Roger's Rules

February 15th, 2009 4:11 pm

Now they tell us!

“White House dampens stimulus expectations.”

They haven’t even extracted the money yet and already they’re telling us poor suckers “not to expect instant miracles from the $787 billion economic stimulus bill he will sign this week, but said it would help eventually.”

Eventually? As in that “long run” about which Lord Keynes said, “in the long run we’re all dead”?

Something like that. White House spokesman Robert Gibbs today said that “the economy is going to get worse before it gets better.”

And what about the 3.5 million jobs the current President of the United States said his spending orgy would “save or create.” (Save or create? What does that mean? How would you measure the saved jobs?))

Oops, now it’s 2.5 million by the end of 2010.

But wait, there is a light, sort of, at the end of the tunnel: “Obama himself said last week that if he failed to heal the economy, he would be out of a job by 2012.”

Delayed gratification, to be sure, but something to look forward to.

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29 Comments

1. Instapundit » Blog Archive » NOW THEY TELL US: White House Dampens Stimulus Expectations. No surprise: As was obvious to anyon…:

[...] THEY TELL US: White House Dampens Stimulus Expectations. No surprise: As was obvious to anyone who was paying attention , it was always about paying off [...]

Feb 16, 2009 - 5:30 am 2. djr:

Assuming the 1000+ page bill wasn’t in fact read by Congress, shouldn’t the Supreme Court look at this to decide if the passage is valid – before the Executive signs it?

Feb 16, 2009 - 5:40 am 3. jefered:

This is hardly news. The administration has been setting expectations on the stimulus plan for weeks.

Feb 16, 2009 - 5:40 am 4. John N. Frary:

While Maine’s congressional delegation, Rs and Ds, issue statements confidently counting the jobs created or saved by the bill, the president’s crew issues their ifs-ors-buts and howevers.

“Jobs saved” is the escape clause. No conceivable way for jobs saved to be convincingly calculated.

Feb 16, 2009 - 5:57 am 5. Javier:

The bastard. Obama is an even bigger liar/manipulator than Bill Clinton (whom I actually respect despite his numerous character flaws).

Feb 16, 2009 - 6:00 am 6. Some animals are more equal...:

The Porkulus Bill was never about stimulus. We Democrats have all the power and there’s nothing to stop this $800 billion giveaway to our friends. Don’t like it? Suck it.

Feb 16, 2009 - 6:03 am 7. Pablo Panadero:

When the economy continues to tank leading up to the 2010 elections, the MSM and all of Democracts will be shouting “…but just imagine how much worse it would have been if we had not done the Stimulus!”

Yes, we have just witnessed the greatest monetary transfer from the politically unconnected to the politically connected since the Viking Invasions of Europe in the 8th century. The only comfort is that the Vikings eventually ran out of loot to plunder and eventually settled down to make their own loot. It may take the Democrats a few election cycles to realize that as well. In the meantime, get your money out the the US.

Feb 16, 2009 - 6:13 am 8. Mrs. Jackson:

LA! It looks like the President may have voted ‘present’ for the 146th time of his political career. It seems he’s got issues with his Stimulus Bill that is causing him serious concern. Well, as serious as Obama can convincingly be. From this morning’s NYPost:

“WASHINGTON – President Obama took heat from a powerful Democratic congressman yesterday after top aides suggested Obama may try to change the already-passed stimulus package he’s promised to sign tomorrow…”"Changing the legislation “is not an option,” Frank, the House Financial Services Chairman, told CBS’s “Face the Nation.”".”"This is not, frankly, the Bush administration, where they’re going to issue a signing statement and refuse to enforce it. They will enforce it.”". Obama has not said exactly what changes he might seek – but one of his problems with the $787 billion economic stimulus bill is that it’s tougher on slashing executive pay than he wanted. His aides said yesterday the administration would find a “workable approach” to executive pay.But the stimulus package doesn’t leave much wiggle room, and the aides did not offer any details. Obama “”shares the outrage that most Americans feel about the spectacle of gaudy bonuses,”" senior adviser David Axelrod said on “Fox News Sunday.”"”We all have the same goal . . . And we want to do something that’s workable, and we’ll work with [Congress] to get to that point.”". Obama has slammed Wall Street execs for taking big bonuses, and issued an executive order imposing new rules limiting the salaries of top honchos to $500,000. But his order did not limit stock options and did not apply to every company getting taxpayer aid. The stimulus crafted by Congress goes much further – it limits stock options and applies to any financial institution getting federal bailout cash. CEOs at any company getting bailout money will have bonuses capped at a third of their salaries under the law. At the largest firms getting the biggest bailouts, the top 20 executives would be covered. With stock options severely restricted, executive pay at Goldman Sachs, Bank of America and Citigroup would get slashed by millions of dollars…”

http://www.nypost.com/seven/02162009/news/politics/top_dem_balks_as_o_hints_at_stim_change_155415.htm

Now the cynic in me believes if Obama really is more than just a neighbor of Bill Ayers and his lovely wife Brutus, I mean, Bernadine, then this capping of executive and CEO pay is exactly what he wants. Because overthrowing capitalism has been the Ayers’ goal for the last 40 years or so. Wall Street, like any Harvard Law School student knows works on the bonus structure and those guys and gals earn those bonuses. All this last minute hand-wringing by O’s people in the Administration is to sound ‘correct’ since most of Wall Street backed him for president. And the handwringing has the added bonus (pun intended) of giving Rep. Barney Frank what he’s always wanted; the chance to sound like a tough guy.

But we’ll have to see, won’t we?

Feb 16, 2009 - 6:25 am 9. Sanjay:

The crisis is unprecedented. No amount of belly aching and discourse would justify delay in action. The situation is quite complex that there is no one solution and there is no one outcome. Only the time will tell whether the stimulus was indeed the most effective pill. We have put Obama in White house and should give him time to operate. There is no instant gratification since we are all in it together.

Feb 16, 2009 - 6:28 am 10. red:

—The Porkulus Bill was never about stimulus. We Democrats have all the power and there’s nothing to stop this $800 billion giveaway to our friends. Don’t like it? Suck it.—

Wow, what a rare find! An honest Democrat err.. Fascist. Thanks for the honesty. Now how about your proto-fascist leadership come clean with the American people?

Feb 16, 2009 - 6:33 am 11. deckap:

Everyone associated with the package has been saying from the outset that it isn’t a sliver bullet and that the economy will continue to slide in the short term. To suggest that only now is the admin dampening expectations is either an outright lie or an extreme case of ignorance.
Take your pick boys

Feb 16, 2009 - 7:07 am 12. Obama to America: Suckers!!! | Billoblog ®:

[...] H/T/ Roger Kimball [...]

Feb 16, 2009 - 7:07 am 13. plutosdad:

I thought it was an emergency, that we were losing 600,000 jobs per month and need to pass this right away to stop that? And that anyone who didn’t want to pass this right away was too busy listening to Rush and a partisan?

Now it’s not going to stop the hemoraghing? That the emergency stimulus is actualy a long run stimulus? (Though the CBO says it’s a long run drag).

Are you saying politicians lied to us?

Feb 16, 2009 - 7:12 am 14. Mark Buehner:

This bill was too important to read. It needed to be voted on immediately to stave off a catastrophe of biblical proportions. And as soon as this long valentines day vacation is over, the president will rush back and sign it.

Feb 16, 2009 - 7:17 am 15. David:

“Wall Street, like any Harvard Law School student knows works on the bonus structure and those guys and gals earn those bonuses.”

Bwaahhaahhaaa

This statement is hilarious All these Wall St execs were out leveraging up their companies to get in on the real estate bubble when any fool could see that it was bound to collapse. Now they are running with their hands out for a bailout.

I’m a hard core conservative but any fool that thinks that the massive bonuses that Wall St pay itself are “earned” is nuts.

This bill is still a joke as letting govt flunkies set pay levels is a disaster.

Feb 16, 2009 - 8:16 am 16. Democrat Economy « The American Catholic:

[...] Update II.

Feb 16, 2009 - 8:34 am 17. Mrs. Jackson:

Per 15 :

Hard core conservatives should have a better understanding of the Free Market and Wall Street.

Yes, like it or not, they earn the bonuses.

Feb 16, 2009 - 8:46 am 18. Blacque Jacques Shellacque:

“Only the time will tell whether the stimulus was indeed the most effective pill.”

Wow, so it’s okay to blow a trillion bucks on a big pork bill even though there’s no way to determine in advance whether it’s going to be “effective”?

Feb 16, 2009 - 9:16 am 19. drjohn:

“And what about the 3.5 million jobs the current President of the United States said his spending orgy would “save or create.” (Save or create? What does that mean? How would you measure the saved jobs?))”

Roger, that was my argument the moment it came out of his mouth.

Feb 16, 2009 - 9:19 am 20. Mark:

The economic cycle will ensure that we pop out of this recession and Obama is right to realize that he will occur before 2012 with or without the pork bill. Our expectation is that if he doesn’t have us out by 4Q’09, which is the date the non-partisan CBO says we’ll emerge, then he has failed.

Feb 16, 2009 - 11:08 am 21. AlexinCT:

Why is this coming as a surprise to anyone? Democrats where only able to pass this patronage bill masquerading as a stimulus bill on a partisan vote (3 RINO senators from the NE don’t count). Then the lost Judd Gregg and his support too when he realized he was being used to give democrats cover. Basically this bill is the democrat’s baby. Owned lock, stock, and barrel. It will do nothing to stimulate the economy at all. In fact, the massive borrowing for this payoff bill will dampen any economic upturn that low oil prices and any rebound in the housing market would have caused.

There have been too many people that have pointed out that the democrat’s promise that this bill was absolutely needed, not stimulate the economy, but to avert disaster, was bogus. Everyone that is not a collectivist shill covering for democrats knows this bill is intended to both give the democrats access to tons of cash for the next election and help them institute a massive collectivist takeover of our private sector by government, at the tax payer’s expense. Europe is about to crash economically. Asia will follow that move. The world is looking at a depression, and the democrats are busy using that to grab as much power, as fast as they can. The economy being in the can allows them to preach gloom and doom and institute solutions nobody would accept otherwise. In fact, the democrats already are discussing the next bill, likely to require another $2 trillion in borrowed cash, and intended to do more of the same as the first bill. Hence this need to now get some cover. That’s why they are telling people not to expect much. It leaves the door open to more drastic moves and more borrowing and pay offs.

Our worst enemy right now is the very collectivist ideology that is driving government to wreck our economy. The major underlying reason for our current economic downturn, the stupid practice of forcing banks to loan money to people that can not pay it back in the name of “social justice”, is being made worse by ideologues that now not only wish to keep that underlying cause in place, but whom are then using billions of tax payer dollars to help people that should have never gotten those loans keep what they got. Of course, at the expense of those of us that did the right things. Right has become wrong, good evil. No amount of collectivist talk and money will fix the economic problems we have now if we refuse to address the underlying reasons for those problems. If you are a hard working, tax paying, law abiding citizen that has not borrowed more than you can pay, get ready to receive the shaft from these collectivists for being so stupid.

Feb 16, 2009 - 12:20 pm 22. Moe Lane » Jobs ’saved’ by ’stimulus’ reduced to 2.5 million.:

[...] Wizbang and Roger Kimball, this is actually the latest estimate of Mark Zandi, not the Obama administration itself. What the [...]

Feb 16, 2009 - 2:35 pm 23. Jobs ’saved’ by ’stimulus’ reduced to 2.5 million. - Moe_Lane’s blog - RedState:

[...] Wizbang and Roger Kimball, this is actually the latest estimate of Mark Zandi, not the Obama administration itself. What the [...]

Feb 16, 2009 - 2:39 pm 24. AST:

Why I think the U.S. is doomed:

Feb 16, 2009 - 8:38 pm 25. apostle of love:

Obama is too beholden to special interests to seriously challenge the forces of greed. Sure, they Wall Street pigs might be forced to share a little so some children of workers can eat. However, the kind of redistribution that would provide prosperity for all will never occur as long as the corporate monopoly in the media lasts.

Feb 17, 2009 - 12:51 am 26. dephine:

AlexinCT, you are dead on balls right.

Feb 17, 2009 - 5:46 pm 27. Shawty:

you know..I am a somewhat educated LOW income person.who has been a stay at home mom for 16 years now and i apologize if that pisses people off.. working when i am able and can..choosing to stay home and raise my kids because i thought that was the better choice as a single parent.. with the support of their father.. that he DOES pay faithfully.. but is nowhere in sight as far as moral support..and i am not bitter about that..but it seems to me that all the people on this forum seem to have all the answers..but yet no solutions. I myself only want to see my children have a fighting chance to succeed at life and make something of themselves and have tried to teach them not to hate and be disrespectful..My observation is that the whole country is in a terrible mess right now and all the finger pointing and name calling and hate and discontent is not going to fix that.. so instead of whining about things.. if you have the better answer why don’t you send it to the President and see what he says.. I myself will just do my best every day to take care of what needs my immediate attention and hope like hell the walls don’t fall in around me..for it seems the simple man pays the bills that matter….

Feb 18, 2009 - 4:42 am 28. Whistle_Blower:

NO COMMENT
———-

Found on the 2nd page of every IRS Tax Return Instruction booklet:
——————————————
A Message From The Commissioner: [Commissar?]

Dear Taxpayer,

U.S. Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr. notably said “Taxes
are what we pay for civilized society.”

We should be proud that the vast
majority of American citizens pay their taxes honestly and of their own free
will.

In an ever more complex and global world, we cannot take for granted this
cornerstone principle of our democracy.
———————————————-

SOURCE: http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1040gi.pdf

———————————————-

As I said, no comment.

Feb 18, 2009 - 12:25 pm 29. Whistle_Blower:

NO COMMENT – 2
—————-

UBS ADMITS TO HELPING CLIENTS HIDE ACCOUNTS

- – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - –
UBS will pay $780 million in fines and provide the U.S. with client identities [!] as part of a settlement in which the Swiss bank admits to helping taxpayers hide bank accounts from the IRS.
- – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - -

Well, there goes my 401K.

I thought Justice Holmes (see #28 above) said that “. . .we should be proud. . .” because Americans “. . . pay their taxes honestly and of their own free will.”

[ Full story (subscription) at: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123499439400216483.html ]

Feb 18, 2009 - 3:52 pm