149 Comments

1. michael ledeen:

that’s why we love you Roger. stay out of the rain, pls. I know it’s tough for californians…

Aug 13, 2004 - 7:33 pm 2. Charlie (Colorado):

This actually goes right with what we were talking about at the bottom of the last thread. When these discussions get going — with their invocations of various special code phrases, like “war hero”, or “AWOL”, or “pro-choice” — they’re often not there to promote rational argument, but just to prevent rational argument.

“Philosophy” — “love of wisdom” — and the search for truth are something else.

PS. Glad you’re back. 300-some item threads take too long to load. Did you pick up the chicken soup for me?

Aug 13, 2004 - 7:39 pm 3. Terrye:

I know what you mean. I feel like a misfit. I am not a rich country club Republican or a poor redneck either. I am not a privileged Democrat who hopes to atone for my sins by caring about the little people, nor am I a soccer mom. Nothing quite fits.

I think Bush is trying to do his job. I don’t think Kerry even understand what that job is. Like most other members of his party it is all about him.

Aug 13, 2004 - 7:41 pm 4. ter0:

More than a few commenters have despaired that the MSM was throwing the election to Kerry by failing to cover his flaws, lies, and inconsistent statements. Until recently the polls were not encouraging and the Bush campaign was slow to react to scurrilous attacks.

Notwithstanding the medias efforts, I believe the Cambodia story is the beginning of the end for Kerry because ultimately voters select the candidate who is most likable or as stated here:

The biggest problem for Kerry is that the Swifties’ attacks confirm what we really want to believe about him anyway. He’s been so damned annoying about his Vietnam record that we secretly want to think the worst of him, and now the Swifties have provided a rational basis for that gut-level irritation that Kerry inspires when he blathers on about his war record. This isn’t just bad for Kerry, it’s disasterous: the amorphous negative that normal people have when exposed to Kerry’s “leadership, courage, and sacrifice” / “three purple hearts” mantra now has a core of fact — or at least, alleged fact — around which to crystalize.

Unless Kerry’s campaign manages to completely discredit the Swifties — which seems increasingly unlikely — the campaign is over; Kerry is done. And after Election Day has passed, I expect that anyone looking backwards will wonder why in the world the Democrats ever thought making Kerry’s Vietnam service a centerpiece was a good idea in the first place.

Link

Aug 13, 2004 - 7:55 pm 5. Hovig:

Roger,

Forgive my saying it (and also for going off-topic), but despite the greater difficulty holding it while riding (especially standing), you may have read the wrong paper on the subway this morning. See if you can’t find today’s (Aug 13) New York Times, as I think a very important article was printed there:

Under Eye of U.N., Billions for Hussein in Oil-for-Food Plan

I say it’s important not only because it’s the first time the media outside the Wall Street Journal have focused attention on it, but because it’s generally negative, it’s almost entirely unequivocal, and it’s rather lengthy. I hope many people will read it carefully, because it’s quite a damning piece, especially considering the paper in which it appeared. (Glenn Reynolds linked to this story earlier today, but the version he found was a radically shorter version, edited and reprinted by another paper.)

If the New York Times be against it, who can be for it?

Aug 13, 2004 - 8:19 pm 6. mrp:

via Lucianne.com:

“C-SPAN will replay John Kerry’s 1971 testimony before Congress on Sunday, August 15 at 6:00 EST”

The LComStaff also posted a link to C-Span’s transcript of John Kerry’s 1971 testimony before the US Senate’s Committee on Foreign Relations.

Aug 13, 2004 - 8:25 pm 7. yoshio:

I think the Swiftie story will come out…there must surely be some reporters out there who see this as an opportunity to make a name for themselves in investigative journalism. I hope they are just hunkered down actually verifying the footnotes, etc. provided in the book. On the other hand, I could just be an eternal optimist!

Aug 13, 2004 - 8:28 pm 8. Terrye:

I think two things will kill the Democrats here:

1] The incredible stupidity of using Viet Nam in the first place considering Kerry’s past. I mean come on, this could not have come as a complete surprise.

2] The complete willingness of Democrats to allow some of the mouthiest, richest and most obnoxious people in America to do their dirty work for them. The truth is there is not room enough in that party for me and Michael Moore and I doubt I am the only one to feel that way.

Of course what do I know, the election is still months away.

Aug 13, 2004 - 8:37 pm 9. Goof®:

And then there was this San Francsico Examiner column…

What a smile.

Aug 13, 2004 - 8:40 pm 10. Terrye:

Goof:

You forgot to give us the countdown.

Cheer up, maybe something really awful will happen and your guy can jump on it like a vulture a road kill.

Aug 13, 2004 - 8:50 pm 11. Pat Curley:

Couple new developments in the Kerry story today–Captain Ed has a astounding post on Kerry’s apparently phantom “brother”. And I’ve worked out some of the timeline on January 1969; doesn’t look likely his mission with the Spook could have happened in that month.

On the flip-flops, it’s not that Kerry doesn’t have positions; it’s just that he knows those positions won’t get him elected.

BTW, I’d like to say that the Ex qualifies as major media, but I don’t think that’s accurate anymore.

Aug 13, 2004 - 9:14 pm 12. MeTooThen:

Roger,

OMG!

You wrote the screenplay to Enemies, A Love Story?

Full Disclosure:

I don’t have or watch TV.

I see one or two movies a year, maximum (maybe a few more of late, as I am a Uber-frequent flyer).

I loathe the cult of celebrity.

But I must fawn over you for just this one moment because Enemies is one of the most brilliant films I have ever seen!

Wow.

Who knew?

OK, I’m done. I won’t mention it again.

Back to business.

Aug 13, 2004 - 9:24 pm 13. Goof®:

Terrye

I did it this morning.

I’m happy with the way things are going.

Schwarzenegger also told Snow that, while he supports Bush, he will not criticize Kerry. Schwarzenegger and his wife have a years-long friendship with Kerry and his wife, and have spent time together at one another’s vacation homes around Sun Valley, Idaho.

“I promised myself that in this campaign I would never talk negative about him, because he’s a terrific human being,” Schwarzenegger said. “I just happen to have a different political philosophy.”

Bush and Schwarzenegger have little in the way of a personal relationship and disagree on many social issues, but Schwarzenegger said the president is doing a good job and should be re-elected.

What’s not to be happy about?

Aug 13, 2004 - 9:31 pm 14. Spacerad:

Media aside, this mathematical analysis of the polls shows Kerry leading Bush by quite a bit in the Electoral College.

Aug 13, 2004 - 9:50 pm 15. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

While we are seeing a few cracks in the Iron Curtain of the MSM, I’m not convinced that Kerry criticisms will get the airing they desire.

To see the bias, imagine if 60 folks from Bush’s National Guard unit popped up and said he was a liar an unfit for commit. Does anyone doubt that there would be a mass frenzy among the MSM?

The MSM has gotten surprisingly arrogant. They are going to tell us what to think, because they know what is correct. And what is correct is whatever defeats Bush. The interesting question is what is the impact of alternative media – blogs, email (an email message can travel to a lot of people) and talk radio.

My group is going to have a rally on Sept. 12 in DC. Anyone want to take bets on whether anyone at all reports on it?

The Swifties are the most important veterans group because of their first hand knowledge of Kerry’s various lies and other misbehavior. But there are many veterans groups that started simply as a result of his anti-war behavior – his outrageous allegations about American behavior, his stereotyping of Vietnam Veterans as crazed baby killers, and his many other lies.

Vietnam, for us, is an open sore. It is open because we were betrayed. One of the worst betrayers was John Kerry.

And none of that has even come out yet.

Aug 13, 2004 - 9:51 pm 16. Barry Dauphin:

Welcome back to the land of the blogging, Roger. Here’s a little more grist for the mill or salt for Kerry’s butt wound. This is an interesting analysis of the implausibility of Kerry’s boat trips to Cambodia in December, January,… (I can hear Kerry sing now, “If ever I should leave you, it wouldn’t be in winter…”-but I digress). From Q and O http://qando.net/archives/003799.htm via One Hand Clapping http://www.donaldsensing.com/

Folks can read for the whole post for themselves (including a perceptive comment from someone named Knucklehead), but McQ does a little research into what kinds of boats went where in Vietnam and the chain of command, etc. “Now, you tell me boys and girls, with those assets available to the unit who’s most familiar with the waterways going into Cambodia, why in the world would someone pick PCF 44 and John Kerry and crew, who were totally unfamiliar with the territory, and have them deliver the agent? You’re right … they wouldn’t. Conclusion: Kerry’s Cambodia excursion, which ever version he’s on today, is nothing more than a figment of his imagination and never happened.”

Aug 13, 2004 - 10:22 pm 17. Charlie (Colorado):

Spacerad, it’s an interesting analysis, but there are several things that strike me about it right off the top.

First of all, I’d love to see some post facto analysis of the method, applied against polling data from previous elections. It sounds immediately attractive, but I’m enough of a mathematician to want to see some other support, or a more formal explication of the method.

A second, and more substantial, question is that this method’s predictions appear to be less sensitive to small changes of closely divided states than the actual electoral college system is. Consider, for example, the case where we have already gotten the results of the state elections in all states but Florida, and we know the results in Florida are close. By your method, our expectation value for the number of electoral votes would be very nearly exactly 0.5x where x is the number of electoral votes for Florida.

Once the results of the election are certified, though, the “state vector collapses” — we have a determination, and either Bush or Gore gets x votes. This is very similar, conceptually, to the good old Schroedinger’s Cat — at the time of observation, either the cat is alive or dead, not 50/50.

The point is that I don’t see that the method shows much likelihood of being very predictive, when that little thought experiments suggests it really can’t predictably distinguish between the cases before the observation of the real certified vote.

Aug 13, 2004 - 10:30 pm 18. Katherine:

“I am glad but I am also sad, because the great flaw in Kerry is the great flaw in most of us (in me) — the inability to tell the truth and admit our mistakes.”

Oh, Roger, yes, it is a part of human nature but normal, decent, honest people can not only overcome it, but also realize advantages of being truthful. In addition it is a trait much more pronounced during adolescence, as we grow up and acquire modicum of wisdom we shed it to large degree.

Kerry, poor man, is stuck in his own Vietnamís Neverneverland. He is the ultimate boy who never grew up.

Aug 13, 2004 - 11:15 pm 19. Katherine:

ì300-some item threads take too long to loadî

Charlie, the time to invest in high-speed Internet connection is NOW!

Aug 13, 2004 - 11:23 pm 20. Spacerad:

Replay to Charlie about electoral votes. I’m pretty sure your right that this is not predictive. It has to do with the fact that the polls can change between now and November. Even states that Kerry thinks he has locked up could shift over to Bush under the right conditions.

What this gives you is a good way to assess the current state of the race. If you look at a Gallup poll with Bush 51%, Kerry 48%, that is only telling you how the popular vote would turn out if the election were held today. If everyone in TX decided to vote for Bush it wouldn’t help him in the EV column. Same with Kerry in Calif.

So this lets you view the horse race from the proper perspective, the Electoral College, and gives you a better handle on how things are going where it counts.

If you look at the table, you’ll see that both Bush and Kerry are picking up partial counts from many states. Some of these states Bush would win and some Kerry would win, but on average the result, if the election were held today and the polls are OK (big ifs), Kerry is winning.

I checked my results against a prof. at Princeton and they compare almost perfectly (see link at bottom of page). He gets almost exactly what I get: a 97.5% chance that Kerry gets 296 or more electoral votes.

But you are right, it is a little weird to think about how the collapse of the wave function works out. Bohr didn’t really explain that one either, did he?

Aug 13, 2004 - 11:49 pm 21. Fresh Air:

Spacerad, Charlie–

A little perspective from the 1988 election.

Here is David Broder explaining why the Bush campaign wasn’t doing anything in July 1988:

An eerie serenity pervades the upper echelons of George Bush’s presidential campaign. While Republicans across the ideological spectrum fret that prospective Democratic nominee Michael Dukakis is being allowed to set the pace and agenda of the contest for the White House, Bush and his handful of advisers seem almost nonchalant about the challenge that confronts him.

“I’m very relaxed,” the Vice President said during an interview in the front cabin of Air Force Two, flying out of here the other day. “It’s too late,” he added with a smile, “to be anything else.”

In truth, Bush and his inner circle of strategists-pollster Robert Teeter, chief of staff Craig Fuller, campaign manager Lee Atwater and long- time friend Jim Baker, the Treasury secretary-argue that it is much too soon to worry about early Dukakis poll leads, which have made other Republicans nervous.

Watching the Bush campaign, many Republicans and neutral observers have concluded that it lacks theme, direction or strategy. But conversations with Bush and some of his key advisers suggest that they are operating on different assumptions than their critics about the timing, the tasks and the basic nature of this election. Agree with them or not, the campaign makes more sense if you understand those assumptions.

As to the timetable, Bush believes voters won’t really start to focus on the choice between Dukakis and himself until the conventions have been held, the vice presidential tickets completed and summer vacations have come to an end. “Labor Day,” he says, “is when the campaign begins.”

Then here is the Washington Post from August 29, 1988:

The end of August finds Dukakis’ presidential campaign on an unexpected down slope. Its big July poll lead has vanished, its issues seem a trifle stale, and even the steady-as-she-goes candidate seems to have been thrown off stride by the barrage of “you’re a soft-on-crime, soft-on-defense, soft-on-patriotism liberal” attacks that began flying at him during the Republican National Convention two weeks ago and haven’t let up since.

Some of the best is yet to come.

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:10 am 22. Spacerad:

There was Willie Horton and that picture of Dukakis grinning in the tank. Those were pretty damaging. I think Bush and Kerry have tried all that stuff already. This thing about Bush in his aviator’s suit on the aircraft carrier saying “Mission Accomplished” reminded me a lot of Dukakis, but it hasn’t had any effect. It’s really hard to imagine what they’re cooking up for after Labor Day. Admittedly, though, there’s lots of them and lots of money around to pay for more.

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:22 am 23. JB:

Spacerad: garbage in, garbage out.

Utterly meaningless.

Zogby saves his accurate polls for the night before. This is a well-known fact.

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:34 am 24. Spacerad:

When they’re up, they swear by the polls. When they’re down, they swear at them.

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:43 am 25. Katherine:

ìThis thing about Bush in his aviator’s suit on the aircraft carrier saying “Mission Accomplished” reminded me a lot of Dukakis, but it hasn’t had any effect.î

You must be joking. Dukakis looked like nothing but a wet fish in that tank. Bush in his flightsuit was scorching hot. Take it from a lady. Woof, woof!

Aug 14, 2004 - 1:42 am 26. WichitaBoy:

I’m afraid this was a little too nuanced for me. What are you trying to tell us here, Roger, that you were not in NYC but were near it? Or that you won’t be there until next month after all?

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:21 am 27. Lewis A:

BTW, somebody might want to tell Kerry that Nixon was NOT President during Christmas of ‘68. He didn’t take office until January 1969. So Kerry is wrong about that, too.

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:40 am 28. David Thomson:

ìEven though I am an agnostic, I think there is something in that religious makeup of his that makes him nervous about lying.î

I am a theological modernist and not at all inclined towards George W. Bushís religious persuasion. Still, this is indeed a very important aspect concerning his psychological makeup. I am also convinced that our current nationís leader is very ìnervous about lying.î All politicians have to occasionally fib. Machiavelli was right and this is simply a harsh fact of life. I can live with that. However, I do prefer dealing with somebody who will suffer enormous existential anguish when they feel the need to be deceitful. John Kerry comes across to me as somebody who can lie without batting an eye lash. Itís just too easy for him. The ìChristmas in Cambodiaî lie reveals a lot about his character. So much so, that we should be terrified if he ever became our commander in chief. And no, I am not indulging in hyperbole. A rational person should be very fearful of Kerry making life or death decisions on their behalf.

Aug 14, 2004 - 3:58 am 29. Howard:

I think what all of you are missing is that Bush is an AA (Alcoholics Anonymous) guy and his spirituality comes from that system. I have a bandwidth busting post HERE if you are interested. I think AA is both his blessing and problem.

Aug 14, 2004 - 5:44 am 30. ter0:

Are Blogs the Datsun, Toyota, & Honda of the 21st Century?

The MSM has gotten surprisingly arrogant. They are going to tell us what to think, because they know what is correct.

The wording of John Moore’s comment above triggered a memory that suddenly made the arc of the MSM-decline story clear to me. His description reminded me of how the (then) Big Three Detroit automakers responded to the influx of Japanese-made cars in the 1970s. The public was buying the smaller, more fuel-efficient Japanese models in increasing numbers, but the automakers viewed this concern with fuel economy to be a passing fad. “We’ll tell the American people what they ought to drive,” was the gist of their response. So they continued to make larger, more luxurious cars that were inefficient.

At the time the automakers’ response didn’t seem that unreasonable. The Japanese cars had no styling and (at first, anyway) were rather unreliable. Toyota, Datsun (now Nissan), and Honda had no dealer network to speak of and servicing and repairing the vehicles was problematic. As is now obvious, Detroit was wrong. It has taken them nearly three decades to recover-and even now they do not dominate the American market as they once did.

So what is the parallel to the MSM? Blogs are the Japanese cars of the early-21st Century media market. Some, in particular the MSM, deride them as unpolished, unprofessional, etc. The MSM tells us that we must still turn to them for “reliable” news and “context.”

But the blogs are giving the American thinking public what it wants in real-time, and in time they may develop into quality products that are as trusted (perhaps more so) than the legacy media (as Glenn Reynolds sometimes aptly refers to them).

Go ahead and sneer, NYT, CBS, NBC, WaPo-at your peril. But remember Toyota.

[The normally reticent Mrs. ter0 -- an avid blog reader -- was spurred to write the above; ter0 approves this message]

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:38 am 31. alcibiades:

Nice link to the Truth Laid Bear, TerO.

Also, Lewis A, I think the point has been made loud and clear and irrefutably to the Kerry camp that Nixon was not President in 1968. That’s one of the useful things, for them, about moving the trip to late January and February. Because Nixon was President then.

Also John Moore writes:

“The MSM has gotten surprisingly arrogant. They are going to tell us what to think, because they know what is correct. And what is correct is whatever defeats Bush. The interesting question is what is the impact of alternative media – blogs, email (an email message can travel to a lot of people) and talk radio.”

I think the point is they were always surprisingly arrogant, always infantalizing their audience. It’s just that, while we may have all suspected it pretty strongly before, with the growth of blogs, the thing has become crystal clear. But they are too addicted to their self-conceptions and too jealous of their privileges to want to begin to change. And one of those privileges,? they obviously believe,? is to frame the debate solely so that the candidate they prefers wins the election.

If Kerry does pull off a win with the MSM so in the bag for him and unrepentant about their own censorship on real issues,? the pity of it is that this is an issue that is going to cause major upheaval in the next term. A large part of the drive “to get Clinton” on his sexual proclivities was caused by the fact that there too, in that election, the media did not give proper play to those stories;? they were too enchanted by Clinton’s “charisma.”

The left keeps on claiming, insouciantly, that Bush lied ? because they’re appropriating the methods the right used during the Clinton administration, but in an altogether different situation where they are not appropriate. The terminology is bizarre in the context of Bush’s decision making during war. The left is fighting the previous war, when the terms of the ongoing fight have changed in very meaningful ways. That, in part, explains their unwillingness to face the new situation.

I think the press is setting itself up to start the same kind of war all over again, if Kerry manages to recover from this imbroglio. Whereas if they simply did their job in the first place and reported critically on this story, they would diffuse this load of resentment from the get go.

To misquote Talleyrand: “They have learned nothing and have forgotten everything.”

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:58 am 32. richard mcenroe:

“I am glad but I am also sad, because the great flaw in Kerry is the great flaw in most of us (in me) — the inability to tell the truth and admit our mistakes.” ó Okay, Roger, granted that self-flagellation is the national sport of your people, as Catholic guilt is of mine, but ask yourself this question:

“Did you ever make up a completely fictional woman ó call her “Raquel,” say ó and use her to define and justify your every relationship with women for the last 30 years?

Unless you’ve got a lucky “Raquel” hat hidden in your briefcase somewhere, I think you’re ahead on points…

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:02 am 33. josé maría:

Dear Mr. Roger you write “I am glad but I am also sad, because the great flaw in Kerry is the great flaw in most of us (in me) — the inability to tell the truth and admit our mistakes.” Not many people recognizes even that, I don?t mean to recognize a lie but even recognize that you lie. I appreciate your corage and honesty. In my personal judgement of people you have gained merit and credibility.

Unfortunately to say the truth carry with it many problems that is why we are usually politically correct.

Congratulations from Spain Mr. Roger.

Best regards for you and your people.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:09 am 34. Syl:

Howard

In your linked post you say “One of the problems with Twelve Step People (AA, NA and so on) is that they learn to “turn it over”; meaning that you turn things over to God and that things will work out to the better purpose.”

I disagree. Your characterization of the result of turning it over is too passive.

Turning it over simply frees you to act without the burden of thinking you can control everything. So you act accordingly.

It can be the difference between being a leader and a micro manager.

Besides which there is no requirement that one become religious, but only that one comes to believe that there is a power greater than oneself. It seems to me becoming religious simply confirms it to you on a daily basis, but it is not necessary for the profound personal change to occur.

And that change removes the mind tricks that tell you you can control your drinking while at the same denying to yourself there is a problem anyway. You see that lies and behavior have only one goal…to get the next drink. Once you give up your attempt to control and turn it over to a ‘greater power’ all this nonsense goes poof. It feels like a miracle. Truly.

It is truly liberating.

Disclosure: I turned it over 25 years ago.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:10 am 35. Charlie (Colorado):

Hey, Syl, say “Hi” to Bill for me.

Howard, your description of your problem with AA doesn’t correspond to the actual AA (and other 12 Step) people I’ve known; it does correspond to complaints I’ve heard on a number of occasions from people who aren’t very well informed about AA.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:49 am 36. Terrye:

Syl:

You have my respect. My mother was an alcoholic and that is why I don’t drink. As much as her drinking cost our family, it cost her more. Her last words to me were “I’m sorry”. Nobody should have to hear that from their dying mother.

I think the president understands that he is human. This sounds trite but I am not sure that some people who run for this office do understand that. They have an exageratd view of themselves. There is nothing so humbling as imperfection.

Now let’s just see if the Dems try to drag the hurricane into the election. I hope not. This is awful, people are dead, people have lost everything they own. This will effect the overall economic numbers and I hope it does not effect the race. This is too tragic.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:53 am 37. Charlie (Colorado):

Spacerad, I’m still kind of confused. You agree with me that your scheme isn’t very predictive. As I understand your description, you’re basically multiplying the (constant) electoral votes per state by the poll results of a couple of polls which, as I recall, have often been rather the outliers, to get a hypothetical number of electoral votes per candidate that doesn’t correspond to the way electoral votes are actually allocated.

What’s this scheme good for again?

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:57 am 38. Jamie Irons:

Terrye:

You said

Now let’s just see if the Dems try to drag the hurricane into the election. I hope not.

I actually think that Bush’s appearance in Florida tomorrow is going to help him, both there and across the country. Because he is a genuine (however imperfect) human being, and his sorrow at people’s losses will come across. This can’t be faked.

Jamie Irons

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:00 am 39. Charlie (Colorado):

Terrye: Now let’s just see if the Dems try to drag the hurricane into the election. I hope not.

Too late.

(Radar, my Abyssinian, helped with that link. Amazingly enough, it still works.)

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:03 am 40. Terrye:

Charlie:

Maybe I am wrong but I read that with the shift in population to the southwest in recent years the president’s chances of an electoral college vote victory is actually enhanced.

Besides that it is too soon to be sure of anything. Too many things can happen too fast.

Just look at Florida this morning and compare it to Florida two days ago. Who knows what the ultimate impact of a disaster like this might be?

Life can not be predicted or projected.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:19 am 41. penwil:

Charlie:

Have you every looked at the http://www.electionprojection.com site? I’m wondering what you think of the methodology used there.

For whatever it’s worth, as of August 10, he has Kerry with 296 electoral votes and Bush with 242. However, just ten days before, on August 1, he projected Kerry with 327 and Bush with 211. Which proves, I suppose, how fluid it all still is, and how ultimately pointless it is to call a November 2 election on August 14th.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:28 am 42. Pat Curley:

Barry Dauphin, the PCF-44 is out because three of the crew members are on record as saying they never went to Cambodia (including two of the vets who were on stage with Kerry at the DNC). Kerry’s only hope is the 94. However, if he’s trying to make it into Cambodia in January 1969, he’s got problems because he only commanded the 94 for the last two days of that month.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:55 am 43. Jamie Irons:

OT to Charlie (Colorado):

I always seem to catch up with your posts long after you’ve written them, but in talking about one method (and it seems dubious to me, as it does to you) of projecting the Electoral College vote, you made an analogy with quantum mechanics (which I took at Yale, but have mostly forgotten, though I’m still good at the algebraic underpinnings

Once the results of the election are certified, though, the “state vector collapses”…

Have you read about the still controversial, but fascinating, redoing of (the quantum mechanical version of) the double slit experiment, by the Iranian American physicist Shahriar Afshar? If his work holds up, the “Bohr interpretation” of quantum mechanics itself collapses.

Jamie Irons

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:34 am 44. Doug:

Welcome to the Big Apple Roger.

I think you can sum up my feelings of the Democratic party (to which I technically still belong) this way: They not only have a problem with “truth”. Truth no longer seems to be a value they highly value. It is like a mini version of Marxism. Except instead of “the party line” they call it “talking points”. It simply does not matter to loyal Democrats that Kerry is obviously a disembling liar and likely a total fraud. To normal people like you and me, Bush seems basicallyd ecent and honest. To today’s Dems, he is a total liar because that’s what they have become so they assume the Republicans must be the same. I must say when I hear the voice of Lanny Davis I get physically ill. I think they actually believe that these swift boat veterans are scurillous liars and Kerry is honest just like all those who picked ont he poor innocent President Clinton. Times are too tough now to trust a disembler. I would support Bush even if a decent man (or woman) was opposing him because I think he merits re-election. But Kerry and his sycophants are dispicable and I really hope they go down in flames.

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:55 am 45. Robert Schwartz:

Kerry made his 4 months in Vietnam the centerpiece of the Democratic convention, glossed over his participation in V.V.A.W. and ignored 20 years in the US Senate. This was done deliberately so he could run to the middle. I saw an ad tonight clipping his acceptance speech with guff about a strong military and strong alliances with France. The real issue is who is the real John Kerry? Was the convention John Kerry, the real John Kerry?

My own take on the convention is that the whole thing was phony as a three dollar bill. If the convention had reflected what was really on the delegates minds, they would have demanded immediate withdrawal of American troops from Iraq, termination of American aid to Israel, war crimes trials for Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz and reparations.

But what about Kerry? Who is the real Kerry? Did the convention show the real John Kerry? or is the real John Kerry the guy who was the V.V.A.W. mouthpiece, who threw somebody’s medals or ribbons over the fence and who in a twenty year Senate career has earned highest marks from the ADA while accomplishing almost nothing?

I think most Republicans would like to run against the hard core leftist. But I don’t think it’s that simple.

I think the real John Kerry is nothing. He is hollow on the inside. He has no core. He has only ambition. He marries for money and social status. He adopts politics for temporary advantage. The accident of his initials gave shape to his military career (thus the choice of the Navy, volunteer for the swift boat, buy the movie camera, hope to star in his own personal PT109) and his route to the senate. When he got back from Viet Nam, the wind was blowing out of the other quarter. Easy, join V.V.A.W., throw medals (not your own they might come in handy later) go back to Massachusetts and do what ever Teddy Kennedy does.

Look at the way he handled the primaries. Dean picks momentum as the “anti-war candidate.” Kerry, who had said it would be wildly irresponsible to vote against the Iraq funding bill, votes against it to cut Dean off. This leads to mocking commercials by the Republicans.

Why are the Swift Boat guys after Kerry. You may if you wish impugn their motives or you can pull Karl Rove out of the magician’s hat, or you can claim Bush put them up to it (on those days when you don’t think he is too stupid to walk and chew gum at the same time). My guess, and I don’t know any of them, is that they are angry, they are angry at John Kerry because they believe that he is a user who used them, they are angry at the media who defamed then in the 1970’s, they are angry at the liberals who have indicted them as war criminals and baby killers (based in part on John Kerry’s testimony) and convicted them without ever giving them a chance to defend themselves; and this anger has festered with compound interest for a generation. They see their fathers lionized as the greatest generation, their children sent to Iraq with respect and the first member of their generation to be lauded is the one who betrayed them. Lord that must hurt.

If I were in their shoes, I would write a book if I had to do it longhand, and I would make sure the word got out if had to stand on street corners and shout. If I went to Rove and he sent me to some guy in Texas with money and a publishing house in NYC so much the better. But my guess is that the CREP has had minimal contact with this.

Kerry’s problem with the Swift Boat book is not that it will make him out to be a liar or a coward. But that it will make him out to be what he is, a hollow man.

Last spring I saw a Maureen Dowd column about Kerry. I quit reading MoDo a couple of years ago after Bush Derangement Syndrome crippled her. But that column contained a gem of a quote:

“It’s not often that you get a presidential candidate to recite poetry to you, especially in a year when W. and J.F.K. are going macho a macho.

But there was Mr. Kerry flying from Boston to New Orleans on Friday, sipping tea for his hoarse throat and reeling off T. S. Eliot’s

“Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock.”

“There are so many great lines in it,” he said. ” ‘Do I dare to eat a peach?’ ‘Should I wear my trousers rolled?’ ‘Let us go, through certain half-deserted streets/The muttering retreats/Of restless nights in one-night cheap hotels/And sawdust restaurants with oyster-shells.”

Then he started on “Gunga Din” and ” ‘talk o’ gin and beer.’”

I thought that the following lines from Proofrock were a perfect motto for the Kerry campaign

Do I dare

Disturb the universe?

In a minute there is time

For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

For I have known them all already, known them all:ÔøΩ

Have known the evenings, mornings, afternoons,

I have measured out my life with coffee spoons;

I know the voices dying with a dying fall

Beneath the music from a farther room.

So how should I presume?

But one of my friend’s suggested that another Elliot poem would be more appropriate:

The Hollow Men

Mistah Kurtz — he dead.

A penny for the Old Guy

I

We are the hollow men

We are the stuffed men

Leaning together

Headpiece filled with straw. Alas!

Our dried voices, when

We whisper together

Are quiet and meaningless

As wind in dry grass

Or rats’ feet over broken glass

In our dry cellar

Shape without form, shade without colour,

Paralysed force, gesture without motion;

Those who have crossed

With direct eyes, to death’s other Kingdom

Remember us — if at all — not as lost

Violent souls, but only

As the hollow men

The stuffed men.

Of course the literary connection runs deeper than that. The rubric of the poem is from Conrad’s Heart of Darkness, which Coppola filmed as Apocalypse Now, which Kerry has worked into his personal narrative as his secret mission up the Mekong.

The thing about truth is that we can not stand it, we seem always to have to push our lives into the narratives we have heard of grander things, we never want to confront our own pettiness, our own selfishness our own errors — our own humanity. The thing about great art, whether Singer, Elliot, Conrad or Coppola, is that it returns us always to the truth, to the heart of darkness.

The Swift Boat vets are laying him Kerry bare, not as a liar, not as a coward, but as a hollow man.

Aug 14, 2004 - 11:22 am 46. ambisinistral:

Here’s a disturbing Kerry article by David Brooks, Kerry’s Cruel Realism (published in the NYT).

It discusses Kerry criticizing a Cuban dissident acxtivity called Varela Project, and the resultant Cuban government crackdown on it. Kerry called the Varela Project counterproductive because it “has gotten a lot of people in trouble.”

The context of Kerry’s statements was a discussion of Bush’s tightening of the embrago against Cuba. His proposal was to open travel to Cuba to fascillitate person-to-person contacts. While there may be some merit in that position, it is incredible that he would be so politically hamfisted as to pull out the rug from underneath an indiginous Democratic movement in Cuba.

Kerry’s foreign policy, at least what can be made of it through all the smoke and mirrors, seems to be using multilateralism as a screen for a new isolationism.

Aug 14, 2004 - 11:46 am 47. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

Robert Schwarz

It is illegal for the SBVT folks to have anything to do with Karl Rove. That is part of the idiotic campaign “reform” set up by Kerry’s friend, McCain, and signed by Bush in the mistaken expectation that the Supreme Court would actually pay attention to the Constitution. This is a reason that the MSM’s attacks (straight from the Kerry spinmeisters) calling these guys Republican shills is so absurd.

I know some of the Swifties. Your guesses on motives are partly correct, but it goes farther – patriotism – the fear of what would happen to the country with Kerry as President.

As far as funding from Republican sources, O’Neill is a prominent Houston corporate litigator. I would expect he would know lots of heavy hitters. He, however, is not a Republican.

By the way, has anyone seen an article in either the NYT or WAPO mentioning the SBVT and their commercial and book yet? The last I heard, those venerable “news organs” were serving their readership by protecting them from having to know about this potentially distressing event.

Ambisinistral

You link didn’t work. But if you consider the way Kerry dealt with the North Vietnamese in Vietnam (he met with them in Paris during his anti-war years), and the Sandinistas in the ’80s (he met with them within 2 weeks of joining the senate), you just might suspect that he likes Communist dictators.

One group attending our Kerry Lied rally is Cuban-American Vietnam Veterans.

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:04 pm 48. PeterUK:

Roger

“The inability to tell the truth and admit our mistakes”.

But these don’t appear to have been mistakes but deliberate career moves,one can have sympathy for human frailty.When entire life seems to have been built on mendacity and has culminated in a bid for the highest office in the land,to me that is not a mistake it is something else.

Who said “Cheats never prosper”?

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:04 pm 49. marek:

The evidence of Kerry’s complicity in a big lie and a collusion to perpetrate this lie is gaining strength:

link

Perhaps the MSM are waiting for the book publication to “come out” from their denial closet, but it will be unforgivable to let this story die.

As a neighbour – I do not wish Kerry to be your president for your, our and world’s sake.

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:10 pm 50. ambisinistral:

Try this link:

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:14 pm 51. ambisinistral:

Bah, that didn’t work either.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/19/opinion/19BROO.html?ex=1402977600&en=25bb43d6573a1f8c&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:14 pm 52. Samuel:

Roger,

I swore to myself that I had exceeded my commenting quota for at least a month and would not comment but I must say this non-WOT post of yours puts into words my sentiments perfectly.

Like you, my original sick feelings came from Clinton’s and the the Democratic Party’s totally hoping on board to save him. No Howard Baker type emerged to treat it seriously, not one Barry Goldwater type to go make Clinton deal with the truth. That coupled with some knowledge of things I will never divulge but know that are even more incriminating to Clinton and what a bad actor he was. But the Democrats are too interested in propping up myth’s and creating an images to be bothered with such things.

I also agree with your assessment on Bush. People can say what they want and there is much to criticize, but painting him the dishonest prevaricator is very difficult for me to take. Disagree with ones policy and point out honest truths as one sees them. This is not however what the MSM and Democrats have been doing. Every thing is in extreme bad faith. Sure the Republicans have their warts and bad actors, and aren’t perfect, but in my opinion it takes an extremely partisan person to believe the Democratic Party behaves with more principled and is not a more hypocritical Party. I have looked from both sides now and there is no comparison. On that and similar points Terrye has most often articulated this the best. Immaturity is a very good word to describe Democratic Leadership. Roger, as I wrote you the other day I have had the opportunity to add people from the Republican side to my list of acquaintances. (I already had plenty on the Democratic side). I will tell you, forget ideology, if one simply weighs quality of character of the individual involved then there is just no comparison, especially in the Senate. People like Senator Warner even make people like Jay Rockefeller look quite unprincipled and disingenuous. Evan Bayh is probably my favorite Democrat as far as being intellectually honest but he is unique and Joe Biden is a blowhard.

In truth I have said the WOT trumps all, but as I have said before, I have come to respect principled people period and the Republicans have many more by percentage of those involved. I feel I know enough here in Washington to make that judgment and that is all that matters to me people can spin this to death. While I am more religious than I was before, I am not one to have religion be much political deciding factor. But I agree with you Roger in that Bush has what I would call a “Ned Flanders” side (though Bush is obviously infinitely more macho then Ned!). This is a quality that quite frankly does more to seal my allegiance to him then any because I believe he will keep his word. I know the nuanced Kerry, he will settle into whatever works for him whenever that day comes, principle has little to do with it, or should I say his principles are so out of line with the nation and unlike Reagan or Bush he will not risk all doing what he knows is right. He can’t govern from his heart because the people wouldn’t put up with it so we are left with a nuanced weasel.

Bush is not going to waste time flattering the voters like Clinton. If people decide to punish Bush for forcing this nation to consume our medicine now rather than wait for a worse condition with even more bitter pills to deal with later, worse on our children, and that will be our loss. Looking back I see very little gained by having Clinton during the 90’s, I don’t care what anyone says, a second Bush I term would not have changed much (other then maybe avert the Republican tide of 1994).

To Roger, Catherine and Terrye, playing the middle maybe ok, but for me casting one’s lot one way or another isn’t. Trust me, changing Party affiliations was one of the more difficult things I have ever done as for me because it was almost like changing Religions, I did it for self therapeutic reasons. I am glad I did and I’ll switch back one day if that is proper. I’ll be a suburban Republican until at least 2008. I will vote for a moderate Democrat if such occasion arises. But my default in the face of ambivalence or a tough choice will be Republican because the Party is run by grown ups. Dennis Hastert is more of a grown up and better than any Democrat I see in the House, Nancy Pelosi is a non-starter. Would I vote for Barbara Boxer? Hell no! When the Democrats grow up I’ll reconsider them.

There are many wonderful Democrats in this great land of ours, however the vetting process on the National level is so horrid as to disallow them to rise to the top. We are left with Pat Leahy, Ted Kennedy, Nancy Pelosi and a DNC that is so cynical and hypocritical as to make me puke. When I see the Democrats treat Al Sharpton as a liberal equivalent to David Duke, or when I see them treat Michael Moore not as a liberal equivalent to Rush Limbaugh but as a lying inciter of hatred with facts acting as nothing more then a simple inconvenience to overcome, then I’ll take notice.

The Democratic Party has become the Party of fanning prejudice, playing to the worse instincts in people, dividing people into groups and interests that are all “what about me”. How long ago this has been coming I know not, but I know that this is where they are at. The Democrats need a Reagan type politician. Clinton was not it. What would be it? A person with Clinton like political abilities and Bush like stubborn principled ways, agree policy wise or not, that is exactly what Ronald Reagan was.

Roger you have been kind enough to compliment me on my posts before. For me this is your best non-WOT post. Thank You.

-JSF

Aug 14, 2004 - 12:31 pm 53. Knucklehead:

Marek:

I hope others have looked at the link to Captains Quarters that you left us. Thanks, BTW. I sometimes worry that I’ve become obsessed with this Swiftboats thing, but this points to one of Kerry’s key Band of Brothers, the guys who “served on the same boat” and are used to dismiss the claims of the other 200 people who only served “near” Kerry, yet this guy was only assigned to Kerry’s boat in the strictest of record-keeping senses. (I’m presuming that he wouldn’t have been taken off the boat’s crew roster until it was determined that he wasn’t returning due to his wounds).

Here is a link to the transcript of Rev. Dan Alston’s Dem convention speech. One line from that speech…

I know him from a small boat in Vietnam, where we fought and bled together, serving our country. There were six of us aboard PCF-94, a 50-foot, twin-engine craft known as a “Swift Boat.”

What is up with this? And why doesn’t the MSM have any interest in this? They cannot be that derelict in their duty, can they?

Aug 14, 2004 - 1:49 pm 54. Terrye:

Samuel:

My ears were burning and here you are talking about me.

Evan Bayh[D] is a pretty rational person. So is Dick Lugar[R]. Both are senators from Indiana. They can actually have a civil conversation without either one invoking Hitler’s name, unless of course they are discussing the history of WW2. But then that is Indiana and note that Bayh is not on the ticket. Too sane for the DNC.

Samuel, like I have said time and again I make no predictions but these are dangerous times and I will not give my support to the sore loser cry baby party. In the long run they will pay for this even if they win the election. Maybe particularly if they win it. I have not changed parties because in Indiana you don’t register one party or another. You just register. In primaries you tell them which party you cast a vote for.

I know the fondest desire of the Democrats is that we get Kerry in and pull out the troops and the Europeans love us again. The truth is the Euros are not going to love us whoever wins this election and if we pull out the troops all those Iraqis who believed in us and risked their lives to build a new future for themselves and their families will suffer, perhaps even die. I guess that thought does not bother Kerry now anymore than it did when we pulled out of Viet Nam and left those people to face the music without us. I am not ashamed to call myself an American, but if we cut and run I will be.

Aug 14, 2004 - 1:53 pm 55. marek:

Knucklehead,

I suspect that the MSM and you would not agree on what their duty is.

I even can’t say anymore that I’m disgusted with MSM and I sincerely hope that the time of reckoning will come and Americans will find a way to educate these “our betters”.

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:03 pm 56. Charlie (Colorado):

Have you every looked at the http://www.electionprojection.com site? I’m wondering what you think of the methodology used there.

Penwil, I have; both of them are essentially “horserace” sites, although both electionprojection and Spacerad’s site are informed by understanding the difference between the popular vote and the electoral college vote, something our brethren in the Democrat Patry seem to still have some trouble with.

As such, I think there’s a good reason to watch them as a way to follow the horserace, and with some groovy graphics. As you say, electionprojection site seems to show small poll changes as fairly large changes in the electoral vote.

On the other hand, I haven’t seen either one of them attempt to justify their methodology as a predictive device, say with analysis of past races.

Ray Fair’s econometric model has that historical test, but I’m not completely comfortable with the idea that elecions are economically determined — although Ray is an economist, to be Fair.

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:28 pm 57. Fresh Air:

Knuckle–

I did as much legwork as I could on the Alston story. The facts are ambiguous. The key is whether he shipped stateside after receiving the head wound on Peck’s boat (or was still in the hospital when Kerry went home in March).

I think Capt. Ed is at a dead end until somebody can prove he wasn’t there between January and March.

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:31 pm 58. Charlie (Colorado):

Jamie, re: Shahriar Afshar — I haven’t read anything, but I’ve just googled it.

My open email address is in my Typepad profile, or should be — drop me a note.

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:32 pm 59. richard mcenroe:

Roger ó I gather you are drawing a distinction between taking a side and joining a party.

Hugh Hewitt has some excellent thoughts on this in If It’s Not Close, They Can’t Cheat, where he points out that, like it or not, every election is basically a binary choice: you vote for the person who helps or hurts your perceived interests. It’s lovely to say, well, I like Bush on the war but I don’t care for his churchin’ or his social policies, but if you vote against Bush for those, then you lose him on the war… and you lose on all three of those concerns. That’s why single-issue bloggers like Andy Sullivan go to such lengths to look as though they are addressing a variety of issues. They don’t know or don’t care what they’re costing themselves and this society in the long run…

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:40 pm 60. Charlie (Colorado):

I think the real John Kerry is nothing. He is hollow on the inside. He has no core. He has only ambition. He marries for money and social status. He adopts politics for temporary advantage. The accident of his initials gave shape to his military career (thus the choice of the Navy, volunteer for the swift boat, buy the movie camera, hope to star in his own personal PT109) and his route to the senate. When he got back from Viet Nam, the wind was blowing out of the other quarter. Easy, join V.V.A.W., throw medals (not your own they might come in handy later) go back to Massachusetts and do what ever Teddy Kennedy does.

Yeah, what you said.

Aug 14, 2004 - 2:43 pm 61. Rick Ballard:

Penwil,

I’ll strongly second Charlie (C)’s approval of Ray Fair’s analysis with the caveat that his only significant miss was in ‘92. The media coverage of Clinton in that election is eerily similiar to what they are attemting to do on Kerry’s behalf today. Of course, the economy was the sole security issue in ‘92. Physical security will probably weigh as heavily as economic security in the final decision in ‘04.

In addition to Fair’s site I would reccommend this Pew Research Report and the repetitive Gallup polls. Specialized Gallup polls aren’t any better than any other polling companies reports but they have a few polls that they consistently repeat that do measure change in attitude. Pew research has a few additional reports that are interesting but most of them utilize either too small a sample or are poorly focused with respect to determinative political issues.

Bush 54%-57%

Aug 14, 2004 - 3:15 pm 62. richard mcenroe:

Another nail in the Kerry coffin, courtesy of

Aug 14, 2004 - 3:35 pm 63. Rick Ballard:

Richard,

At keast give us a hint.

Aug 14, 2004 - 3:37 pm 64. richard mcenroe:

Mark Steyn ‚Äî links are your friend…

Aug 14, 2004 - 3:37 pm 65. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó If he was transferred back to the unit, there would be records: unit personnel reports, pay records, transfer orders from hospital to unit, remembrances of other crew…

Aug 14, 2004 - 3:39 pm 66. Robert Schwartz:

John Moore:

I accused the Swifties of nothing. I just tried to put myself in their place. I said:

“If I went to Rove and he sent me to some guy in Texas with money and a publishing house in NYC so much the better. But my guess is that the CREP has had minimal contact with this.”

I also said:

“If I were in their shoes, I would write a book if I had to do it longhand, and I would make sure the word got out if had to stand on street corners and shout.”

I accept that patriotism is a plausible and worthy motive. It is just that my shriveled heart runs on fear and anger.

My global point was that Kerry was best understood through the great art that best illumed the dark tunnels of the 20th century. Singer, Elliot, Conrad, Coppola. Kerry is not a heroic figure, not a tragic figure, he is a pathetic figure; The uncomprehending white man hearing the words: “Mistah Kerry — he dead.”

Aug 14, 2004 - 4:11 pm 67. Fresh Air:

Richard–

I understand a bunch of paperwork would have been generated had Alston returned to Kerry’s unit. But the fact that Capt. Ed can’t locate it is not dispositive evidence that it doesn’t exist.

I think Alston probably isn’t the guy in the famous photo, BTW, and that Alston’s story is Clintonian bunk.

P.S. Another great piece by The Master of Diaster from New Hampshire. Thanks for the link.

Aug 14, 2004 - 4:57 pm 68. wu-ping:

Quite an echo chamber in here.

Aug 14, 2004 - 5:07 pm 69. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

Robert Schwartz

I never meant to accuse you of accusing. I just wanted to hit the idea of collusion between the Swifties and the Bush Campaign by pointing out that it is illegal.

Aug 14, 2004 - 5:17 pm 70. Roberts:

So, wu-ping, contribute something.

Aug 14, 2004 - 5:31 pm 71. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Captain Ed’s got another picture up, of Kerry’s “band of brothers” posing with their medals. No Alston.

Aug 14, 2004 - 5:37 pm 72. Knucklehead:

Fresh Air

I agree that nothing available is conclusive. But as far as seems available record-wise, Alston was not part of Kerry’s crew until Kerry took over PCF94 (apologies if I have the PCF number wrong but either way its Kerry’s second PCF command – I’m not bothering to look up the PCF number because the two digits don’t matter to the point). But Alston was in hospital with pretty serious wounds on the day that Kerry took command and there seems to be no evidence he ever returned to combat duty and, IIRC, some good evidence Alston went back stateside without ever returning to duty on PCF94.

If you look at Alston’s DNC speech (and I read the transcript several times) there is nothing in there that specifically says, “I was on John Kerry’s boat in combat” but there is a ton of stuff that clearly implies that – stuff like “shed blood together” and the like. There’s Plausible Deniability in there but it won’t wash, IMO. Alston seems to have been presented as one of the “on the boat with John” guys yet, at best, was (like the majority of Swiftvets) merely fighting “near” Kerry.

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:13 pm 73. Fresh Air:

Richard—

I saw the photo of the sailors in their Dixie Cups with their medals. That pic was almost certainly taken in March, since it looks like Kerry is wearing his Silver Star. The picture does indeed include Short, who was Alston’s replacement.

But in order for this story stay nailed down we need some proof Alston was out of country or in hospital during February and March. Any takers?

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:17 pm 74. Fresh Air:

Knuckle–

You have the facts and inferences right. The issue is whether Alston could have rejoined Kerry and actually seen combat between Feb. 1 and March 17 when Kerry blew (was blown) out of there. We need strong evidence, like Alston’s medial records, to prove this for certain.

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:22 pm 75. Knucklehead:

Fresh Air,

Exactly. Now we have two people who need to familiarize themselves with Form 180

Kerry took over a boat for roughly 6 weeks. If I am reading what info is available correctly, in that 6 weeks he went on something like 18 patrols with the boat and collected all 3 medals and 2 of his three Purple Hearts. Alston was in the hospital, and had just gotten there, with serious wounds. He may have returned to combat status as a crewman on what was now Kerry’s boat but it seems somewhat unlikely. The “sense” I get from the little “evidence” available is that Alston was basically processed out of theater and sent home – the Millon Dollar Wound, if you will.

Nothing about that suggests anything negative about Alston… until he gives the speech at the DNC where he seems to pretty clearly imply that he made a significant number of patrols with Kerry at his boat commander and fought hard and shed blood and knows what a fine commander Kerry was. This doesn’t seem likely given 6 weeks of Kerry command on that boat, something like 18 missions, and Alston on Day One with a nasty head wound. Even money plus says Alston didn’t ride patrol with Kerry as his commander even once and even if he did ride on Kerry’s boat as a crewman, it wasn’t nearly what he implied it was. At the very least it wipes away the “the Swiftvets against Kerry didn’t serve on his boat while the ones for Kerry did” meme.

While fully acknowledging that I am anti-Kerry I will also claim that I’ve put the best due dilligence I am capable of into examining the info available and have come to the conclusion (subject to more and/or surprising info) that Kerry is full of shit about his heroism and Cambodia.

Additionally it seems to me that Kerry either seriously misled his campaign staff or that his staff is complicit in constructing a clear falsehood (OK, maybe just a wild stretch) regarding his Vietnam service. Either way it ain’t good. If info keeps piling up and he misled his staff some of them should soon head for the hills if for no other reason than personal integrity (there must be some of that left in the Democratic Party, musn’t there?). If they were complicit in constructing the falsehood, well, I never had any doubt the Dems are irretrievably corrupt.

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:52 pm 76. Knucklehead:

BTW, what could Alston be thinking to join this charade?

Aug 14, 2004 - 6:55 pm 77. Fresh Air:

Knuckle–

I agree with you. I have spent at least four hours today looking at old newspaper articles and online resources to try to verify the story. At a minimum, there has been some misdirection by the campaign staff regarding the actions of PCF94 on Jan. 29, i.e. Kerry claiming to have been in the firefight in which Alston was wounded, when Lt. Peck was commanding. But as relates to the charge that Alston never served a day with Kerry, IMHO we are still missing that holy nugget of certitude.

As to what would motivate Alston–a man of the cloth, no less–I haven’t the foggiest. Maybe he forgot whose boat he was on. A lot amnesia going on around in the Kerry camp these days.

Memo to anyone living in Columbia, S.C.: Find an old newspaper account of David Alston getting wounded and sent home in Jan. 1969 and you have yourself a bonafide scoop!

Aug 14, 2004 - 7:05 pm 78. Samuel:

Terrye

Amen to your post and yes Richard Lugar is a good non partisan, Lee Hamilton is/was also very reasonable. I especially appreciate your last sentence about being an ashamed American if we cut and run because we are Americans first and members of political parties second.

wu-ping

An echo is uniquely determined by what one says. Please by all means do yourself proud.

.

Aug 14, 2004 - 7:23 pm 79. richard mcenroe:

Roger — Smoking Gun found on Kerry’s attempt to dodge the draft before joining the Navy.

And you know, the Reverend Alston could put a stop to this by showing his records, too…

Aug 14, 2004 - 7:57 pm 80. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air et al ó Generally, if a soldier or sailor had to be sent away from his unit for more than a few days’ medical treatment, he would not find himself sent back into the same exact unit, IIRC from my day (“Knap that flint, private!”), unless by happy coincidence there was another opening in that squad, platoon or, in this case, boat (mind you, that coincidence might not have been all the happy for the guy leaving the opening…). If he was away long enough, Alston might not even have been sent back to CoastDiv13. So the odds favor Alston not having been on the boat, especially if it took no further casualties during Senator Gilligan’s three-hour tour… of course, Alston could clear that up in a second with his own records…

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:04 pm 81. richard mcenroe:

If this guy is right, Kerry rats himself out about requesting a Purple Heart under false pretenses…

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:19 pm 82. Terrye:

Samuel:

My number one concern is that we do not abandon this endeavor. I am not so partisan or short sighted that I do not realize that people’s lives are at stake. Too bad the same can not be said for all those progressive folks out there who think so damn highly of themselves.

I just hope that if that idiot Kerry actually manages to win he does not disgrace us all by running away. We will never be taken seriously again and there will be no way to stop the likes of AlQaida. Like it or not the world is counting on us whether they or us realize it. So I am hoping that when JFK the lesser is spouting that crap about making it up with the French and pulling out and all the rest he is just appeasing the dip shits.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:33 pm 83. Terrye:

wu ping:

Don’t be shy little feller. We won’t bite.

Honest.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:36 pm 84. Rick Ballard:

Folks,

This forum at swiftvets (now closed to further comment) has more points on the Alston matter. They don’t say why the forum has closed but I’m guessing that enough info has now turned up to falsify the Kerry/Alston link.

Additionally, I wasn’t aware that two of Kerry’s band of brothers were actually campaign coordinators (in Arkansas, oddly enough). No proof that the position is paid. If the Alston/Kerry connection proves (as seems likely) to be false, then the entire “band of brothers’ theme is as phony as a $3 bill. The reason being that Alston was the only one of the merry band to have spoken at the convention. If the other crew members stood and watched a man that they knew had not actually served under Kerry deliver an address in their name then one can logically ask the nature of the “tie that binds” these men together. If Alston did not in fact serve under Kerry, then he has my sympathy. Kerry contacted him in ‘96, he did not volonteer. So many, many lives corrupted by one man’s overweening arrogance. For him to think he could get away with this is practically unimaginable.

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:53 pm 85. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

Basic rule: if you elect an opportunist, his policy claims a meaningless. He will do whatever he feels like.

Kerry is an opportunist.

QED

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:54 pm 86. Charlie (Colorado):

Oh, Richard, isn’t that interesting?

That appears to be original reporting by Charles Laurence of the Telegraph too.

(Although I swear I’d heard that before, about the ddenied deferment and all.)

The Telegraph isn’t exactly the Weekly World News, either.

Isn’t this interesting?

Aug 14, 2004 - 8:54 pm 87. Rick Ballard:

Charlie (C),

That forum I linked is even more interesting. I just don’t think the MSM/DNC is going to be able to keep the lid on this.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:08 pm 88. Charlie (Colorado):

Sorry, Rich, I didn’t mean to diss your forum. I just scanned a good bit of it — including the fascinating discussion of FITREPs; I plan to ask my Uncle who was a senior Naval officer about them — but the thing that really struck me was that the Telegraph is now apparently really pursuing the story.

It’s showing up in the SF Examiner and the Rocky Mountain News, even if only as op-eds so far.

It’s been around for more than a week now, and the book doesn’t even come out until Tuesday, I don’t think.

It looks like this story is finding its “legs”.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:13 pm 89. Rick Ballard:

Charlie (C),

That’s the third (I believe) article in the Telegraph. I agree entirely with you and Richard that it is very interesting. Most interesting to me is the fact that they chased down the author to verify it. That indicates that the Telegraph has decided to put some dough behind the story. A couple more scoops by the Telegraph and I don’t see how the coverup can be continued.

Drudge is doing hurricane and Olympics coverage right now but I’d bet he picks it up by morning. Facts are very hard things.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:28 pm 90. Erik:

Not sure if this has allready been posted here, but I found an interview with Alston in the Charlotte Observer (07/27/2004). I could read it thru the Google cache:

http://www.google.se/search?q=cache:LTlqxgcsYp8J:www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/news/politics/9251042.htm%3F1c+david+alston+vietnam&hl=sv

“David Alston spent four months alongside John Kerry, 35 years ago.”

“Kerry took over command of Alston’s boat, PCF-94, after a battle in which the boat’s previous lieutenant had been injured. Alston was also wounded in that fight, a clean gunshot through the arm.”

4 months cant be right, no matter how you count it, even if Alston never left the boat at all.

Second, this interview contradicts how Alston was injured on January 29, it’s not a head injury from shrapnel here, and it doesn’t say anything about him being away from the boat because of it.

And it implies that the reporter got that information from Alston himself, just before his speech.

The January 29 incident is still on John Kerrys site, in the command history for Coastal division eleven. But I cant find any other reference to january 1969 on the site, his after action reports start on February 12.

One would think that after 35 years, these things wouldn’t change so much all the time.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:41 pm 91. Rick Ballard:

Folks,

Read the teaser in thus WSJ editorial. They’ve got something nice planned for Kerry. They gave Kerry’s SF fellow first shot and now they’ve announced that they’ll be “sorting this out later”.

Who makes Maalox? Gotta buy some stock on Monday.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:43 pm 92. Samuel:

Terrye

My number one concern is that we do not abandon this endeavor… I just hope that if that idiot Kerry actually manages to win he does not disgrace us all by running away. We will never be taken seriously again and there will be no way to stop the likes of AlQaida. Like it or not the world is counting on us whether they or us realize it.

My problem Terrye is I am burdened by my knowledge of John Kerry and character flaws that are just too deep for these times we live in. Bush is much more a Truman type person, not particularly articulate (though infinitely more charismatic than Harry) but he knows what he believes and would have been the one President since Harry who I believe would be willing to drop the bomb if necessary. What is ironic is that I feel he would hate doing it more than any of those less willing, but I just think he would do it if he felt it was his best decision. It is strength of character and this guy has it in spades. I want a guy at this time that will not look at his own survival above everyone else’s. I want one willing to when critical willing to sacrifice his own political ambitions and self interests for the good of all and this President has done this.

When we first went to Iraq I was still very much against this President. I literally said at the time, “This will wear very badly with time, this will do him in.” I feel he will indeed survive November, but I also feel he will probably leave his second term with ratings not near where they would be if he like Clinton flattered with words and fed the public political candy all while kicking the more difficult issues down the road like his predecessors, for this I do believe he will wear well in history, however.

I heard Larry Sabato say that there will be another Harry Truman, whether it is this election cycle or not remains to be seen, however one thing is for sure, Kerry is no Eisenhower waiting in the wings.

Aug 14, 2004 - 9:47 pm 93. Fresh Air:

Richard, Charlie–

I hate to douse the deferment flame, but that Telegraph story is from March. Check the date (and I think the Brits do months & years backwards).

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:04 pm 94. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Those are metric months *g*. And besides, the information is still current.

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:07 pm 95. Goof®:

Please correct me if something has changed, but isn’t the Examiner a free tabloid published weekdays and distrbuted to racks, etc. in San Francisco and on the remainder of the Peninsula? There are no major media newspapers in the Bay Area, but there are many that do set you back a couple of coins.

And then there is the Telegraph.

Still a smile.

80 days to go.

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:13 pm 96. Fresh Air:

Swiftvets has been hacked! Nothing like supporting free speech for all.

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:30 pm 97. richard mcenroe:

Keep

smiling,

Goof…

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:31 pm 98. richard mcenroe:

And by the way, Goof, down here in LA, it was the freebie New Times that blew the lid off the LA Times’ illicit involvement in the Staples Center, the MTA subway cost scandals involving Senator Feinstein’s husband, and the rampant corruption in the LA Unified School District.

For that matter, freebie papers like the Village Voice and LA Weekly have been bastions of cutting-edge leftie thoughtand journalism since the ’60’s.

So what exactly is your point about the Examiner?

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:38 pm 99. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó It looks okay now. I’m not surprised, though. Hugh Hewitt got hacked last week.

Remember, their speech is free. Ours is censorable.

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:44 pm 100. richard mcenroe:

A remarkably damning Kerry time-line

Aug 14, 2004 - 10:59 pm 101. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

What was the sign that swiftvets had been hacked? Scott may have just been doing a Sat. Eve maintenance.

Aug 14, 2004 - 11:10 pm 102. Spacerad:

Charlie, Spacerad -

Sorry, I haven’t been around til now to answer your post about the Electoral Expectations site.

What is it good for?

Well, for one thing, all the recent polls are combined into one and properly weighted against the target population. This creates something that is pretty much unbiased, and certainly not biased by me.

The other thing, it tell us where we stand and what we have to do to win in November. This is much better than a 50%-47% Gallup poll that really doesn’t tell you a thing because you don’t know who, if anyone, has changed their mind in what state.

Polls are never predictive unless people stop thinking and events stop happening.

Aug 14, 2004 - 11:10 pm 103. Goof®:

rm

I am.

Of course the first thing to catch my eye, since I am not in the midst of a Florida hurricane, is the Glenn Reynolds’ link to the SF Examiner. The dam of silence in the major media about Kerry may be beginning to break.

My point?

Aug 14, 2004 - 11:14 pm 104. Rick Ballard:

Captain Ed has built a very strong timeline concerning the Alston matter. Trying to steal Lt. Peck’s combat record for January is bad enough but this Alston thing is just incredible. Perhaps there is a simple explanation that is escaping me but I think it fairly obvious that Alston is flat lying in his description of being present at the action which resulted in Kerry’s Silver Star. And every one of the “band of brothers” knows he’s lying.

Aug 14, 2004 - 11:47 pm 105. Lola:

I have been reading “A Matter of Character” by Ronald Kessler – it’s a very fascinating portrait of Bush. Frankly, I’m just astounded by the misconceptions that people have of Bush and just surprised at how much I bought into these misconceptions in the past.

Aug 15, 2004 - 5:07 am 106. Syl:

It really feels like watching history unfold as we watch these guys doing research live before our eyes. Especially Ed.

Compare this with MSM. While in both cases you’ll get opinions as to what the uncovered facts ‘mean’, in the case of the MSM the research is done behind closed doors.

In Ed’s case it’s all in the open with input accepted from anyone who has something legitimate to offer.

And what is missing from Ed’s research, but is prevalent in the MSM, is something we can do without. And that is quotes from anonymous sources.

Heh.

Aug 15, 2004 - 6:30 am 107. Syl:

Lola

So true! An author who had written a story about how Bush had personally done research on children and reading because he’s upset that children can’t read, had his story spiked by the Washington Post editors because it was too favorable to Bush.

It doesn’t fit the manufactured perception.

I don’t remember the author’s name…saw him on Fox.

Aug 15, 2004 - 6:34 am 108. Erik:

Syl,

I think you and Lola are talking about the same guy, Ronald Kessler:

http://www.nationalreview.com/interrogatory/kessler200408090855.asp

It doesn’t say specifically here that his story was spiked by Washington post, but it seems to be the same guy..

Here’s the homepage:

http://www.ronaldkessler.com/pages/3/index.htm

Aug 15, 2004 - 6:56 am 109. kellymo:

Just wanted to give you all a thumbs-up for the last few days. The host and the commenters here make this one of the most articulate and informed blogs around (heck, even without the host!).

To tie into the MSM portion of your conversation, I found this on the Editor & Publisher website this AM – “Many Editors in Ohio, Key Swing State, Predict Bush Victory”: http://209.11.49.220/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000611562.

It’s just an informal survey (you know what that’s worth), but the thing I found interesting was the paper that was left out – my hometown paper, the Cincinnati Enquirer. Now why would they survey every other large paper in the state, but leave out the Enquirer? It wouldn’t have anything to do with the fact that the paper is based in Hamilton County, one of the Republican party’s strongholds, would it?

Aug 15, 2004 - 7:00 am 110. kellymo:

Well, crud. That link didn’t work, so let’s try this one:

http://209.11.49.220/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000611562

Aug 15, 2004 - 7:03 am 111. Syl:

Erik

Yes! That’s him! Thanks for the links! Everybody, I recommend checking them out. Kessler said on Fox that he had written an article for the Washington Post (he has written articles for them before) and his immediate editor had approved it.

It went upstairs and was spiked. The reason stated was one of his sources was ‘pro-Bush’. Duh.

Aug 15, 2004 - 7:46 am 112. Terrye:

Samuel:

I think Goof is a prime example of why the character flaws in Kerry you spoke of will never be exposed in the larger press. They don’t want to hear it. plain and simple and anyone who say s otherwise is just some right wing nut who reads tabloids.

Unless of course it is Bush’s awol story and they want to go harass some old dentist and try to get him to say his signature was forged 35 years ago or some such nonsense. Then they are just intrepid journalists doing their job.

Bush was not considered devisive until the media said he was. And now we are faced with the situation in which we have to elect Kerry or they will continue to punish Bush. My guess is they would make sure anyone they did not approve of was “devisive”.

Kerry is just an oppurtunistic politician waving his bloody shirt and lying about his record. He could pull out those troops and leave hundres of thousands of people to die and not feel a moment of remorse, just so long as he could blame Bush.

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:09 am 113. Charlie (Colorado):

Goof, I’m not clear on the transfer of the SF Examiner from the Hearsts to Exim, but the paper has been in existence for a long long time. I just read the online version, and I don’t think it can be dismissed out of hand.

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:10 am 114. richard mcenroe:

On Fox Sunday, Donna Brazile is calling the Swift Boat veterans “hired guns” (yes, Donna Brazile is calling someone a hired gun).

Mary Matalin tried to not address the Swift boat claims but had to acknowledge that the Swifties are out there and have a grievance with Kerry. She didn’t go so far as to endorse them, but did tie their objections to Kerry’s onsolete “cold war” attitude towards the war on terror.

They mentioned Cambodia! and the Kerry campaign retraction. Brazile had squat to say back to it but to repeat her hired gun mantra. You know, John O’Neill (Perot voter twice, Clinton voter once), Republican hack.

Hope Goof has enough fingers for all the holes the Kerry dike is springing…

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:31 am 115. richard mcenroe:

Goof ó Boy, what a content-free waste of bandwidth. My point is that the Cambodia story IS leaking into the MSM and the the “free press” often IS the free press in the community and has a record of substantial journalism, particularly in major cities.

So what is your reason for dismissing the Examiner?

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:37 am 116. Goof®:

rm

I try. My point remains my point. An opinion column in a free tabloid (that has the name that was for ages attached to the Hearst newspaper in San Francisco) is what it is–nothing to get your hopes up over.

Then there is Jack Kelly. http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04228/361477.stm

79 days to go.

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:51 am 117. penwil:

I had an interesting experience yesterday . . .

I was at a book club meeting in San Francisco, at which there were 12 people present. At one point the conversation turned toward the election and one woman made a prediction that there would be an upset and Kerry would win in a landside. At which point, to my utter shock, the woman seated next to me spoke up and asked the group if they had heard of the swiftboat vets’ accusations. I’d say half of the group had already heard, but only vaguely, and they were dismissive, as was to be expected in SF. The woman–who must read the blogs, because she was so well-informed–went on to give chapter and verse, and I chimed in to give her support. One woman’s reaction was to start shouting that it was a Republican smear tactic and she “refused to believe it” over and over, until she was practically in tears. Another woman admitted she didn’t care whether it was true or not, she hated Bush so much, she would vote for Kerry no matter what he’d done. One woman insisted going AWOL from the NG was worse. Four people remained silent. But what was interesting was that three people asked questions and seemed genuinely perturbed by what they were hearing. When we told them that Kerry could clear it all up by releasing the records but that thus far he refused to to so, one man said, “I want to know what’s in those records,” and the other two (women) nodded and said, that they too now want to know what’s in the records.

Now these are liberal SF Democrats, so I hardly expect any one of these three, who are now at least starting to wonder about Kerry, to turn around and vote for Bush, but it was interesting to see the impact that the story had just through a couple of people talking about it. If just one mainstream newspaper did an investigative story on it, this thing would blow the election apart.

I’ve been thinking for awhile now that the WSJ’s going to do it, ever since they published two op-ed pieces written by Kerry defenders, without yet having printed a story on the accusations. I think they’ve just been waiting for the book to come out, and they’ve got a reporter out there digging as much stuff up as they can meanwhile. And talk about a story that will sell papers and put a reporter’s name in lights.

The WSJ has more subscribers than the NYT, in fact is second in circulation only to USA Today.

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:51 am 118. richard mcenroe:

Ooh. Brit Hume just tore Juan Williams a new one over Cambodia.

“Do you or do you not agree that these charges deserve as thorough an examination as the Bush AWOL charges?”

“No, but ó î

ìCase closed.î

Aug 15, 2004 - 8:51 am 119. Jamie Irons:

Richard (8:31), you wrote:

You know, John O’Neill (Perot voter twice, Clinton voter once), Republican hack.

Small point, but O’Neill voted for Perot twice and Gore once; he couldn’t vote twice for Perot and once for Clinton (unless he were in Chicago! as Perot only ran, IIRC, when Clinton did.

Jamie Irons

Aug 15, 2004 - 9:26 am 120. richard mcenroe:

Jamie ó you’re right, I’m wrong. I just tend to lump those two together into one big insult against human dignity and my intelligence…

Aug 15, 2004 - 9:37 am 121. richard mcenroe:

CENSORSHIP in Chicago!

The Sun-Times deleted regular columnist Mark Steyn’s column about Kerry in Cambodia, available here

You can write to them here

Aug 15, 2004 - 10:33 am 122. Fresh Air:

Richard–

Whooah! Time out!

I found Steyn’s columnhere.

It looks like it’s still online to me, and I’m virtually certain it’s in today’s printed edition.

Aug 15, 2004 - 11:14 am 123. Fresh Air:

Everyone–

I hate to keep banging this drum, but Captain Ed is about to break the biggest story of the election thus far: that David Alston, featured speaker at the Democratic National Convention, never served on John Kerry’s boat.

If true, his entire “Band of Brothers” theme and his own crediblity collapses. Though the reasoning is largely deductive right now, should hard evidence be brought forth this story will be un-ignorable.

Aug 15, 2004 - 11:22 am 124. richard mcenroe:

Jihn Kerry ó remember when?

Aug 15, 2004 - 11:41 am 125. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Word is, it was replaced by a Jesse Jackson reprint. Can anyone in Chicago confirm? If true, I apologize.

Aug 15, 2004 - 11:42 am 126. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air — I know it’s online, I linked to it myself. Which would make dropping it from the print edition doubly disingenuous.

From “Mekong Mailbox” at Mark Steyn’s site

DISSENT SILENCED

While this is yet another great Mark Steyn vivisection of John Kerry, the story here is not that Steyn is a fantastic columnist who has his finger on Kerry. The real story is how devastating this critique is. The DNC has sued to shut down the Swift Vets, and Steyn’s column, which is the ONLY reason I am an actual subscriber to the Chicago Sun-Times, did not run in the paper yesterday OR today. The Chicago Sun-Times is an otherwise horrible paper and their local columnists appear to be culled from the dregs of the local high school yearbook staff. That said, the paper has the common sense to run Steyn, but pulled his column yesterday and replaced it with an op-ed piece by Jesse Jackson! As an aside, the paper’s coverage of the coming Obama papacy passes straight past laughable and headlong into nausea. Obama’s mother couldn’t say so many nice things about him without drawing fire. Thank you Mark Steyn. I will be taking notes and make sure to cancel my subscription to the Sun Times if they make a habit out of pulling your columns.

George Connolly

Evanston, Illinois

Aug 15, 2004 - 11:48 am 127. Rick Ballard:

Knight-Ridder is doing straight coverage now. I wounder when AP/UPI will decide they can’t hold out any longer? I think that the Telegraph is going to be the one to watch though. If they were chasing the story back in March, it appears that they have a higher level of “interest” than any of the regular MSM. The Brit’s gave quite a bit of impetus to Monicagate prior to its breaking wide, IIRC.

Jim Geraghty at NRO has a good “preview review” of the book. Worth a look.

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:01 pm 128. Jamie Irons:

Rick Ballard wrote:

Jim Geraghty at NRO has a good “preview review” of the book. Worth a look.

Thanks, Rick. I have been relying on you the last few days to (as the lamentable “Reverend” might say) “keep hope alive” that the MSM aren’t going to completely suppress this story.

Jamie Irons

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:08 pm 129. Terrye:

All these socalled loyal Democrats out there can shoot the messenger and call this a smear job on the part of the vast right wing conspiracy but they should remember that there was ample evidence that Bill Clinton not only did not serve in Viet Nam [no secret] he was also a womanizier from way back.

Now apparently the party policy has changed in regards to military service but even the Democrats should stop and think about the fact that if the DNC had taken some of those charges about Clinton and his trouble with the ladies more seriously they could have saved themselves a world of hurt.

They can not keep blaming everybody else. Kerry’s past has always been murky when it came to Viet Nam and to act as if this whole thing is just the fantasy of the conservative press is to flirt with disaster.

Kerry can alwasy release his records and if they will vinidicate him then I would assume that both he and his accusers know that. So why doesn’t he?

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:10 pm 130. Fresh Air:

Richard–

If the letter you posted is correct, I am in error.

I will drop by a newsstand later to confirm. While not unprecedented, it seems awfully premeditated to spike a conservative taking up the cudgel against Kerry with Jesse Jackson.

As Glenn Reynolds says, More crushing of dissent!

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:14 pm 131. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Just browse, don’t give ‘em your buck-fifty or whatever.

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:19 pm 132. richard mcenroe:

Further from Fox News ó Donna Brazile also flatly denied Kerry said he would pull the US out of Iraq, starting in six months, after he made just that statement in front of the press and TV cameras. Is ignoring the candidate good campaign policy?

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:28 pm 133. Terrye:

richard:

I don’t think it is a question of ignoring him, it is just a matter of knowing which JOhn Kerry said what at a given time.

After all he said he would not pull the troops out before he said he would pull the troops out before he said he would not pull the troops out. The only thing we know for sure is that Chirac is coming to the rescue as soon as George leaves town.

But then again…..

Aug 15, 2004 - 12:41 pm 134. richard mcenroe:

Terrye ó Good heavens! You mean Chirac is going to risk alienating Gerhard Schroeder, who already said Germany wasn’t coming? Isn’t that insensitive towards the world community or something?

Aug 15, 2004 - 1:03 pm 135. Fresh Air:

Richard–

Well, I certainly agree with Mr. Connolly about the Obama coverage in the Sun-Times, which borders on idolatry. However, I must defend them in this instance. Steyn’s column appears on page 39A in today’s newspaper. Connolly may have purchased a Saturday edition that, for whatever reason, contained Jesse’s column instead.

Aug 15, 2004 - 1:38 pm 136. richard mcenroe:

Whatever reason? Well, I sit corrected…

Anyway, for a Kerry story that’s deliberately funny…

Aug 15, 2004 - 2:10 pm 137. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó FWIW, I e-mailed Steyn to see what he has to say…

Aug 15, 2004 - 2:15 pm 138. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Also FWIW, I used to work a shabbas goy gig running a newstand on weekends. The editorial, cultural, comics, etc. material was delivered on Saturday, already printed, for the Sunday edition, at least for the Times and NY Daily News. A switchout like that is puzzling from a logistics standpoint, unless the Sun-Times is a much smaller paper…

Aug 15, 2004 - 2:18 pm 139. Fresh Air:

Richard–

Yep. It would be very tough logistically. The Sun-Times has a daily circulation (before exaggerations) of about 450,000. Sunday is actually less, probably 250,000. It’s a fat mother though, and 39A would have been laid out in the galleys on Friday.

I can’t explain it.

OT, the SwiftVets have deemed the Alston story too hot to handle and locked the thread.

Aug 15, 2004 - 2:52 pm 140. Charlie (Colorado):

Is ignoring the candidate good campaign policy?

In this case? Probably.

Besides, no matter what you say, he’ll agree with you at some point.

Aug 15, 2004 - 3:43 pm 141. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Too hot to handle, or are they being sensible and letting Cap’n Ed make the running?

Aug 15, 2004 - 4:07 pm 142. Fresh Air:

Richard–

Roger that. According to the swiftvets.com moderators, the Swiftees are trying to avoid a Charlie Foxtrot that would damage the credibility of their substantiated allegations.

I don’t blame them for letting Cap’n Ed take over, though I’m going to contact a few reporters myself and see if they can put some firepower onto it.

This thing could be very interesting.

Aug 15, 2004 - 5:24 pm 143. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

On their BBS, they have shut down the Alston story. What that means is anyone’s guess. They may be afraid that someone will commit libel. They may be afraid that someone will use a racial slur that could be used to tar them (look at how Corsi got clobbered). It could be that they want to keep some details secret until they sort out the evidence. Or it may be something else.

Keep in mind that O’Neill is a very successful litigator, and that the forces of darkness have their shock troops ready to pounce on the slightest oops. For that matter, the media is ready for that too – if they can bring the story out in the context of a SBVT scandal (or “appearance of impropriety”) they will.

These guys are effectively at war with the Democratic Party and all the various rich turkeys that are associated with them. They have to be very, very careful.

Aug 15, 2004 - 5:34 pm 144. Rick Ballard:

Well, Sen. Kerry is showing great courage in facing this improglio, he has decided to first face the staff at his wife’s home in Ketchum, ID for four days in preparation for facing the entire country. Golly gee, he has been on the road for two whole weeks and it’s just the presidential race. Perhaps his true memory will return during this time of contemplation.

Aug 15, 2004 - 6:05 pm 145. John Lynch:

Today (Monday) Wall Street Opinion Columnist Robert Pollock has an article Holiday in Cambodia

Aug 15, 2004 - 10:00 pm 146. John Lynch:

John M

I posted on the “Mentir …” thread today’s WSJ article on SWVTs. Pretty positive for the Vets. and it is Wall Street Journal.

A Google a few minutes ago for “Swift Kerry” gives a lot of local papers giving coverage. It is mixed, mostly against the “smear,” some discussing the allegations.

Aug 15, 2004 - 10:21 pm 147. Rick Ballard:

Byron York at NRO has more solid info on the Alston matter. I am relieved that Alston at least served as much as two weeks with Kerry.

Aug 16, 2004 - 7:20 am 148. ed:

Hmmmm.

NRO article: ” “I was not hospitalized,” Alston says. “I was treated on a Coast Guard Cutter…I was only off the boat [PCF-94] two weeks, ” ”

Ok now this is getting even stranger. He says he was treated on a Coast Guard cutter? But previous statements/documentation shows that he was airlifted to an Army medical base for treatment.

WTF? Is there *anything* that isn’t a complete cloud of BS in this matter?

Aug 16, 2004 - 9:55 am 149. ed:

Hmmm.

From: http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/002242.php

——————

AWFA: GMG2 DAVID MARION Alston, USN, 99T 57 46

BRAVO: ACTIVE DUTY, ATTACHED TO COASTAL DIVISION ELEVEN AT AN THOI, RVN

CHARLIE: INJURY, HOSTILE FIRE

DELTA: 29, JAN 69, 1030H, SONG CUA LON – SONG BO DE, WHILE SERVING AS FORWARD GUNNER ABOARD PCF 94, ENGAGED IN CORDON AND SEARCH OPERATIONS IN THE ABOVE RIVER, GMG2 Alston RECEIVED SHRAPNEL WOUNDS TO HIS HEAD WHEN PCF CAME UNDER INTENSE HOSTILE ROCKET AND A/W FIRE.

ECHO: CONDITION GOOD, PROGNOSIS GOOD. PRESENCE OF NOK IS NOT MEDICALLY WARRANTED AS REPORTED BY CORPSMAN.

FOXTROT: MRS. IDA MCQUILLAR ALSTON, MOTHER

GOLF: NOK NOT OFFICIALLY NOTIFIED. REQ NOK NOT REPEAT NOT BE NOTIFIED.

HOTEL: SERVICEMAN TREATED BY CORPSMAN AND MEDEVACED TO 29TH EVAC HOSP. BINH THUY.

2. PATIENT ABL TO COMMUNICATE WITH NOK.

3. NO FURTHER INFO WILL FOLLOW.

——————

So David Alston was “MEDEVACED TO 29TH EVAC HOSP. BINH THUY.” and NOT a Coast Guard cutter.

So. WTF!?

Aug 16, 2004 - 10:04 am

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