe r2=0.1, it’s not enough to be predictive. Doing good does not always bring pleasure. And what is pleasurable is not always good.

So, to think of these joys as rewards for our actions may be misleading, and lead us to believe that we are in control.

It seems to me that this idea that we can control events is really dangerous. If you believe we can control events, you seek the power to exercise that control, the power attracts those who tell you that you are “The One”, and before you’re done you no longer need God because He is dead. The very first sin was one of pride: “I would rather rule in Hell than serve in Heaven.”

Anyway, I like to think of these moments of joy not as rewards or payoffs for anything we’ve done, but the manna that He has sent from Heaven to sustain us on our journey to Him. The good news is that He sends them whether we deserve them or not. The bad news is that when He sends them, I may not deserve them, and when I deserve them they may be held back.

I realize this all makes it hard to determine if you’re a victim or just have bad luck. But that’s a feature, not a bug.

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:52 am 104. Dave:

Charles: Doug: others: Buddy seems to be AWOL. I’ll try to fill the gap.

Fannie Mae (FNMA) Federal National Mortage
Association. It was created back during the New Deal. Was a governmental agency. Its purpose was to buy mortages. Would only buy top-quality paper. Minimum of 20% equity in the house, buyer fully qualified etc. etc.

With Fannie Mae in place, banks and S&Ls could always find somebody to buy their mortages, thereby giving them additional cash with which to make additional onas. This was a key element in making long-term, fully-amortized and NON-CALLABLE loans available to the general public. Note the NON-CALLABLE.
Historically, banks could and did seize property even though payments were not in arrears. They would “call” the loan giving the borrower a whole 30 days to come up with the cash to pay everything off.

Fannie Mae did of course enjoy large cash flow
from low-risk purchases. So much so that she decided to do some direct lending of her own. Hardly sub-prime. Fannie would loan you $100G if you had $125G deposited elsewhere.

Fannie got real successful and decided to become a single mom. Her out-of-Wedlock son
was named Federal Reserve Mortage Acceptance
Corporation. Called Freddie Mac. Did the same thing. Bought mortages.

Sometime in the l970s, Fannie Mae became publicly traded but retained governmental authority. Freddie did something similar.

Along the way, the requirement for quality mortages and/or quality lending got lost.
Fannie and Freddie abandoned a balanced diet and gorged themselves on junk, junk and more junk.

So now they are about to take really big losses. So long as those losses do not create illiquidity in the banking system, not a major problem. BUT, FAnnie and Freddie have the legal authority to soak the taxpayer
to pay their debts.

In other words, we got us a gigantic case of corporate welfare to pay for.

Like the S&L crisis of the 1980s and early 90s, it will take some out-of-the-box thinking to solve the problem. Hang tight.

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:40 am 105. Doug:

Too Good, Revelations to John!

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:41 am 106. Doug:

Campaigns See a Wider Set of States in Play
With just over eight weeks left until Election Day, the two sides are settling into an unusually broad set of state-by-state face-offs.

McCain and Obama Plan Ground Zero Appearance

The Early Word: Understanding Palin 10:10 AM ET

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:54 am 107. ridgerunner:

Chrisa798,
I don’t buy the New England apologetics in the Forbes article. From their own figures, New England giving = .013 X .85 = 1.07% of average income. Southeastern/Gulf Coast giving = .022 X .65 = 1.43% of average income, and from a lower average income to boot. If you can’t admit that is greater generosity, then …. The Boston Foundation says one must adjust for the New Englanders having higher taxes, but they voted for the tax-and-spend legislators. In the South, the view has been that government charity is less effective, and Southerners follow through on this view by being more generous privately.

Tcobb,
I have no illusions about the Left. My point was that their concern for the underpriveledged is unconvincing to the extent that they are less generous in charitable giving than conservatives are, and therefore they approach your voyeuristic “altruism” type.

Sep 6, 2008 - 12:28 pm 108. slade:

Fannie and Freddie abandoned a balanced diet and gorged themselves on junk, junk and more junk. - Dave

Question: “my understanding” is that the quality of the loans was disguised, as well as the loans themselves, by being bundled as CDO’s. Nobody could evaluate the level of risk in the CDO vehicle so Fannie/Freddie et al can’t really be faulted for buying up the junk paper. The fault belongs with the entities that generated the bad mortgages which is another story.

Would you agree?

Sep 6, 2008 - 12:55 pm 109. Lifeofthemind:

@slade,
Your argument sounds like “Help me before I buy junk again.” What are the Managers and Board of Directors paid for? If anything of this level happened at a totally non-governmental firm like Bear Stearns then they would be out of business and people would be headed to jail.
/never mind

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:17 pm 110. Jay:

Wrong Slade. The false models behind the pricing of thos CDO’s plus the improperly designed insurance models are part of the problem but Fannie & Fred leveraged the junk to incredible levels while paying the bosses incredibly high salaries and benefits. They sold their stock to banks all over the world who expected the Treasury to bail them out if things went wrong.
It is a gigantic swindle that is bipartisan.
This bailout plus others down the pick expected no moral hazard hits will result in a US debt that will destroy our credit.
The slient partners in this swindle who only got academic cudos are the finance professors and the economists who confused models with reality. Lucas, Prescott, Merton, Engle should be forced to return their Nobel prize money to the Bank of Sweden, who then should admit that the Economics prize committee were idiots.

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:25 pm 111. slade:

No LOTM, it’s a technical issue that has to do with the way the securities are packaged in a CDO. The metrics not being adequate to describe the value/risk of the bundled product.

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:26 pm 112. Knight:

RWE 9/5/08 - 2:50 pm -

Yours was the single most impactful post I’ve read in years. My father was a POW of the Japanese.

Listening to John McCain speak of being broken still leaves me without words to describe the pain to hear his words and absorb what that meant then and now. My experience of men who are heroes is they never think they are and they rarely speak of it. John McCain had to bring it home to people who have never met one. You see and hear his discomfort with speaking of his experiences and as always how the genuine hero gives the credit to others.

I have printed out your post and thank you for it. God’s grace comes out in darkest times - the Vietnam POWs’ solution to healing one another is heartbreaking, humbling and loving. Thank you.

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:33 pm 113. John:

@Benj Re: “Race mattered here too and Judis misses that angle…”
Actually, Judis highlights race as the crux of Obama’s conversion — the debate over SON/SOC at the 1989 Illinois Issues seminar. In Judis’ telling, Obama’s recognition that Alinsky’s organizing principles were fully adaptable to apparently racist ends was “problematic,” to quote Obama.

Judis’ larger point is that during Obama’s actual CO experience in the 80’s — waved today by his supporters both as a precious badge of honor and as a model to be followed today — Obama’s “…assignment was to operate in the classic [Alinsky] style,” according to Kruglik. But having repudiated those principles and beliefs, Obama can no longer claim their radical credentials. It’s the price of apostasy — if you do not now believe in the father, son and holy ghost, it is empty to claim you should be treated seriously as a christian, on the grounds you once held those mistaken beliefs. It’s right up there with parricides pleading mercy as orphans.

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:38 pm 114. JFSanders:

Thanks Doug. When I ran it through Google I kept the quotation marks. It only brought up a few hits. And not the original speech. Thanks again.

Volokh is of the opinion that we are whistling past the graveyard on this statement. Although he does look askance at the need for a civilian org. to have the same strength levels as the military.

Jim

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:40 pm 115. slade:

Not to hijack the rhinoceros, but the CDO concept was developed by (convicted) Michael Milken of (now-defunct) Drexel Burnham Lambert. After the securities scandal, the vehicle lay dormant until picked up by the mortgage industry around 1999/2000. I’ll let the economists pick it up from there.

Sep 6, 2008 - 2:43 pm 116. Lifeofthemind:

@slade,
I know that there are problems in how the metrics describe the contents of the CDO. That does not suffice to explain why you are absolving the responsible parties. It is a question of who owns the problem? I do not think that the models are worthless. To me they assist but do not substitute for traditional management practices. A reasonable person should have been able to look at the risks involved and suggested a corporate structure that would better insulate the larger economy from a regional failure. To me the best answer sounds like breaking these firms each into 12 smaller units. Size is not a pure good.

Sep 6, 2008 - 3:05 pm 117. slade:

LOTM: I’m not absolving anybody of anything but The Blame Game is seductive is it not. Let the economists weigh in on this one. CSPAN aired an interview with a journalist who looked into the subject; took more than a few calls from some articulate folks who objected to placing the blame on Fannie/Freddie for exactly the reason I stated. The CDO package - courtesy of Mikey Milken - is flawed.

Sep 6, 2008 - 3:25 pm 118. Teresita:

First it was Barack’s destitute brother who needs a home, now it’s Old Glory.

McCain supporters, claiming they rescued 12,000 miniature American flags from the site of Barack Obama’s nomination acceptance speech last Thursday, redistributed the orphan flags to audience members ahead of a McCain rally in Colorado Springs on Saturday.

McCain supporters said the flags were discovered by a vendor at Denver’s Invesco Field after the conclusion of the Democratic National Convention. The vendor supposedly found trash bags full of flags in and near garbage bins, and turned them over to the McCain campaign.

Sep 6, 2008 - 3:42 pm 119. Pursuit of Justice:

Has Obama ever slammed doors on anyone? McCain and Palin have a record of doing so, whenever one of the regular people they are supposed to identify with, gets sufficiently uppity to speak to them outside of a photo op.

I SEE ELITISTS.

Sep 6, 2008 - 3:58 pm 120. Lifeofthemind:

Wonder if there is a Rent-a-Troll agency? Are the same clowns that were posting Putin’s talking points a couple of weeks ago now spouting for Obama? Maybe it is like a phone sex operation on TV. Rows of old ladies typing away on screens for minimum wage with scripts and cigarettes next to them.

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:06 pm 121. Pursuit of Justice:

Lifeofthemind:

There are link pages to instances of McCain and Palin intemperance. I could post them if you don’t mind being proven wrong.

Who’s pro Russia? Bush tried to build 2 military runways in Georgia. Another failure. And why did he need to do that? Because al-Maliki is dictating surrender in the SOFA process. Russia and Iran should pay for McCain’s candidacy; they are already bearing fruits from same.

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:12 pm 122. NahnCee:

Teresita - did you see the update response from the Dem’s? That the Republicans had “wrongly taken” the flags? Dem’s are not claiming that they weren’t being thrown out, but maybe it’s the same thing as it being illegal for bums to rifle trashcans looking for bottles.

“Wrongly took” — you just KNOW a lawyer wrote that.

And we’re supposed to admire and respect this bunch of yahoo’s.

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:15 pm 123. cjm:

obama: those aren’t my flags, they belong to bill ayers.

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:33 pm 124. Triton'sPolarTiger:

“I have no illusions about the Left. My point was that their concern for the underpriveledged is unconvincing to the extent that they are less generous in charitable giving than conservatives are, and therefore they approach your voyeuristic “altruism” type.”

What gripes me is that the leftist is charitable… with other peoples money. Long ago I stopped figuring out what percentage of my tax money went to fund welfare brood mares, etc… too depressing - maddening even.

It’s NOT charity when what’s given doesn’t belong to the giver in the first place… IT’S THEFT.

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:48 pm 125. NahnCee:

THis is also the same bunch of convention planners who swept into town demanding that only foods of a certain color be served in order to be ecologically friendly.

I guess red, white and blue aren’t colors that the Dem’s feel particularly friendly towards.

Sep 6, 2008 - 4:55 pm 126. cjm:

they like red pretty well

Sep 6, 2008 - 5:04 pm 127. MarkJ:

Triton’s Polar Tiger,

Obama, on the stump, seems to be constantly tipping his head back ever so slightly - it reminds me a bit of the Nellie Olson character in the “Little House on the Prairie” series… overblown schoolgirl “I’m better than all of you” pride.

Funny thing, I’ve noticed that too. It looks eerily like this….

http://home.btconnect.com/theatrotechnics/images/mussolini.jpg

“Il Duce” cocked his head back to give him the appearance of looking taller and provide a more aggressive look. I’ll leave it to others to explain to why Obama does the same thing.

Sep 6, 2008 - 5:37 pm 128. 2x4:

Lifeofthemind: Wonder if there is a Rent-a-Troll agency?

Not yet, but I am sure someone would take it up. Great biz potential! The agency can rent-a-troll to anyone, even to the opposite sides of some dispute paradigm. Probably not as profitable as selling armaments, but with low overhead cost.

But in this case, it’s all Obots. That is, troll army paid direct from DNC as “staffers”. They don’t need that many, it’s mostly copy and paste anyway, maybe about 50, about half for quickies and the other half for posting on sites where some degree of thought (contextual replies) is required.
DNC got an inspiration from Pootybots, though.

Sep 6, 2008 - 5:37 pm 129. Doug:

WAY ot, but of interest, I’m sure:

Aspergersgentleman:
From AudioFile
Although Daniel Tammet is only 27, as an autistic savant with Asperger’s syndrome, he has already lived an unusual life. Strict routines are necessaryâ the same number of flakes of porridge for breakfast and cups of tea at exactly the same time each day.

He can recite pi to 22,514 places from memory, and he learned Icelandic in a week. He experiences synesthesia, which makes him see numbers and letters as shapes and colors and emotions. (He was born on a Wednesday, which is a blue day.) Simon Vance enhances this memoir with a sensitive performance. He affects an almost imperceptible awkwardness of speech to capture the spirit of Tammet as an extraordinary and successful individual. A.B. © AudioFile 2007, Portland, Maine– Copyright © AudioFile, Portland, Maine –This text refers to the Audio CD edition.

Tammet traces his life from a frustrating, withdrawn childhood and adolescence to his adult achievements, which include teaching in Lithuania, achieving financial independence with an educational Web site and sustaining a long-term romantic relationship. As one of only about 50 people living today with synesthesia and autism, Tammet’s condition is intriguing to researchers; his ability to express himself clearly and with a surprisingly engaging tone (given his symptoms) makes for an account that will intrigue others as well.
—
—
AspergersGentleman
It is with great sadness that I announce the passing of Buddy Larsen, an American Internet Icon.

In an age of crotch-shots and snuff films, Buddy Larsen needed no frontal nudity nor shaky-cam beheadings to spread his informational self, like a bat out of Aristides loquacious hell.

He could pontificate with the pontiffs and jive with the jive turkeys; he was many things to many men. There was refinement and gravitas in his poetic waxing about the finer points of chaw and he would never begrudge a man who was too poor to afford an effete spittoon. He could speak of monetary policy and romance, of patriotism and showtunes. If he was a robot, he would pass the Turing Test in the most delightful colors!

God, welcome Buddy Larsen into heaven, and let his energy recouple into the Internet through divine bandwidth, unbeholden to physical constants.

Sep 6, 2008 - 5:39 pm 130. Jack Okie:

cjm:

Yeah, I thought the red stars circling the Denver convention center added a nice touch.

Sep 6, 2008 - 5:44 pm 131. NahnCee:

So … I’m confused. Did Buddy die?

Sep 6, 2008 - 6:27 pm 132. bobal:

That’s what we want to know. Can’t figure it out, so Doug put it, hoping Buddy would see it.

Sep 6, 2008 - 6:32 pm 133. Doug:

That was an Asperger’s post from long ago.

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:07 pm 134. Storm-Rider:

Peter Boston: “Obama’s victory was more than a progressive move,” Chapman wrote. “It was a dialectical leap ushering in a new era of struggle. Marx once compared (the) revolutionary new era of struggle with the work of the mole, who sometimes burrows so far beneath the ground that he leaves no trace of his movement on the surface.”

“The method of engaging in trifles at public meetings and doing real business on the quiet justified itself brilliantly.” Friedrich Engels

“I declared to them point-blank: we have received our mandate as the representatives of the proletarian party from no one but ourselves.” Karl Marx

“The proletariat will use its political supremacy to wrest, by degree, all capital from the bourgeoisie, to centralize all instruments of production in the hands of the state… Of course, in the beginning, this cannot be effected except by means of despotic inroads on the rights of property” Karl Marx

“The Communists disdain to conceal their views and aims. They openly declare that their ends can be attained only by the forcible overthrow of all existing social conditions. Let the ruling classes tremble at a communist revolution. The proletarians have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win.” Karl Marx

“The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.” Karl Marx

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:19 pm 135. Peter Boston:

“The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.” Karl Marx

That is the money quote, no?

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:50 pm 136. Storm-Rider:

The meaning of “peace” in Marxist/Socialism, i.e.: Communism is peace under tyranny - same thing goes for every totalitarian system of government including Fascism, Nazism and Totalitarian Islamic Sharia.

Peace under tyranny is an oxymoron - there is no peace under tyranny. Tyrants are by definition at war with human liberty and all people who seek liberty.

Our founding fathers understood in the most intimate way that there is no such thing as peace under tyranny - there is only peace under liberty - and there is only war under tyranny.

“Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!” Patrick Henry

Sep 6, 2008 - 7:59 pm 137. Teresita:

“The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.” Karl Marx

That is the money quote, no?

Sounds like a Sura in the Koran, if you substitute “Allah” for socialism.

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:09 pm 138. cjm:

islam is dying. in 50 years it will be a niche religion. it’s big on easter island though (with seagulls)

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:25 pm 139. Storm-Rider:

Give me liberty or give me war.

Sep 6, 2008 - 8:26 pm 140. Benj:

John - my (parenthetical) comment re Judis and race didn’t refer to O’s crit of Alinksy’s model of community organizing though thanks for pointing to O’s position on that front (which seems to me to be right on). I was thinking of O’s clarity in “Dreams” re the limits of his mentor’s economist understanding of power & oppression. O was a little more alive (for obvious reasons) than K about how/why race matters in America. In the past I posted one key passage in “Dreams” where O takes a black woman who’d taken to wearing blue contact lens to see “For Colored Girls…” - In his telling, the experience of seeing that play was a transformative one for the woman in question. It was certainly comparable to another big moment (he describes earlier) when a church women overcomes a history of passivity to talk back to a lying bureaucrat. O was aware the first moment didn’t quite fit into his mentor’s “community organizing” template. While he clearly came to comprehend the limits of that template, he doesn’t spell them out in “Dreams.” The book is not a disquistion on theories of organzing. And let me underscore that Alinsky and/or his heirs don’t have the final Word on that front. My brother has done such work for close to 30 years. He’s never read Alinsky and has only the vaguest notion about what the IAF is. To come back to your metaphor, there’s no Church here. Cept perhaps for the organizing tradition established by SNCC. It was the example of (what Halberstam calls) “The Children” that moved Obama to want to become an organizer in the first place. And when he decided to enter politics, he wasn’t breaking a faith with his orginal heroes. He was returning to the model of the Civil Rights Movement (and Dr. King)…

Nahncee - my guess is that YOU as well as me might have s bit more standing than Wretch when it comes to commenting on American elections. As per Johnny Mac, we’re American citizens. Wretch is a citizen…of the world.

Noticed that Wretch re-upped on the Muggeridge passage condemning fellow travelers (which PEter had introduced earlier in the thread) and then added a (wannabe) inspirational coda - “But not us. And not today. Not this day.” Though Wretch leaves things suggestively vague (sorta like Mac’s Mark Salter “Fight” song at the end of the acceptance speech), I’ll assume he believes that he (and the bulk of his Club) are resisting today’s moral equivalent of yesterday’s fellow travelers. And given that Obama is the subject of his post, my guess is that Wretch is implicitly accusing O of being a closet Totalitarian…

This is, in fact, a foul slur. Obama has publicly cited Solzhenitsyn as one of a dozen or so writers who have had the most influence on his world-view. He has NO history of ever making excuses for totalitarian states, no history of yearning for the Golden Days before Wall came down, not even a history of Third Worldism - he recently went out of his way (in his patriotism speech) to condemn Mugabe ..For ML King man and a fan of FDR, O is actually pretty conservative when it comes to political economy - He’s something of a Hamiltonian (see his Cooper Union on the Mortgage crisis last spring) but he’s no totalitarian.

There is, though, one candidate who has a documented history of censoriousness within the public square. When she was mayor, Ms. Palin had a widely reported run-in with her town’s librarian when she tried to pressure the lady over how/what materials would be available at that local institution. Her efforts on this front were rebuffed - thanks to the efforts of 100 or so folks who organized to defend the library and the librarian. Bad feelings over the incident have lingered.

Any conservative who cares about free speech should be daunted by Ms. Palin’s record. But. Let me be clear. I don’t believe her election would be a clear and present threat to my civil liberties. Mac’s decision to go for Palin was a deeply cynical act. But probably not THAT dangerous to the Republic. Tempted to wail on folks who pump up fears about my guy, but it’s important to keep cool, especially when others persist in losing theirs…

Sep 6, 2008 - 9:18 pm 141. Peterike:

Benj, I suggest you take a gander at these editorials, for starters, to locate O’s totalitarian tendencies.

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/series8.aspx

Of course, you may feel there is such a thing as Socialism with a velvet glove, which is to say a non-totalitarian way of implementing it. I don’t agree, but it’s not an argument I can be bothered to have right now.

Oh, and the librarian thing with Palin is a smear and a distortion, certainly the way you tell it. Though I had to laugh when you said she was “probably not THAT dangerous to the Republic.”

Your schoolgirl crush on Obama is affecting your unsane brain.

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:06 pm 142. buddy larsen:

ha hah –thanks for the obits –naw, some of us have hurricanes to board relatives on the run from –AND some of us became a grandpappy for da foist time at 6:45 PM, when eldest daughter & hub finally dominoed. Cute little feller –looks kinda like Winston Churchill.

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:36 pm 143. Doug:

Congrats, Gramps!
Aspers’s is amazing isn’t he?

Sep 6, 2008 - 10:54 pm 144. buddy larsen:

Thankee kindly –have a cigar on me –uh, somehow. Yep Asperg’s got torque alright –great obit –i like ta died laughin’!

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:03 pm 145. Doug:

Did everyone see Cannoneer’s Pakistan link?
Holy C…!

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:09 pm 146. Bob Murphy:

@Benj
“Nahncee - my guess is that YOU as well as me might have s bit more standing than Wretch when it comes to commenting on American elections. As per Johnny Mac, we’re American citizens. Wretch is a citizen…of the world.”

Nice try.

You are an impertinent, pretentious and gratuitously verbose pimp on a mission, Benj.

Given the political line and worldview you have been flogging here for weeks, it is you who have no standing in logic or reason to comment on the American election. Wretch has demonstrated a strong commitment to reason on a hugely diverse range of issues for at least the year I have been reading the Belmont Club. He may or may not be an American citizen but that is simply not relevant when it comes to venturing incisive comment.
And you are one eyed about a presidential candidate who lives in a narcissistic, elitist mental projection that has little to do with the real world.
And even less to do with a nation built on the finest anti-authoritarian basis in history (the Constitution).
Obama lives in the plastic world of chatter mind and you tend to inhabit the that world as well.
It’s a bit rich that a person with your anti-American mindset would would don the cloak of citizenship to denigrate the relevance of the kind of comments and analysis Wretch comes up with which are far more in tune with traditional US views than yours.
And once again you did not source or otherwise substantiate your slurs on Sarah Palin.
On the basis of what you have contributed to this site to date you seem to be a silly little pissant and a gratuitously loquacious one to boot.
You are a bothersome twit.

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:13 pm 147. Dave:

Grandpa Buddy: Looks like you are in for some blood, toil, tears and sweat.

Scroll back up and you will see where I tried to fill in for you with a dissertation on
FNMA and FRDMAC.

And if Slade and LifeoftheMind are still reading: I am sure that some of the CDOs were knowingly fraudulent and went undetected.
I am equally sure that some Fannie and Freddie executives knowingly turned a blind eye to what they were buying in other cases.
Some of the sellers sold willingly, in other cases I get the impression that FAnnie and Freddie twisted arms to buy at a discount so they could re-sell at a premium. In cases like this the full panoply of human actions can be seen. The good, the bad and the indifferent.

As far as CDOs go, I prefer the kind of CDO that “Ginnie Mae” used to peddle and maybe still does. The “bonds” are directly serviced
by the mortages, thereby diffusing risk. And each certificate can be rated by what percentage of the principal is of what quality.

I just gotta relay to you all how P> J> O’Rourke defined bond ratings.

D-rated bond: Like money lent to a younger brother.

AAA-rated bond: Money lent to a younger brother by the Gambino family.

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:14 pm 148. 2164th:

Buddy, next time you are going to die, give us a signal.

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:21 pm 149. Gary Rosen:

Congratulations, Buddy!

Sep 6, 2008 - 11:52 pm 150. Benj:

What do you drink Bud? I’ll tip my next Bass Ale to you!!

Murph the Surf - “Pissant…Twit…Pimp…” - All Good. But “gratuitously verbose”? You don’t know what verbose means - Not sure you should look the word up in the dictionary, though. You might find your picture there…

Sep 7, 2008 - 1:16 am 151. ridgerunner:

Bob Murphy,
My sentiments exactly. Additionally, why would anyone wish to engage a poster who bobs and weaves his way out of every rhetorical or factual difficulty.

Sep 7, 2008 - 2:42 am 152. Doug:

What “Gramps” Larsen was really up to.
ht - Desert Rat

Sep 7, 2008 - 4:18 am 153. Storm-Rider:

Benj said: “Ms. Palin had a widely reported run-in with her town’s librarian when she tried to pressure the lady over how/what materials would be available at that local institution.”

Sarah Palin did not try to ban or burn any books. All libraries select books from the millions of available books. Sarah Palin wished to de-select some books that were selected by the librarian, but she did not try to have any books burned or pressure publishers not to publish - that would be the mark of a true book-banner. No doubt Sarah Palin would select some books that the librarian in question wouldn’t select, so by the same token, doesn’t that make the librarian a book banner by this same faulty reasoning?

Without the use of reason we will sink into despotism by slow decrements. “World Socialists” i.e.: Democrats like Benj, are counting on liberty-loving Americans to be stupid; not to think; to be sheep.

Sep 7, 2008 - 5:27 am 154. Doug:

Librarians,
How did they become so radical?
Answer:
They went to college.

- He Went To Paris -

Sep 7, 2008 - 6:36 am 155. John:

@Benj
I intended suggest that Alinsky-style CO circa 1980s consitutes a belief system (I apologize if the belief system I chose to illiustrate the analogy was a distraction). Belief systems are closed explanatory systems, and one can no longer claim belief after arbitrarily opting out of components of the system.
For the record, it’s perfectly possible for a belief system to be a true representation of reality.

Sep 7, 2008 - 7:46 am 156. slade:

Appreciate the feedback Dave. If I can “hijack the rhino” briefly (programmer invented a new urban cliche!), the transparency of the securities is critical to adjudicating justice, as in enforcing penalties, and implementing resolution, as in restructuring of the institutional ownership.

My reading is that these securities were flying around the globe and none of the holders were aware of how much “bad paper” they owned. One of the reasons/excuses during the early days of the “sub-prime” story for being unable to value the extent of the problem was not knowing where it was at any given day; hence the slow exposure of the foreign impact. The short story being that the bad mortgage paper was traveling incognito through the CDO vehicle and probably a few other tricks I am not fully apprised of.

In my view, the Gambino family and human nature are never to be discounted - at any rate - but, in this case, they’re facilitators, not root causes. The problem began with the new lending institutions that generated mortgages in the complete and in many cases criminal absence of proper asset confirmation procedures that are standard in the mortgage industry.

Furthermore, it is my understanding, that these “new lending institutions” came about as a result of removing the long-standing (70 yrs?) “Chinese Wall” (Glass-Steagall) between investment banking and commercial banking. These are the culprits.

Fannie/Freddie not so much. But now comes a perfect opportunity to take them out.

That last sentence being pure speculation, of course, in keeping with the spirit of the subject.

This risk started in one place. The civil/criminal penalties won’t be able to find their way back that far.

Sep 7, 2008 - 8:24 am 157. trangbang68:

Essay on Real Clear Politics where the sainted Barney Frank (Didn’t he play Jim on “Father Knows Best”?} is commenting on the politicization of family values.
It must be part of a series where Pol Pot will will opine on peaceful transition to civilian government; Madonna will celebrate aging with modest demeanor and Keith Oberman will advocate for calm, reason political commentary.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:07 am 158. Fat Man:

Reading the TNR article, which I thought was good, brought to mind what killed Alinskyite organizing.

In a parenthetical, Judis wrote: “Indeed, Alinsky’s first group, the Back of the Yards Neighborhood Council, had become a bastion of support for segregationist George Wallace in the 1960s.”

This lead everyone in Chicago in that era to understand that Alinsky did not have all of the answers.

In a certain sense, the entire history of leftism is an attempt to find the path to true socialism. Marx proposed that his science of history showed that capitalism would collapse and that the proletariat, organized by their experience of working in the capitalist’s manufactories, would then seize power and create communism. By the end of the 19th century it was clear that was not going to happen. Sorrel advanced the idea of syndicalism and the general strike to replace it. His disciples such as Mussolini and Lenin, based their systems on his theories, but things quickly got ugly.

In the US, Alinsky hoped to use community organization to build the infra-structure for socialism. That became untenable when Back of the Yards turned out to be “objectively reactionary” The bloom really came off the rose for BHO in the 80’s:

“Joravsky kicked off the discussion by recounting Alinsky’s core principles. Green then brought up a controversial organization, Save our Neighborhoods/Save our City (SON/SOC), that had launched in February 1984 in response to fears that Harold Washington would promote public housing in certain white neighborhoods–leading to an influx of black residents. As Green noted, SON/SOC was organized by Alinsky disciples who were following their mentor’s principle of basing demands on self-interest.”

Obama drew the correct conclusion. Alinskyism was unworkable and would not create socialism. He then followed the same path (although I have no idea how much history he knows) as Mussolini and Lenin. He set out to use the leadership principle (Fuhrerprinzip) to create socialism. He had determined to become the ONE.

Folks: we have got to stop him.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:10 am 159. NahnCee:

Bob Murphy - wow. Way-good rant. Lotsa quarter-words and not too long. I like it.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:24 am 160. Peterike:

Libertarian party candidate willing to lay a million bucks that his Columbia GPA was higher than Barack “I won’t release my transcripts” Obama’s. He was a classmate of The O and claims he never saw him at school, and doesn’t know anyone who ever knew him.

Funny story, goes on too long.

http://www.reason.com/news/show/128461.html

And whattya know, he’s another person who sees right through the Big O.

“A vote for Obama is four years of Karl Marx, and no one should be happy about that,” he told us and a few genial young libertarian activists over cocktails. “He’s a communist! I don’t care what anybody says. The guy’s a communist…. And his mother was a card-carrying communist, and he says she’s the most important person in his entire life; he learned everything from her.”

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:25 am 161. Dave:

Slade: We gotta give the poor old rhinoceros a rest pretty soon.

In the very near past we had Enron. How many analysts bought into earnings scenarios that would have meant that company owning 864%
of Gross World Product?

Why did they do that? Were there that many crooks around? No, the real culprit was and is wishful thinking.

Baack in 1929 10% margin and creative accounting in the Special Miscellaneous Account led to the big crash. Again, wishful thinking caused otherwise normal people to lose sight of reality.

All of which is the downside of an otherwise healthy survival instinct. Go for the gold!
The gold rush, the oil rush, the cyber rush
and many more reflect proper instincts. The casualties represent inevitable lack of thoroughness.

We shall muddle our way through this one, never fear.

Gotta work. See ya later.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:31 am 162. slade:

Nothing like a good workout to keep the weight problem under control, Dave. But I concede half a point on topicality (highly over-rated by the way, but defer to the group).

Enron was different because they had the regulators on board - Arthur Anderson accounting firm. Scandalous in the extreme. That’s not the case with housing.

But I see see the point - the Big Rush comes in many flavors, like a DQ Blizzard. On this one, I’m seeing failures in the private sector but the fix is being applied to the (semi) public GSE’s. It’s OK.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:44 am 163. Benj:

Benj said: “Ms. Palin had a widely reported run-in with her town’s librarian when she tried to pressure the lady over how/what materials would be available at that local institution.”

Storm said: “Sarah Palin wished to de-select some books that were selected by the librarian, but she did not try to have any books burned or pressure publishers not to publish - that would be the mark of a true book-banner.”

Storm - Glad you’re feeling easy because P is not a “true bookburner,” just a “de-selecter.” But - just so we’re all clear - I didn’t claim she was book-burner and went out of my way in my post to allow that I didn’t regard her candidacy as a threat to my civil liberties (though I tend to be beamish about America as you know). But your post just underscored her censorious side. Do YOU feel comfortable with the idea of mayor who puts pressure on the local librarian - whom no-one claims was incompetent - to “de-select” vids/books/cds?

The candidate whom Clubbers repeatedly accuse of incipient totalitarianism is, in fact, an embodiment of liberal-mindedness in the public square. The one who makes so many Clubbers hearts rise is proudly provincial.

Storm - You say I’m “counting on liberty-loving Americans to be stupid; not to think; to be sheep.”

Hmmm - a couple days ago and a few threads back back we had a half-dozen respectful back and forths ranging over the subjects of federalism, the legacy of Southern New Dealers and the meaning of Monticello…A Clubber looking on suggested the flow of comments was a “keeper,” though he was on your side of the argument. As the girl once sang - “Don’t make me over…”

See - this is exactly why we NEED Obama. He believes political discourse should amount to more than casting aspersions on calling your opponent a “pissant” (or a “bookburner”). If he makes it - his presence might even elevate the tone here at the Club.

Sep 7, 2008 - 10:26 am 164. Benj:

John - The IAF has a template - spose you could call it “a belief system” - and Obama certainly learned practical organizing technigues from Mr. K. If you take a look at “Dreams,” though, you’ll see how he underscores his distance from his mentor almost immediately. My memory is that when O indulges in “faith” talk about the American organizing tradition, it always re the Civil Rights Movement…

Sep 7, 2008 - 10:36 am 165. buddy larsen:

I hope hope hope that this new rising Palin-populism will connect to Fannie & Freddie. Please search [ fannie freddie scandal ] and just take a look at all that has transpired under the popular radar. Look at ”wall” person & 911 commish jamie Gorelick re F & F. Look at the $20mm severance packages that’ve accompanied the departures of the last few scandal-fired big chiefs.

Heck, just read this from September 2004. That’s 2004, boys & girls. Now four years later we’re getting blindsided by a “financial accident”? I ain’t lecturing –i ignored all this too –figuring somebody somewhere MUST be paying attention & will surely do the right thing, y’know, in time.

“Fractional banking” is a great engine of growth but it depends on something fundamental that has somehow gone missing. The folk know it, too –look at 14% congressional approval polls. Enter Sarah Palin (today’s polls are showing the front edge of what may a breakout for McCain/Palin).

I think the press had us focused on Martha Stewart when the WaPo tried to ring the F&F alarm bell. You, know, Martha the arch criminal. Feh.

Benj, kudos your dedication to the communicating of the “meaning” of Obama. You’re on to something re populist revoulution –looks like it’s building on the right, tho. C’mon over, man. We’ll covert Obama soon enough –and he’ll be a force, just as you say. But let’s get him turned around facing in the right direction first. I mean, jeez, man, how much proof do you need that Big Government by its very nature will always be a bigger problem that any problem it can solve.

Sep 7, 2008 - 11:51 am 166. slade:

Populism or something else?

Every time I turn around, I am hearing Smart Growth, Smart Planning, Smart Thinking, Smart Solutions, Smart Design, Smart Ecology …

Culminating in [hat/tip Bobal] Smart Intelligence.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:02 pm 167. slade:

To just footnote accounting practices, none of the federal government books are maintained according to GAAP. This is a “mechanical” problem that should be fixable without falling into the black hole of ideology or religion.

Fannie/Freddie, soon to be followed by the PBGC, just the leading edge of the government accounting wave.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:09 pm 168. slade:

Fannie failed to follow the rules in accounting for complex financial instruments known as derivatives, which the company uses to hedge against movements in interest rates. Much of rival Freddie Mac’s accounting problems involved accounting for derivatives.

The derivatives market being huge and totally out of control, not just in the housing industry but throughout the financial markets. No lesson learned from LTCM. (I mentioned the derivatives market earlier in connection with CDO’s and was corrected by commenter who noted they were different vehicles.)

Before I get banned or chided, these new financial vehicles came from where and have been allowed to run without a leash because of what?

Vehicles that add no value to a commodity or grow a business.

And yet we are told that markets are the “engines of wealth creation”.

They used to be - in the industrial and manufacturing setting. But in 2008 the real money is in currency and speculation - paper profit, not growth.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:19 pm 169. slade:

Vehicles that add no value to a *product* - I meant to write.

Commodities are different.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:21 pm 170. slade:

Yep. The complicity angle better defined. No angels in that outfield. A DQ Blizzard waiting to melt. AGW all right.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:30 pm 171. slade:

Which means my prediction of PBGC failure about 3-5 years out about right.

Wait for a few more airlines to fail.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:32 pm 172. weSwinger:

“Children’s children are the crown of old men; and the glory of children are their fathers.” Proverbs 17:6

Congratulations, Buddy.

Sep 7, 2008 - 12:53 pm 173. Storm-Rider:

Benj,
OK, I’ll concede the point; you didn’t call Sara Palin a book-banner or book-burner. I was sensitive to your post because of all the other leftist bloggers who are making the false claim; so, on this point I apologize for offending you wrongly.

“But your post just underscored her censorious side. Do YOU feel comfortable with the idea of mayor who puts pressure on the local librarian - whom no-one claims was incompetent - to “de-select” vids/books/cds?”

Benj, since public libraries are, well, public; i.e.: for the people at large in the community, it is ultimately up to the majority of those people to decide which books are selected and which are de-selected. There is nothing wrong with Sara Palin trying to de-select books if she believes they are objectionable to the majority in her town - that is not “censorious side.” If the majority in the town want those books to stay, so be it; if the majority wish them to go, so be it - any books de-selected can still be purchased because those books are still in publication. If a librarian goes against the will of the people, then the Mayor has a right to replace him or her. Remember what President Lincoln said; we are supposed to have government of the people, by the people and for the people.

“Bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will, to be rightful, must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal laws must protect, and to violate would be oppression.” Thomas Jefferson

“The issue today is the same as it has been throughout all history, whether man shall be allowed to govern himself or be ruled by a small elite.” Thomas Jefferson

Overall, Benj, your points are well taken - and I’m trying to be descent and reasonable as well.

Sep 7, 2008 - 1:43 pm 174. Doug:

Larsen brings up Jamie the Wall Gorelick.
Wherever she went, corruption was sure to follow.
Slade blames “deregulation.”
But some is the direct result of additional regulation in combination with human corruption.

Sep 7, 2008 - 1:49 pm 175. Tamquam Leo Rugiens:

Sylwester: “Although a movement as a whole might be characterized correctly as immoral and deceitful, the movement nevertheless probably still contains within its members much motivation that is moral and sincere.”

Evil knows itself, and knows that it is unendurable. That is why when we, that’s you and I, do evil, be it large or small, we seek to justify it. We concoct rationalizations to hide the nature of what we have done from ourselves, and, when challenged, from others. So it is with movements and ideologies. Were the bare, naked truth of them believably opened to the view of the world they would be scorned or ridiculed at best and the worst of them would be instantly destroyed.
Here on this terrestrial sphere humans are the admixture of the Divine Spark and of the basest clay. All have sinned, says St. Paul, all fall short of the Glory of God Whose Image vivifies us and informs us. It is a common tactic of evil to use this fact as a justification to minimize it’s perceived wickedness in it’s critics. Hitler, after all, loved dogs and children, how bad could he have really been? I remember Pol Pot being depicted as a poor, misunderstood victim, an old man whose dreams had died. He was allowed to live out the rest of his life in peace. His victims are dead anyhow, so what difference does it make?
If these examples do not make your guts coil you are morally dead and not to be trusted. There are many such, and more are made daily.
Pilate asked, “What it truth,” and showed that the use of carefully laundered narratives as facades for hidden lies and uncomfortable facts is as old as man himself. And it is universally part of our fallen nature, as any of us can remember not the first time pointed the finger and said “It wasn’t me, Mama.”
Exculpation is even cheaper than grace.
Yes, be sure that there are glimmers of goodness in the most wicked individuals and in the most depraved ideologies, just as there are similar shadows in all the best. What of it? Shall I pity Pol Pot and rage against George Bush? I think not. The reason for that is not because I am a fervid partisan of Bush’s, but because I am partisan of Truth. All is not relative. There are higher principles and reliable guidelines for knowing, understanding and living well and honorably in an piebald world. It should be remembered that there is a Heaven and a Hell; people choose which road they will travel. Heaven is populated with the imperfect of this world, and Hell with lots of nice folks with good intentions.

Sep 7, 2008 - 2:13 pm 176. Storm-Rider:

Barak Hussein Obama: “You’re absolutely right that John McCain has not talked about my Muslim faith.”

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2008/09/spreading_the_smear_that_obama.html

Dr. Freud was unavailable for comment.

Sep 7, 2008 - 2:19 pm 177. slade:

I’m also suggesting the bigger picture - (1) the derivatives market, as in LTCM, another (private) bailout, looking for home, any home (while Paulsen is rhetorically grandstanding on the Freddie/Fannie platform Robert Rubin has his eyes on the derivatives market - well fine for both of them) and (2) lack of GAAP accounting in government - it’s all a bad mess mess for a Jamie Gorelick to happen.

But you get points for keeping it civil.

Sep 7, 2008 - 2:39 pm 178. slade:

Deregulation destabilized entire industries - from airlines to utilities. Upon bankruptcy, the industries with defined benefits pension plans defaulted to the PBGC. There is a link between deregulation and GSE failures.

It may (or may not) work out in the long-term, but it serves no purposes to be coy about the short-term relationships.

Sep 7, 2008 - 3:04 pm 179. Peterike:

Benj protesteth too much, I think. Or maybe he loses track of his own rhetoric.

Benj backpeddles thusly:

But - just so we’re all clear - I didn’t claim she was book-burner and went out of my way in my post to allow that I didn’t regard her candidacy as a threat to my civil liberties.

Didn’t claim she was a bookburner? Didn’t regard her as a threat? Let’s roll the videotape of the original comments….

There is, though, one candidate who has a documented history of censoriousness within the public square.

A “documented history.” That seems to leave little wiggle room.

When she was mayor, Ms. Palin had a widely reported run-in with her town’s librarian when she tried to pressure the lady over how/what materials would be available at that local institution.

Hmmmm…. “Tried to pressure the lady over…what materials would be available.” Like what? Cups at the water fountain? The brand of toilet tissue in the loo? Seems to me Benj is saying — in a very Clintonesque, non-legally binding way — that Palin wanted to block books.

Her efforts on this front were rebuffed - thanks to the efforts of 100 or so folks who organized to defend the library and the librarian. Bad feelings over the incident have lingered.

Ahh, so she WANTED to be a book burner, but she was a REBUFFED book burner. Benj slices his pies thinly.

Any conservative who cares about free speech should be daunted by Ms. Palin’s record.

Cat, kindly leave the bag. “Cares about free speech”? Why would we care other than, as is implied, speech is threatened? “Daunted by Ms. Palin’s record”? Daunted? Over books that were never banned? Or is Benj trying to suggest those books were burnt in Palin’s heart, and were it not for the brave townsfolk coming to her castle with torches and pitchforks, the books would today be ashes?

But. Let me be clear. I don’t believe her election would be a clear and present threat to my civil liberties. Mac’s decision to go for Palin was a deeply cynical act. But probably not THAT dangerous to the Republic.

Yes, yes. Not a “clear and present” danger or anything. She has to get her feet wet, after all. Then she’ll be a danger. And no, it wouldn’t be “THAT dangerous” (Benj’s emphasis, not mine). So if she’s not THAT dangerous, she’s still, you know, dangerous. Just not THAT dangerous.

Benj, you should read what you write.

Sep 7, 2008 - 3:38 pm 180. buddy larsen:

Thanks, y’all–for the congrats –the Proverb is wonderful –them ancients were mighty deft –and apologies to wretchard for personal use of serious thread to insert feather in cap –har –

Slade, i couldn’t agree more re GAAP. I mean, to say that a financial institution isn’t using GAAP –as if that is a minor problem –is like saying the ship is fine except that it won’t float.

F&F move will be showing up on the Asian mkts here pretty quickly. We could have a big up day. Here’s hoping.

Sep 7, 2008 - 4:35 pm 181. buddy larsen:

Slade, right –Glass-Steagall now looks more wisdom and less anti-growth. OTOH, these questions cry out for quantification. Regulations increase opportunity costs. Hard to know when just where you don’t the golden goose taking a dump.

Sep 7, 2008 - 4:44 pm 182. Benj:

Peter - see Stormrider’s last post - Given that he disagrees with me re Palin, I think you’re more likely to be convinced by his apology to (and for me) than anything I could say…

While I don’t believe Palin is a Brownshirt, I’m surprised that conservatives (& would-be Jeffersonians) are so blase about the idea small town mayor injecting herself into the process by which the local librarian selects material. Especially when the mayor in question seemed to want to promote a particular cultural agenda.

Buddy - Hope you’re right that the upsurge of right-wing populism will generate new ideas about how to deal with today’s malefactors of great (paper) wealth. But Palin’s record on earmarks, Wasila town budget, and the Bridge to Nowhere - leaves me hanging… Seems like her reformism is, ah, Alaska-bound. Consider O’s record on the other hand. There were basically two policy positions which truly distinguished him from Hillary. 1. The vote against the war 2. The pledge not to take money from lobbies…I’m well aware that O is not pure on this score. Alexis made me suck on O’s ethanolism and bows to Illinois’ farmers…But O’s fundraising - early on - put him in a position to pursue a more populist agenda than any modern Dem (or pub).

If you get a chance - might check O’s speech on the mortgage crisis at Cooper Union last spring and tell me what (you think) he got right and wrong. I could use some steers on that front as I’m no expert on the banking system…

Sep 7, 2008 - 5:01 pm 183. buddy larsen:

benj, start with theory of “fractional” banking and how the Fed works it –good stuff everywhere on search. Once you understand why local banks sell their originations it all comes very clear what happened. Price is information –when it starts giving bad info, bubbles form.

F&F was buying junk –so a lot of junk got created –why not, it had a buyer.

Look at HUD –the percentage it represents in F&F vs the percentage it represents of F&F’s junk (ratio is i think around 1:20) –meaning HUD loans are 20 times as likely to be bad as any other source. Now look at the Community Reinvestment Act. Now look at Barney Frank, house banking committee chairman. Now look at the new 300 billion housing bailout. Who gets to buy patronage with that? The same folks who were ’spose to be overseeing the activities that caused it be ‘necessary’ in the first place?

Yep. Smell anything? It’s called “congress”.

Sep 7, 2008 - 5:23 pm 184. slade:

Buddy - speaking of geese and dumps and all, what just disturbs my normally bland demeanor is that for lack of simple book accounting, the ship of state is floundering, while we debate about Obama’s dangerous “Marxist” rhetoric and McCain’s “temperament.” This country cannot pay for all the pending bailouts, continued military activity abroad, deficit reduction, let alone any new programs like health care. Much of the pain could be mitigated by simple accounting and strict accountability, what I call a “mechanical” fix - a problem with a set of solutions amenable to objective screening without the compromising influence of ideology. But no, we have “comprehensive” this, that, and whatnot social programs - border security, health care, tax reform. It is simply unconscionable to me that our government lacks even the basic platform of business accountability. As far as I am concerned it is a criminal abrogation of fiduciary responsibility of taxpayers money. I could go on but that’s the gist of it. We can’t even make the easy stuff happen.

Sep 7, 2008 - 5:37 pm 185. slade:

What are computers for if not spreadsheets and relational databases?

Sep 7, 2008 - 5:50 pm 186. Storm-Rider:

Benj said: “Consider O’s record on the other hand. There were basically two policy positions which truly distinguished him from Hillary. 1. The vote against the war 2. The pledge not to take money from lobbies”

1 Obama was and is wrong to oppose the battle of Iraq; because this is just war in defense of American life and liberty, and in opposition to the International Islamo-Fascist Alliance. Iraq under Saddam Hussein was a member of this Islamist Alliance of Tyranny, and it would have remained in this same anti-life, anti-liberty, anti-American alliance under al Qaeda, the backup team in Iraq, as well. We have defeated a two headed Islamist monster in Iraq, and it is a badge of honor for loyal and patriotic Americans - liberty-loving Americans.

2 Obama’s pledge not to take money from lobbies is like a wolf pledging not to take chickens from the coop.

Sep 7, 2008 - 6:14 pm 187. Bob Murphy:

Nicely put about fiduciary responsibility in government but then there’s the line about the fatal flaw in democracy being that it lasts only slightly longer than it takes for the people to find out they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury.
I have been resident in Australia for 35 years so don’t know for sure but rather suspect the same spending trends in the US as here.
I have a couple of graphs which show a decline in government infrastructure investments at the same time as a rise in expenditure on social entitlements in the 70s.
Total expenditure remained roughly the same but the balance shifted from nationbuilding to government handouts.

Sep 7, 2008 - 6:21 pm 188. Storm-Rider:

Benj,
I went back and re-read your earlier thread:

“There is, though, one candidate who has a documented history of censoriousness within the public square…Any conservative who cares about free speech should be daunted by Ms. Palin’s record.”

Now, I apologized to you when I implied that you called Sara Palin a book-banner or book-burner; you owe us all an apology for stating falsely that Sara Palin censors books or that she is a threat to free speech. And as I think about this, what is the difference between accusing someone of being a book-burner or book-banner vs. being a censor or a threat to freedom of speech?

My apology is now qualified, but it still stands on a technicality.

Sep 7, 2008 - 6:58 pm 189. buddy larsen:

Slade, it’s not just federal debt either –unfunded pensions county & municipal pensions are a coming big story. Already a few local governments have gone bust –one county in Alabama iirc and city of Vallejo in California. Public service unions have busted ‘em with benefit packages –just like their private counterparts have done to the auto, steel & airline industries. Vallejo, with a full-salary retirement at 55 iirc and folks living to 75 had for all practical purposes two complete sets of muni employees –one working, the other retired. Now it’s bust, and on top of the goodies disappearing, Vallejo itself is losing commerce (poor services, high taxes to do a ‘workout’), meaning it’s more or less financially nuked itself. Oh, the party of heart! Those Vallejo employees had it good for awhile but their kids are going to have to split home & scatter –maybe go west to find work –China, where there’s no party of Heart!

Sep 7, 2008 - 7:48 pm 190. buddy larsen:

Something about public service unions i don’t get: if a traditional union is formed by labor to protect itself from private capital, what exactly is a public employee union protecting itself from?

Sep 7, 2008 - 8:19 pm 191. slade:

Well that’s just discouraging. Pain becomes a political commodity. There should be a market.

Oh that’s right. They’re called elections.

Sep 7, 2008 - 8:39 pm 192. slade:

what exactly is a public employee union protecting itself from?

Reality.

Sep 7, 2008 - 8:43 pm 193. slade:

My impression was that the older private union plans, from 20-30 years ago, were burdened by high pension liabilities whereas the more modern public unions are burdened by increasing cost of health care. But I am not surprised to hear that communities are going for two-fers.

All of the union disputes I hear about stall on health care negotiations.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:01 pm 194. Paul:

Bob Murphy:

To amplify your point, my state of California from the mid fifties to the mid seventies, ( the golden age of the freeway ), was spending between 16-20% of the State budget on highway infrastructure. When Arnold took office, the State of California was spending about as much on giving away free wheelchairs as on highway infrastructure.

Benj: You know in the internet age, some libraries have had problems of wierdos surfing the net on library computers for porn and other fun stuff. Libraries no longer just dispense books. Could that be one of Palin’s concerns in this case?

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:09 pm 195. Dave:

Buddy—What is the story on copper and have you tracked borax lately? (Hi Slade. am now going after the hippopotamus).

Has been a lot of talk lately about the return of inflation—a generalized currency debasement. As the Austrian with the contrary opinion, I dissent.

What I think we are seeing is a convergence of contrived shortages. Silver miners have been harassed (on environmental grounds of course), gold mines have been put out of business, most notoriously the Rosa Montana in Romania, ethanol has jacked up the price of groceries, not to mention Jim Beam, and we hardly need to talk about petroleum.

Some of these qualify as deliberate, others unintentional but they all come together to jack up the CPI.

Now I keep hearing about widespread thefts of copper and copper products. Is this reflective of price increases and if so, what do you think is boosting this commodity?

Now I will let you in on two secrets about borax. (1) It was really two horses and 18 mules. 20-Mule Team just sounded better.

2) Borax has some 250 to 300 broad industrial areas and some 20 times that many specific applications. Therefore, demand for borax
can be a very good indicator of economic conditions. If that mountain of mined borax outside Boron shrinks, the good times are rolling. If it grows and grows, we got us a recession.

Now were there to be stagnant or shrinking demand coupled with price increases above and
beyond direct cost increases, we would probably be looking at (gasp) stagflation.
That would tend to prove me wrong and currency debasement theories right.

So can you get a read on all this? In your spare time, of cuss, of cuss.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:12 pm 196. buddy larsen:

paul, at some point in time, somebody in every community is going to have to put their foot down on open access porn that kids can get to. It’s child abuse, leaving those doors open for ten year olds.

slade –right –third-party payer drops the system squarely into the “tragedy of the commons”.

Sep 7, 2008 - 9:17 pm 197. Wadeusaf:

@Gramps Larsen, good on yer.

@ Benj, Check it out,

http://www.frontiersman.com/articles/2008/09/08/breaking_news/doc48c1c8a60d6d9379155484.txt

I have to take the them Mayor at her word, the inquiries were not about banning or deselecting books, but at protecting the city from law suits. There was at the time a number of bits of litigation about the subject throughout the NW, especially in regards to porn in the public eye. Totally relevant to the job, and completely reasonable manner with which she sought to know the limits of her responsibility. Please note she responded with “nothing particular” and generally approached this and other interviews of heads of the various city agencies with questions pertaining to the function of the agency and their perceptions of those functions. In 1996? I think we can label the librarian as paranoid seeing as some on she did not have reason to particularly be chummy with was now her boss, and the climate of the NW at the time. Kudo’s to Palin, she took no advantage of the situation, kudo’s to the librarian, vigilance takes all forms I guess, tilting at imaginary windmills served her well.

Of course that is censoriousness, depending on who gets to twist the story first, and last.

Sep 7, 2008 - 10:25 pm 198. Doug:

The Vanishing Republican Voter -

What the middle class needs most is not lower income taxes but a slowdown in the soaring inflation of health-care costs.
If health-insurance costs had risen 50 percent rather than 100 percent over the Bush years, middle-income voters would have enjoyed a pay raise instead of enduring wage stagnation.
John McCain’s health plan, which emphasizes tax changes to encourage employees to buy their own insurance rather than rely on employers, is a start — but only the very beginning of a start.

Some Republicans have brought great energy to this problem. In the Senate, Robert Bennett of Utah has written a bill with the Oregon Democrat Ron Wyden that would require employers to “cash out” employer-provided health care — and then midwife a national insurance marketplace in which employees would join plans that offered more price control and price transparency.

Mitt Romney in Massachusetts put an end to the tax disadvantage that hammers consumers who buy health care directly rather than through their employers. Rudy Giuliani proposed a federal law to enable low-cost insurers in states like Kentucky to sell their products across state lines in high-cost states like New Jersey.

But it remains unfortunately true that the Republican Party as a whole regards health care as “not our issue” — and certainly less exciting than another round of tax reductions.

Sep 7, 2008 - 11:52 pm 199. Paul:

Doug:

Government heavily regulates or is heavily involved in all those industries related to the major cost items of a family budget. Those being:

Housing
Food
Health Care
Energy
Insurance
Schooling

and of course taxes.

These costs of Housing, Food, Health Care, Energy, Insurance and
Schooling have all increased at rates far in excess of that of household income for many years. That is why the middle class is in trouble. Republicans have been very slow to respond to the point of denying that there is even a problem. Major Republicans pundits like Rush, Michael Medved and others don’t even want to talk about increased costs of living for families.

In particularly urban areas and blue states, controlled largely by the public employee unions, the trial lawyers and the environmentalists, backed by the academics and the foundations, state and local governments have gone literally berserk, in too many ways too mention, micromanaging to the smallest detail, increasing liability, discouraging competition, punishing entrepreneurship, and generally pushing a socialist no growth agenda. The tentacles of leftist controlled government power go very deep and wide, with several generations of monkey wrenchers entrenched throughout the bureaucracy and judiciary.

It is a very serious threat to our economy and our liberties. Yet, one sees very little opposition to this slow socialist takeover.

Sep 8, 2008 - 8:10 am 200. Doug:

Agreed.
Since schooling (NEA)
Produces Sheeple, not People.

Sep 8, 2008 - 8:48 am 201. Benj:

Wade - Checked it out - can’t see why it puts you at your ease. To accuse the librarian of “paranoia” seems a bit over-the-top. There are other accounts of the incident which suggest that 100 or so town residents gathered in support of her. Doubt they rallied over a procedural issue…BTW - occures to me that this incident may have taught Ms. P. that pressing a social conservative agenda might have some draw-backs…She does not seem to have had that heavy a hand as a gov…

HAve you read the now-famous Kilkenny letter? - There’s a bit of rumor-mongering at the end re Sarah’s basketball days and the author may very well have her own ax to grind - local and PTA politics can get nasty - but I don’t believe it is propaganda, in part because the author is upfront about her own biases. Check it out (if you haven’t already.)

http://fairlyconservative.com/the-race-for-president/a-chat-with-anne-kilkenny-from-alaska/

Sep 8, 2008 - 9:41 am 202. Charles:

OT:
from the last thread
slade:

The CDO concept was developed by (convicted) Michael Milken of (now-defunct) Drexel Burnham Lambert. After the securities scandal, the vehicle lay dormant until picked up by the mortgage industry around 1999/2000. I’ll let the economists pick it up from there. CSPAN aired an interview with a journalist who looked into the subject; took more than a few calls from some articulate folks who objected to placing the blame on Fannie/Freddie for exactly the reason I stated. The CDO package - courtesy of Mikey Milken - is flawed.
/////////////////
In addition I heard on Rush today that HUD back in the 90’s under Andrew Cuomo mandated that freddie and fannie mae had to make loans to low income households–ie high risk households.

Sep 8, 2008 - 12:21 pm 203. Doug:

Upfront about her own biases?
She does not say she contributes to Obama from multiple addresses from other states.
Does not say she is a UC Berkeley Sociology Grad.
She does not say…

Sep 8, 2008 - 1:44 pm 204. Doug:

Here’s Tony Blankley on economic foolishness:

“Currently, the United States has the second-highest corporate tax rate of all industrial societies, after economically anemic Japan.

The U.S. federal rate of taxation is 35 percent, and when the average state and local corporate tax rates are added, American corporations pay, on average, a 39.27 percent tax on their incomes.

China is at 25 percent; Mexico is at 28 percent; socialist Sweden is at 28 percent; and prosperous Ireland is at a mere 12.5 percent.”

The Other Side of Kim du Toit

Obama’s solution to the problem of jobs and industry going offshore is to lean toward protectionist policies (renegotiate NAFTA, oppose new free trade treaties, etc.). When one combines Obama’s plans to tighten international trade, create carbon trading regulations that will be the equivalent of a further $100 billion corporate tax, raise taxes generally on business, as well as his mind-numbingly counterproductive ‘windfall’ profit taxes on petroleum product companies… one has a formula for economic catastrophe not seen since Herbert Hoover’s similar Depression-inducing policy in 1929.”

Sep 8, 2008 - 2:05 pm 205. Doug:

These attitudes, and more, define the tenor of the party leadership, and sent a message to the grassroots and media that it was
“Bros Before Hoes,”
to quote a popular Obama-supporter T-shirt.

On the day McCain announced her selection as his running mate, Palin thanked Clinton and Ferraro for blazing her trail.

A day later, Ferraro noted her shock at Palin’s comment.
You see, none of her peers, no one, had ever publicly thanked her in the 24 years since her historic run for the White House.
Ferraro has since refused to divulge for whom she’s voting.
Many more now are realizing that it does indeed take a woman - who happens to be a Republican named Sarah Palin.
ht - al-Bob

Sep 8, 2008 - 2:52 pm 206. Doug:

The always embarassing Joe:

YouTube - Biden on Debating Gov. Palin

“Deadly Errious“

Sep 8, 2008 - 4:21 pm 207. Wadeusaf:

Is it flawed to believe someone will not exaggerate or exacerbate a situation, because they tell you up front they are prone to such exaggeration or exacerbation?

Taken with a grain of salt, please, no sugar.

Sep 8, 2008 - 11:18 pm 208. Benj:

Hey - In re Palin’s own account - for “rhetorical” - she might have meant “hypothetical”? - but maybe the mistake there is telling. “Ideological” might have been the better term. Sure you’re you’re not barreling over a bridge to…? My guess is Storm’s apology for the lady is probably closer to where it was at. He accepts her censorious side cos it didn’t inpinge on private rights/property. That’s all true but it don’t seem very Jeffersonian to me…Just so we’re all clear - watched a vid from February 08 on c-span. I thought the woman seemed pretty wining…She’s “smart”, as that Berkeley emailer underscored. No Dan Quayle (Or Barb Boxer!). Which makes her willingness to allow herself to become a Rovian caricature - Pitbull w/ lipstick even more morally problematic?

Sep 9, 2008 - 7:41 am 209. Wadeusaf:

Some once said extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, or something to that effect. but if folks as in the e-mailer are going to spout off, can we not at least agree to follow a line to be sure it isn’t a line of udder bs.

That is what it is about. But with “OH” using dubious sources for his holy font, “the what for” to anoint his ascension, having a nose for bs leads to clarity. Besides which the job is vice president, not head cheerleader. For that you need teeth, a category in which Joe has a decided disadvantage, being long in the tooth also implies fewer of them.

Of course that is also why older folks are choosy about what they sink their teeth into. No matter how it squares up, your man is trying to bite off more than he can chew, much less swallow. And there lies the only”morally problematic” aspect I see.

I hope you have plenty of tums on hand.

Sep 9, 2008 - 5:30 pm 210. Tom the Redhunter:

“HAve you read the now-famous Kilkenny letter?”

yes and it’s a joke. You are soooo gullible. I’ve been somewhat involved in local politics for 25 years and have seen a hundred “Anne Kilkenny” letters. It’s been debunked

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/sliming_palin.html

Sep 9, 2008 - 7:42 pm 211. Benj:

Redhunter captured by the game - “Anne Kilkenny’s letter has been debunked.” Here’s factcheck’s own line on that…

“Correction: In our original story, we incorrectly said that a few of the claims we examine here were included in the e-mail by Kilkenny. Only one of the claims – about the librarian’s firing – was similar to an item in that e-mail. We regret the error.”

Just so we’re all clear - Fact check actually quotes Kilkenny neutrally in their own account of the library incident and that account does not claim K.’s account of the library incident is false, though it also offers up Palin’s defense avec (confused?) talk re her “rhetorical” questions. I’ll assume Tom missed Factcheck’s correction, though, in fact, it was unnecessary to anyone who had read the letter closely. I myself sent emails out to folks who passed on those bogus lists of banned books. (BTW - Never made any claims myself on that front, nor did Kilkenny.) Hope Tom would/will bust those on his side who are spreading untruths. Got a LOT ops on that score lately as Mac campaign has been full tilt lying mode lately…

Sep 11, 2008 - 10:56 am

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