121 Comments

1. Tom Grey:

Kerry is going down. The Leftist Press bias will be next — and in fact, it IS their fault, and of academics, NOT to have looked at Kerry’s Lies, earlier. Like, 1986, at least. The press has been enabling Kerry, and his false Leftist moral superiority, for years.

The press has this silly Unreal Perfection as the standard, that anything real fails, if looked at. To maintain such stupidity requires constant self-censorship. Which PC is, and always has been, full of.

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:42 am 2. Terrye:

I heard Clinton say that none of what these men said mattered becasue none of the swifties ever served with Kerry. He either does not know about Gardner or thinks he can lie his way out of it. I think their greatest problem has been the fact that they simply can not admit the fact that there is any merit to what the swifties say and so they have to make dumb comments like Clinton’s denial. Methinks thou does protest too much.

In the words of Abe Lincoln. You can fool some of the people all of the time, all of the people some of the time but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.

or something like that.

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:52 am 3. Jamie Irons:

Terrye:

Close.

But I think it went: “You can fool all of the people some of the time, and some of the people all of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time.”

Or something like that.

Jamie Irons

Aug 30, 2004 - 6:15 am 4. Jamie Irons:

Man, looking at that photo that accompanies the article Roger cites, Dan Rather appears to have put on a few pounds since the last time I looked (some years ago; I have given up on network news altogether).

Maybe it’s because he can’t bestir himself to sniff out a few facts on his own. The insipid and colorless quality of what he has here to say on the Swift Vets shows him to be far behind the story.

Jamie Irons

Aug 30, 2004 - 6:22 am 5. Terrye:

Jamie:

Well you know what I mean anyway.

Dan is just like the rest of us, he is getting older.

Aug 30, 2004 - 6:36 am 6. holdfast:

The very idea that Clinton can get away with commenting on ANYTHING to do with Vietnam is just maddening. I mean, I believe that most of what the Swifites’ have to say is true, but next to Clinton, Kerry looks like the cloned child of Audie Murphy, Chesty Puller and George S. Patton.

I just finished reading Brendan Miniter’s “Losing Bin Laden”, and would highly recommend it. I was anticipating a well-deserved hatchet job on the Clintonistas, but was surprised at how nice to them it actually was. Most of the really damning quotes come from people within the administration. I hope that this is required reading in the Bush Admin – not to bash Clinton but to avoid making the same mistakes. I noted three interesting things:

Richard Clarke

Richard Clarke came off looking pretty good. Though I think he was too legalistic in his approach, he was putting in the time and effort on a file that the higher-ups in the administration didn’t want to hear about, and trying hard. It’s too bad he chose to lose his mind in the public testimony before the 911 Commission (by all accounts he was far more fair and balanced in the closed hearings).

The Pentagon

I was pissed at General Shelton’s attitude – I guess I’m naive enough to want military officers to be better than the hacks they serve. I know that the Pentagon hated Slick Willie’s guts (well, Bill had confessed to “loathing” the military) but I really would have expected the Chiefs to put the good of the nation above feuds with the WH. Instead they tried to scupper Clarke’s plans for snatching Bin Laden. The plans were admittedly flawed, but the military should have worked with him to tighten them up instead of tying lead weights to them.

Retreads

It seems like many of the Clintonites responsible for the “misterable failure” (tm, Dick Gephardt) that was a the US response to Bin Laden under Clinton (Jamie Rubin, Sandy Berger,Rand Beers, Joe Wilson etc) are the same people who are advising Kerry today. For anyone who is even moderately serious about national security, this should be a deal killer (paging Andrew Sulivan – stay home on Election Day).

Aug 30, 2004 - 6:46 am 7. jdm:

It cannot be denied that the Clintons were consummate politicians. In addition, I am guessing that they had to work through any number of campaign crises in AK politics. The end result was an campaigning machine that was usually able to deal with anything that came up – and lord knows, stuff came up.

Kerry and his experience as an undistinguished junior senator to Teddy in Mass who could essentially dial it in campaign-wise leaves him and his staff as pale imitations of the Clintons. Their lack of ability and experience is being revealed almost daily. It’s embarassing, almost painfully so.

It is slowly but surely being revealed that Kerry is a candidate with few, if any, strengths, and lots of weaknesses. That the Democrats allowed things to get this far is an indictment of their failings as a party – things like this should’ve been known or discovered during the primaries (one can really see how much the SBVs “hate” Kerry that they let him get out of the primaries before revealing what they knew).

Kerry’s inability to be honest even with himself in the face of the supposed culmination of his career, speaks volumes. He knows – or should know – about the apple polishing, the fibs, and yes, the lies he has told over the years. A man with that much baggage should never have run: this campaign is going to be excruciatingly painful for all concerned.

I can only hope that Kerry doesn’t do something stupid as befits his narcissism (the only thing he has which exceeds Bill C’s).

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:02 am 8. jedrury:

I read “Unfit for Command” over the weekend and its initial charge, re: point-by-point analysis on the medals, is devastating.

So when one is debating a Kerry lover always ask them; “have you read the book ?” A appropriate rejoinder routinely resulting in a “Well, ahhh, no, but it is all ao negative anyways.” The short sighted passion of the left is duplicated by its refusal to toil in the vineyards of reflection and thought.

The SwiftBoat Vets ads are highly effective and they definitely have “legs,” but to be campaign effective those legs have to be long distance runner legs, not sprinter’s. They have to carry through September as a campaign issue.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:08 am 9. jerry:

Presidential campaigns are a good test of how much potential a candidate has to succeed in the office. By that measure Kerry has failed the test. It is not the specifics of the Vietnam issues that currently dog him but his preparation for and reaction to the SBVFT attacks. He should have at least anticipated some flack about his post-war anti-war activities. His only plan was to pose as an Audie Murphy like hero and to blunt any criticism not only of his anti-war activities but his pro-communist stand in Central America, his pro-Soviet stand on defense in the 80’s and his post-cold war proposals to cut intelligence and defense by even more then was planned by Bush-41 and Clinton. He has engaged in the kind of wishful thinking that would result in disaster overseas and an inability to deal with domestic issues. He has demonstrated a significant lack of leadership skills that truly make him “Unfit for Command” to lead the nation in its national security or domestic affairs.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:14 am 10. Jamie Irons:

Terrye

You’re getting older!?

Jamie Irons

(From reading many of your posts, I had you pegged as another spring chicken, like myself!)

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:15 am 11. M. Simon:

Kerry will start gaining traction when he can answer the following koans/questions/jokes:

ó==ó

Steal this sig:

George Bush never called me ìbaby killerî.

There is a big difference between William Calley and John Kerry. William Calley is a proven war criminal. For John Kerry we only have his word as an officer and a gentleman.

What is the War Hero Afraid of?

Form 180. Release ALL the records.

The Ads: Video links

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:15 am 12. jedrury:

JDM:

Interesting comment.

You are correct that there is a marked difference in styles between Clinton and Kerry. I gulped down some stomach pills and forced myself to watch Clinton at Riverside Church last night

on C Span. Give the devil his due; he is masterful and utterly shameless in his ability to weave the Bible, religion, political lies, edgy half truths and self effacement masking his arrogance into a seamless web of articulation. He can talk his way out of anything.

Kerry is a very scripted in the campaign speeches and does have than oratorical charm that Bubba possesses. And your comment about organization is turning out to be especially correct.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:19 am 13. julie:

Am I the only one who finds Clinton boring? Anyway, the SBVT are going to release ad #4 this week. Does anyone know what it will focus on?

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:27 am 14. DennisThePeasant:

Regarding Bubba and the Dragon Queen-

Bill and Hillary have now put in their obligatory Kerry-shilling appearances and will gleefully fade into the woodwork. Now they can say they’ve done their bit and get back to plotting for 2008. I’d imagine that both are somewhat amazed that Kerry has, to date, made their lives so easy.

Regarding Roger’s Point on Kerry’s Response-

Reading William Raspberry’s column this morning in the Dispatch (linked to by Instapundit) and after hearing Dowd’s Letterman appearance, I’m coming to the conclusion that it is starting to dawn on much of the pro-Kerry punditry that there very well may be a whole lot of fire in back of all the smoke. Keep track of how many rats jump the ship over the next two weeks.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:31 am 15. Pat Curley:

I think back to the Meet the Cuomo Aide interview this spring, where Russert gave him the opening to apologize to the veterans and Kerry suddenly got the stiff spine he’s lacked on everything else. For once he wasn’t going to waffle, or flip-flop.

I think he’s spent too much of his life in Massachusetts and DC, where his anti-war celebrity was an asset. He believes that everybody now accepts the lefts’ criticism of the war, that the only problem with what he said was it wasn’t artful enough.

As to the Cambodia tale, I think it reveals Kerry as a fabulist. Over the years, tales have grown and morphed. Cambodia probably was first mentioned in his 1971 draft proposal for a book; IIRC 1971 was when Nixon claimed there were no troops in Cambodia. By 1979 the story had morphed so that Kerry was in Cambodia when Nixon said it.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:37 am 16. Mike_Nargizian:

M Simon

Lose the message at the end of every post. It makes reading the message 10x more difficult and cumbersome. Or at least blockquote it so its in smaller type.

Roger’s Post

What will Bush’s bounce be?

The Repubs have the key MO going into the Convention.

Analyzed the Swing States, (Ohio Key) where Bush is still a bit behind overall.

McCain is working from 4:30am to 1am in the morning and shaking more hand than anyone?

WHY IS THAT? 04 or 08?

WILL CHENEY GRACEFULLY DROP OUT AND BUSH PICK UP McCAIN? and get a huge Momentum Bump and maybe the election?

1) It gives McCain guaranteed entre and momentum to run in 08.

2) It guarantees the Repubs dominant Press Coverage for the next 2 weeks!! TOTAL DOMINANCE that even the liberal press couldn’t change.

3) It gives the Repubs a huge poll boost they couldn’t get otherwise, HUGE.

4) It brings the debate away from Kerry and makes him insignificant.

5) Cheney could slip into Sec of Defense (though I love Rummy) or State (Powell’s leaving – I can dream man!)

6) It puts the middle independents and many Americans behind the next administration strongly in the face of the European hatred and that is huge for this country at this time in history!

7) It saves this country from a close controversial election at a time when we can least afford it and sures up this admin’s mandate. No controversies about polls staying open 3 extra hours in St. Louis!

It shuts the fuck up Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Franken and the noise makers after the election is a SLAM DUNK. What are they going to carp about then?

9) Kerry endorsed McCain, tried to get him to run with him, and the liberal media loves McCain.

How are they going to get around that post the Convention? YOU TELL ME THAT ONE? IMPOSSIBLE.

10) Only negative is Rove still believes how many (%of) Evangelicals that get out to vote

will determine the election and McCain could hurt there.

I think except 10 -

IT WOULD BE BETTER FOR THE COUNTRY IN THE END.

Mike

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:41 am 17. chuck:

Re Clinton:

He can talk his way out of anything.

Practice makes perfect.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:43 am 18. MeTooThen:

Roger,

No, John Forbes Kerry is still the likely next President of the United States.

What matters is the mobilization of voters. Look at the streets of Manhattan, the Left is mobilized.

Polling data are mixed, some show that independents equally are moved closer to or farther from voting for Kerry because of the SwiftVets.

And then there’s the MSM.

Tonight ABC, CBS, and NBC will not be televising the RNC.

How do you think the Big 3 networks are going to spin the rest of the RNC once they do televise it?

Hint: It won’t be pretty.

No, Kerry is still the front-runner and the MSM will continue to try to bury Bush.

If the MSM turn on Kerry, it’s a Bush landslide victory, otherwise, the mobilized Left will carry Kerry to the Presidency.

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:52 am 19. richard mcenroe:

M. Simon ó “…answer the following koans/questions…” [blank space]

Wow, brevity

IS the soul of wit! *g*

Mike_Nargizian ó Cheney is the sinister bogeyman of the ABB crowd because of his connection to Halliburton (although they have no trouble with the $100 million construction contract Kerry’s family got from the Vietnamese after he squashed the Human Rights in Viet Nam Act in 2001). But they are not going to vote for Bush no matter what. Sacking Cheney gains him nothing.

Also, Bush has a record of standing by his time, sometimes longer than he should, as in the cases of Tenet and Norm Mineta, both of whom should have been sacked long ago (Mineta, in fact, is still the Transportation secretary, mandating that we cavity-check senior citizens at airports to avoid the appearance of racial profiling…).

Aug 30, 2004 - 7:55 am 20. jerry:

MeToo:

First, the left you see mobilized will not exclusively be voting for Kerry. They are a mixture of various colors of communist, Naderite, Greens and other fringe groups. The remainder are pretty much DU type fringe players.

Second, these mobilized lefties have high turnout rates for protests and low turnout rates at the polls. If this were not true then McGovern would have beat Nixon, Mondale would have beat Reagan and Dean would be the nominee.

Third, in a country of nearly 300,000,000 affluent people, it is not hard to get a couple of hundred thousand people to NYC just before school starts.

Fourth, and perhaps most importantly, the left doesn’t like Kerry anymore then it likes Bush. To the extent they vote for him it is because he is ~Bush. If Kerry even attempts to move to the center he will lose the left. If he reasserts his socialist ideology he will lose the broad middle.

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:05 am 21. Sandy P:

Hey, everyone, have you seen this?

Via Samizdata, from the New Yorker, a conversation between Norman Mailer and his son:

…Anyway, what really flabbergasted me was a something only a few paragraphs into the article where the younger Mailer dropped this little bombshell:

JBM I feel we’ve entered a realm where the question is, whose propaganda is better? The left (Democrat) is beginning to figure out that they can’t beat the right (Republican) with intelligent argument. They need punch phrases that get to the heart of the average American…

Excuse me? Your party cannot win with intelligent argument? Is that because you have no intelligent arguments to make or because the majority of people are too stupid to understand? This suggests either a very deep flaw with your basic tenets or a very dim view of the population in general. JBM continued with:

… If that’s the case, what is the future for our country?

What indeed? The elder Mailer had a ready answer.

NM Thatís not my first worry right now…

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:07 am 22. richard mcenroe:

Time = team

About the Raspberry piece. Gotta love the arrogance. Even as they start to distance themselves from Kerry, the MSM are still saying, “Sure, WE know better, but those wretched proles ó” (you know, the ones the MSM is supposed to be informing) “ó just don’t get it…”

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:09 am 23. Carl in Atlanta:

TRACTION:

Just did a Google seach for:

“Swift Boat Veterans” + Kerry

Result: 229,000 hits

I can’t remember where I saw it, but there is a blogger out there who was keep track of the # of Google hits one would get from this search. Two weeks ago it was miniscule. Ten days ago the # was only in the 3,000’s. Yeah I’d call that traction; at least on the internet.

BTW, it’s nice to be able to post again. My Typepad password got messed up and I’ve been “locked out” for that past couple of weeks! Howver, I still visit here each day, at least twice. Have fun Roger!

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:13 am 24. Catherine:

Pat Curley

As to the Cambodia tale, I think it reveals Kerry as a fabulist.

Thanks for the word ‘fabulist.’

I’ve been calling him a confabulator, which turns out to be an incorrect use of psychiatric terminology . . . and I’ve been trying to find a word that expresses what I meant to say with “confabulation.”

This is seriously OT, I know. But thanks.

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:37 am 25. Terrye:

Me Too:

Lucky for all of us the country is not NYC. Democrats outnumber Republicans in that city 4 to 1. I can’t imagine how Rudy G. ever won. I think if the convention had been somewhere else there would have demonstrations but probably not as large.

As for crowds look at sporting events, street festivals both here and abroad, Mardi Gras etc. The important thing is not the number of people in the streets, but the number of people that vote and the vets may be pretty damned mobilized themselves.

Jamie:

When I was born we were fighting a war in Korea and you could buy a coke for a nickle. That is how damn old I am.

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:43 am 26. Samuel:

The media is still trying to divide the Republican base by spending a disproportionate time talking about such a “conservative platform” and “socially moderate speakers”. Well I have been a “Liberal” Republican for about a year now and could give a rat’s ass what the platform says, and I am sure this is going to bother Republican Moderates or Conservatives a hell of a lot less then Democrat sitting Senator Zell Miller giving the keynote address at the Convention will bother the MSM and Democrats.

To Susan Estrich, I saw the fear in your eyes, you know it is over, get back to being one of the more intellectually honest Democrats. Saying if Bush wins because of the Swift Boat controversy then his Presidential win would be illegitimate is just ridiculous. The Democrats decided to go after Bush’s National Guard service, call him dishonest and made a calculation to hide Kerry‚Äôs Senate record behind his Vietnam Service, believing this would trump Bush. It didn’t work, deal with it. Democrats made the rules, chose the topic, again I say deal with it. I invoke the words of the late Lawton Chiles, “If you can’t run with the big dogs then stay on the porch!”

DennisThePeasant, the media will turn on Kerry as they have no one else to turn on. They can control themselves only so long.

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:47 am 27. Samuel:

Terrye

Democrats outnumber Republicans in that city 4 to 1.

WOW, I thought it was 6 to 1. The Republicans must be gaining ground!

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:50 am 28. Catherine:

As to the “left” winning this, that & the other, this is a very conservative country. (Check out THE RIGHT NATION, for instance. Or any of the series of books trying to explain why the U.S. is the only Western country in the world not to have developed a serious socialist movement.)

The Democrats understand this. That’s why their whole convention was: Me War Hero, Me Make Good President.

FYI, from THE RIGHT NATION:

Socialist parties blossomed in every important country in Europe in the second half of the nineteenth century, mobilizing mass support for expanding the power of the state, both to provide welfare services (such as pensions) and to restrain the power of the market. But in America socialists cast their seed on barren ground.

….

the socialists’ failure was also ideological: in America, they ran into a working class that showed far less enthusiasm for socialist ideas. Back in 1890 Friedrich Engels fumed that “America is so purely bourgeois, so entirely without a feudal past and therefore proud of its purely bourgeois organization.” Interestingly, the left-wingers that America did eventually manage to produce clung to individualism, unlike their European equivalents. Prior to the Great Depression the entire gamut of American labor, from the mainstream unions in the American Federation of Labor to the radical Industrial Workers of the World, opposed programs that extended the role of the state. The AFL opposed state provision of old-age pensions, compulsory health insurance, minimum-wage legislation, unemployment compensation; and from 1914 onward it was even against legislating maximum hours for men. Most American leftists were more interested in getting their fair share of the American dream than creating a socialist society.

By 1929 Joseph Stalin was so impatient with the progress of socialism in America that he summoned Jay Lovestone, the head of the American Communist Party, to Moscow to explain the lack of success. . . . In fact, the Great Depression did eventually “Europeanize” American politics a little. The New Deal led to a huge expansion in the state’s powers to tax, spend and regulate, including a Social Security system to help the aged and government agencies to monitor the affairs of business. . . .

For all that, the most striking thing about the New Deal, considering the extent of the calamity that America was facing, was its moderation.

http://www.nationalreview.com/script/printpage.asp?ref=/comment/micklethwait_wooldridge200406170930.asp

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:53 am 29. Catherine:

Samuel & Terrye

Assuming we’re talking about NYC, I just read last week, in the Westchester section, that the ratio of Democrats to Republicans is 5 to 1.

Republicans are now substantially outnumbered in Westchester, too. I think the ratio here is 4 Democrats for 3 Republicans, which is way higher than I would have pegged it. I would have said there’s me and then there’s George Bush’s cousin John, who, I discovered via the blogosphere, lives in my town. So that makes a total of 1 Republican in all of Westchester since I’m still a registered Democrat.)

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:57 am 30. jerry:

Catherine:

I have always attributed the “no feudalims, no socilaism” to Seymour Martin Lipsit. Learn something new every day.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:00 am 31. Samuel:

Catherine

I heard that only 61% of New York Republicans are supporting Bush. It seems that New York is the inversion of the South. In North Carolina Democrats outnumber Republicans by more than 20%, yet Bush carried North Carolina by 13%.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:05 am 32. Knucklehead:

The irregularities of Kerry’s military service just keep getting deeper.

For example, I was reading sometime Roger’s Place commenter Bedlar and deep in the comments section someone brought up the length of Kerry’s service or, perhaps more accurately, the length of time between his enlistment and his Honorable Discharge. It does seem puzzling…

Kerry enlisted in mid-Feb ‘66. His terms and conditions for service, according to his Enlistment Contract, would was for six years.

Kerry terminated his active duty in March ‘70. This should have left him with just less than two years of inactive reserve requirement. His campaign website timeline stops shortly after with the note that he was registered as “completed service”.

His DD214 says “No discharge certificate issued at time of seperation”. (BTW, his DD214 does have his Silver Star listed as “with Combat V”.)

His Honorable Discharge is Feb. 1978.

His Record of Discharge From Active Duty is from Feb. ‘72. This notes that the type of Discharge Certificate is Honorable.

His Record of Service notes that he was transferred from active duty to the Naval Reserve in Jan ‘70 and then to Standby Reserve – Inactive, in July ‘72 and, finally, discharged in Feb. 78.

This suggests that he was in an “active” reserve for roughly 2.5 years – Jan ‘70 to July ‘72. Wouldn’t there be some reporting component to this? And why was he not fully discharged from the US Naval Reserve in ‘72 once his six year enlistment contract was fulfilled?

I could be missing something on his site, but I’m not finding anything that ’splains the six additional years as Standby/Inactive reserve from ‘72-’78. Can any of you former officers enlighten me about this?

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:09 am 33. Demosophist:

Roger:

The conventional wisdom I heard today on CNN is that the Swiftvet ads aren’t having much of an effect. Something like only 36% of the public thinks there’s any truth to them. Now, clearly, part of the reason for that is the liberal media bias that consistently plays down or ignores the bite of the case they make. I heard Chris Wallace say recently that the Swiftvets haven’t come up with a single official document supporting the claim that no enemy shots were fired during the Bronze Star episode. As though that proves the case that Kerry was under fire. But I think there are some documents showing that there was no bullet-related damage to any of the boats (let alone the humans), which strongly suggests that they weren’t sitting there under fire from the N. Vietnamese for 90 minutes. Bush Chris’ mind is made up.

But the real reason most Americans are dismissing this is because the President has. Bush has simply not legitimated the notion that the Swiftvets might be right, and has gone even further to state that he thinks Kerry was a hero. The result is that, true or not, the Swiftvet campaign has lost a lot of its steam.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:13 am 34. Terrye:

Samuel and Catherine:

Maybe we should settle for saying there is a whole bunch of Democrats and very few Republicans. Isn’t that why Michael Moore said he was surprised the terrorists hit NYC? Sort of the like the shock the French felt when their journalists were taken by some crazies calling themselves the Islamic Army. Oh well, that is off topic.

The closest America came to a true socialist movement were the agrarian populists of the late 19th and early 20th century. They tried to forge an alliance with the unions of hte cities but could not sustain the movement. Americans are too independent.

They had great names, like Sockless Simpson.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:14 am 35. Sandy P:

WHOA-

He was in ACTIVE service when he met w/the VC or NVA in Paris????

He was still in active service when he testified in ‘71?

I also read on another blog that there’s a VV reunion coming up this weekend and rumor has it that he was the 1st 3-and-out PH’er.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:16 am 36. Knucklehead:

Catherine (not sure which with-a-C you are, but I suspect the orginal),

The failure of a hard, Euro-style social-democrat party to take hold in the US is interesting. I suspect it is one the key elements to Euro-frustration with the US. The fact that we haven’t fully embraced the Euro-style welfare state grates on their sensitivities. Its an implicit rejection and they don’t like it. Add to that the the US economy consistently outperforms the Euro economy and that they’ve written US capitalism’s obituary several times and been proven incorrect and they sometimes get downright outraged about the whole thing.

Suspicion number two is that the Clintonistas, Hillary in particular, envisioned finally transforming the Democratic Party into a real Euro-style social-democrat party. The big swing for that was HillaryCare. I’m too lazy to track down the cite, but around that time she made some comment about how the government could not be held responsible for “undercapitalized” businesses that, to me, completely tipped her hand.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:23 am 37. Terrye:

Demo:

The Fox poll said that 13% thought Kerry was lying and 35% thought he was embellishing his record. Only aobut a third actually believed Kerry’s accounts. In other words people are having doubts about his record.

I think it has hurt him because the Dems act like it has and because the polls show that has. Don’t underestimate the effect that unhappy vets will have on the election.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:24 am 38. geoffg:

Terrye,

Being born in the middle of WWII, I recall the time frame you mentioned. Coke was a nickel for 8 oz. and gasoline was something like 25 cents per gallon.

Hasn’t changed much. Today, Coke is a buck, and gas is $2

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:27 am 39. Knucklehead:

Sandy P,

Well, apparently he was Active Reserve. I have no idea how the US Naval Reserve works now, or then, but I believe “Active Reserve” has a “reporting” commitement (something similar to the weekend/month + 2 weeks/year of the National Guard).

As I said, I don’t know how the Naval Reserves worked then or now, and since the Vietnam war was winding down they may not have kept strict track of reporting commitments. If there were reporting commitments, however, I’ll be laughing if anyone holds Kerry’s feet to the fire about showing us he wasn’t “AWOL” (don’t scream, I know the term doesn’t apply) during that time.

To get back to your original question… It does seem that Kerry may, indeed, have been something a bit more than a “former US Naval officer with some minor legalistic technicality inactive reserve status” when he was off in Paris meeting with the North Vietnamese. Hmmm….

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:29 am 40. Goof®:

Samuel

There are reasons members of Congress rarely move from Capitol Hill to the White House. Did Bob Dole run on his accomplishments in the House and the Senate?

I like Zell Miller, but he doesn’t make any sense. John Connally made sense. He also changed his party affiliation. My general observation these days is that both parties are full of the incoherent going on and on about the meaningless. In other words, they mirror the culture they’re a part of. I love the culture and I like (or am sympathetic) to the politicians. What can I say? The last politician I was seriously mad at was the President’s father and that was way back in 1980.

I still think his is going to be very close and is going to be decided, in all likelihood, during the last weekend in October.

Best.

64 days to go.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:34 am 41. George:

Steve Gardner served on John Kerry’s boat longer

than anyone else but he wasn’t the only dissenter

who served on John Kerry’s boat.

William L. Schachte Jr. (you know — that guy who

went on to become a Rear Admiral) served on a

boat with John Kerry. And he says Kerry never

earned that first Purple Heart:

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/robertnovak/rn20040827.shtml

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:36 am 42. Terrye:

geoffd:

I am old enough that I can remember a time when the Democratic Party had integrity.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:40 am 43. jerry:

Knucklehead:

Kerry did not have a drill requirement. He was released from active service and his status until placed in the inactive reserve until 1978 was that of an individual ready reservist (IRR) without a drill requirement. He had the option of finding a unit to serve with but it was not a requirement. Every officer was placed in the IRR pool upon release. There are not enough billets in the Naval Reserve to require every released officer to attend a drill and there has never been a shortage of volunteers for open billets.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:42 am 44. jdm:

> Coke was a nickel for 8 oz. and gasoline was

> something like 25 cents per gallon.

> Hasn’t changed much. Today, Coke is a buck, and

> gas is $2

Actually it hasn’t. An 8 oz Coke is 3/4s of a can (which costs roughly 50 cents). A nickel in present dollars is

35 cents (from 1950). Sounds like 50 cents to me.

See here for constant gas prices from 1950. They look pretty stable except for Jimmah’s time manning the pump.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:44 am 45. blogaddict:

As far as Kerry and the truth goes–I believe he’s one of those consummate and deeply pathological liars who has long since lost sight of what is a lie and what is the truth about his life, if indeed he ever knew in the first place. And he has built his entire life and persona on these lies. He will never retract them, never.

I believe Kerry has narcissistic personality disorder. See this http://www.angelfire.com/ego/narcissism/ .

A few selected quotes to whet your appetite:

“Lying is an integral part of the narcissist’s behavior and all their self-reports are unreliable. His cognition is impaired to the extent that he frequently misinterprets other’s speech, actions, and thoughts. He may believe that someone respects or loves him although this is a fantasy which exists only in the mind of the narcissist. Narcissists will over inflate their own accomplishments, are boastful, and pretentious…A narcissistic injury occurs when someone defeats or criticizes the narcissistic individual. The narcissist may not show it outwardly, but he is haunted by criticisms and defeats…When a narcissistic injury occurs, the narcissist begins to feel empty, degraded, and humiliated and he is capable of retaliating with narcissistic rage. His reactions constitute disdain or defiant attacks.”

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:48 am 46. Knucklehead:

Demosophist,

While its possible that the Swiftvet campaign has lost some steam it seems equally possible that they are merely in transition between phases. There are a lot of unanswered questions regarding Kerry’s service and the years following it. Kerry’s campaign (and the MSM) would be foolish to discount the Winter Soldier and VVAW stuff. They made that mistake with the Swiftvets in the first place and they can’t be dumb enough to make the same mistake twice, can they?

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:51 am 47. Samuel:

Catherine, Terrye

Our country is unique from the beginning. The fact is the Revolution was led by the rich elite, George Washington was probably the wealthiest American (of course he earned it the old fashioned way, like Kerry he married into most of it), but unlike the Socialist elites these people were extremely religious or very friendly to those practitioners of such religion.

It is the religious aspect to our moralism that sets us apart from the rest of the world. We must not go too far in suppressing this as bad. Many try to paint Social Conservatives as if they were like the Taliban, which is ridiculous. I am convinced this is also why Israel is so uniquely supported by the United States, in fact more supported by the Right then the Left. Tom Delay is much more supportive of Israel than the average lefty I assure you.

This is why Irving Kristol said Social Conservatives are the easiest to ally with politically even when it would seem that should not be the case, as Neo-cons are moralists and patriotic, the Social Conservative?s righteous moralism makes for natural principled appeal on right and wrong issues like Iraq and Israel and the War on Terror. Also while the media plays a “split” between Moderates and Conservatives at the Republican Convention they lose the bigger point. Like most moderates, they don’t champion these issues as much as they are tolerant, they are second or third on the tier of importance. In a political environment like today it is not an issue by a long shot. The fall of the Berlin Wall and Soviet Union exposed this during the 90’s, but the United States is also more uniquely security minded, and we live in such a mindset, 911 changed the equation, otherwise many if us would still be where we were in 2000.

In truth the difference between a moderate Democrat and a moderate Republican is emphasis of importance. To most moderate Republicans, social issues are third on the list, fiscal and security trump, for Arnold it is probably more fiscal, to Rudy more Law and Order, but they trump social issues for both. To the moderate Democrat the opposite is true. Social issues tend to trump fiscal and security issues. Whenever these get reshuffled then the political deck gets reshuffled as well. I still believe the Republicans have the wind at their backs because of these issues. Roger, myself and others are proof of this.

There are also the character issues as well that greatly matter to all Republicans which I won’t get deeply into. But where these issues matter in a post 911 world the Republicans have the edge. This matters to me for sure, after all I am a 45 year old grown-up.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:51 am 48. Rick Ballard:

Knucklehead,

I think you need a cite for the active aspect. I’ve only found inactive status attributed. You are absolutely correct in the reporting requirements but each unit had different actual performance criteria. There was a surfeit of returning officers during those years and they could hook up with a local unit, come in and sign in once a month and even skip the two weeks. I used to make up drills with a Guard unit in California by doing paperwork for the Top. The company that I served in had four 1st lieutenants on roster, none of whom showed up for drills. We also had the normal officers complement (1 Capt., 1 1st Lt. and 4 2nd Lt.) When I asked the Top about it he said the officers were all completing their contracts and that they were all Nam vets. This was in ‘70-73 so it fits the time period but it was California and Army so there may be significant differences in requirements. Plus the Reserves and Guard units operated under seperate regulations to begin with.

Finding the name and location of the Reserve unit where Kerry was assigned would be a start – if he had an actual service obligation.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:52 am 49. Fresh Air:

Goof–

There are reasons members of Congress rarely move from Capitol Hill to the White House. Did Bob Dole run on his accomplishments in the House and the Senate?

Yes. Any further questions?

As to Zell Miller not making any sense, you need to spend more time in Georgia. It’s a different breed of Democrat down there, a Jacksonian one. And Zell Miller is an old Marine who doesn’t dig the dissolute behavior of Bill Clinton and lack of scruples of his annointed successors. Quite easy to understand really. Miller didn’t want to leave his party so he did the honorable thing: he resigned.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:53 am 50. Knucklehead:

Thanks for the info, Jerry. Any idea why the six additional years beyond the six of the enlistment contract?

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:54 am 51. notthisgirl:

I mentioned before, on this and one other blog, that you ought to watch this new story by that reporter for the Chigaco Sun Times. It’s about the “V” supposedly added to Kerry’s Silver Star.

The new article, where the reported talked with Secy’ Lehman, said that Lehman in no way remembers signing the papers (Kerry’s website apparently had a document approving the “V”/Silver Star with Lehman’s sig on it).

Why does this all have legs? First, Kerry made Vietnam the centerpiece of his campaign. Kerry also manipulated the information of his Vietnam experience apparently, and it’s all coming out. And why he would bate these people with the phrase BRING IT ON defies logic.

One other thing … you need to compare a little here. Look at Bob Kerrey, a REAL war hero. He never uses his experience and heroics to his benefit – real heros don’t (John McCain too, btw). John Kerry did a heroic act by pulling that fellow out of the water – but it seems to be the rest is up for question.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:00 am 52. Knucklehead:

Rick,

Jerry seems to have addressed this. I was only aware of two status possibilities for reserve duty: active and inactive. Kerry’s Record of Service (I linked to it above) notes a transfer from active duty to Standby Reserve and then a subsequent transfer to Inactive Reserve. Apparently “Standby” is some sort of quasi-inactive case where the participant was free to be active or not as he saw fit but being “active” required some effort – i.e, “inactive” was the default status for “Standby Reserve”.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:01 am 53. Terrye:

I noticed an interesting thing in the polls. In spite of the numbers I cited about 50% said Kerry deserved his medals, while 49% said he did not.

In other words there are people who are willing to let Kerry keep his medals in spite of the fact they think he fudged on the facts.

These must be the at least he went now can we please move on people.

I wonder what the impact will be if people start to hear in detail about the anti war activities. Especially the dubious nature of some of the Winter Soldiers investigation and the meetings with the NV.

I doubt it will ruin him but it will make him bleed.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:06 am 54. M. Simon:

Richard here are the questions/koans/jokes again in a form you can easily read (they follow the –==– symbol.

As to my obnoxios sig. When the complaints start rising from regular readers I know the advertising is starting to get noticed. Regulars are always botherd by an ad message well before it becomes ineffective. Sorry ’bout that. Besides it is not for the regulars. And if I wanted to make it hard to read I’d just leave it off.

BTW Drudge is charting the Kerry meltdown:

Kerry daughters get booed on MTV.

Kerry daughters booed

And Daschle(D)is running as a Bush supporter.

Daschle supports Bush

ó==ó

Steal this sig:

George Bush never called me ìbaby killerî.

There is a big difference between William Calley and John Kerry. William Calley is a proven war criminal. For John Kerry we only have his word as an officer and a gentleman.

What is the War Hero Afraid of?

Form 180. Release ALL the records.

The Ads: Video links

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:10 am 55. Goof®:

Fresh Air

Wrong again. The debate transcripts are probably available somewhere, but I don’t have the time right now.

http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/1096dole.htm

Georgia Democrats understand? None that I’ve read seems to.

Best.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:12 am 56. jerry:

Knucklehead:

The US 6+6 system is an amalgamation of the American Militia system with a modified Prussian Reserve system. We wantedto have access to trained military manpower without having to expend large amounts of money on maintaining a WWII sized active + Reserve force. All military contracts were for 6 years of active/ARC commitment. Unlike the British the maximum enlistment for US military service has always been 6 years. I donít know the reasons for 6 years inactive requirement but I suppose it has something to do with age and length of time without active service. It would be like starting from square one. IRRs don’t drill but they can be called to active service. During the Korean War many non-drilling reservist were called up to fight with the most famous being a Marine Captain from Boston. The protagonist in ìThe Bridges at Toko Riî was an IRR who got called up to fight in Korea.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:13 am 57. Samuel:

Demosophist, Knucklehead

This is not losing steam, nor will it at least until the debates. The Swifties have much more money now and are in the process of making more commercials. As long as they make commercials, the story stays alive. These guys are on a mission and it is more personal then political.

Goof

I tend to agree with you as I did change party affiliation and am not one to sit on fences. Zell makes more political hay by retaining his Democratic Party status. If he were younger and seeking re-election I am sure like Rodney Alexander and Ralph Hall he would change. He gave the keynote address in 1992 for Bill Clinton and now he is giving the Key-Note address for Republicans. He is giving the Democrats a back-hand on his way out the door. If I were a Democrat I would be annoyed, but I am not so I will take it, but I would have preferred him to switch parties.

Ed Koch is on more solid ground. He is a Security Hawk and supportive because of the WOT period. Zell has actually become pro-life and conservative on most other issues as well, he should switch.

The election will not be close, either Kerry becomes the first Democrat to break 50% since Carter, or he loses (with Bush getting above 53% (53-57%). If Kerry is polling well above 45% in early November, he may win. If the Presidents approval rating continues to rise as it has been and gets well above 50%, he will win.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:15 am 58. Terrye:

Samuel:

And there are the debates when each side hopes their guy does not do or say anything stupid.

gonna be a nail biter.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:20 am 59. Knucklehead:

Jerry,

Be patient here. I still don’t understand this “6+6″ business. When I served, voluntary military, the way I understood my enlistment was that I was signing up for a total of six years with some portion of that on active duty. Once the active duty portion was completed one could become part of the reserves (and maintain that indefinitely) or go onto the “inactive reserves” list for whatever remained of the original 6 year commitment.

When I finished my active duty I recieved my Honorable Discharge, plain and simple. And my name went on a list that I gave no further thought and heard nothing about. No piece of paper or whatever that I can recall ever arrived telling me that my inactive reserve commitment was completed. They didn’t wait the remainder of the six years to issue me my HD.

What am I failing to understand? (BTW, if the timeframe matters, I served active ‘76-80 and, as far as I know, remained inactive until ‘82.)

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:24 am 60. WichitaBoy:

MeTooThen

There’s always room for doubt, but I just can’t see Kerry doing anything but crashing and burning at this point.

Remember, what really matters is the Electoral College. The South and the West outside the Left Coast are Bush country at this point. Kerry, like MA, is way out of the mainstream of American politics.

Here’s one small example. My Democratic son and I were looking at the pictures of the protesters last night. He was appalled. His immediate, visceral response was that he didn’t want to be in the same party as such moonbats. That they were abusing the legacy of the Sixties. That he doesn’t want to vote for Kerry anymore.

Now Kerry’s struggling to hold on to IA, WI, OH, MI, and PA. That’s just not enough to win the election. If Kerry’s not careful, he’s going to end up with nothing but New England and California (which, truth be told, is all he represents anyway). Kerry represents the radical chic element of our society, the rich beautiful people who know better than the rest of us and hold the rest of us in utter contempt. Vietnam completely aside, most of us hayseeds aren’t going to go for that. The only thing holding him afloat at all is dislike of Bush.

Carl in Atlanta

Good to see you back.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:24 am 61. holdfast:

Terrye – “Lucky for all of us the country is not NYC. Democrats outnumber Republicans in that city 4 to 1. I can’t imagine how Rudy G. ever won. I think if the convention had been somewhere else there would have demonstrations but probably not as large.”

-Because, at the end of the day, all the Democrat children who wuv their mommy also realise that they need a daddy to protect them from the bad man on the subway. This is why Romeny and Weld got elected in the Bay State. The Dems want to control the legislature (spending, social engineering etc) but they also want someone who can protect them from the things that go bump in the night. Sure Romney, Pataki, Bloomberg (and, to a lesser extent Guliani) aren’t exactly Georgia Republics (or even Georgia Democrats – you go to Zell) but they’re a lot better than NY or Mass Democrats.

Catherine – “Most American leftists were more interested in getting their fair share of the American dream than creating a socialist society.”

- I think that may become my definition of “good” leftists

JDM – “See here for constant gas prices from 1950. They look pretty stable except for Jimmah’s time manning the pump.”

-One has to be a bit careful with this – it is essentially the price of gas adjusted for inflation – except that the rise in the price of gas was one of the 2 or 3 main CAUSES of that inflation – a fairly new, 20th century phenomenon. Others – devalution of the dollar

due to printing money to pay for Vietnam AND the Great Society, and monekey business with gold. All three were, of course, interreated.

-I would argue that if the Dems had one or both houses of Congress, they’d be a lot less freaky about Bush. I mean, Bush is authntically conservative (except w/r/t $$) but he’s just not the wild-eyed radical that the Dems want to paint him. In the first two years he actually did some pretty “good” bipartisan work (NCLB – Kennedy??), but after the 2002 elections, he really became evil incarnate for the Dems. I think that many felt that they were owed at least one house, and instead this bumbler from Texas actually had coattails!

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:25 am 62. Samuel:

Terrye

I consider the debates Bush’s last hurdles. This of course makes them Kerry’s last great opportunities as he is indeed slipping. I expect the Republicans to get nothing but a positive bounce from the convention. I also expect Bush to win the debates.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:28 am 63. Sandy P:

–could not be held responsible for “undercapitalized” businesses that, to me, completely tipped her hand.–

You might find something on Econopundit, but Steven’s archives aren’t the easiest to maneover thru.

That’s what lost him and he’s a former marxist econ prof.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:36 am 64. Fresh Air:

Goof–

Nice non-response. I worked on Dole’s campaign and wrote position papers for him. You are wrong; his candidacy was based upon his record in the Senate, not his biography. In fact, he didn’t start to talk about his war experience until his handlers pushed him to do so.

Not sure what this has to do with Kerry, either. Then again, I’m not sure what anything you write has to do with anything.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:37 am 65. jerry:

Knucklehead:

It might be different for enlisted but for officers it a total of 12 years oblications. Kerry entered the Navy in 1966 and was discharged from the inactive reserve in 1978. It may have changed post Vietnam. My period of service was 1971 to 1983 although I effectively done in 1975.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:41 am 66. Knucklehead:

Got it. Thanks Jerry. Of all the things to question wrt Kerry’s service, apparently the 12 years before receiving his HD isn’t interesting.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:46 am 67. chuck:

…about 50% said Kerry deserved his medals, while 49% said he did not.

The amazing thing here is that people actually have an opinion on the subject. Who would have thought that medals would have become an important topic? That Kerry managed the feat is quite remarkable. Of course, the swifties did help him along. Go swifties.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:52 am 68. jdm:

holdfast, I was mostly trying to find something that refuted if only partially the notion that prices are much “higher” nowadays. The chart on gas prices doesn’t reflect the rise in gas taxes either (at least that I could find), I assuming that prices in real dollars have actually fallen.

But what I really wanted to comment on was this line:

> I mean, Bush is authntically conservative (except w/r/t $$)

There is no way Bush could be considered conservative. Center-right? check; moderate? check; conservative-lite? check; but conservative? No way.

Two issues among others stand out, his acceptance of the egregious Campaign Finance Reform and his ambivalence of retiring the assault gun ban.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:54 am 69. MeTooThen:

jerry & Terrye,

“Fourth, and perhaps most importantly, the left doesn’t like Kerry anymore then it likes Bush.”

Huh?

The Left doesn’t like Bush?

Are you joking?

The Left and the Democratic Center has characterized Bush as Hitler, Stalin, The AntiChrist!

There has been no moderation of the invective and vitriol that has been spewed at Bush from, not only, “the fringe Left”, but from Party leaders such as Kennedy, Gore, Pelosi, et al.

As far as marchers becomming voters, I would suggest you will be surprised by the voter turnout.

The greater the pre-election polled margin in favor of Bush, the greater the mobilization will be of Kerry voters come Nov. 2. They are desperate. They are enraged. They will vote.

The conservative Bush base may stay at home, as will the undecided voters.

The unrelenting MSM message, that the sky is falling, Bush is Evil, Abu Ghraib, Israeli Spies, Lying SwiftVets, will, I believe, deliver a Kerry victory. Unless Bush can mobilize his base to vote, or somehow he can manage to convince the undecideds to vote for him based on his own record, I think it’s a Kerry win.

Aug 30, 2004 - 10:59 am 70. chuck:

MeTooThen,

You are either an diagnosed pessimist, or a Moby, I’m am tending towards picking the latter.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:02 am 71. Knucklehead:

jdm,

It is very difficult to compare prices simply through inflation indexing. As an example, in the mid to late 80’s the goverment was trying to figure out how to bring the fact that computer power was going through the roof while prices for computers were dropping through the floor. They wanted to do that to make inflation figures less.

Go back to the early sixties and families had one TV (and not always a color TV) and usually only one auto. Today TV’s are “cheap” (unless you need a personal cinemax complete with earthquake capability). The price of autos, in terms of absolute dollars, induces “sticker shock” yet families typically own two or more autos. There are things we own today that were not even considered 30 years ago. Even a solid middle-class family who owned a solid, new auto and a home in ‘62 or whatever wouldn’t have been likely to have those things air-conditioned. Today they’d be unlikely not to.

In the case of gasoline I suspect we’d have to look at it as a “staple” and compare it to other staples such as “milk” or some more generic thing like “food”. What did a gallon of milk AND a gallon of gas cost in, say, ‘74 vs. today? What about a loaf of bread, etc.

The Poverty Pushers scream bloody murder if anyone even suggests such a thing, but Americans today, even those we consider poor, live substantially more comfortably than they did 30 or 40 years ago. Part of what passes for discussion of the “economy”, it seems to me, is really something more like fretting about the the “national anxiety level”. Unemployment is not particularly high (in fact and argument can be made that it is pretty darned low) yet people are “anxious” about their jobs, therefore their sense of the economy is something less than the reality of the economy. I don’t know that there’s any way to deal with that other than to accept that perception is reality.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:11 am 72. Rick Ballard:

Knucklehead,

Jerry answered while I was typing. If I knew Jerry was covering something I’d just wait, he doesn’t disappoint.

Wrt Swiftvets Phase I, the only issues remaining that I believe have importance are:

1)Who generated the first PH?

2)Who generated the iterations of the Silver Star citation and why was language removed and added?

Wrt Swiftvets Phase II

1)Why did Kerry remain active in the VVAW after Hubbard was exposed as a liar and a phony?

2)The VVAW ties to the CPUSA were obvious from the beginning. Why did Kerry embrace an organization at least partially funded by the Communist party.

3)Was there more than one meeting with Madame Binh or other North Vietnamese negotiators.

4)Why did Kerry fail to report a potential conspiracy to assasinate United States Senators?

5)Where has Kerry ever acknowledged the utter stupidity of his assertion that “only a few thousand” South Vietnamese were going to be affected by a North Vietnamese takeover.

Wrt debates: If Kerry showed the sparkling charisma exhibited by Algore the debates might be worrisome. The kindest thing that can be said about Kerry’s ‘Q’ rating is that absence may make the heart grow fonder among those with incipient Alzheimer’s.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:11 am 73. jerry:

Metoo…

Your reaction to my tortured syntax tells me that your analysis is rather faulty. To say that they don’t like Kerry anymore then they like Bush should tell you that that they feel the same way about both candidates.

First of all, Kennedy, Gore and Pelosi etal are the fringe left.

Second, I have heard this all before. In 1972, a friend of my working in McGovern Campaign assured me that the 18-21 years olds were going to give McGovern the margin of victory to win the Electoral College if not the popular vote. He used similar logic to yours, i.e., look at all the protestors who come out to defeat Nixon.

Third, Protest size, particularly in NYC, just means a bunch of lefties are having a big party in town where they can smoke dope, get laid and have a good time. I would wager that half will not get out of bed to vote on November 2nd.

Fourth, politics is like boxing. The Champ has to be knocked out to be defeated. So far Kerry may have been ahead on points, at least until the Swifties, but over the next few weeks he has to knock Bush out. He has been damaged by the SBVFT and no longer has the muscle power to knock him down. Therefore, he is a loser.

Fifth, Conservative Republicans may grumble but they always have the highest turnout rate. I bet even Pat Buchannon is going to vote for Bush.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:12 am 74. lindenen:

–could not be held responsible for “undercapitalized” businesses that, to me, completely tipped her hand.–

What does this even mean?

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:13 am 75. DennisThePeasant:

Mike N.-

John McCain is doing the schmooze-a-thon thingee because he is not particularly popular with Republicans. You see, McCain is a RINO (Republican In Name Only), which is why he is ‘respected’ by the MSM and wildly unpopular with most of his Republican congressional collegues and with the Republican establishment.

McCain is also somewhat dense. It has finally dawned on him that playing footsy with John Kerry over the V.P. slot and ragging about the SBVFT is not going over well in the party he wants to lead post-G.W.. He’s at the convention for damage control purposes, nothing else.

Think it all through. John McCain needs George W. Bush far more than George W. Bush needs John McCain. Yeah, McCain will help Bush’s campaign, but people won’t vote Bush because McCain tells them so. Nor will people vote Kerry because of Cheney.

John McCain wants to run in 2008, and to do so he’s got be start being a good little Republican right now…because he does not control the RNC. G.W. does. And if Bush decides to torpedo McCain, he can do it in a heartbeat.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:15 am 76. Pat Curley:

There is zero evidence that conservatives are going to sit on their hands rather than vote this year. The Buchananites? How many votes did he get in 2000?

The LA Times poll recently showed Republicans voting for Bush by a 93-3 margin, while Democrats were shown as voting for Kerry by 81-15. Indeed, the only way the Times was able to limit Kerry’s deficit to 3 points was to oversample Democrats.

Plus Kerry’s boy wonder comes out this morning and says “Let’s make a deal” with the Iranians–they get nuclear power plants, we get promises that they won’t build bombs. Hey, it worked with the North Koreans, right?

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:19 am 77. Knucklehead:

Lindeman,

The Euro-style welfare states are qausi-corporatist economies. They have a strong partnership between large corps and gubmint.

The US economy depends very heavily and small-businesses and startups. They are often described, rightly IMHO, as the engines of economic growth.

COnverting the US into a Euro-style quasi-corporatist welfare state requires the establisment of a stronger partnership between something like the Fortune 500 and government. I don’t suggest there isn’t “cooperation” now, just that it would need to be much greater and approach a formalized relationship.

The HillaryCare medical industry grab would not only have been something close to nationalizing something like 7% or so of the US economy but it would also have opened the door to formalizing this corporatist-government partnership. To me it always looked like merely the first giant leap toward moving the US firmly in the Euro-style welfare state direction.

One of the big complaints about HillaryCare what that small businesses couldn’t afford it – it would severly hamstring small-businesses and would be a boon to large corporations. Hillary, at some point, made some statement in response to that criticism that the US government couldn’t be concerned with “under capitalized” (read “small”) businesses. To me that was a clear indication of her ultimate goal which was moving toward a big-business favoring euro-system.

I still believe the “vision” of the Clintonistas, if they have one, is to turn the Democratic Party into a Social-Democrat party modeled after the Europeans. The next two decades are the ideal time to try and accomplish that because we boomers are the rat in the boa’s belly and would love nothing better than to have the “safety net” converted into a comfy hammock for our declining years

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:31 am 78. Terrye:

Me Too:

The left we see in the streets is loud obnoxious and not too bright.

Calling Bush Hitler might make them feel good but it will only serve to piss off somebody else who knows and understands who Hitler really was.

If one is to believe Pew only 25% of the public even believe what the media says so the devotion of the MSM to Kerry might not be as useful as you think.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:36 am 79. Tom Holsinger:

Rick,

I’ve heard that Kerry had been a very good debater, but that was before he developed terminal waffling disease about 10-15 years ago.

But IMO even the debates don’t matter anymore. I feel that what the Swifties really did was reveal just how incompetent the Kerry campaign really is. You guys think the Swifties had an effect on the election varying from major to decisive.

I disagree. At this point it appears the Kerry campaign has been fatally incompetent (for the general election) from the beginning. They’d have found some other way to screw up had the Swifties done nothing.

The Bush campaign has had a plan for September and October for months now. Whatever it is, the Kerry campaign plain lacks the professional skills to cope with the GOP assault and sell their own guy at the same time. Or maybe even either one by itself.

Look at the polls. It seems that Kerry goes down a point or two per week whenever he is the focus of attention, and stays even or gains when he isn’t. He went down a little bit during the week of the Democratic convention. He went down a little bit more each week the Swifties had him in the headlines. So maybe the major effect the Swifties have had is to keep Kerry in the headlines, instead of their message.

Polling concerning Kerry’s image and character might prove me wrong – perhaps the Swifties did hole him below the waterline. It will be interesting to see if polling shows his image, etc., goes up during the GOP convention when he isn’t the center of attention.

But right now his campaign seems so inept that I don’t see how he can win, and the voters seem to dislike him more the more they see of him.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:37 am 80. Knucklehead:

Rick Ballard,

Your lists seem to be right on target. I keep wondering why Kerry just doesn’t suck it up and release those hundred pages of military records that the WaPo found out about but can’t get at through FOIA application. I was speculating that perhaps there was something in there that would explain why it took him six extra years to get his HD. Apparently that’s a dead end area of speculation.

Regarding the CPUSA stuff… I sincerely hope this area gets covered. If Kerry was tied in with that crap he should be exposed for it. The MSM, of course, doesn’t want that to happen because then it will become perfectly obvious that Kerry was gaffed through the gills like a prime hunk of bait and tossed over the side and the MSM chomped the whole kit – hook, line, and sinker – and was played like a prize marlin by the Soviets.

Aug 30, 2004 - 11:48 am 81. Terrye:

Tom:

You are onto something here. People do not like Kerry and the more they see of him the worse it is.

I think a lot of people will say they think it is not fair to go after him now after all these years, but then again a good half of them will say they believe some if not all of the swiftie claims.

What makes Kerry look bad is the fact that the issue came up at all. And the fact that it goes on and he seems unable to put an end to it.

Aug 30, 2004 - 12:00 pm 82. Rick Ballard:

Tom,

I’m not part of the “you guys” that think the Swifties deal will sink Kerry. I’ve been watching his campaign’s reaction and hold the same view as you do concerning the campaign staff competency issue. Kerry’s decision to rely on the Kennedy machine’s “brain trust” is spectacularly inept. The Kennedy machine is remarkably adept at burying scandal in MA, although, even there, they rely very heavily on the lap dogs in place at the Globe. The Kennedy machine is simply not scalable to a national campaign. Right now the campaign is absolutely failing in two areas – OR response development and the advance team work. The advance people are screwed because of Kerry’s lack of “debt owed” by other Democratic pols. I don’t believe that he ever established the personal or organizational ties necessary to mount a successful national campaign. Additionally, I would note that he has no ‘Q’ among blacks. He might as well be Martian as far as the black vote is concerned.

The Swiftvets just exposed intrinsic weaknesses early. Whether that will be a net plus or minus is dependent upon Kerry’s ability to make necessary adjustments in campaign staff. I doubt that he can do it because I don’t think that he knows how to do it. He’s essentially as shallow as he is hollow. I would not be surprised to see a major campaign shakeup by the coming weekend.

Aug 30, 2004 - 12:02 pm 83. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

jdm

(one can really see how much the SBVs “hate” Kerry that they let him get out of the primaries before revealing what they knew).

The SBVT guys helt a press conference giving a bunch of information, including the fact that Kerry’s entire chain of command considered him unfit for command, on May 5. They had an explicit intent of giving the dems time to run someone else if Kerry resigned as a result of the charges – this because there are plenty of democrats in that organization.

Knucklehead

During his time in the regular reserve, Kerry was in inactive status. His only requirements were to keep the government informed of his whereabouts (details are on the record). I was in the Naval Air Reserve and went inactive in 1969 just by filling out a form. In 1971 (I think) I was recalled to active reserve status (as Kerry could have been) but I got out of it by being a Vietnam Veteran. . Had Kerry not been in inactive status, he would have had the standard weekend per month plus two weeks in the summer requirement.

What is more interesting is that Kerry has tried to conceal his military membership during his anti-war years. Originally his biography had a 2 year gap in his service, which hd a bunch of us veterans scratching our heads. When his service record came out, they got rid of his military years entirely from his biography. If you go look at it now, it appears as if he were discharged in 1970 – his military history ends there.

In fact, he was on active duty when he flew Walinsky around from one anti-war speech to another. He was in the active reserve, inactive status when he met with the enemy in Paris (twice at least) and when he gave that vicious Senate testimony and all his other anti-war activities.\

George

The Democrat spinmeisters, knowing the liberal press won’t call them on it, say that none of Kerry’s critics served on his boat, and of course imply that only the people on the boat knew anything about Kerry. Both of these are bald faced lies that even Fox News fails to catch.

Rick Ballard

The first purple heart was clearly invalid, making Kerry a shirker. We would know who generated it if he signed the 180. Supposedly it came from some unknown in Saigon. It did arrive at the end of his tour (I think it caused the end of his tour). The Swifties do not agree among themselves whether Kerry was thrown out of Vietnam or if he left voluntarily.

As to VVAW – Kerry was looking for a platform where he could use his combat record to get fame. VVAW met that well. That he was willing to deal with communists is clear. There was more than one meeting with the enemy. It is in the FBI files (don’t know where) – there might be info on wintersoldier.com. Kerry believed (perhaps correctly, we shall see) that the communists couldn’t hurt him. As to why he didn’t report the conspiracy, it was because he was an anti-government activist. There are a whole lot of other questions he needs to answer. The assertion of a few thousand was probably in the PRG script he was using.

DTP

Agreed that McCain is somewhat dense (bottom 10% of his Annapolis class). He also has a hell of a temper and never forgets an enemy. I think he is a real hero (although there are some rumors, but I don’t credit them unless I know the source). His father as CINCPAC denied a request of mine (grumble). He did provide a welcome home dinner for Vietnam Vets, and I appreciated that – also got to hear Westmorerland give his analysis of the war, He is my Senator, and not popular among the party apparatus here. I think RINO is a bit strong – he is for real on defense and patriotism issues as far as I know. But the press is able to lead him around by his ego.

Aug 30, 2004 - 12:16 pm 84. Fresh Air:

As a former photojournalist, allow me to offer a word about coverage of the protests.

All photographers love protests! They are very easy to cover and offer emotion, action (albeit staged action), and best yet, the possibility of honest-to-goodness combat. Every photojournalist, no matter how timid, secretly yearns to be a combat photographer. For most it is but a Walter Mitty fantasy. So the paintball version like we see in NYC will have to serve instead.

You see, the truth is that even in big cities, news photographers rarely have great opportunities for skull-thumping-type action. You are usually cordoned off from real police action, and peering through a long lens at distant dots moving around.

Yet every photographer has some image from an earlier protest seared (seared, I say!), in him, like Stan Grossfeld’s Pulitzer Prize-winning image of the flag-wielding demonstrator in South Boston.

Conveniently enough, protests offer the delicious possiblity, however faint, of capturing that essential moment from up close, when an unruly yahoo makes an ill-advised move towards a policeman and, in the blink of a shutter curtain, the blood pouring down the protestor’s face is preserved for posterity, thus catapulting the lucky photog into history.

It’s a two-sided deal. The people marching know it’s fake; the people covering it know it’s fake, but don’t care. But it’s great entertainment, don’t you know!

Aug 30, 2004 - 12:18 pm 85. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

Rick

Not only are the Swiftvets going to keep on going, but as the focus shifts to Kerry’s anti-war behavior, other groups are going to appear and start making noise.

Right now, our group, Vietnam Vets for the Truth has people on sidewalks across the country bypassing the MSM by providing information about Kerry (like the an article showing that his picture is in an honored place in the Saigon war museum) that the MSM will ignore. We are a 527 (hint – donations apprecdiated).

We are having a rally in DC on Sept 12, with John O’Neill as one of our speakers. I’ll be flying back for that.

There is no telling how many other groups there are. I have a couple of Vietnam Vets against Kerry sort of bumper stickers on my car, and a magnetic sign, and lots of people come up and express approval. On my tornado chase trip, I had a suitable hat, and veterans were all over the place and they all disliked Kerry.

Aug 30, 2004 - 12:24 pm 86. Tom Holsinger:

John Moore,

I recall reading somewhere that Kerry’s immediate superior said he invited Kerry to put in for a transfer based on his Purple Hearts as a vehicle to get a trigger-happy incompetent out of the superior’s Swift boat squadron. Kerry’s taking his superior up on that was normal and plain common sense.

What would be interesting is whether Kerry’s first Purple Heart (in date of action as opposed to award date) was awarded due to a request by Kerry, or by his superior as a means of getting rid of him.

Aug 30, 2004 - 12:33 pm 87. jedrury:

Image of the day:

Kerry with goggles wind surfing at Terezzza’s home on Nantucket. Someone please educate me who this guy thinks he is appealing to with his various images; JFK in knit pants on bike, JFK

in hockey gear, JFK throwing the football on the tarmac while waiting for a plane.

He has Edwards out on the hustings while he and Terezzza are dining on the island during some R&R. He should be out there countering every move the president makes. Tracking him like a hungry wolf and stealing every minute of air time as possible.

Henry Cabot Lodge, VIP candidate for Nixon in the run against the real JFK, used to demand a nap every afternoon and snoozed his way out of a job. Can Kerry be next ?

Aug 30, 2004 - 1:11 pm 88. Terrye:

John:

I got my book finally. just now.

I am home sick today with a virus so maybe I can get some of it read.

Aug 30, 2004 - 1:12 pm 89. jdm:

John Moore, actually I knew about the press conference (I googled it before writing). But then I thought that by May, it was a done deal, Kerry was everything-but-crowned.

I do agree that the conference was a shot across the bow, so to speak, that the Democrats (and the MSM) ignored.

Aug 30, 2004 - 1:25 pm 90. Jamie Irons:

M. Simon

As to my obnoxios (sic) sig. When the complaints start rising from regular readers I know the advertising is starting to get noticed. Regulars are always botherd by an ad message well before it becomes ineffective. Sorry ’bout that. Besides it is not for the regulars. And if I wanted to make it hard to read I’d just leave it off.

I am not trying to be unpleasant or combative here, but why on earth would you want to adopt an attitude like this in a shared space where several people have already asked you to desist?

If you were dining somewhere and people at an adjacent table asked you to extinguish your cigar, would you use an argument like the above? (I know the analogy is imperfect.)

Jamie Irons

Aug 30, 2004 - 1:40 pm 91. Rick Ballard:

Jamie.

The “tragedy of the commons” argument is never of high value to libertarians. It is also why a strictly libertarian philosophy is unsuitable for use in governance. Libertarianism reqires a level of self-discipline and self-knowledge that has been unobserved in human society. It is as unrealistic in pure form as Marxism. It’s also about as resistant to logical argument as Marxism. Some day a different strain of humanity may arise but evidence of its occurence to date is extraordinarily thin.

Aug 30, 2004 - 2:03 pm 92. Goof®:

Fresh Air

What a smile you are.

I replied to Samuel about a comment posted by him. The comment included:

The Democrats decided to go after Bush’s National Guard service, call him dishonest and made a calculation to hide Kerry‚Äôs Senate record behind his Vietnam Service, believing this would trump Bush.

I simply pointed out to Samuel that members of the legislative branch generally do not make much of a point of talking about their legislative records for a number of reasons. I pointed to Bob Dole because he was the last Senator to win a major party nomination and because he had a much stronger record of legislative accomplishment than does Senator Kerry.

You chose to disagree with my contention and I chose to respond.

Here is Bob Dole’s 1996 acceptance speech.

http://www.4president.org/speeches/dolekemp1996convention.htm

Count up the number of times he refers to what he had been doing during the preceding 36 years.

Hope this helps.

Aug 30, 2004 - 2:14 pm 93. Terrye:

Goof:

At least Dole showed up for work.

Aug 30, 2004 - 2:30 pm 94. DennisThePeasant:

M. Simon-

The ‘ad’, as you put it, isn’t annoying because it has been repeated, it’s annoying because it is poorly executed. As you well know, I am about the last person on Earth who would disagree with you on this particular issue. Irrespective, that doesn’t stop me from weighing in with a candid and cheery “Your advertising sucks out loud”. OK?

Chances are, if you’re pissing off the regular posters, you are also pissing off the regular and semi-regular readers. I do not think your intent amongst any of the readers and posters at this site is to plant the subliminal suggestion that they should respond to the mere mention of the Swift Boat Controversy with annoyance. But let me assure you, regardless of intent, that’s about where you are.

From the Friendly Advice Department: Make it better or give it a rest, with a heavy weighting to the latter.

Aug 30, 2004 - 2:54 pm 95. M. Simon:

DtP,

Funny thing is I get e-mails telling me how much my little jokes are enjoyed.

To each his own.

–==–

JM,

I have no money to contribute at this time but if you think any of my sigs over the past month or so are useful feel free to appropriate them with or without attribution.

ó==ó

Steal this sig:

George Bush never called me ìbaby killerî.

There is a big difference between William Calley and John Kerry. William Calley is a proven war criminal. For John Kerry we only have his word as an officer and a gentleman.

What is the War Hero Afraid of?

Form 180. Release ALL the records.

The Ads: Video links

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:04 pm 96. Fresh Air:

From the Los Angeles Times, June 12, 1996. Coverage of Bob Dole’s resignation speech:

Tuesday’s departure speech provided Dole a potential platform for laying out such a program. But Dole passed it up, saying he did not want to deliver a partisan address. Instead, he dwelt extensively on his Senate experiences and on senators he has known–references that touched his fellow legislators but probably were incomprehensible to a large number of potential voters.

Dole’s evident show of emotion and the references in his speech to compassionate programs he has supported–disability rights efforts, for example–pleased some of his advisors. But, as one aide conceded, the Republican presidential hopeful has yet to explain to voters how his experiences connect to a broader agenda for the country.

Goof–

As you may or may not know, presidential candidates use their acceptance speeches for a variety of different things. (Remember the man from Hope?) In Dole’s case, he was trying to shine a light on himself that was different than the one-dimensional, harsh (and unfair) silhouette created by the media.

Of course he ran on his record. How could he not? He was an icon in Washington. Bob Dole lost for a host of reasons, but the biggest one was that he was facing one of the most gifted campaigners in U.S. history. His defeat was not because his bio fell flat or he had nothing to run on (both of which are the case with your man John Forbes Kerry).

You are right that House and Senate members have a hard time succeeding to the presidency because they have long paper trails. But Dole never ran and hid from his record the way Kerry is doing. Say what you want, but Bob Dole was not a chair-warmer in the Senate.

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:07 pm 97. MeTooThen:

jerry & Terrye,

First, Terrye, hope you feel better soon.

Thank you for your thoughtful responses.

And no, this is not 1972 (although we have been spending an awful long time in the way-back machine haven’t we?).

This is not about whether or not the 19-21 year olds will decide this race.

There are not only lunatics on the streets of NYC, but plenty of “normal folk” too.

Believe me, I hope to hell I am wrong about this, but the demonstrations seen in NYC mirror those in Europe in the run-up to the war in Iraq and thereafter.

Think Spain.

The tenor and timing of the marches here, as was the case there, are similar.

The same groups are sponsoring the US marches that sponsored those in Europe.

What these groups want is US humiliation and capitulation. Perhaps those marching here don’t understand that (or perhaps those who plan to vote for John Forbes Kerry for that matter), or perhaps they do.

The marches at the RNC are not a one-off event, the feelings behind them have been brewing for a long time (well, since the Florida recounts). If, and yes that’s a big if, that rage is translated to votes, Kerry wins 300+ electoral votes.

Like I said, I hope I’m wrong or it doesn’t happen (I’ll take either), but IMHO, Kerry looks strong to win.

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:08 pm 98. Jamie Irons:

Rick Ballard

I very much appreciated this remark of yours in response to my appeal to M. Simon immediately preceding your post:

The “tragedy of the commons” argument is never of high value to libertarians. It is also why a strictly libertarian philosophy is unsuitable for use in governance. Libertarianism reqires a level of self-discipline and self-knowledge that has been unobserved in human society. It is as unrealistic in pure form as Marxism. It’s also about as resistant to logical argument as Marxism. Some day a different strain of humanity may arise but evidence of its occurence to date is extraordinarily thin.

Your comment was very quickly followed by yet another posting of M. Simon’s “ad.”

Quod Erat Demonstrandum, as we used to say at the end of a proof.

Jamie Irons

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:16 pm 99. M. Simon:

Jamie,

If you will go back to the start of all this about 3 Aug or so you will find my first sig.

I informed our host that I intended to put a sig on every message I wrote from now till election day. Our kind host thought it was a pretty good idea. Now if our host objects I surely will conform to his wishes.

In most advertising campaigns the company gives up using effective advertising too soon because the company doing the advertising gets tired of the commercial well before the target audience. Read Ogilvy on the subject.

In deference to you though and for this post only I will remove the link to the swiftie ad to shorten the sig by a line.

BTW the sig is not for you kids. It is for the OFs who were in the war. People of a certain age have trouble reading small print. Lucky I don’t use a larger type face in bold, eh?

Simon

ó==ó

Steal this sig:

George Bush never called me ìbaby killerî.

There is a big difference between William Calley and John Kerry. William Calley is a proven war criminal. For John Kerry we only have his word as an officer and a gentleman.

What is the War Hero Afraid of?

Form 180. Release ALL the records.

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:23 pm 100. Rick Ballard:

Dennis,

Oh well, when appeal to reason fails there’s always invective. Although if the hide is as thick as the skull the effort will have problematic results. Boors often lack the intelligence to realize it when they’ve been insulted.

Jamie,

Unfortunately, as predictable as sunrise. Infantilism masquerading as seld-actualization is understandable for those under 35, for those over that age keeping a “safe” distance is the only remedy that I’ve found.

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:38 pm 101. M. Simon:

The secret of effective advertising is repetition, repitition, repitition.

Stupid people often fail to understand when they have been educated.

My hide is quite thick. Insults I’m impervious to.

OTOH if you can cite a book on advertising to support your position I’ll be gald to check it out. Being of the engineering persuasion I am not immune to reason. You have any evidence to back up your position?

I have Ogilvy.

ó==ó

Steal this sig:

George Bush never called me ìbaby killerî.

There is a big difference between William Calley and John Kerry. William Calley is a proven war criminal. For John Kerry we only have his word as an officer and a gentleman.

What is the War Hero Afraid of?

Form 180. Release ALL the records.

The Ads: Video links

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:52 pm 102. M. Simon:

Glad I’m far past 35.

ó==ó

Steal this sig:

George Bush never called me ìbaby killerî.

There is a big difference between William Calley and John Kerry. William Calley is a proven war criminal. For John Kerry we only have his word as an officer and a gentleman.

What is the War Hero Afraid of?

Form 180. Release ALL the records.

The Ads: Video links

Aug 30, 2004 - 3:53 pm 103. Jamie Irons:

The secret of effective advertising is repetition, repitition (sic), repitition (sic) .

[Sigh...]

Also the secret of effective spelling.

Jamie Irons

Aug 30, 2004 - 4:23 pm 104. Terrye:

me too then: [and pay attention to this]

I heard that a NY paper [I think the Post] did a survey and 80% of the demonstrators were from NYC and 2/3 of them thought that shooting at and killing our troops in Iraq was a fine and dandy thing to do. I don;t know if this is true but it wouuold not surprise me one bit.

I also doubt that middle Americans are impressed with the numerous buckfush signs, the naked singing boys, the bags of urine, the reports of harassing women, the screaming of obscenities at anyone that might be a delegate and the in general over the top, rude, outrageous, discourteous insane and stupid behavior that is a disgrace to the city and an embarassment to the Democratic party if they are in any way associated with it.

It can only help Bush.

As for their pent up feelings, well in the words of a looney lefty NYC protestor, fuck em.

I doubt seriously if their feelings are any stronger or more pentup then say the feelings of Viet Nam veterans who were spit on by just the same kind of people years ago and somehow someway those veterans their supporters and families managed to let the Dems have a convention without making complete asses of themselves.

Aug 30, 2004 - 4:26 pm 105. Terrye:

only two typos, I am getting better. would would would would……

Aug 30, 2004 - 4:30 pm 106. penwil:

Terrye,

That poll you refer to is from the New York Sun.

Some excerpts, which are quite the eye-opener, are quoted here:

http://betsyspage.blogspot.com/

The only presidential candidacy these guys are going to affect is Kerry’s, and it won’t be to help him.

I’m beginning to wonder if one of the big stories being missed by old media is the fanaticism of the pro-Bush voter (or anti-Kerry voter as the case may be). I’ve read several anecdotal reports that the crowds Bush has been drawing have been huge and wildly enthusiastic. And we all know now how motivated the vets as a whole are to defeat Kerry. For myself–I’ve always been the type of voter who wouldn’t walk across the street to attend a political rally, and I’ve got a few complaints about Bush, but I will crawl over broken glass to vote for him if I have to because of the war on Islamofacism.

Aug 30, 2004 - 4:42 pm 107. Jamie Irons:

penwil

I’ve always been the type of voter who wouldn’t walk across the street to attend a political rally, and I’ve got a few complaints about Bush, but I will crawl over broken glass to vote for him if I have to because of the war on Islamofacism.

My feelings exactly.

Jamie Irons

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:02 pm 108. Terrye:

penwil:

I concur.

I think that the ABB crowd has always underestimated the respect and regard that Bush’s supporters feel for him. It does not mean we believe he walks on water, but I do believe he is the man we need in Washington right now and bunch of screaming assholes won’t change my mind. If anything they make me that much more determined to support Bush.

Maybe Trippi was right to be paranoid. He seemed to think that the devil Rove is behind the craziness in NYC. I think he has too high an opinion of the mindset of his own party.

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:06 pm 109. Goof®:

Fresh Air

I voted for Dole (and I do mean Dole) in 1976 and in 1996. I’ll be voting for Kerry (and I do mean a suitable alternative to the incumbent) in November.

M. Simon

You’re doing good work. Don’t stop now.

Terrye

You’re still easy. Never change.

Later.

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:47 pm 110. Terrye:

Goof:

I think I have changed about as much as I can in one life time.

I would not vote for John Forbes Kerry if you put an assualt gun to my head.

Like I said at least Dole took his job seriously. The only thing Kerry takes seriously is his frigging ego.

You are easy too. I mean that as a compliment. honest.

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:55 pm 111. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

terrye,

I agrree. I don’t think these folks realize that anybody can respect Bush, much less like him.

I happen to like him. Not everything he does, but that shouldn’t be a surprise.

The left is believing their own BS, just like the press did on the Swiftees. I think the Swiftee program may have changed politics forever.

Of course the media is now innoculated. They don’t show new Swifty advertisements, given them free air time.

But then there’s the book.

This whole thing seems to have been a masterstroke, although the MSM has been able to blunt it by casting doubt on the Swiftee assertions.

We are going to have demonstrations here (Tempe, AZ) because the last debate is here. I can’t wait. It’s always fun at those things, and by then maybe the darned culex pipiens west nile virus vectors will be gone by then. I’m going to do a Protest Warrior thing.

Aug 30, 2004 - 5:57 pm 112. Roberts:

Goof, you have never articulated a coherent reason why Kerry is a rational choice in this election. Never.

Aug 30, 2004 - 6:27 pm 113. Terrye:

John:

When you have your demonstration please don’t get naked and sing.

People might confuse with the Kerry supporters. They are kind weird y’know.

And yes, the swifties took the bull by the horns as my Daddy used to say. No politician will feel really safe ever again.

Aug 30, 2004 - 6:55 pm 114. Syl:

Ah…was busy with Gaston’s rain, wind, and thunderstorms today. Missed a good thread.

I saw a ticker go by the bottom of convention coverage on Fox tonight. Terry Mc is outraged that some of the delegates are wearing…

bandaids with purple hearts on them!!!

LOLOL

Yep. Our dear Swiftvets have made an impression.

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:27 pm 115. Terrye:

Syl:

Is that the same Terry M that said he could not wait for his war hero to debate the deserter?

The man is such a weenie.

Aug 30, 2004 - 8:36 pm 116. richard mcenroe:

On Sports Central after Monday Night Football tonite, they showed Kerry screwing up a high school football scrimmage. Host Rob Fukuzaki started making “three Purple Heart” jokes. It’s getting into the general consciousness…

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:47 pm 117. John Moore ( Useful Fools ):

Terrye,

Have no fear. Were I to do that the sky would be split by continuous lightning, the ground would shake, fires would spring up all over the place, and the earth would swallow me up.

Aug 30, 2004 - 9:48 pm 118. DennisThePeasant:

M. Simon-

You’re getting praise from Goof.

I rest my case.

Aug 31, 2004 - 4:11 am 119. jerry:

goof:

You are irrational. You may not like Bush but Kerry clearly has no idea on how to defend the nation and is a leftwing extremist to boot.

To reinforce this point it is beginning to look like the 3rd Purple Heart may have been part of deal to get rid of a troublesome and somewhat inept officer without doing something to damage his long term prospects. This is commonly done in service particularly when it is clear that the officer in question will be leaving as soon as his commitment ends.

Given these likely facts tell me why you think Kerry, who is obviously unfit for leadership, will do a better job then the incumbent.

Aug 31, 2004 - 7:07 am 120. Tom Holsinger:

Rick Ballard,

Kerry seems to be finally shaking up his campaign staff. IMO this is too little and too late.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2105890/

Aug 31, 2004 - 1:25 pm 121. Goof®:

Roberts / jerry

Why bother? If I turn out to be right as to how the process will unfold (and so far I’ve been more right than wrong for 181 of the 243 days that began the day after John Kerry became the presumptive nominee and will end on election day) I’ll do a post-mortem–maybe.

Why do you care why?

Sep 1, 2004 - 7:35 pm

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