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	<title>Comments on: Partnerless In Gaza</title>
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	<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/</link>
	<description>Just another Pajamasmedia.com weblog</description>
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		<title>By: Morton Doodslag</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28577</link>
		<dc:creator>Morton Doodslag</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:39:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28577</guid>
		<description>Over the long term, do such tactical changes have any genuine significance?  At best, all we&#039;ve done is temporarily lift the Muslims from their sewer of Islam, their vile anti-human belief system which cheapens, degrades, and defiles all it touches.   Through our expenditures in precious life and treasure, the Muslims have been handed a golden opportunity to prove they aren&#039;t complete barbarians -- but to no avail -- they will remain Muslim in Afghanistan -- they will remain Muslim in Iraq -- they will remain Muslim in Gaza and the West Bank, and they will remain Muslim as long as we attack the symptoms of Islam, but leave the kernel of Islam alive and thriving as we have done. 

As a symbol of our failure to grasp the matter forthrightly, we currently can be seen rebuilding  (with US tax dollars!) the Muslim&#039;s disgusting mosques after they&#039;ve  utilized them as weapons caches, recruiting offices for terrorists, and bastions of incitement and hatred.  Are we out of our minds?  

As long as those terror spewing hatred wallowing Islamic societies are allowed to remain Muslim, the nightmares which Islam unleashes on the world will perpetuate and thrive.  The magical (and extremely costly) charms of civilization which we have bestowed on these slavish adherents to Islam will surely expire as soon as we leave the ball at midnight -- or as soon as we stop pouring staggering aid dollars and precious blood into their maw to prop up their irredeemable society.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Over the long term, do such tactical changes have any genuine significance?  At best, all we&#8217;ve done is temporarily lift the Muslims from their sewer of Islam, their vile anti-human belief system which cheapens, degrades, and defiles all it touches.   Through our expenditures in precious life and treasure, the Muslims have been handed a golden opportunity to prove they aren&#8217;t complete barbarians &#8212; but to no avail &#8212; they will remain Muslim in Afghanistan &#8212; they will remain Muslim in Iraq &#8212; they will remain Muslim in Gaza and the West Bank, and they will remain Muslim as long as we attack the symptoms of Islam, but leave the kernel of Islam alive and thriving as we have done. </p>
<p>As a symbol of our failure to grasp the matter forthrightly, we currently can be seen rebuilding  (with US tax dollars!) the Muslim&#8217;s disgusting mosques after they&#8217;ve  utilized them as weapons caches, recruiting offices for terrorists, and bastions of incitement and hatred.  Are we out of our minds?  </p>
<p>As long as those terror spewing hatred wallowing Islamic societies are allowed to remain Muslim, the nightmares which Islam unleashes on the world will perpetuate and thrive.  The magical (and extremely costly) charms of civilization which we have bestowed on these slavish adherents to Islam will surely expire as soon as we leave the ball at midnight &#8212; or as soon as we stop pouring staggering aid dollars and precious blood into their maw to prop up their irredeemable society.</p>
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		<title>By: goesh</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28574</link>
		<dc:creator>goesh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 19:16:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28574</guid>
		<description>IDF goes in, makes some rubble, kills a bunch of Hamas fighters, destroys a bunch of Hamas supplies, slows the rocket attacks significantly for a while and it recycles all over again in another 5 years. Hamas is too smart to keep on engaging amidst the rubble, house by house, they will stop shooting and live to shoot another day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IDF goes in, makes some rubble, kills a bunch of Hamas fighters, destroys a bunch of Hamas supplies, slows the rocket attacks significantly for a while and it recycles all over again in another 5 years. Hamas is too smart to keep on engaging amidst the rubble, house by house, they will stop shooting and live to shoot another day.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexis</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28525</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 04:46:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28525</guid>
		<description>Rod Blagojevich is a godsend for the Israeli Defense Forces.  Why?  When Rod Blagojevich nominated Roland Burris to fill Illinois&#039;s U.S. Senate seat, he knocked the bloody pictures in Gaza off the front pages; Gaza is no longer the lead story in the evening news for the American mainstream media.  That&#039;s great.

The less media attention that gets put onto Gaza, the better.  Moreover, the media need to keep at least a pretense of balance rather than focusing on Gaza all the time.  For every report from the Gaza Strip, there should be at least one report from Sderot, Ashkelon, or Ashdod.  Let&#039;s not assume that screaming Palestinians are the only people in the entire universe who just happen to suffer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rod Blagojevich is a godsend for the Israeli Defense Forces.  Why?  When Rod Blagojevich nominated Roland Burris to fill Illinois&#8217;s U.S. Senate seat, he knocked the bloody pictures in Gaza off the front pages; Gaza is no longer the lead story in the evening news for the American mainstream media.  That&#8217;s great.</p>
<p>The less media attention that gets put onto Gaza, the better.  Moreover, the media need to keep at least a pretense of balance rather than focusing on Gaza all the time.  For every report from the Gaza Strip, there should be at least one report from Sderot, Ashkelon, or Ashdod.  Let&#8217;s not assume that screaming Palestinians are the only people in the entire universe who just happen to suffer.</p>
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		<title>By: Staring In Disbelief</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28512</link>
		<dc:creator>Staring In Disbelief</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 23:37:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28512</guid>
		<description>Another great article over at The Weekly Standard &quot;Gaza Is Not Lebanon&quot; 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/975wlwfj.asp

While everything the author says may be true, I still think a ground assault is  past the point of diminishing returns for Israel. Hope I&#039;m wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another great article over at The Weekly Standard &#8220;Gaza Is Not Lebanon&#8221; </p>
<p><a href="http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/975wlwfj.asp" rel="nofollow">http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/975wlwfj.asp</a></p>
<p>While everything the author says may be true, I still think a ground assault is  past the point of diminishing returns for Israel. Hope I&#8217;m wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred2</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28510</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 23:28:54 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Michael Gray has it about right.  The minimum for Israel is to stop or nearly stop the rockets and the importing of rockets.

Longer term, replace Hamas with somebody dedicated to the 2-state solution.  Somebody like the PA.

The central fulcrum here is the 2-state solution.  Hamas is standing in the way and the world needs them eliminated so the 2-state solution can go forward.

Now the 2-state solution might be a poor idea (who will replace Abbas?  What keeps Syria out of Palestine?) but that&#039;s the goal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael Gray has it about right.  The minimum for Israel is to stop or nearly stop the rockets and the importing of rockets.</p>
<p>Longer term, replace Hamas with somebody dedicated to the 2-state solution.  Somebody like the PA.</p>
<p>The central fulcrum here is the 2-state solution.  Hamas is standing in the way and the world needs them eliminated so the 2-state solution can go forward.</p>
<p>Now the 2-state solution might be a poor idea (who will replace Abbas?  What keeps Syria out of Palestine?) but that&#8217;s the goal.</p>
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		<title>By: Surind Raj</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28497</link>
		<dc:creator>Surind Raj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 18:42:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Worth a watch:
http://www.terrorismawareness.org/what-really-happened/

Worth a read:
http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2007/10/message-to-peaceful-muslims.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Worth a watch:<br />
<a href="http://www.terrorismawareness.org/what-really-happened/" rel="nofollow">http://www.terrorismawareness.org/what-really-happened/</a></p>
<p>Worth a read:<br />
<a href="http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2007/10/message-to-peaceful-muslims.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2007/10/message-to-peaceful-muslims.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: davod</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28489</link>
		<dc:creator>davod</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 17:33:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28489</guid>
		<description>From what I have been reading recently Hamas was moving ahead in its efforts to turn Gaza into an Islamic ruled state in the Taliban mold. If so,the Isralis might well have been better off waiting for the terror to take effect.

Having said this, I understand why the Israelis moved when they did.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From what I have been reading recently Hamas was moving ahead in its efforts to turn Gaza into an Islamic ruled state in the Taliban mold. If so,the Isralis might well have been better off waiting for the terror to take effect.</p>
<p>Having said this, I understand why the Israelis moved when they did.</p>
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		<title>By: marymcl</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28479</link>
		<dc:creator>marymcl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 15:37:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28479</guid>
		<description>John Bolton makes a good argument for dumping the current peace process altogether and moving to a three-state solution (Israel, Egypt and Jordan) 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/04/AR2009010401434.html?hpid=opinionsbox1</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John Bolton makes a good argument for dumping the current peace process altogether and moving to a three-state solution (Israel, Egypt and Jordan) </p>
<p><a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/04/AR2009010401434.html?hpid=opinionsbox1" rel="nofollow">http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/01/04/AR2009010401434.html?hpid=opinionsbox1</a></p>
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		<title>By: Michael Gray</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28474</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Gray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 13:29:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28474</guid>
		<description>DougS:

The declared end-game has been well-publicized:
* Stop rockets
* Prevent re-armament (read: stop the tunnel-smuggling)
* Prevent acts of terror (read: if Hamas starts planning suicide bombings, they get a visit)
* Monitoring by international force (presumably with covert Israeli participation, e.g. through cameras)

The point re: Hamas&#039; internal security isn&#039;t an &quot;end-game&quot; so much as a means of managing the problem.  I&#039;m not at all sure it is in Israel&#039;s interests to topple Hamas.  Remember - a ruling group loses support if it doesn&#039;t provide services.  Before becoming the government, Hamas got &quot;points&quot; for anything it did in the way of social welfare; now, it loses points for every need it doesn&#039;t take care of.

Leaving a weakened Hamas in power would make sense for Israel.  And the weakening is only partly achievable by force.  The rest of the work is socio-economic - choking off Hamas&#039; resources, crippling their ability to manage Gaza (bombing the government buildings and destroying the filing cabinets/databases with info on taxes, salaries, etc. - brilliant; the follow-through is with additional spanners in the gears), and tying the social power structures (i.e. the important tribes) to Fatah rather than Hamas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DougS:</p>
<p>The declared end-game has been well-publicized:<br />
* Stop rockets<br />
* Prevent re-armament (read: stop the tunnel-smuggling)<br />
* Prevent acts of terror (read: if Hamas starts planning suicide bombings, they get a visit)<br />
* Monitoring by international force (presumably with covert Israeli participation, e.g. through cameras)</p>
<p>The point re: Hamas&#8217; internal security isn&#8217;t an &#8220;end-game&#8221; so much as a means of managing the problem.  I&#8217;m not at all sure it is in Israel&#8217;s interests to topple Hamas.  Remember &#8211; a ruling group loses support if it doesn&#8217;t provide services.  Before becoming the government, Hamas got &#8220;points&#8221; for anything it did in the way of social welfare; now, it loses points for every need it doesn&#8217;t take care of.</p>
<p>Leaving a weakened Hamas in power would make sense for Israel.  And the weakening is only partly achievable by force.  The rest of the work is socio-economic &#8211; choking off Hamas&#8217; resources, crippling their ability to manage Gaza (bombing the government buildings and destroying the filing cabinets/databases with info on taxes, salaries, etc. &#8211; brilliant; the follow-through is with additional spanners in the gears), and tying the social power structures (i.e. the important tribes) to Fatah rather than Hamas.</p>
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		<title>By: DougS</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/04/partnerless-in-gaza/comment-page-1/#comment-28466</link>
		<dc:creator>DougS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 09:37:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1699#comment-28466</guid>
		<description>Since Cast Lead began, I have been wondering what Israel&#039;s end-game. They want a fight to the finish with Hamas? Fine. But they also have no intention to re-occupy Gaza for the long-term. So who or what stabilizes Gaza to make sure no more rockets fall in southern Israel?

As others have been said, a Surge-like solution is not possible here. So my guess is that Israel just wants to bag (or body-bag) as many Hamas leaders as they can, destroy as many rocket sites as they can, net as much intelligence as they can, and if possible, leave Hamas vulnerable to a Fatah counterstroke. Stabilization in this case may mean giving Abbas&#039; hard boys the chance to exact revenge, and maybe even finish off Hamas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Since Cast Lead began, I have been wondering what Israel&#8217;s end-game. They want a fight to the finish with Hamas? Fine. But they also have no intention to re-occupy Gaza for the long-term. So who or what stabilizes Gaza to make sure no more rockets fall in southern Israel?</p>
<p>As others have been said, a Surge-like solution is not possible here. So my guess is that Israel just wants to bag (or body-bag) as many Hamas leaders as they can, destroy as many rocket sites as they can, net as much intelligence as they can, and if possible, leave Hamas vulnerable to a Fatah counterstroke. Stabilization in this case may mean giving Abbas&#8217; hard boys the chance to exact revenge, and maybe even finish off Hamas.</p>
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