Debkafile and The New York Times do not agree on apportioning blame for the school horrors in Beslan. One thinks it’s mainly the work of Chechen nationalists while the other sees heavy Al Qaeda involvement. International > Europe > Chechen Rebels Mainly Driven by Nationalism” href=”http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/12/international/europe/12russia.html”>Which is which?
I know. It’s too easy. You didn’t even have to read it. Next quiz will be tougher.
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12 Comments
1. BigFire:It’s kind of weird that I trust internet rumor rag like DEBKa more than the Newspaper of the Record(tm) The New York Times.
Sep 13, 2004 - 1:37 pm 2. Tom Holsinger:The answers are:
a) Yes.
b) Both.
c) All of the above.
Sep 13, 2004 - 1:42 pm 3. Laurence Simon:This must be another of your trick questions, because I don’t see Israel as an option for the media to blame everything on.
Sep 13, 2004 - 1:55 pm 4. Terrye:I wonder if the editors of the NYT will ever come to the realization that there are fanatical Muslims running all over the planet killing people.
It must be awful frustrating for the likes of AlQaida go to such truouble and then see media outlets mitigate their accomplishments.
Sep 13, 2004 - 2:14 pm 5. Dan Darling:Ah, the good old NYT …
Of course, the presence of Ingush and Ossetian Muslims as well as bonafide Arab al-Qaeda figures like Khattab or Abu Walid among the Chechen Killer Korps makes perfect sense if one considers them a nationalist rather an Islamist movement.
Obviously, they must be fighting to drive foreigners from Chechnya …
Sep 13, 2004 - 2:41 pm 6. penwil:If the Times were to admit that Al Queda was involved in the Beslan massacres then that would validate everything George Bush has been saying and doing these last three years. And if George Bush is right, then that means their entire world view is dead wrong.
We could have film at 11:00 of Osama himself shooting those kids in the back and the Times would still have to deny it.
Sep 13, 2004 - 2:50 pm 7. RogerA:What Tom said above–the common thread is Islamic terrorism–only slightly modified to fit the particular circumstances on the ground. Islamic terrorism, characterized by fatalism and fantacism, is the true culture of death.
Sep 13, 2004 - 3:14 pm 8. Henry D:The Times has to fact check with Terry McAuliff, or is that Art Bell?
Sep 13, 2004 - 3:22 pm 9. Warthog:The correct answer is that it doesn’t matter.
Nationalism, sovereignty, self-determination, and those pesky wars of national liberation must become secondary to the greater goal of smashing Islmalism wherever it is found. If we get confused about the priorities and have to go through these debates every time before confronting Islamists in their bases then we will never get ahead of them.
If you want to find the model for how not to fight Al Qaeda and its progeny look at how the Palestinian terrorist organizations have successfully manipulated public sympathy for the concept of independence to shield them from an all out assault by a superior military force. Sorry, but those desires have to be suspended for a generation or two while the more serious work is done. We would never have won WWII without doing the same.
Sep 13, 2004 - 4:54 pm 10. zeppenwolf:NYT: “There are people from foreign countries – perhaps 20,” Ilyas Akhmadov, a Chechen leader living in the United States acknowledged…
He can count them from here? A “Chechen leader”, living in… Poughkeepsie?
NYT: “Al Qaeda’s interest in the region is undisputed.”
I have some trouble reconciling the headline with much in the article– what difference does it make if al qaeda is not actually blowing themselves up there, but merely paying other people to do so? Is that it? Confused.
Unfortunately, the Debka file doesn’t seem completely compelling to me either:
“…the failure of the Russian authorities to confirm their nationalities…”
Yes, I agree that’s frustrating. But it doesn’t seem to prove to me that the terro..er, militants, were Arab, or were Not Arab. It just proves that the Russians continue to be fairly cagey.
“Putin has gone to great lengths to pin the Beslen school siege on Chechen separatists.”
Did he? When/Where/What did he say to that effect, and most imporantly, Why? I have to admit I don’t follow Putin’s supposed motivation here– has he not now stated that he reserves the right to pre-emptively strike at terrorists even should they receive quarter in other nations? And has he not drawn numerous comparisons to our 9/11? It doesn’t seem to me that he’s trying to distance himself from the Islamic flavor of his crisis at all.
Sep 13, 2004 - 5:05 pm 11. Dan Darling:zeppenwolf:
It’s unclear whether the Russians were referring to national origin or ethnicity when they described 10 of the hostage-takers as being Arab. Jordan and Syria, two of the countries named by Russian authorities as being the place of origin for the foreign hostage-takers, both have sizeable ethnic Chechen communities that one could easily see as serving as a source of recruits for the hostage-takers.
Sep 13, 2004 - 6:14 pm 12. WichitaBoy:Terrye
It must be awful frustrating for the likes of AlQaida go to such truouble and then see media outlets mitigate their accomplishments.
LOL. It reminds me of this story from The Onion (now premium service only, unfortunately):
Anybody paying attention to Saturday’s bomb blast there by the way?
Sep 13, 2004 - 6:18 pm