39 Comments

1. Sean Casey:

Weak argument.

The best you can do, Rog?

Oct 4, 2008 - 7:29 am 2. Annabel:

And what would be your argument, Sean Casey?

Oct 4, 2008 - 9:21 am 3. Arktek48:

I think this will put things into perspective. Imagine my surprise two years ago while paying a visit to my mother who was in a nursing home in suburban Chicagoland. While checking her mail I came a across a voters registration card. According to David Orr she was a registered Democrat (as were probably a lot of other senior residents at this home). The only problem with that scenario was that my mother was not a U.S. citizen. Phone calls to David Orr Cook County Clerk were met with surprise and vows to look into the situation. There was never any investigation or follow up and I’m sure even though my mom passed away two years ago, Obama can count on her vote this November!

Oct 4, 2008 - 9:50 am 4. airth10:

The data points you sarcastically refer to should also include the Bush administration and how it has starved the country of funds to carry out mutually beneficial social programs. But conservatives like you have no interest or respect in funding social programs that can make life better for many. For instance, conservative have cut medical programs that could benefit many children. The killings in Chicago reflects more the ills brought on by Republicans than Democrats, as you so happily but wrongly outline. The stewardship under Republicans has been abysmal when it comes to cities, e.g. New Orleans.

The culture of mean spiritedness and lack of compassion Bush&Co. has engendered throughout the nation is also a data point you should refer to, with its incompetence and very poor management skills, as we have seen with the economy. Bush&Co. have cultivated a resentment in America that could also be the seeds of more violent acts.

Why also the high rate of murders in Chicago is perhaps because many of the law enforcement officers have been shipped off to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Many have returned. But such disruptions have often effected and damaged the continuance and stability needed in law enforcement. Another data point you might consider, Roger, is that so much funding has been thrown at the “war on terror” that funds for other policing, which is more essential to a community’s protection, has been starved.

Oct 4, 2008 - 9:52 am 5. Letalis Maximus, Esq.:

airth10:

Bull. Shit.

Chicago’s murder rate is the lowest its been since 1965. Go puddle that crap over at Kos, or HuffPo, or DU, OK?

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:21 am 6. Letalis Maximus, Esq.:

Oh…and here’s a linky poo.

http://www.policeoneproducts.com/patrol-issues/articles/1654449-Chicagos-murder-rate-lowest-since-1965/

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:22 am 7. Tom:

Airth,

Yep it is always the wingnuts fault. Just because Democrats run these cities and they are out of control, it is the Republican’s fault.

But then the arguement falls apart when you look at New York. When the Republican’s took over the Mayors position, crime dropped and the city has kept the quality of life up with the new mayor, also a Republican, is the face of the Bush onslaught.

So go back to your liberal fallacies and keep drinking the Kool-aid. Throwing money at Community Organizers and ACORN will fix all ills. Really. Seriously. In a perfect world.

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:22 am 8. GingerGuy:

Airth10 wrote…”The data points you sarcastically refer to should also include the Bush administration and how it has starved the country of funds to carry out mutually beneficial social programs.”

I am laughing…it’s Bush’s fault.

Then Airth10 wrote…”Why also the high rate of murders in Chicago is perhaps because many of the law enforcement officers have been shipped off to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.”

And then we are to think the high homicides rates are because of the Police?

If too many people begin to think like this we are in big, big trouble. May God save us from ourselves.

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:33 am 9. andyb:

Nice try airth10. No facts, no figures, just anecdotal argument. I have lived in Chicago for all of my 43 years. Daley Jr. has put more police on the streets over the years, they are not being shipped off anywhere. The state and municipal governments have poured more money into the education system over the years, money that is raised through ever-higher property tax rates, yet test scores have only marginally improved in Chicago over the last decade. Cook county has soaked it’s constituents with every new tax they could come up with, and raised the level of all existing taxes, yet it is never enough. When they raised cigarette taxes 2 years ago to nearly equal the pre-tax price of cigarettes, (under the guise of improving public health), cigarette sales fell off substantially. The Cook County board then started wringing their hands because the tax receipts from cigarette sales were not producing the expected revenues. (More fool me, it was never about getting the public to give up smoking!?) The answer in Chicago and Illinois is always “more funding”, yet that answer never seems to produce real quantifiable results. In Chicago, it is illegal to own a handgun, yet deaths by handgun shootings lead the nation. Every ill in our world cannot be laid at the feet of George Bush, although I’m sure you would like to try to do so. You simply don’t know what you are talking about.

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:35 am 10. Percy Dovetonsils:

Guys, just wait and see if Chicago gets the Olympics. It will be a festival of graft that would put a banana republic to shame.

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:52 am 11. Assistant Village Idiot:

No, don’t stop him, LM, Esq! The beautiful self-contradiction of airth10 should be encouraged and spread throughout the internet. Tell him he’s wonderful Tell him he’s smart. Tell him he should really make an effort to get that word out to as many places as possible.

Oct 4, 2008 - 11:59 am 12. Mike K:

California is gamely following Illinois’ lead and now needs a $7 billion handout from the feds to avoid default. Democrats have run the states, where they were placed in charge, into the ground, just likke Fannie-Freddie. The mentality is well illustrated about by Airth10. God help the country if Obama wins. It’s the end of the American Age and that, of course, is Ayres’ aim.

Oct 4, 2008 - 12:06 pm 13. ahem:

airth10: Go soak your head, you moron. All you idiots sound alike.

Oct 4, 2008 - 12:18 pm 14. Pee Wee Herman, Community Organizer:

Roger, you dissed the most important leaders in all of Illinois…we, the community organizers.

10 Hail Marys for you. And 400 voter registrations for Acorn. Dead or alive.

Oct 4, 2008 - 12:21 pm 15. dk70:

44 Billion in debt.

Now where is the money managed by the fund invested? Mortgage Backed Securities?

Oct 4, 2008 - 12:38 pm 16. Webrider:

The nice thing about a commenter like airth10, is that it’s all it takes to remind us of how absolutely ignorant, stupid, and irrational the left really is.

Oct 4, 2008 - 12:56 pm 17. Sandy P:

The data points you sarcastically refer to should also include the Bush administration and how it has starved the country of funds to carry out mutually beneficial social programs. But conservatives like you have no interest or respect in funding social programs that can make life better for many. For instance, conservative have cut medical programs that could benefit many children. The killings in Chicago reflects more the ills brought on by Republicans than Democrats, as you so happily but wrongly outline. The stewardship under Republicans has been abysmal when it comes to cities, e.g. New Orleans.

———-

Umm THE REVEREND Jesse Jackson was paid $5/head for each child signed up to the state’s child plan. He was not successful – go figure.

In the 70s – Chicago was known as “Beirut by the Lake.”

Chicago has been run by Dems for 50++ years.

———

They starved the schools decades before W came along.

IF you don’t understand a city’s history, you may not want to comment on it.

It’s called “The Combine.”

And Blowdry wants to provide STATE child health insurance for families making up to $200k/yr……

Even at $200/k that would put you in a 1/2 million $ home.

Middle-class can make $150/k year here. That’s nurse/firefighter, etc.

Oct 4, 2008 - 12:59 pm 18. The Mad Parson » Tsunamis Aren’t Always Meterological:

[...] This is meant to specifically tie Democrats to the financial meltdown, but what I find interesting is the part about Illinois’ underfunded pension plan.  Of course, this type of thing was all over the news a couple of years ago, and has since given way to even bigger economic problems on the front page of your trusty local newspaper (”he typed, with a sarcastic smirk on his face”). [...]

Oct 4, 2008 - 1:01 pm 19. Self-hating boomer:

At the risk of being captain obvious, it’s pretty amazing that the national/international economic mess accrues an advantage to Obama, given what a swell job he and his party have done for the economy in Illinois. What are people thinking? WTF are people thinking???

Oct 4, 2008 - 1:18 pm 20. nlcatter:

no conneticut is worse

and calif is larger

typical GOP bullshit

Oct 4, 2008 - 1:21 pm 21. Pedro:

Blaming the mess in Chicago on Bush’s policies and a lack of funding is charitably “dysfunctional” thinking.
Notwithstanding that everyone with any power in the political chain of command is controlled by Democrats; the City of Chicago, the State Legislature, the Illinois Governor, as well as the U.S. Congress. With all that power and money the incompetence must be very embarrassing. If you have got to blame someone rather than take any responsibility for the mess may I suggest blaming those bad old red neck Republicans from the Florida panhandle and, of course, global warming.
Obama earmarked a billion dollars in his 1st part time term in the U.S. Senate. Who got the money? Didn’t you get your fair share?
Blaming, finger pointing, being the victim, and gaming the system is what Chicago is all about. Y’all must be proud?

Oct 4, 2008 - 2:15 pm 22. Steve:

Roger is right on Chicago.The Windy City is headed for bankruptcy and they will not be able to blame Republicans or capitalism just overpaid government workers.For more on the decline of Chicago:
http://www.newgeography.com/content/0040-the-decline-chicago-the-city-doesnt-work

For the relationship between Chicago Democrats and the Chicago Mob:

http://nalert.blogspot.com/2008/03/chicago-democrats-and-chicago-mob.html

Oct 4, 2008 - 3:25 pm 23. Laurence:

The story about unfunded pension liabilities has probably gotten much worse.

The S&P 500 has dropped over 20% since the story was written. If the Illinois pension funds suffered similar loses, the unfunded liability may now be over 50% unfunded. These workers are not covered by Social Security and Illinois cannot print money as the federal government does. Since these plan are not covered by ERISA, I doubt if they fall under the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation.

Oct 4, 2008 - 4:05 pm 24. John Bonaccorsi:

Airth10 – I’m not sure I would call myself a conservative – maybe a fascist – but at any rate, you’re right: I’m not interested in funding social programs. Should I develop an interest in funding them, I will do so – of my own volition, with my own money. If you are interested in funding them, you are free to fund them with your own money, as is every other un-mean-spirited and un-lacking-in-compassion person in the country. Kindly cease thinking it appropriate for the government to move money from one person to another. That the Constitution permits that is the disgrace of the Founding Fathers, who failed to set anyone free.

Sean Casey – Being half-Irish myself, I’ve had an opportunity to observe that few Irish listen – but let me waste my time: Just what exactly is it you think you have in common with the black voters without whom the Democrat Party wouldn’t even exist? Are you happy the government has ruined your formerly-white neighborhood with Section 8 housing? Are you pleased your 401k has just been thrown down the rat-hole of subprime mortgages that the government saw fit to guarantee and that it forced banks to grant to the un-creditworthy, not a few of them black? Are you pleased that black criminals are out in public to roam the sidewalks and subway stations used by you and your children and grandchildren? Are you glad that the government has turned tax-supported schools – which shouldn’t even exist – into Negro-zoo wastelands?

I personally am not happy about any of those things; and that’s why I regularly vote for the Republicans, who are unlike the 100% Communist Democrats in being only 98% Communist. I take the 2%.

Oct 4, 2008 - 4:46 pm 25. Steynian 263 « Free Mark Steyn!:

[...] ROGER KIMBALL on the Obama Heartland: “Data points from the Windy City” …. [...]

Oct 4, 2008 - 5:21 pm 26. Marc Malone:

This report sounds like every other large, Dem-controlled city with a strong union presence and a large mass of minorities. The Rust Belt is all like this.

Urban Detroit is 90% black, while the suburbs are 90% white. Who ends up as mayor of Detroit? Kwame Kilpatrick. Off to jail. The Governor is a Dem. Of course, MI’s sales tax rate is 10%+. Hostile to corporations. No right-to-work laws. And the people wonder why the economy there is the worst in the nation! Despite the trained labor availability, auto plants are being moved to right-to-work states, i.e., away from the union towns.

The Preamble to the Constitution says to promote the general welfare, not ensure it. Geez, but these Dem/Socialist are dumb! Whenever you see a financial crisis, Dem fingerprints are all over it. Social causes are stupid.

Oct 4, 2008 - 6:36 pm 27. Ravalli County News » Blog Archive » “This is the political culture that Obama comes from in Illinois. He’s going to ‘fix’ Washington politics?”:

[...] In the last six months, 292 people were murdered in Chicago. [...]

Oct 4, 2008 - 6:52 pm 28. Roger Godby:

All this about “that toddlin’ town, Chicago?” Been there many times. Knew students at the U of Chicago, most of whom got mugged at least once, because of what lies across the big road to the south; every campus building required electronic ID to enter, back in the late ’80s. Recall a rape at an el station (Garfield Park, was it?) in broad daylight; nobody did anything, some chump witness quoted as saying he thought it was just a live sex act. Drove through the housing projects on accident due to an outdated map–grim. As a child, on a family trip to Chitown in a chilly season in the late ’70s, I recall asking my mom, “Why is that woman wearing such short pants? Her legs must be cold.” Oh, “She’s a streetwalker, dear,” with on further explanation, which left me puzzled, because the woman was just standing on a street corner, not walking at all. Stayed downtown at the Holiday Inn and slept with the desk chair under the doorknob because of all the unsavory characters in the lobby and out front. But the Field Museum rocked.

And Chicago will keep voting DNC, ’cause that’s the Chicago way, just like Michigan and other states will continue to self-inflict themselves with the DNC.

Oct 4, 2008 - 7:56 pm 29. airth10:

andyb:
“Nice try airth10. No facts, no figures, just anecdotal argument.”

Roger Kimball didn’t offer any better in his argument. But, then, conservatives can get away with it.

Oct 4, 2008 - 8:36 pm 30. Sean Casey:

Wow. That was all really interesting.

See you fools at the inauguration.

Oct 4, 2008 - 9:14 pm 31. John Bonaccorsi:

Right-o, Sean. Just make sure you don’t get off at the wrong Metro station.

Oct 4, 2008 - 9:35 pm 32. BigHerm:

In the last ten days the following have been reported in the two Chicago daily newspapers;

A city worker had a swimming pool built at his house with cement to be used for runway expansion at O’Hare.

The same city worker-mobster-had a Com Ed generator dispatched to said poolhouse during the August power failures at city expense. The generator was supposed to be sent to O’Hare for backup power.

The Governor is being investigated for having his house renovated by Tony Rezko. The Governor bought an old home in a gentrifing neighborhood and rehabbed the home. The Governor cannot produce documentation that proves that he paid for the renovations. Not even a cancelled check!

The hometown presidential candidate secured a grant for $100,000 from the FHA to built a park in an underserved neighborhood. They erected a cheesy prefab gazebo-probably from Menards-and absconded with the rest of the cash. Nobody knows where it is, watch the video on the Sun Times web page, it is infuriating.

There have been approximatley 2600 murders in Chicago since the Iraq war began, and approximately 7,000 non-lethal shootings in the same period.
The shootings are hard to verify because the police are being pressured to underreport shootings.

I am astonished that the national media does not cover any of the above.

When Obama was questioned about the culture of corruption he said that sometimes it gives him “pause”

Unbelievable!

Oct 4, 2008 - 9:58 pm 33. Galen Slade’s Place » Blog Archive » So how’s it going in Chicago, Democrats?:

[...] http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerkimball/2008/10/04/data-points-from-the-windy-city/ [...]

Oct 5, 2008 - 5:37 am 34. andyb:

Apparently airth10, you can neither read nor add, because I just counted 11 facts or links to statistics in Roger’s piece. It took you all night to come up with that rejoinder?
And since you seem to enjoy quick hit & runs, here’s a Chicago-centric story you’ll really like:
On a purely personal, selfish basis, I should vote Democratic this and every election cycle. You see, I am in a quirky corner of the business world that actually tends to do better when Dems are in power, because we have greater opportunities when there is economic dislocation. So with the possibility of 4 years of Obama and an all Democrat Congress, the future is looking pretty bright to me, on a professional basis only. And if that were not enough, our business ALSO benefits from very favorable tax-treatment, all thanks to…yes, you guessed it, A DEMOCRAT!!!!(or more accurately, a long line of Democrats). I know, it’s deliciously ironic, a conservative like me, in a business that prospers when Dems are screwing things up, then gets taxed less than everyone else. Hey, they’re YOUR political choice not mine. How does this relate to Chicago? Well, an old-line Chicago Dem, named D. Rostenkowski, former head of the powerful Ways and Means committee, was instrumental in retaining the great tax treatment that our business enjoys. Years and years of well-placed political contributions to him and subsequent Chicago Dems have secured their loyalty. I was born here, I fully comprehend “the Chicago Way”, as does BO and his crowd.

Oct 5, 2008 - 5:46 am 35. BlueRidgeForum » Is Sarah Free At Last? A “Republican Woodstock” in LA:

[...] to be sure no one will run out of talking points, here are some “Data points from the Windy City” courtesy of Roger Kimball at Arma [...]

Oct 5, 2008 - 9:40 am 36. srlucado:

I was born in Chicago. I attended the University of Illinois at Chicago. I had a lot of fun in Chicago. I was, at age 24, one of the youngest administrative staff members of Rush-Presbyterian-St. Luke’s Medical Center in Chicago. I met my wife in Chicago, and I was married in Chicago, at St. Hyacinth’s.

But all that being said, I got the hell out of Chicago more than two decades ago, and while I miss some things (Italian Beef sandwiches and pizza), I wouldn’t move back on a bet.

It was in the process of becoming a socialist state 25 years ago, and it’s only gotten worse and worse – higher taxes, more crime, bigger and less-effective government, fewer rights, more corruption. (In fact, my former landlady’s grandson became an alderman, right up until his indictment and subsequent conviction.)

Put another way, “That’s not the Chicago I knew.”

And that’s not what I want for America.

Scott

Oct 5, 2008 - 8:39 pm 37. Chicagolander:

I live in the Chicago suburbs. Friday my new property tax bill arrived. At a time of steep declines in real estate, stagnant wages, etc., guess how much it has risen this year (we are reassessed every 3 years)? 25%.

Did you get that? Twenty-five percent. Overnight. My property taxes have nearly doubled in about 4 years, since I moved here.

Forget the 10% sales tax. This is the story in Chicagoland.

Oct 5, 2008 - 11:40 pm 38. airth10:

Chicagolander,

That’s really a data point you’re talking about there. Anyway, you’re probably paying to little in you property tax.

Oct 6, 2008 - 6:23 am 39. andyb:

srlucado,

After living in Cook County for 30 years, I moved in the 90’s to a suburb, just 1 1/2 blocks outside of Cook. It was my personal tax-and-spend emancipation day. I now live in a Republican-run county that budgets according to expected revenues, and my property taxes have gone up roughly in line with CPI, give or take a percentage point, over the last decade. It can be done, spending can be kept in check. Our garbage is still collected, the streets are paved, there are food banks still in operation, people are still treated humanely, police and fire protection is terrific, hospitals continue to treat people. It’s all pretty normal. And I get to look over the Cook County border with glee whenever I cast my gaze eastward. By the way, my parents were marries at St. Hyacinth’s!

Oct 6, 2008 - 7:07 am

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