57 Comments

1. klrfz1:

Didn’t Freeland get the memo? America is going to reinstitute the draft. If he votes, he might have to serve. If everyone in the world gets to vote, think of the army the US will have.

Oh, you want power without responsibility? Yup, you may be a Democrat (wanker).

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:43 am 2. Rulen:

Excuse me, but I don’t think it was Al Gore’s loss or Bush’s win that brought on these world changing events. I believe it was the murderers of 9/11 who wrought this. Can’t the liberal press at least remember this date???

Rulen

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:54 am 3. Jamie Irons:

Roger,

I like your analysis here.

We Americans have become, with respect to the Euros, what the family therapy people call “parental children”– kids who parent the parents, and parent the other children as well.

Jamie Irons

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:56 am 4. Charlie (Colorado):

Well, Jonathan, we’d be happy to have you vote in the US elections. All you have to do is get a visa, establish residence, wait a few years, renounce your UK citizenship, and swear an oath to “protect and defend.”

Otherwise, sod off.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:05 am 5. richard mcenroe:

That’s the best testimonial for voting against Al Gore I ever read.

And you know, I’d like some more votes, too.

I’d like a vote in Russia, France and Germany, to express my pleasure with their leaders for spending a decade lining their pockets with Saddam’s oil money, for violating international sanctions to sell him weapons to be used on his own people and our troops and allies, for tying us up in their pet Balkan quagmire (remember, “we’ll only be there for one year?”)…

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:21 am 6. klrfz1:

By the way not only did I misspell Freedland’s name but I don’t even know what a wanker is.

My apologies to the thread.

To continue my point, if John Kerry was elected by the world and was able to draft an army of Frenchmen then he could actually keep his campaign promise to get the US out of Iraq. I would pity the Iraqis though.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:22 am 7. Birkel:

I’m writing this in extremely broad terms. I don’t mean to imply any gender biases. I’m extending a metaphor and I hope the readers of this blog will understand this comment as such. Thank you.

One of the memes that ought to get greater press is GOP=daddy party and DNC=mommy party. If you like Europe can be the child party. Security moms are moving to the GOP because they’re the daddy party. Daddy makes you feel safe. Dad tends to be the more protective. Mom tends to be the one who “kisses it and makes it better.” That’s fine when there aren’t people trying to kill you. I don’t think you can kiss it and make it better in Beslan. Bush qua daddy is the overarching meme of this election, IMO.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:24 am 8. Charlie (Colorado):

Interesting editorial.

Here’s a quote:

“What appears to be going on is that the left, once the home of genuine populism, has been losing touch with the people and retreating into an elitist shell.”

Roger, I think you’ve got a kamerad here.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:24 am 9. Charlie (Colorado):

kirfz, the wonders of the Internet:

“”WordNet (r) 2.0″

wanker

n : term of abuse for a masturbator syn: tosser, jerk-off”

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:26 am 10. klrfz1:

I do know what a wanker is then.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:29 am 11. Charlie (Colorado):

Klrfz, I was pretty sure you were just seeking reassurance, since you used it perfectly.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:45 am 12. flenser:

“It is no exaggeration to say that the actions of a few hundred voters in Florida changed the world.”

This sums the attitude of the liberal elite. (Sorry, Roger.) Some people have free will, others are moved by deterministic forces beyond their control, beyond even their knowledge. America, and Americans, are fully responsible for their actions, and are expected to evaluate and anticipate everything several steps ahead. The terrorists, and the corrupt, cynical countries who support them, are moved by blind, impersonal forces. Mohommed Atta had no more choice in what he did than the swallows returning to Capistrano.

This can fairly be described as a “liberal” mentality because it is precisely the approach that liberals have taken to normal criminal behavior for the last fifty years. Whatever name is attached to this doctorine, it is poisonous to the concepts of justice, equality, freedom, and individuallity that our way of life is based on.

It is abdication of responsibility by some, accompanied by the implicit or explicit shifting of responsibility to others.

Sep 26, 2004 - 10:20 am 13. Fresh Air:

Charlie (C), Kirfz1–

From Merck’s Manual, here is an alternate definition:

“Wanker. (n) A spontaneous sore occurring in the groin area, often brought on by reading The Guardian or attending one of Harold Pinter’s plays. Writers, poets, academics and members of non-governmental organizations are particularly susceptible. Warm milk is known to give temporary relief. The only known cure, however, is reading Up from Liberalism by the light of a burning United Nations flag.”

Sep 26, 2004 - 10:31 am 14. Ray:

The Guardian and their Eurotrash friends in Germany and France should be more concerned about what the headlines will say four years from now.

November 2008 will be when the announcement will be made as to whether Europe is a safe place to live and work. The answer will not be determined by the military or political actions of these faux “friends”, because they have no military, and their political activities are inspired by Chamberlain and Petain.

Just as when the end of Europe was looming in 1939, and pacifism was the coward’s prayer, those with courage stood and fought. Those with courage are now standing and fighting. The Guardian will be one of the beneficiaries if the headline in November, 2008 states, “FREEDOM AND LIBERTY PREVAILS AND WORLDWIDE TERRORISM IS DEFEATED”.

Sep 26, 2004 - 10:56 am 15. ricpic:

Well, it’s the next logical step.

Isn’t the UN – that bastion of integrity – going to monitor our election?

Isn’t sovreignty selfish? An affront to “the international community?”

Everybody in the pool!

Isn’t that the only way to be FAIR?!?!

Sep 26, 2004 - 11:03 am 16. PeterUK:

klrfz 1 and Charlie,

The word ia most often used in conjunction with the adjectives “complete” or “absolute” or “utter”,this lifts it from mere reflection on his onanism into an observation on the man’s whole lifetime achievement.

Sep 26, 2004 - 11:40 am 17. Rick Z:

At some point during my gradual 30 year appostacy from the progressive faith, I made a profound discovery. How can I put this?

People on the “right,” in general, are much nicer.

On the left, it seems that one’s virtue is measured by membership in one of the designated victim groups, lifestyle/habbits, consumption patterns and voting behavior. You can be a thoroughly nasty SOB in your interactions with others, but if you’re a nonsmoking vegan dissabled Lesbian Nader voter, you’re the salt of the earth.

…not to say that there’s anything wrong about being a nonsmoking vegan dissabled Lesbian. Some of my best friends etc. etc.

Sep 26, 2004 - 11:40 am 18. Syl:

I’m really in danger of tuning out on all of this. Quite frankly I don’t give a rip what Freedland thinks. Let him whine and seethe and moan and oh me as much as he wants. It’s his life to waste.

I’d rather listen to grown ups.

Sep 26, 2004 - 11:43 am 19. richard mcenroe:

Dear Mr. Freedland: Oops.

Sep 26, 2004 - 11:55 am 20. chuck:

I agree with Syl, I don’t give a rip what Freedland thinks either. Let him fix up his own country and do the work to make it influencial. If he is too lazy to make the neccessary sacrifices, tough. Norman Geras comments on the article, originally in the Guardian. Scroll down to Elective alignments.

What these folks really want is sovereignty over the US. That was settled back in 1776 – 1781.

Sep 26, 2004 - 12:20 pm 21. penwil:

Syl: “I’m really in danger of tuning out on all of this.”

I’ve already tuned them out–the Dems and Kerry and old media and Europe. What useful purpose do they serve anymore? They not only haven’t contributed a single useful thing toward the war we are fighting, they’ve gone out of their way to be obstructionists. They are bankrupt of morality, ideas and purpose. The world passed them by on Sept 11, 2001, and since all their wishingful thinking isn’t going to change what is, they’re a waste of our time.

Because “what is” is the reality that sometime in the next five weeks, there is going to be a major Islamic terrorist attack on this country. It’s all about street cred–the Islamofacists must attack before our election because everyone expects them to, and so if they don’t they will be seen as weak, and it will look like a major victory for us infidels. The attack is coming, how we’ll react to it is the question. Oh, I know the Dems and Kerry and media will all sing a chorus of it’s Bush’s fault, if they dare. Will the majority of us buy into that? I hope not, but I just don’t know.

Sep 26, 2004 - 12:31 pm 22. Charlie (Colorado):

The word ia most often used in conjunction with the adjectives “complete” or “absolute” or “utter”,this lifts it from mere reflection on his onanism into an observation on the man’s whole lifetime achievement.

In general? Or specifically with reference to this wanker?

Sep 26, 2004 - 12:31 pm 23. Cabarfeidh:

Dear former colonial peoples:

Guardian readers are chinless wonders with two brains and no commonsense and also include the London branch of Democrats Abroad.

Normal pro American people like 97% of the UK do not read the Guardian except when it is holding a portion of fish and chips on a Friday night.

The writers in the Guardian are what is known as tossers, which means the same as the rhyming slang for Merchant Bankers……

Yours aye

A British Chap

Sep 26, 2004 - 12:35 pm 24. PeterUK:

Charlie,

In general.

British Chap,

We should tell them that the Guardian is the house organ of the “We are all guilty and deserve all we get” party,which bunch of auto-flagellants comprise all of the liberal left public sector.They particularly despise the US because it is beyond their control,if there is anything they hate it is not having control.

English Chap

Sep 26, 2004 - 12:54 pm 25. WichitaBoy:

Freedland has a point.

At the end of World War II Europe effectively lost its sovereignty to non-European powers (US and USSR) for the first time in modern history. Europe, which had so proudly ruled the world through its global empires, was now ruled by the world instead.

The shock is still reverberating on all sides.

Then, with the collapse of the Soviet Union, the United States found itself, reluctantly, in the approximate position of the Roman Republic at the end of the Punic Wars. Namely, it is in a position of responsibility and effective military control over lands overseas which it had no intention of ruling or controlling in the first place.

In the Roman case the exigencies of the new military situation destroyed the Republic.

Over the course of centuries the Romans gradually did manage to bring these other peoples into the Roman system (now Empire), as citizens with full rights. First the other Italians, then some people from Gaul, and eventually everybody in the Empire became a Roman citizen. Famous emperors like Marcus Aurelius were Spaniards.

The present system is unworkable for two reasons. First, the Europeans, Japanese, and other groups who have been brought into the American system are no longer, as Roger points out, responsible for their own defense. Second, as Freedland points out, they no longer have a say in their own destiny. This is not democratic and is bound to cause resentment.

It may be that it is time for us to give some consideration to bringing these other groups into the American system with full rights and responsibilities. I believe that the UN was intended to be something of this sort but it cannot work as now constituted.

We could begin, say, by bringing in France as the 51st state.

Sep 26, 2004 - 1:28 pm 26. Terrye:

I have heard this stuff before.

Does this mean they will pay taxes? No representation with taxation.

And so the Arabs will get to vote in our election before they ever vote in one in their own countries? Maybe Osama could run for Global Senator from the state of Jihad.

And the Brits, {God bless them} don’t have direct elections for PM in their own country but want direct elections for President in ours? Fat chance.

But then again maybe we get to vote in their elections to. Let’s have a vote on the European Union..

yea or nay..

As for the last election, the point is not Florida, it is the rest of the country. After all if Gore had carried his home state he might have had a chance Florida or no Florida.

And Gore is a lunatic. You don’t know what he might have done if he had been president after 9/11. I seem to remember a lot of chest pounding from Dems like Gore who have now turned dove.

Sep 26, 2004 - 1:35 pm 27. Terrye:

Wicita boy:

God no. Bite you tongue. Louisiana is French enough.

And I meant no representation without taxation of course.

But I do like the idea about the draft. Maybe this is what the Dems had in mind when they slipped in the draft bill.

Sep 26, 2004 - 1:40 pm 28. mongai:

Every country has a Guardian newspaper or two. In Japan it is Asahi (and Mainichi to a lesser extent). The readership is exactly as Cabarfeidh describes. All of these papers say the same thing, in about the same way, at about the same time. Lazy bunch of wankers that they all are. The “we deserve a vote in the elections to save the Americans from their stupidity” line is making its rounds here as well. But which paper is the lead wanker? Asahi is merely repeating lines being repeated elsewhere.

Wichita Boy

Great points.

In Japan a lot of “new” conservatives are keen on building a more equitable strategic alliance, and fast. “Internationist” liberals and paleos are up in arms, but the general public is behind the effort. No one wants to be a 51st State, Asahi newspaper folk claim Japan already is, but many do want a stronger bilateral relationship based on shared rights and responsibilities. The new conservatives here want independence from America so they can build a healthy inter-dependence. America needs strong friends not weak dependents. I say bi-lateralism, bi-lateralism, bi-lateralism….

Sep 26, 2004 - 1:58 pm 29. WichitaBoy:

Terrye,

I like Louisiana. A lot. And I like the Frenchness of it.

But I am boycotting French products as long as France suffers under its current anti-American regime.

Just kidding about about France though. In reality we’d probably have to bring it in as four states.

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:02 pm 30. chuck:

WichitaBoy:

Then, with the collapse of the Soviet Union, the United States found itself, reluctantly, in the approximate position of the Roman Republic at the end of the Punic Wars.

That historical analogy has occurred to me also. I don’t know how far it carries, but it is scary in many ways. American democracy is a sophisticated balance of different forces that I don’t see in other countries, in particular, in Europe. WWII and it’s aftermath seems to have destroyed what might be called the conservative strain in the area, and without it there is an insufficient check on the left. Perhaps Europe will rise again, it survived the plague and the Thirty Years War, but it is not going to happen overnight.

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:04 pm 31. mwalls:

Wichita Boy & Terrye:

[sarcasm warning]

I’ll be happy to have France or Quebec as a 51st state, right after we glaze & pave them so that civilized people can live there.

[end warning]

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:04 pm 32. mwalls:

Mongol:

The post-Punic war Rome is not a bad analogy, somebody just needs to remind the Eurotrash what happenned to Corinth for dissing a couple Roman Senators who were visiting (Roman version of cleaning urban blight).

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:07 pm 33. chuck:

Just kidding about about France though. In reality we’d probably have to bring it in as four states.

Ok, name the four state capitals. Paris would never be the same, eh.

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:09 pm 34. rumblestrip:

Chuck says: (posted at 12:20 PM)

Click on Norman Geras and scroll down to Elective assignments.

May I suggest, instead, that you scroll down to Orgasmic towel.

Thanks very, Chuck. Now I know what story I’ll tell my mother-in-law tonight at the dinner table.

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:10 pm 35. mrp:

Considering the New York Times’ lack of success in abolishing the Electoral College, Mr. Freedland’s plaint does seem rather absurd.

I’ll say this for the Guardian, though: in regards to talent, their writers are superior to those of the NYT by an order of magnitude.

Sep 26, 2004 - 2:43 pm 36. jdwill:

I’d like a vote in Russia, France and Germany, to express my pleasure with their leaders for spending a decade lining their pockets with Saddam’s oil money…

richard

Touche!

Sep 26, 2004 - 4:05 pm 37. Samuel:

Charlie, concerning…

we’d be happy to have you vote in the US elections. All you have to do is get a visa, establish residence, wait a few years, renounce your UK citizenship, and swear an oath to “protect and defend.”

I must say you couldn’t be more wrong. Simple illegal entry into our Nation along with a Driver’s License and/or Social Security Number, valid or not, is all that is needed. Where I live you just walk in, tell them who you are, and vote. They don’t even check whether you are a citizen let alone the actual person you are claiming to be. Our Founding Fathers must be rolling over in their graves! Heck they may even be voting as well.

Now that I have crossed over to the dark side I will add this. While Democrats like to cry foul about Republican intimidation and suppression of votes, most Republicans would say in full honesty and candor with free admission that they are indeed seeking to suppress the votes of illegal aliens, dead people, convicted felons and other like “potential voters”.

Sep 26, 2004 - 4:19 pm 38. Terrye:

Americans fought their revoltuion for a reason. I really don’t see us letting the Euros in the Union anytime soon. No good can come from that.

I think the Europeans are resentful because in 1945 the United Staes was one of the only industralized countries left standing with an intact infrastructure. Well excuse us for not getting in a world war with our neighbors.

Wichita:

I buy nothing French. But Louisisana is a very intersting place. They have the Napoleonic code there and a parish system and it really is different. Ask any realtor.

But so is California.

Sep 26, 2004 - 4:19 pm 39. Morenuancedthanyou:

I’d like a vote on which journalists, editors, producers and wankers continue in their powerful positions of control over the news and views made available to the public.

Sep 26, 2004 - 4:24 pm 40. Sandy P:

– Bush qua daddy is the overarching meme of this election, IMO.–

well, that puts a whole new spin on “Who’s your daddy?”

And I don’t think I want to go there.

Sep 26, 2004 - 4:51 pm 41. Wenda:

I wish I remembered the credentials of the following information, but I don’t. But it makes sense. (Fake but accurate?)

An American living in Paris earns money by teaching a course on Americans. He begins each session by asking how many in the class have broken a bone. Sometimes no one raises his/her hand, sometimes one, occasionally two.

He says, In America, it would be the reverse: all but one or two people would have broken a bone.

The risk-takers emigrated. The risk-averse stayed.

Over a few hundred years, perhaps that matters.

Sep 26, 2004 - 5:06 pm 42. Syl:

–well, that puts a whole new spin on “Who’s your daddy?”–

Heh and Kerry, yo mama

Sep 26, 2004 - 5:39 pm 43. radtop:

Big dogs don’t let his fleas vote.

Sep 26, 2004 - 5:58 pm 44. Terrye:

Wenda:

Catherine did a post some time back about this. The idea was that work was being done to find the gene. It seems some scientist thought a certain type of hyper activity was genetic and was connected to this. A sort of risk taker gene.

I am sorry I can’t remember more or put it better than that.

But if you think about it, it makes sense.

Sep 26, 2004 - 6:17 pm 45. klrfz1:

I just read the Best of PL: Days of Awe post on Powerline about a meeting between the President and a number of Jewish rabbis. Once again I am struck by how lucky we are that George W. Bush became our president.

And we are lucky to have bloggers to pass on information that will never be covered in the main stream media. I guess I haven’t mentioned it before but thanks Roger L. Simon for your blog, too.

Back on topic: if Kerry won the election, instituted the draft, and drafted an army of Frenchmen, would they still vote for him next time? You make the call.

Sep 26, 2004 - 6:28 pm 46. Assistant Village Idiot:

WichitaBoy, we shall divide Gaul into three parts (Three shall be the number…).

And thank you for the inside info Mongai.

Roger, there should be a new series starting this year of Best Blog Writing of 2004, to come out in February or March in paperback. I think you may be the man to edit it. Normblog’s essay should be included, as it will still have meaning ten years from now.

As to the meaning of wanker, I have always thought that the great er, pleasure that left-liberals take in analyzing the pathologies of their opponents and er, puffing themselves up thereby, made that Britishism a really superior slang item.

Sep 26, 2004 - 6:59 pm 47. John Clayton:

ìAnd Gore is a lunatic. You don’t know what he might have done if he had been president after 9/11î

Terrye, how can you write that with a straight face? According to Robert Novak and William Safire on Meet the Press today, the United States military is waiting until after the election to attack the cities in Iraq that arenít under government control. If itís the right thing to do, then President Bush should tell Americans this before the election and explain why he is going to do it. Instead, heís going to cost more American soldiersí lives in the long run by letting the insurrection get a firmer hold in those cities so that bad news from Iraq doesnít hurt his re-election chances. I canít vote for someone who would sacrifice even one life to get or hold political office, and I donít know why or how any self respecting American citizen- especially combat veterans- could either.

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:02 pm 48. chuck:

John Clayton:

I donít know why or how any self respecting American citizen- especially combat veterans- could either.

I like a fellow who is not afraid to confess his ignorance.

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:10 pm 49. Roberts:

I’d like to say that it is amusing that Clayton would make such accusations on Novak’s word … but it isn’t amusing.

It should be clear that the US Army hasn’t been delaying operations in Iraq for political purposes to anyone who is actually paying attention. But lets do Clayton more honor than he deserves and take him seriously.

Why doesn’t he condemn the Democrats who refuse to join with the President in an aggressive Iraq policy? Oh, Clayton’s little cheap shot about sacrificing soldiers’ lives for political gain was just hypocrisy? I never would have guessed…

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:32 pm 50. RogerA:

John Clayton: I wouldnt put too much stock in either William Safire or Robert Novak–Safire likes to think he is still “in the loop,” but hasnt been for years–Novak has his own agenda and apparently a straight line to the Arabists in State and CIA–Might want to check sometime on their prediction accuracy–Safire usually publishes his around the first of the year–Novak, never, as far as I know.

It doesnt make much sense that we would wait to attack the strongholds in the Sunni Triangle until after the election–looks to me like the President would get a boost for cracking down on them before the election. Ultimately, however, it does appear to me that the provisional Iraqi government is really calling the shots in Iraq–my friends on the left may not believe that, but it I think a strong case can be made that is the case.

Finally, with respect to your last point about combat veterans: that would be me for one. Presidents do have to sacrifice lives in war (Abraham Lincoln comes to mind). You may believe that is a political calculation–so be it. I do not see that trait in the President, thus I am supporting him in this election.

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:37 pm 51. richard mcenroe:

John Clayton ó Is that before or after Bush empties the universities with his new draft?

“I donít know why or how any self respecting American citizen- especially combat veterans- could either.” ó Well, since we have veterans here from every service this side of the Coast Guard Auxiliary, I can assume you haven’t been paying much attention to this blog, let alone doing anything as foolish as visiting Captain’s Quarters, the VVFT and SBVT sites or reading Unfit for Command.

Sep 26, 2004 - 8:44 pm 52. Samuel:

John Clayton

According to Robert Novak and William Safire? You quote them and then treat that as gospel? From that unsubstantiated somewhat lonely voiced premise you move forward into your channeling of Dan Rather, which is to say “let me accept hearsay and supposition as fact” all because of course it rings true to a heart cynically filled with pre-conceived notions of this President and his underhanded ways.

Well to me you represent quite well the “Poster Child” of what is wrong with the cynical left, though you did say one thing that rings true to this ex-lefty…

I can’t vote for someone who would sacrifice even one life to get or hold political office

I agree, yet it is John Kerry that killed for opportunity! He personally confessed, “I committed atrocities!”, admitting to murder and torture. Now he is using the fame of such confessions for his own gain. Should we allow such a man to serve? No way! I’ll leave you to defend him.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:17 pm 53. the_epistoler:

This column by Freedman is too ridiculous to comment on in a limited space. I don’t know what he was smoking, but I’ll give it a whack.

Sep 26, 2004 - 9:59 pm 54. Fausta:

Freedland and, generally speaking, the Grauniad’s Eurabian-centrist POV ignores two major players that will be coming to the fore in the next decades: China and India.

Both China & India have substantial economic growth, account for 35% or so of the total population of the world, and the average age of their citizens is lower than that of many industrial countries.

So let Freedland dreams of American elections, and Grauniad readers dream along with him.

(The Guardian’s so bad at correcting its own errors that apparently they even ignored misspelling their own logo)

Sep 27, 2004 - 5:49 am 55. Ray:

Novak’s smug complacency on “Meet The Press” was also evident in his article this A.M. (see Real Clear Politics) attempting to claim that the CIA was at war with Bush. He is beginning to sound like Dan (unimpeachable sources) Rather.

Novak’s real role in life is his attempt to remain pertinent. His real source is himself, which appears very impeachable.

Sep 27, 2004 - 6:14 am 56. John Clayton:

to Chuck, Richard McEnroe and Samuel:

I am ignorant, about a lot of things, including the Internet. One of my old buddies thought that Iíd enjoy reading the posts on this website. I thought that there would be good discussions of whatís really going on. But it seems that if someone disagrees with what you say, the first thing they do is try to show how clever they are when they make fun of you and try to get their on-line friends to join in. I thought I left this all behind in 7th grade. Some guys were small and hadnít hit puberty yet and bullies liked to make fun of them and get their gang to go along. Later it turned out that the bullies were just as scared as everyone else and they put on a big show of being tough so no one would find out.

So the guy I like to read is CBFTW Like me, he is someone who has been touched by war. He doesnít puff up like a bullfrog to show how tough he is. Heís not afraid to let us know heís scared. We all were scared shitless when faced daily with death or loss of someone we were close to. Anyone who says heís not scared isnít someone I want covering my back, because he must be high or stupid. And anyone who would put someone through what I went through for the sake of winning an election doesnít deserve my respect. Youíre welcome to your opinion, itís still a free country. And donít give me any bull that people like me are fighting for your freedom in Iraq- we may be fighting for something over there, but it isnít the right of Americans to vote, worship as we please, go where we please, or speak our piece.

Oh, and Colin Powell said yesterday that American troops are going to secure the no go areas before the January elections. So Novak and Safire were right.

Sep 27, 2004 - 7:50 pm 57. Keith:

Mark Steyn chimes in.

Sep 27, 2004 - 9:17 pm

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