122 Comments

1. wu-ping:

Hi Roger,

Have you ever read what John Kerry said before Congress? I believe you’ll find it a great speech and a speech that is very respectful of soldiers, veterans, and civilians.

It never accused any of Kerry’s peers with atrocities. He did testify to atrocities that Tommy Franks has confirmed took place.

It was true then, and sadly and unbelievably, it has become true today as well.

Roger, why do you waste your talents with this narrow group of echoing haters?

Aug 24, 2004 - 12:56 am 2. Patrick S Lasswell:

wu-ping,

“Roger, why do you waste your talents with this narrow group of echoing haters?”

I wonder exactly the same thing about the Democratic Party.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:14 am 3. Patrick S Lasswell:

wu-ping,

“They told stories that, at times, they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Ghengis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam…”

Exactly how does this respect the soldiers and veterans? Repeating lies is good because…

I suspect that Roger is listening to what the Swiftboat veterans are saying because they are standing up to be counted. Old liberals and other people who still value character like that sort of thing.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:23 am 4. Birkel:

Thank you for standing to be counted. As I posted in the comments yesterday, Kerry seems like the “Forrest Gump” candidate because he tries to tie himself to every major political movement of the last 40 years. He’s a committed anti-war guy who now tries to act as a potential wartime presidential candidate in order to achieve a post-9/11 victory.

Wu-Ping may say whatever (s)he wants. Kerry did not tell the truth that Gen. Franks was acknowledging. Franks meant that those things had happened, as they happen in all wars regardless of the banner flying in front of the troops. Mr. Kerry undoubtedly quoted liars and charlatans from the “Winter Soldier” meetings to obfuscate his own participation in the lies. Franks clearly did not mean that the entire ranks knew of abuses, as Kerry implied.

BTW, punishing abuses is a sign of a system working. Finding the bad guys and punishing them is a sign of humanity. Even the Abu-Ghraib prison scandal, which sickened me, is proof that American ideals actually mean something. We’re punishing the bad ‘guys.’ Respect for veterans would acknowledge the overwhelming majority who would report atrocities, yet we remember Col. Calley (That’s the Vietnam Me Lai guy, right?) as the bad guy.

Q: Wu-Ping: What was the name of the person who reported the problems? Don’t google. Was it Kerry?

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:57 am 5. dr. sanity:

It is not being “nuanced” to be anti-war and throw your medals away and then at the same time to be pro-war and bask in the glow of those same medals. By trying to have it both ways, Kerry has again shown that what he really stands for is…John Kerry. What could he possibly say about Iraq? He doesn’t know yet which position (pro or con) will help him the most.

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:18 am 6. Cap'n Billy:

wu-ping at 12:56 AM:

What a mindless comment. Kerry offers a few ritual generic words of praise for military people, then goes on to deliver one of the most atrocious blood libels I have ever witnessed, while still a serving officer in the Naval Reserve (and I witnessed it on TV at the time. It’s seared… SEARED! in my memory). And wu-ping calls it a “a speech that is very respectful of soldiers, veterans, and civilians.” I’ll never understand the thought processes of these so-called “liberals.”

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:25 am 7. Jamie Irons:

Wow! Great piece!

I remember Rick Ballard on this forum predicting a week or two ago that the WSJ would come out with an editorial like this after preparing the ground with the Rassman editorial and others.

Talk about cracks in the MSM’s dike…

Jamie Irons

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:39 am 8. Stephen_M:

Hmmm – Has Kerry Backed Off Of First Purple Heart Claim?

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:43 am 9. David Thomson:

ìHe doesn’t know yet which position (pro or con) will help him the most.î

Exactly. Charging Jon Kerry with being a flip flopper, who points his wet finger into the blowing wind, is not a punch below the belt. John Kerry displays the behavior of someone who will say just about anything to acquire power and prestige. I strongly suspect that his liberalism might merely be a matter of geography. Kerry was born and raised in a very liberal area of the country. Embracing liberalism is therefore highly recommended if one desires a successful political career. What might have occurred if Kerryís roots were Texan?

There is one thing which concerns me. Mickey Kaus is giving John Kerry hell over these recent events. However, officially Kaus is still a Kerry supporter. Has he changed his mind? If not, why not? Doesnít character count in Kausí evaluation of a candidateís fitness to hold office? Needless to add, there are a number of peculiar folks like him.

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:47 am 10. Connecticut Yankee:

More bad news for Kerry, who seems to be a one-man target-rich environment: 1) Captain Ed has a post about documentary proof of collusion between the Kerry campaign and several 527s: “Bringing It On”–

http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/002318.php

2) PoliPundit has posted a choice quote from today’s WaPo editorial:

“This [story about Christmas in Cambodia] does not undermine Mr. Kerry’s military bravery, but it does raise an issue of candor. It’s fair to ask whether this is an episode of foggy memory, routine political embroidery or something more. Indeed, the Kerry campaign ought to arrange for the full release of all relevant records from the time. Mr. Kerry granted historian Douglas Brinkley exclusive use of his wartime journals and other writings; the campaign should seek to be freed from that agreement and to make all the material public. Though the ads are being underwritten by longtime Bush partisans, the Kerry campaign’s claim of illegal coordination between the Swift boat group and the Bush campaign is unconvincing.”

http://polipundit.com/2004_08_22_polipundit_archive.html#10933465314130972

Could be a bad-hair day in the making for Kerry.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:00 am 11. Jamie Irons:

wu-ping:

Before commenting on this forum, please be sure you are an “echoing hater.”

BTW and more seriously, by his (her) comments above wu-ping (who is most assuredly not an echoing hater) confirms my assertion here last night that the “Vietnam” argument is really a surrogate for the Iraq war argument. In wu-ping’s narrative, Abu Ghraib = Mi Lai. Because atrocities occur in all wars, all wars are the same. AS Tommy Franks admits atrocities occurred in Vietnam; he surely meant that everything that we did in Vietnam was an atrocity. And of course he knew first hand that everything we did in Iraq was an atrocity. Why, the US should just call itself “Atrocities R US.”

Really, when you think about it, the “liberal” viewpoint is so economical of thought. All distinctions are erased, except for the all-important “All virtue is on my side.”

wu-ping, you are hereby invited to shout “Bush=Hitler.” Go ahead, get it out of your system.

Jamie Irons

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:10 am 12. Southpaw:

I must take issue with JPod’s take on Cambodia:

“In 1973, Kerry was a leader of the anti-war movement. That same year, the American Left went nuts when the Nixon administration admitted it had secretly invaded Cambodia in 1969 and 1970 to roust out Communist fighters.

It’s hard to overstate just how big an issue this was in 1973. Cambodia was officially a neutral country, and it was the contention of the anti-war movement that any movement across Cambodia’s borders constituted a violation of international law.

If Kerry is to be believed, then this leader of the anti-war movement remained silent in 1973 when he could have spoken out about how he was ordered to violate Cambodian neutrality as early as 1968.”

The American Left went nuts (any many more outside this demographic by this point) because what was learned in 1973 was that incursions into Cambodia had expanded to into full scale arial assault in secret. It was known long before that time that the US had violated Cambodian neutrality on a much smaller scale. It was at least known since 1965 because Sihanouk broke diplomatic relations with the US that year over such border incursions.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:18 am 13. Jamie Irons:

Southpaw

Even so, doesn’t Podhoretz’s point about Kerry’s silence at that time about his own “incursions” still stand? Or have I missed something?

Jamie Irons

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:23 am 14. Southpaw:

JI,

Possibly. It’s also possible that it wasn’t raised as an issue in 1971 because it was taken for granted that the US regularly crossed the border in hot pursuit. That wouldn’t have been news and it probably wouldn’t have been as effective as anti-war testimony compared with examples of gruesome atrocities.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:36 am 15. Southpaw:

FYI, Heads Up , Yadda Yadda Yadda…

Slate’s Fred Kaplan wrote a defense of Kerry’s Christmas in Cambodia story yesterday which I’ve just read for the first time. I’ve pasted the link in the URL field because I have no idea how to embed links here. There’s some info about pre Nixon incursions into Cambodia as I described above as well.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:54 am 16. lindenen:

This is what Drudge has posted. Assuming this pans out (aka is true), it’s pretty bad:

“Kerry’s campaign now says is possible first Purple Heart was awarded for unintentional self-inflicted wound…

# Kerry received Purple Heart for wounds suffered on 12/2/68…

# In Kerry’s own journal written 9 days later, he writes he and his crew, quote, ‘hadn’t been shot at yet’… Developing…”

Man. I hope this isn’t more Drudge bs.

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:36 am 17. penwil:

That oped from today’s Washington Post linked to above and on the earlier thread quotes an interesting bit from Brinkley’s book, which is in turn quoting from Kerry’s so-called diary:

– “The banks of the [Rach Giang Thanh River] whistled by as we churned out mile after mile at full speed. On my left were occasional open fields that allowed us a clear view into Cambodia. At some points, the border was only fifty yards away and it then would meander out to several hundred or even as much as a thousand yards away, always making one wonder what lay on the other side.” His curiosity was never satisfied, because this entry was from Kerry’s final mission. –

So on the one hand in the diary he’s claiming he got within 50 yards of Cambodia but apparently never actually crossed the border because he always wondered “what lay on the other side.” And note this entry was from Kerry’s last mission, which was a couple months after Christmas Eve and after January as well.

On the other hand, though, we got the magic hat, seared–seared in my memory story of being in Cambodia on Christmas Eve. A story that has been repreated so often that it’s been seared into everyone else’s memory too.

And on the other other hand we had a recent version of the magic hat story that involves multiple secret trips into Cambodia to ferry Navy Seals and Green Berets and what have you, but all during January.

And on the other other other hand we have what may or may not be the latest version of the story, which is that when Kerry said he was in Cambodia, he meant within fifty miles of Cambodia. Of course that directly contradicts the diary entry which puts him within 50 yards of the border on his last mission and doomed for ever after to wonder what’s on the other side.

Oh, what an tangled web we weave . . .

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:40 am 18. penwil:

lindeman-”Man. I hope this isn’t more Drudge bs.”

Supposedly this came out the mouth of a Kerry spokesman who was being interviewed by Major Garett on Fox.

What’s especially damning about this is that that third purple heart was his ticket home. His “excuse” for abandoning his “Band of Brothers.”

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:49 am 19. RogerA:

I honestly don’t know what is funnier–(1)Watching Kerry twist on his own words and narcissism; or (2) watching the MSM contort themselves trying to defend Kerry against all possible odds; (3) watching “historians” like Brinkley pander to the political establishment; or (4)looking at the dissolution of the democratic party as a major institution of American politics. This isn’t a tragedy–it is burlesque. I think there is an old adage about “the truth is the only thing that can be told the same way twice.”

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:53 am 20. lindenen:

penwil, is there evidence of that? Meaning video footage? Are they playing it all over Fox News? Or will be?

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:56 am 21. mrp:

Taking into account the Washington Post editorial and the Drudge alert (posted by lindenen 7:36AM), it seems to me that the Kerry/Edwards people are planning a major document dump soon – perhaps just before or during the GOP convention. Probably medical records, journal excerpts, military records, etc. Like he has a choice

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:56 am 22. penwil:

lindeman,

I don’t know. I read about it earlier, but I don’t remember where, and now I can’t find it. It could be just an internet rumor and Drudge picked up on it. In any event, with all the hits Drudge gets, if it really happened and Fox has it on tape, it’s sure to get replayed and replayed and replayed . . .

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:12 am 23. Connecticut Yankee:

Penwil et al–

A link to the Fox video is posted over at Captain’s Quarters– click on the link below and scroll down to the link embedded at “Update”.

http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/002317.php#comments

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:16 am 24. devildog:

Can you imagine?

MAJOR GARRETT (from Fox News): “And questions keep coming. For example, Kerry received a Purple Heart for wounds suffered on December 2nd, 1968. But an entry in Kerry’s own journal written nine days later, he writes that, quote, he and his crew hadn’t been shot at yet, unquote. Kerry’s campaign has said it is possible his first Purple Heart was awarded for an unintentionally self-inflicted wound.”

Ring…ring…ring…

Malkin: Hello.

Matthews: Michelle? Hi, Chris Matthews here.

Malkin: Oh great, what do you want?

Matthews: I wanted to apologize for slamming you about all that self-inflicted wound stuff.

Malkin: Umm…okay. So you read Unfit for Command?

Matthews: Well, no. Cuz of the media blackout on this I was watching Fox News and

Malkin: click…jeez, what a schmuck.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:21 am 25. richard mcenroe:

Devildog ó Since I believe the formidable Ms. Malkin is a Filipina, she is more likely to have said “tonga” than “schmuck”. But I think you got the very nub of her gist…

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:24 am 26. ambisinistral:

devildog,

You beat me to it. Both Mathews and Keith Oberman (who called her a fool) owe Malkin apologies.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:25 am 27. richard mcenroe:

Wu Ping ó Just a question. Do you realize how sanctimonious and condescending it is for you to assume we haven’t read the text of that speech? Unless you intend to provide material quotes from it contradicting the points and tenor of this thread, I suggest you find a new line…

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:26 am 28. holdfast:

Ralph Peters absolutely NALS IT in the NYPost today:

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/29339.htm

He manages to explain, in terms anyone can stand, why any serious perso with military service could not possibly trust Kerry as CinC. He finds the words that I have been groping for – breaks down why Kerry sets off internal alarms in some people. I think this also goes a long way to explain why the Swifites are doing this – reasons that have sbsolutely nothing, pace WaPo columnits, to do with being part of a “Republican Smear Machine”.

Peters is a learned and thoughtful retired Army Intelligence professoinal – with a number of bokks, fiction and non-fiction to his credit. In truth he was probably too learned and thoughtful to reach flag rank in the military, whcih is unfortunate for the Army, but fortunate for us readers.

Hightlights:

As far as the swift-boat controversy goes, it’s likely to remain a he-said-she-said issue through Election Day. The red flag to military men and women is that so many swift-boat veterans have come out against John Kerry. Not just one. Not 10. Dozens upon dozens.

This is as rare as humility in the Hamptons. Vets stick together. Kerry likes to play up his “band of brothers” image, but if he’s got a band, his opponents have a symphony. And even if the first violinist turns out to be a “Republican stooge,” it’s nonetheless stunning for so many vets to denounce a former comrade publicly. It just doesn’t happen unless something’s really wrong.

As for Kerry’s support from his own crew, that’s normal military psychology. You get the most objective view of a junior leader from his peers ó the other swift-boat commanders (and their crews) who had to fear a weak link in the chain.

Integrity matters to those in uniform. You have to be able to depend on the guy in the next foxhole ó or swift boat. Trust is more important than any technology.

And John Kerry just doesn’t seem trustworthy.

This is so profoundly a part of the military code of behavior that it cannot be over-emphasized. The rule is that those who brag about being heroes usually aren’t heroes at all. Bragging is for drunks at the end of the bar, not for real vets. And certainly not for anyone who wishes to trade on his service to become our commander-in-chief.

I have reservations about voting for George W. Bush. But I have no reservations about voting against John Kerry. And I’m not alone.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:29 am 29. holdfast:

Actually he NAILED IT – preevu iz mi frend

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:30 am 30. flenser:

southpaw

Thanks, I needed a little light relief. That Slate piece was a pisser. I especially like this bit;

“Having pretty much failed at their efforts to disprove the official U.S. Navy account of Kerry’s valor in battle ..”

I guess that is why Kerry and his friends in the media are squawking so loudly about the Swift Boat ads.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:39 am 31. devildog:

Good post holdfast.

Mr. John “No Sh*t, There I Was” Kerry (a.k.a. Captain Willard) is indeed unfit for command.

The cracks in the MSM coverage is in full gape with Kerry slams in the WaPo, NY Post, NYDN and WSJ.

Does anyone else here Morrison singing “…this is the end, my only friend, the end.”

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:43 am 32. Warthog:

Is anybody else ready to scream to the outrageous duplicity of the Kerry talking heads who cavalierly call 250 Swifties liars and then get indignent when called on it?

Four years ago I really didn’t care less who the President was or which party controlled Congress, but is that changing now. The brazen lack of honesty among the Kerry speakers is insulting and more than a little scary. It’s not too much of a leap to see yourself as a criminal defendant in a hate-speech trial in 2007 if Kerry and the Democrats get ahold of the levers.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:57 am 33. penwil:

From the Post piece:

“Real heroes (and I’ve been honored to know some) never portray their service in grandiose terms, telling TV cameras that they’re reporting for duty. Real heroes may be proud of the sacrifices they offered, but they don’t shout for attention.”

I think that reporting for duty moment is one of the big reasons Kerry didn’t get his post-convention bounce. You don’t have to be in the military to know a braggart when you see one. Even gansta rappers know the difference between talkin’ the talk and walkin’ the walk.

And it shows how totally tone deaf Kerry and his campaign are. The people that reporting for duty line was meant to impress are the very people most likely to have been wholly turned off by it.

Can you imagine this man this clueless in a nuclear showdown with the mullahs of Iran? It is the stuff of nightmares.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:58 am 34. Rick Ballard:

mrp,

The Kerry rowback via document dump won’t work. The timing sucks – evidence of contradictions between Kerry’s journals, Doris Kearns Brinkley’s hagiography, the initial recommendations for decorations (signed by none other than Il Capitano himself), the original citation language, the “modified” citation language are all now wending their way through both the internet and the DNC/MSM – all this could have been avoided had Rood filed his article within 48 hours.

The decision by the Kerry/DNC/MSM to stonewall the story for ten days means that the minutiae will now be debated into October. Kerry is now campaigning with his pants engulfed in flames.

Another thing to consider concerning this is that the campaign is chewing up resources in trying to combat it. Not just the money for the ads pleading for mercy from Bush but all the campaign leadership time being spent trying to decide which contradiction to deal with first. Campaign team morale is undoubtedly suffering also as everyone begins to understand what a hollow shell they have on their hands.

Kerry may have some very well hidden strengths but he’s brittle. He’s going to snap – either howl at the moon like Dean or go so far over the top rhetorically that he will be self-defined as the user that he is. The speech at the American Legion is going to be very, very interesting. I’m almost ready to bet that he won’t show. If he does, I’m very curious as to what the reaction will be.

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:00 am 35. D Anghelone:

…she is more likely to have said “tonga” than “schmuck”.

The Kingdom of Schmuck. No, not the Catskills.

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:03 am 36. leaddog2:

Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, Sadamn Hussein ….. where Millions Died!

Now EVEN the Washington Post is admitting that Hanoi John Kerry LIED about Cambodia, etc. Such actions RESULTED in the Deaths of Millions of Boat People and led DIRECTLY to the Killing Fields of Cambodia. (2 Million Plus Deaths there) “Johnny, I NEVER KNEW you loved killers like Pol Pot”.

I supported War, BEFORE I supported Peace, BEFORE I voted for the $87 Billion BEFORE I Voted AGAINST the $87 Billion for the Soldiers. (Duh! Now, I am confused)! John Kerry —- 2004)

Hanoi John Kerry’s Evolving Story…. It changes FREQUENTLY! Stayed Tuned!

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:12 am 37. Charlie (Colorado):

Jamie:

Really, when you think about it, the “liberal” viewpoint is so economical of thought. All distinctions are erased, except for the all-important “All virtue is on my side.”

Yeah. What you said.

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:17 am 38. ambisinistral:

Christmas in Cambodia Dead. Last Purple Heart on Life Support but Fading Fast. Winter Soldiers just ramping up. Also, I think out of control protests at the Republican Convention would only highlight Kerry’s post war activities.

So, when does the media decide they’ve embarrassed themselves enough (although they’ll treat it as Kerry embarassing them)? When that happens most will try to get back in front by turning on Kerry like a pack of dogs. Kerry’s campaign has imploded and I think it is only going to get much, much worse.

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:32 am 39. Fresh Air:

Richard–

I’m not sure, but I think Malkin is married to a Jewish guy. In which case, shmuck or, even more likely, putz, would be part of her everyday synonyms for “talk show host.”

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:44 am 40. devildog:

Kerry’s campaign has imploded and I think it is only going to get much, much worse.

Yep, I think you’re right ambisinistral.

Here’s a link to a thorough, sober look into Kerry’s Silver Star citations.

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:45 am 41. flenser:

Completely off topic, sorry. But funny as hell all the same.

A Marxist NY paper, Long Island Newsday, has a list of the various protest groups who will be in NY for the convention.

a sample;

“Food Not Bombs: Self-styled revolutionary movement dedicated to non-violence and the distribution of free vegetarian food to all those who want it. The first group was formed in Cambridge, Mass., in 1980 by anti-nuclear activists and has since spread throughout the country.”

You can’t parody these people, they already sound like something out of a Monty Python skit.

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/longisland/politics/ny-foley3940903aug24,0,1485700.story?coll=ny-lipolitics-print

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:45 am 42. geoffg:

Last night in a TV interview (I forget which), Oneill said the SBVTs have more ads coming. I can’t wait!

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:46 am 43. devildog:

Good point Fresh Air. You’ve inspired an idea for a contest — pick the word that best describes Matthews:

a) Schmuck

b) Putz

c) Kavetch

d) Yenta

e) All of the above

Perhaps f) could be “clueless loud-mouthed pr*ck and DNC muppet” or some such. Any other ideas? Did the words “journalist” or “commentator” pop into anyone’s head?

Aug 24, 2004 - 9:54 am 44. mrp:

Rick Ballard -

August -was- traditionally a slow month in a presidential campaign, but now the internet and the 24/7 cable networks have put a stake through that topic of CW.

The dynamics of the campaign will change on the first day of the GOP convention. The focus of the Bush managers will be on the War On Terror, not Vietnam. I’m pretty sure that any RNC official mentioning Swifties, Swiftboats, Cambodia, or Silver Stars will be summarily tossed into the closest mob of ANSWERistas.

The media will focus on the anti-GOP activities (their prayer: “Please let there be teargas, blood, and riot…”). The reporters want a story they can dine out on for the next 20 years.

I doubt Kerry will dump all of the Vietnam stuff. Just enough to allow the MSM to wash their hands of the subject so they can moveon to how four more years of Bush will lead to a failed war and fascist dictatorship.

There is one possibility, however. I think the greatest danger to Kerry is the matter of his meetings with North Vietnamese government officials while he allegedly held a USN Reserve commission. If it can be established definitevly that he held a commission while meeting with NV delegates, that will really hurt him.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:01 am 45. penwil:

Check out Drudge’s latest headline.

http://www.drudgereport.com/

It’s hard to tell what Drudge’s source is for this, (Kerry’s swiftoboat commander himself?) but if the conversation related therein is true, than Kerry seems to be genuinely bewildered as to where the swiftboat vet anger is coming from. It’s just too strange.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:09 am 46. Sandy P:

wu forgets one thing, while Cabana Boy testified to Congress, didn’t he report these atrocities to his superiors so they could stop them?

And why didn’t he report to the FBI a possible assassination of senators his group was considering?

“We will not quickly join those who march on Veteran’s Day waving small flags, calling to memory those thousands of lives who died for the ‘greater glory of the United States. We will not accept the rhetoric.We will not readily join the American Legion and the Veterans of Foreign Wars. We will demand relevancy such as other organizations have recently been able to provide. We will not uphold the traditions which decorously memorialize that which is base and grim.”

-John F. Kerry, Epilogue to “New Soldier” (MacMillan Publishing, Co, Fall, 1971)

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:13 am 47. flenser:

mrp

“If it can be established definitely that he held a commission while meeting with NV delegates, that will really hurt him.”

I’m inclined to doubt this. I suspect that the typical Kerry supporter is not going to desert him, no matter what comes out. There seems to be a group of undecideds of about 10 -15% of the public who will decide this election. If my take on their mentality is correct, they are not the kind of people who will be moved by a story like this, especially since it will never get extensive play in the media. I think this story is too abstract and legalistic to impact them.

Of course, every bit helps, and the more time and money he has to spend defending himself, the better.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:18 am 48. Rick Ballard:

mrp,

There is no doubt that Kerry held a USN Reserve commission at the time of his Paris coordinating visit with the North Vietnamese. His website confirms it as does his hagiography. His commission was a reserve commission to begin with – not a regular Navy commission. So, he didn’t transfer to the reserves, he had a reserve contract to begin with.

I agree with your observations concerning partial release. The Kerry campaign is choosing to bleed to death slowly rather than simply opening a large vein and laying back in a nice warm tub. No difference in the end result.

Team Bush is not going to touch this. There is absolutely no need to change their game plan whatsoever. Kerry’s team gets to fight two fires at one time and all they have is a leaky watering can to work with.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:21 am 49. Sandy P:

And you know what’s even better?

The millionaires have to pour even more of their money into defeating Cabana Boy.

Bout time they spent their own money.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:26 am 50. flenser:

“… More accurate than the NYT):”

To be filed under; Praise, Faint.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:32 am 51. DennisThePeasant:

Given the NASA photographs, putz seems the most appropriate of the entirely appropriate in and of themselves choices.

If the Viet Nam thing doesn’t pan out he can always republish the NASA photos and claim he was in Trojan War. Chris Matthews would buy into that.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:32 am 52. insatty:

Sandy P’s relevant quotations from Kerry’s 1971 screed makes me wonder: MacMillan would make a fortune if it simply reissued “New Soldier.” So why doesn’t it? Usually it’s the looney left that smell conspiracies everywhere. But the patent MSM bias makes me believe that MacMillan would not want to harm the MSM’s candidate.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:35 am 53. mrp:

Not having served in the military, would someone be kind enough to post the oath required upon receiving a US Naval commission?

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:38 am 54. penwil:

Insatty,

The publishing rights probably reverted back to Kerry a long time ago. When you sign a contract with a publishing house to publish your book there’s usually a line in the contract that states that the rights revert back to you after a certain number of years after the book goes out of print (i.e.–the publisher stops printing copies for sale).

So the only way for the book to get reprinted now would be if Kerry resold the rights to another publisher, something he isn’t going to do.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:44 am 55. DennisThePeasant:

penwil-

If Kerry really did phone Brant last night, it would suggest to me that Kerry’s internals have absolutely gone to Hell. He would have to assume that Brant would make the call public, and that in doing so would only heighten this controversy and serve as an admission that the Swift Boat allegations are damaging him.

Dollars to doughnuts Kerry’s internal polling is saying this is hurting him big time. And it would also serve as a suggestion that Kerry’s strategy of blaming Bush for the Swifties isn’t working at all. There would be no need to call Brant otherwise. It appears John and the boys are starting to panic.

And remember, in between the conventions is supposed to be Kerry’s ‘good time’. Seems that it is turning out to be my ‘good time’ instead.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:51 am 56. flenser:

penwil

Somebody is selling a CD on ebay which is described as the complete text of the book, “New Soldier”. Cost is $14.95.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:54 am 57. Rick Ballard:

“I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR (OR AFFIRM) THAT I WILL SUPPORT AND DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES AGAINST ALL ENEMIES, FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC; THAT I WILL BEAR TRUE FAITH AND ALLEGIANCE TO THE SAME; THAT I TAKE THIS OBLIGATION FREELY, WITHOUT ANY MENTAL RESERVATION OR PURPOSE OF EVASION; AND THAT I WILL WELL AND FAITHFULLY DISCHARGE THE DUTIES OF THE OFFICE UPON WHICH I AM ABOUT TO ENTER.”

I’m not sure what you wanted it for. The UCMJ and the Constitution (vide 14th Amendment) are where his legal problems lie. Not that I believe that those problems will be pursued. According to the DNC/MSM the right to “speak truth to power” trumps the constitution. Even when the “truth” you’re speaking is hogwash.

Devildog,

Samuel can confirm it but I believe the proper yiddish word for Chris Matthews is goniff.

Aug 24, 2004 - 10:59 am 58. Rick Ballard:

My apologies for the bolded caps. I started to type in the blockquote tag, got interrupted, came back, had a minor mental lapse and bolded instead.

I don’t know what I’ve done to Preview to deserve this. Our friendship appears to be at an end.

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:04 am 59. John Lynch:

Slate seems to have removed Fred Kaplan’s embarrassing article.

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:21 am 60. penwil:

flrenser: “Somebody is selling a CD on ebay which is described as the complete text of the book, “New Soldier”. Cost is $14.95.”

Poor Kerry, he can’t win for losin’. Somebody probably hold of an old copy of the book, and scanned and burned it onto a CD. It’s getting harder and harder to protect a copyright any more, as the music and movie industry–and now John F. Kerry–are finding out to the detriment of their bottom line.

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:34 am 61. marek:

Rick Ballard,

‘goniff’ (from Hebrew ‘ganav’) means ‘thief’ and unless Samuel is from a different parish he will agree.

The generic term ’shmuck’ with whatever matching adjective will do fine in Matthews’ case.

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:38 am 62. Michael Parker:

John Lynch: I just checked, and Kaplan’s article is still the headline article on Slate.

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:46 am 63. Sandy P:

When John Kerry decided it was time to do his first national TV interview since the Swift boaters for Bush launched their attack on the senator’s Vietnam War record, he did not choose CBS’s “60 Minutes,” ABC’s “Nightline” or “NBC Nightly News.”

Kerry picked Comedy Central’s “The Daily Show,” where he will appear tonight in an extended interview.

Via Croowblog, WP’s reporting.

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:58 am 64. Stan:

Can you believe these folks?

Kerry tries to intimidate TV stations by threatening lawsuits if they air the Ads.

Kerry’s lawyers call on the Publisher to embargo and withhold distribution of the Book.

Slate / Fred Kaplan post a specious piece trying to defend a Kerry “story” that Kerry already has retracted. Then they pull the post! It’s “hide the ball”, “…pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.” We truly are in the Land of Oz.

Chris Matthews, who likes to wear the mantle of objectivity, has an exchange with O’Neill and accuses him of using the “usual right wing tactics” then has the comment deleted from the transcript to cover his partisan rear.

These are not people that want to debate the issues to arrive at mutually acceptable policy – they want it THEIR way, period.

Stan

Aug 24, 2004 - 12:06 pm 65. mrp:

Rick Ballard -

Thanks for the post (Posting it in bold was unintentionally perfect ).

Your point about Americans not caring about points of law during campaigns is spot on. But we do care about solemn oaths – oaths made by newly-minted ensigns, and oaths taken by presidents. If John Kerry held a US naval commission while providing aid and comfort to our North Vietnamese enemy, then he most certainly violated his solemn oath. His failure to publically apologize for his meeting(s) with NV officials during a time of war makes him eminently unqualified to serve as the US commander-in-chief.

Aug 24, 2004 - 12:24 pm 66. Knucklehead:

Devildog,

The “Combat V”, otherwise known as a “Combat Distinguishing Device” (or some similar name) apparently is not authorized, by statute, for Silver Stats. The authorization does, however appear in the paperwork that Lehman signed. It doesn’t make sense, but there apparently is a piece of paperwork that authorizes the Combat V. Odd, but it seems almost insignificant given the questions regarding the third PH awarded for chronologically first wound, John’s Excellent XMas Up the River, and Winter Soldier.

Aug 24, 2004 - 12:27 pm 67. Mark Poling:

Akefa, what’s your take on the coverage of Bush’s Air National Guard service?

Aug 24, 2004 - 12:46 pm 68. Bostonian:

“MacMillan would make a fortune if it simply reissued “New Soldier.” ”

This is likely true, but they would need permission from the author, one John Forbes Kerry.

Apparently he has denied this permission.

Aug 24, 2004 - 12:57 pm 69. D Anghelone:

New Soldier is online and downloadable but I haven’t a link.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:13 pm 70. Fred Jacobsen (San Fran):

Southpaw:

Like Mr. Simon, Podhoretz’s recounting the context of the Cambodia issue in the early 1970’s rings true to me. I was a freshman (UC Santa Cruz) in 1969-70. In April, 1970, the print and broadcast (remember, there were only 3 channels in those prehistoric times) media reported that the U.S. had been bombing Cambodia since March, 1969. This disclosure was a bloody shirt to the anti-war movement. Among other consequences, demonstrators shut down every campus of the University of California for the Spring Quarter 1970 (not just a day or two) [by "shut down" I mean every class cancelled]. It resulted in the protest at Kent State (5/4/70). It was, in short, a big deal. Which is why I find it astonishing that, in his 1971 Senate testimony, Senator Kerry would not have recited a personal experience of an incursion into Cambodia (assuming that it ever occurred) in addition to inventorying the other illegal actions he listed. True, the Cambodia issue erupted into another political brouhaha in 1973. But that paled in comparison with the Spring of 1970.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:13 pm 71. Rick Ballard:

marek,

Thanks for the info, mentally I had goniff pegged as conman, crooked swindler, just generally dishonest, rather than thief. Schmuck just doesn’t carry the weight of distaste that I feel for Matthews.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:13 pm 72. marek:

Akefa,

Aren’t you tired from hawking your tripe around? I’ve seen your stuff on VodkaPundit, Chicago Boyz, here and probably somewhere else. It’s boring.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:15 pm 73. marek:

Rick,

As I said that’s the exact meaning of goniff, but in Yidish, and depending on the local tradition your interpreation might be correct too.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:23 pm 74. PeterUK:

Afake,

“Most journalists don’t regard this as real news and prefer to deal with real world coverage.”

You obviously don’t have a clue about journalists,this story has everything,intrigue,scandal,clandestine incursions,war,the military,lies,deceit it only needs sex and it is a tabloid editors dream!

What journalists want more than anything is a story and in the main are as parochial as anyone else, as the man said ” Nobody went bust underestimating the public” Prurience sells.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:24 pm 75. Charlie (Colorado):

The Fred Kaplan piece link. I dunno why it moved.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:27 pm 76. Mark Poling:

The New Soldier Online.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:29 pm 77. marek:

Akefa,

Then why are you getting tired of this talk about Kerry’s feats? Don’t you want to make him even stronger and ensure his election? As a matter of fact I think you should pitch in and instead of talking about Bush talk about Kerry’s Cambodian nights. Make him stronger.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:30 pm 78. Roberts:

Charlie, I didn’t save a copy of the previous Kaplan story to see if they edited it. Blast.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:46 pm 79. devildog:

The “Combat V”, otherwise known as a “Combat Distinguishing Device” (or some similar name) apparently is not authorized, by statute, for Silver Stats. The authorization does, however appear in the paperwork that Lehman signed. It doesn’t make sense, but there apparently is a piece of paperwork that authorizes the Combat V. Odd, but it seems almost insignificant given the questions regarding the third PH awarded for chronologically first wound, John’s Excellent XMas Up the River, and Winter Soldier.

Knucklehead:

Thanks for the follow up. Although I thought I’d seen Silver Stars with V’s, I must have been mistaken. If you haven’t read this article from the authors of Fake Warriors: Identifying, Exposing and Punishing Those Who Falsify Their Military Service, it’s very interesting and makes your point.

That said, I agree completely that this seems insignificant at this point. It kind of feels like piling on — the character deficit has already been proven and character, like virginity, doesn’t lend itself to degrees.

Aug 24, 2004 - 1:56 pm 80. DennisThePeasant:

God, what a great day…

You know, every now and then something happens…the stars align, the Lord smiles, whatever…and there comes an event, a circumstance so delicious that it can warm the chilliest Republican heart and affirm the goodness of life in times of thinning hair and bulging waistlines…

Here I am working at home, groovin’ to some Zappa, and the door rings. I open it up and there he is; no more 22 years, fresh-faced and earnest looking, carrying a petition on a clipboard and wearing a big “Kerry/Edwards’04″ button. I looked at him and the first thing that ran through my mind is when Gene Hackman’s Blind Hermit reacts to Pete Boyle’s Monster crashing through the front door of his hut in Young Frankenstein:

Thank you, Lord. Thank you!

Anyway, there I standing in front of him with a 2 day growth of beard, wearing my ‘SpongeBob SquarePants’ t-shirt, torn jeans and sandals. He takes one look at me, thinks Ally! and chirps enthusiastically “Would you like to sign a petition to make sure John Kerry becomes your next President?”

Thank you, Lord. Thank you!

I didn’t hesitate a second, I’m proud to say. I put on my most maniacal wide-eyed grin and slowly enunciated “Winter…Soldier.” He just stood there for a moment…it was processing…and then without a word turned around and walked away.

I couldn’t resist.

“Have a nice f***ing day!”

Thank you, Lord. Thank you!

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:12 pm 81. devildog:

Samuel can confirm it but I believe the proper yiddish word for Chris Matthews is goniff.

Thanks Rick and Marek! I think goniff fits well.

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:16 pm 82. Knucklehead:

DtP,

I have to tell you. Since the day I discovered the fun at Roger’s Place, this is the first time you have disappointed me. Why on earth didn’t you invite the Young Moron Moonbat in, sit him down, spend 5 or 10 minutes “finishing up a call”, and then let him spill his guts for another 10 or 15 minutes? Then you could have sent him on his on his Winter Soldier’s White Water Rapids Ride to Cambodia.

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:29 pm 83. Knucklehead:

Devildog,

No need to thank me for any followup. In fact I meant to thank you for putting up the link to the frontpage article. Unfortunately I “projected” and, rather than reading the article got bogged down in the “Combat V” article that was linked to early on.

The remainder of the article you linked to gets to some very valid points regarding Kerry’s Silver Star and the “farming” he’s done wrt it over the years. Fascinating and I recommend anyone here take the time and trouble to read it.

Slowly but surely, more and more people are digging deeper and deeper into Kerry’s idiocies. My Mom is still on the fence about this election and one of my sisters, a definite Bush vote, has been fretting for months. I’ve told them both to just wait, Kerry is such a miserable candidate that he will implode. Heck, that was before I’d even begun to check into the SwiftVets stuff and now that I’ve begun looking into Winter Soldier I’m even more convinced.

BTW, I mentioned some time ago my Knucklehead’s Informal Bumper Sticker Poll. Ninety miles driven today in significant traffic, not a single Kerry bumper sticker noticed. Whatever support he has is weak and much of it will crumble before Nov. 2.

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:43 pm 84. wxjames:

Oh, the irony. John Kerry has his choice of six mansions in which to sleep. And yet, his house of cards is in danger of collapse. God must have the strangest sense of humor, no ?

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:54 pm 85. wxjames:

K-head, Kerry has so little interest, I’m a thinkin that dems will stay home in droves and the Bush landslide will become a rout of epic proportions.

Aug 24, 2004 - 2:58 pm 86. devildog:

BTW, I mentioned some time ago my Knucklehead’s Informal Bumper Sticker Poll. Ninety miles driven today in significant traffic, not a single Kerry bumper sticker noticed. Whatever support he has is weak and much of it will crumble before Nov. 2.

Knucklehead:

I was listening to Hugh Hewitt last week and a caller said that one of his neighbors had removed a Kerry sign from the yard once the Christmas in Cambodia story broke. I thought that was interesting and since I remembered seeing two Kerry signs in my neighborhood I went on a jog last Sunday morning — one down and the other is still up.

Now I don’t think anyone motivated enough to post a sign in their yard is going to change their allegiance to their candidate so easily, but I think there’s a level of uncertainty, or a sense of potential embarrassment that’s setting in — that little inner voice that something isn’t right.

Come to think of it, I think all those Kerry signs in Florida that are missing weren’t really stolen.

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:04 pm 87. hollywood:

knucklehead,

” Ninety miles driven today in significant traffic, not a single Kerry bumper sticker noticed. Whatever support he has is weak and much of it will crumble before Nov. 2.”

Out of curiosity, what state do you reside in?

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:05 pm 88. DennisThePeasant:

Hollywood-

Not the state of Ignorance. Give it up, you’ll never meet him.

Knucklehead-

I’m sorry to disappoint you. In my own defense, there are several mitigating factors…

1. The corgis. I could not have had him in the house without the dogs crawling all over him and shiffing Democratic sniffs and the like. It would have taken 5-10 minutes just to calm them down.

2. The wife was due home. If she had walked in on me doing a number on some Kerry volunteer, well, let’s just say I would be somewhat lonely for the next week or so. She’s a Republican, but she insists that I be somewhat polite and mature when she is around.

3. I was on a serious Zappa buzz. He came right in the middle of Status Back Baby (off 1967’s Absolutely Free, which is not only a wonderfully sarcastic song, it could be John Kerry’s next theme song (look up the lyrics on the internet, you’ll love ‘em)). A Zappa buzz is, by definition, judgement impairing.

4. After spending a week trying (unsuccessfully) to get Mork, doublecola and the above mentioned Hollywood to give an honest, straightforward answer on anything relating to John Kerry’s military and anti-war activities, the idea of extending patience to yet one more moron just wasn’t makin’ it.

5. I’m taking Taekwondo for the express purpose of kicking some Lefty Dimwit in the nuts prior to November 2. I have not yet attended enough classes to do this in the correct manner. Substance overrides all, but style still counts for something.

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:27 pm 89. hollywood:

DtP,

You need rutabaga and lots of it.

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:34 pm 90. DennisThePeasant:

H-

Whatever. Hope to see you prior to Nov. 2.

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:40 pm 91. Knucklehead:

DtP,

Explanation more than adequate. Now I understand. I could have had more fun with the Young Dimwit. Rather than corgis I could have just let the 70lb All American Mutt demonstrate her fascination with strangers up close and personal. I coulda tortured the Moonbat for hours and never left a mark.

Oh, regarding the Zappa lyrics. I was one of those who could get from my desk near the windows, out of the classroom, down two flights of stairs and out of the building before the final bell finished clanging. I had no status in HS and wanted none. Zappa is OK, but that particular song don’t do squat for me. I was always Born to Run but, unfortunately, needed to be an earlier adopter of 4-cylinder efficiency.

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:49 pm 92. Occam's Beard:

DtP,

Loved your story, which reminded me of when a some snivelling little git of a canvasser came to my house in Berkeley. After one look at me (bearded and long-haired, as I was at the time) he obviously figured he had a live one here, and happily chirped, “Hey, what do you think of Ron Dellums? Huh? Huh?”, pen poised expectantly over clipboard.

He literally staggered back a step…

Aug 24, 2004 - 3:49 pm 93. Jamie Irons:

OK, now I’m getting paranoid.

Things are going way too smoothly!

Could JFK be using on Bush the famous “rope-a-dope” strategy that he employed when he fought Sonny Liston in their famous first secret bout

in Camobodia?

Jamie Irons

Aug 24, 2004 - 4:03 pm 94. Knucklehead:

Oh!!! BTW, here’s one the folks at Roger’s Place might enjoy. I was yacking with one of my Park Toll, Walk the Dog Buddies. She’s a recovering Moonbat like so many here. With the exception that this sweet lady, retired teacher and such, has been transforming into DtP-not-so-lite over the past few months. She was telling me about a parking lot encounter she had with some Bumper Sticker Moonbat and she finished up with, “I almost lost it completely. It was bad enough that I shouted at her, but I almost cursed her. I can’t take it anymore. I’m too old and I’ve had it with being nice to idiots.” Cracked me up.

BTW2, more of Knucklhead’s Eavesdropping Poll results. In the past three days I have overheard two people remark (completely seperate incidents) that they hung up on political pollsters immediately. Both reasons, paraphrasing, were “They’ll just mark down whatever Kerry-lovin answer they wished I’d given them anyway, so why bother.”

I’m tellinya’ Boys and Girls, Samuel may need to revise his prediction upward. Kerry ain’t sellin’ well.

Aug 24, 2004 - 4:08 pm 95. Southpaw:

Fred Jacobsen

You’re right about the reaction to bombing in Cambodia 1970 being much more severe than in 1973. But this is three years earlier than what JPod claims was the year when the “American Left went nuts” as if they had just discovered that the US violated Cambodian neutrality for the first time. As I stated above, Prince Sihanouk broke diplomatic relations with the US in May 1965 over border incursions. The incursions did not stop, however, nor was it a secret – The Washington Post reported such incidents on 8/4/66 & 10/15/66 including a US promise to take, “measures to prevent any recurrence of such incidents.” It’s also true that Sihanouk resumed diplomatic relations and at least once disclosed the location of communist bases to the US, according to Francois Ponchaud. The protests in 1970 were the result of the expansion of these limited incursions into a large scale invasion, despite Nixon’s assurances to the contrary. What happened in 1973 (and which JPod leaves out) is that the American people found out that Cambodia had been bombed continuously since 1969 and that reports had been doctored to keep this a secret from the public and Congress. Anyway, by 1971, Kerry’s “Cambodia Carol” would not have been an earth shattering disclosure (even if it was true)because the US-Saigon violation of Cambodian neutrality had already been exposed on a much larger scale.

Aug 24, 2004 - 4:16 pm 96. Rick Ballard:

Jamie,

I just saw a two minute take from a campaign speech in New York. If an EMT had jumped on him and hit him with the paddles set at 400 joules, it wouldn’t have surprised me. The campaign shills were 2 beats off with the cattle prods in the audience too. Kerry was pausing (he knows when the boys are supposed to hit the red buttons) and there was a noticeable lapse prior to the first clap. Personally, I think he either needs a complete transfusion or they need to replace the batteries. He looked a lot more like the Ali of today than the Clay of the Liston fight.

BTW – are you going to be the designated wu-ping whupper? He stayed up ’til 1AM in order to be first, you know. You did a very nice job on him.

Aug 24, 2004 - 4:21 pm 97. Jamie Irons:

Rick Ballard

You said:

are you going to be the designated wu-ping whupper? He stayed up ’til 1AM in order to be first, you know. You did a very nice job on him.

Why thank you! I wasn’t even trying. (He said modestly).

Why, if you wanted to see some whuppin’, you should have seen me in Cambodia (near Cambodia, on the watery borders of Cambodia and Zanzibar, where the Nile Delta-Ganges confluence pours out of the Hindu Kush, and those turbulent waters find their final resting place in what is now known as Lake Erie ) on Christmas Eve, 1968.

//Kerry handler, geography specialist

No, wait…on Christmas Eve, 1968, I was with my family in Monterey, Mexico. Never mind.

Jamie Irons

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:00 pm 98. DennisThePeasant:

Hey-

Rope-a-dope was the first Ali-Foreman fight, not Clay-Liston.

Now, the important question…I would like answers/opinions for tomorrow morning…wife will not allow me to play here tonight-

Something about ‘quality time’ together. Offering her a seat next to the computer didn’t work.

Anyway-

If you kick a Lefty Dimwit in the nuts prior to Nov. 2, does he qualify for a Purple Heart?

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:08 pm 99. Knucklehead:

DtP,

Only if the Culture War is recognized by Congress. The Meanspirited Shock Brigade of the VRWC will, however, award you a campaign ribbon.

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:19 pm 100. Tom Holsinger:

Fred Jacobsen,

UC Santa Cruz was not shut down for the whole spring 1970 quarter or any significant part of it. I was there for the whole quarter save for a week when I was in D.C., and that was due more to the massacre at Kent State than to the invasion of Cambodia. It was my junior year. I attended Stevenson 1967-71.

As I recall, all UCSC classes were cancelled for at least a day to protest the invasion of Cambodia, and some classes were cancelled for longer periods, but only a few, if any, were cancelled for more than a week.

UC Santa Cruz was not a political school – its motif then was happy anarchism. The few radicals learned the hard way not to bug other students in the spring of 1969 when they tried to rouse people for some idiot protest at the administration building. Here are three examples of the results:

1) Natural science lab. Radical comes in at 6 am and tries to get pre-med major to come to protest. “Here, hold this beaker of red fuming nitric acid.”

2) Stevenson Dorm Four (all male). Coed tries to rouse sleeping male students to attend protest. They grab her and pretend to drag her down to the bed. She screams and runs away. They follow bare-ass naked and hollering loudly. Keystone Kops chase ensues as other male students stagger out of their rooms in response to all the thumping and go “BOO!” at her, then join in chase. All but her have a fine time for about ten minutes and then they let her out the front door.

3) Me in Stevenson Dorm Five. Male lefty (idiot sophomore transfer from UC Davis for a quarter) woke me up at 6-6:30 am to go to protest. I got up, pretended to be waking up to get him closer to make his pitch, and then sucker-punched him. My roommate was awake by then. We dragged idjit by the heels down the hall to a storage room and gagged/tied him up, then went back to sleep. I got up around ten, showered, checked on idjit, got his ID from his wallet, got his home phone number,

and called his parents in Sacramento. Their darling boy had fallen in with bad companions. Who were getting him into trouble. I was a responsible upperclassman concerned about an otherwise good kid. This was at 10:30 a.m. I released idjit an hour later. His parents arrived at lunch and took idjit home to attend a junior college.

You do the math for their speed getting from Sacramento to UC Santa Cruz in 90 minutes.

This taught our lefties not to disturb the bears.

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:20 pm 101. richard mcenroe:

Fresh Air ó Split the difference: “Ganz tonga…”

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:26 pm 102. Jim in Texas:

Devildog,

Authorizing the “V” device (for valor) on Bronze Star, Distinguished Flying Cross, and some Theater Awards is/was used to designate the award was under “valorous” circumstances which usually meant the award was for combat related service.

The Bronze Star is essentially the combat equivalent of the Meritorious Service Medal, introduced in 1969. You could (and can) receive a BS for meritorous service in a combat zone without actually engaging the enemy.

The “V” was added to the awards to differentiate the non-combat award from the combat version of the award.

Not to say the BS w/o the “V” is any less deserved, just not for closing with the enemy.

BTW, if any of your fathers, grandfathers were awarded the Combat Infanty Badge (CIB) during WWII, then that person is automatically entitled to a BS.

As a result of a study conducted in 1947 the policy was implemented that authorized the retroactive award of the Bronze Star Medal to soldiers who had received the Combat Infantryman Badge or the Combat Medical Badge during World War II”

My father was a former infanty officer in Okinawa and spent 28 years in the USAF and never knew that. I found out and applied for his (it took almost a year) and he finally received it in a surprise ceremony in 1989.

I don’t think I have ever seen him cry until that day.

It’s worth it guys, email me or search online, it’s easy to apply for but it takes some copies of the older documents.

Jim in Texas CMSgt, USAF ret.

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:30 pm 103. richard mcenroe:

Rick Ballard, marek ó Don’t forget “Momser” and “Schlemiel”. And if there has ever been a candidate with more of a Goyisher Kopf than John Forbes Kerry, he must have been running against Jeff Davis…

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:30 pm 104. marek:

richard,

No argument from me – Yiddish vocabulary is nuanced enough to describe our hero. On the other hand maybe it’s too gentle.

Aug 24, 2004 - 5:58 pm 105. richard mcenroe:

Dennis the Peasant ó Just remember: kick for distance…

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:20 pm 106. Terrye:

Dennis:

Say hi to the little lady.

Now as for the purple heart issue, one would have to assume that said lefty had balls. It could be that because of an accident of birth or perhaps some confusion as to gender kicking them in the balls would not be possible.

However, smaking them upside the head would work as well and of course it would get them a purple heart. No doubt the event would be seared into their memories.

I went to a Zappa concert years ago. The man was rude. I mean obnoxious and loud and rude.

All:

It does seem to me that the Kerry campaign is floundering but I wish we could add AlSadr swimming with the fishies to the good news. Or at least see him out of the picture. This shrine morphing into the Alamo thing is getting old.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:26 pm 107. PeterUK:

No Dennis, the Lefty Dimwit qualifies for the Purple Bruise and cluster.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:43 pm 108. Rick Ballard:

Peter,

That’s Purple Bruise and Eggplant Cluster

Terrye,

I have been wondering about Najaf for a bit. I know we don’t want to knock down the mosque but I’m beginning to think that it’s more than that. I saw on the news today that Iraqi regulars appear to be conducting operations in a manner similiar to our forces. Has Najaf become a live fire training exercise? I haven’t noticed that we’ve pulled our forces back at all. We seem to just be killing a fair number of Sadr’s militia every day. Flypaper again? Conditioning the Iraqi public in general to combined US-Iraqi action? A very, very curious situation and not at all like Fallujah (or Najaf for that matter) in April. One morning Alawi is going to say “that’s it” and Sadr will no longer be a problem, but I’m betting it’s an Iraqi force that does the final take out.

Aug 24, 2004 - 6:57 pm 109. Terrye:

Rick:

Yes I think there is in Najaf more to this than we know.

It would seem that it could be ended very quickly if the authorities wanted to. The talking heads are saying this delay places our forces at risk, but I am not sure they are more at risk than they would be if we blew that thing up.

Remember Waco.

Why is it they can’t use tear gas? Have the rules been changed?

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:16 pm 110. richard mcenroe:

Terrye ó In the words of Joss Whedon: “Hittin’ somebody in the head with your fist is never a good idea, but sometimes itís just hi-larious…”

And we can’t use tear gas because it isn’t halal. Gotta fight terrorists with sensitivity, ya know. Besides, it is important for the Iraqi government forces to learn they can win one… In WWII they used to use a couple of bypassed islands with holdoutJapanese garrisons for “blooding” green units before sending them into “real” campaigns.

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:39 pm 111. Terrye:

richard:

I know that gas is nasty but I would prefer tear gas to being shot.

I did see a bunch of the Iraqi troops today on the News. They looked pretty serious.

I am trying to be open minded but I have to say there is something aobut the region that is just weird. I know I know that sounds unkind, but sheesh.

Aug 24, 2004 - 7:47 pm 112. ambisinistral:

Speaking of Najaf. I’ve read in a couple of places that one of the complications is treasure that is stored in the Mosque. Apparently a number of very old scrolls, jewels and cash.

Sistani turned down the keys to the Mosque because he wanted it guaranteed that the treasure was still there. Apparently, if it was clear that Sadr looted that treasure, his stock and his Irani backer’s stock, would plummet through the floor. And not just in Iraq, in Iran also.

It looks to me like they just want to keep picking off defenders until the resistence in the shrine collapses and it can be entered in a fairly organized manner (as little fog of war as possible). The first place they’ll head to is the safes that held that treasure.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:02 pm 113. richard mcenroe:

Terrye ó Damn straight they’re serious. This is not fighting over a couple of police stations. Imagine if these were Christian troops fighting to recover St. Peter’s Basilica.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:08 pm 114. marek:

Another nail to Kerry’s Rassmusen story?

http://qando.net/archives/003894.htm

via CaptainQuarters

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:14 pm 115. ambisinistral:

Here is an article about the Mosque’s treasure

http://www.turkishpress.com/turkishpress/news.asp?ID=25081

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:32 pm 116. devildog:

On the SBVT story…

“What I’ve heard from colleagues is that people feel it probably has had too long a life,” said Frank James, a Chicago Tribune reporter. “We wish someone would put a stake in this vampire.”

Ah, okay. You don’t cover it for over a week, then you spend a few days trying to destroy the Swiftboat veterans credibility and now you wish it would just go away. Great stuff. What muppets.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:56 pm 117. Knucklehead:

Rick, Terrye, Rich:

The mosqe at Najaf stuff is, IMO, one of those things we’re gonna have to wait a while to know enough about to understand. There is no doubt we could do a Grohzny on it any time we want. So why don’t we? That’s one I feel needs to be left to the folks on the scene to understand and, some day, ’splain. Saving a dozen or so US lives by wasting everything that moves in or near it today may, possibly, be the sort of action that costs a hundred lives over following weeks due to lunatic fringers joining an insurrection later. It could also be that that they are using it to work the Iraqi forces into shape. Or because they need to take it intact to show that Sadr looted it. Or some combination of those things and, maybe, others we can’t even guess at.

To be honest, I think our forces have found a new, or at least smarter, way to fight in the 21st century. I don’t believe earlier methods for measuring success apply. If, in fact, they have changed the way wars like this are fought, or at least how we go about fighting them, I imagine there are some botches along the way. It seems to me the last thing we want is Chechnya – the reasons for that might be obvious, but then again, maybe not.

Aug 24, 2004 - 8:58 pm 118. Sandy P:

So, does anyone think Ter-ay-zha will divorce him?

Aug 24, 2004 - 11:05 pm 119. devildog:

So, does anyone think Ter-ay-zha will divorce him?

Why Sandy P?

Of course, everyone knows he’s an empty suit. Without a doubt I can say that everyone but the French and Germans know he’s as exciting as a common rock in a rather large rock pile. Of course that includes the pundits’ analysis that even with the hard-on cocktail of two Viagras and a three Levitras with a tequila back he’s still a zero. And yes, that includes that very special camouflage ‘hat.’

But why do you think divorce Sandy? Is he truly that dumb to kill the cash cow? And yes, of course, I did indeed mean cow.

Aug 25, 2004 - 12:25 am 120. DennisThePeasant:

Richard-

LOL. I will remember…distance!

Terrye-

LOL. I will assume they have ‘em. I’ll go with “Trust Without Verification” on this particular issue.

I never saw Frank in concert. I have always felt there are certain types of people how are far more fascinating at a distance. Zappa was one of those people.

Knucklehead-

The high school years were years of achievement for me. I won both the official “Class Clown” award and the unofficial “Class Asshole” award my senior year. Who knows, if Roger starts handing out annual awards here some day, I may be able to revisit past triumphs…

Aug 25, 2004 - 3:46 am 121. TmjUtah:

Dennis -

“To be honest, I think our forces have found a new, or at least smarter, way to fight in the 21st century. I don’t believe earlier methods for measuring success apply.”

You are half right.

One of the big disconnects between the conduct of this war and what our perceptions of it are is that we’ve unmistakably gone back to ‘earlier methods’ for measuring success…and media is still holding out for a return to the Vietnam model. Most of the late-Vietnam era and post-Vietnam decade was marked by U.S. unwillingness to confront an enemy on the ground; too many images of broken men buying a loss from the evening news in our minds allowed us to forget that even winning efforts involve broken men.

Declining to confront just means that our dead die needlessly. Fighting without an objective is not much better, if any. But fighting aggressively, seeking out the enemy to destroy him, taking and holding ground then pushing forward relentlessly to the next objective IS the ‘earlier method’ that works in winning wars.

The media perks up only when helicopters or Spectres get called in. I am here to tell you that the private soldier in the Sadr militia carrying a rifle thinks about those animals a long, long second place after the possibility they are under observation by our infantry. Sadr’s thugs get their pictures in the news and get a big islamo stiffy for carrying AK’s and chanting ‘death to the infidel!’ but all they get from the Marines, Army, and ING troops in front of them is a single shot from out to 800 yards. The gunships are called in when mortars or strongpoints are located. The retail killing by aimed rifle fire goes on around the clock.

I cannot imagine the psychological state of the Mooks. That’s o.k., that’s not a necessary component to dealing with them. This round in Najaf has gone on for two weeks. The cordon around the shrine has been sealed for over a week and by all accounts the perimeter creeps in by a few hundred yards per day. They longer the Mooks fight, the fewer suiciders, bomb planters, and foreign fighters there will be to deal with down the road. Our troops have been trained to kill, not to examine their navels, and our media and the enemy are both seemingly incapable of dealing with the fact we aren’t pulling back.

Will we change their minds? Maybe. Eventually they’ll surrender, or they’ll die. As soon as we finish this election cycle the bad guys will know how serious we are about finishing what we started. Then we can get to the really heavy lifting.

Aug 25, 2004 - 8:04 am 122. PeterUK:

Someone is providing the backbone for al Sadr’s ad hoc,ragtag and bobtail Mehdi Army and it isn’t al fat boy,there is probably a core of Iranian?Syrian/alQuaeda fighters in the mosque.These would undoubtedly blow the mosque, themselves and any US or Iraqi troops entering the place.It is election year,what would suit the usual suspects better than a disasterous explosion in one of Islams holiest sites that also killed a couple of hundred troops? No, I don’t mean the Democrats,or then again.

Al Sadre may not be planning this as he seems to be an opportunist,but I don’t think he is fully in control,which accounts for the tergiversation that is occuring.

Aug 25, 2004 - 12:08 pm

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