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	<title>Comments on: Optimism from Ross</title>
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	<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/</link>
	<description>Just another Pajamasmedia.com weblog</description>
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		<title>By: Mike_Nargizian</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32795</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike_Nargizian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2005 18:21:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32795</guid>
		<description>The &lt;b&gt;Big Trunk&lt;/b&gt; link goes to Ross&#039;s article as well. Please fix that link I&#039;d like to read his analysis.



Thanks.


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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The <b>Big Trunk</b> link goes to Ross&#8217;s article as well. Please fix that link I&#8217;d like to read his analysis.</p>
<p>Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: Terrye</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32794</link>
		<dc:creator>Terrye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2005 01:22:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32794</guid>
		<description>I just think the young men with ski masks and guns would rather terrorize people than work. Work is boring and such a drag.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just think the young men with ski masks and guns would rather terrorize people than work. Work is boring and such a drag.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin P</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32793</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2005 01:13:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32793</guid>
		<description>Roger:



I would love to be optimistic but recent history has made me wary. The fact that Arafat is dead and their has been some positive noise coming from the rump PLO I can never forget that Arafat promised the end of violence as a solution and we know what a lie that was.



This does not mean we should not try to heal the open wound that is the Palestinian- Israeli conflict but we must do it realistically. We must let Israel defend itself and not listen to the &quot;honest broker &quot; garbage from the American left. Israel is not perfect but until Palestinian actions match the occasional good words we must hold fast. Just as Kerry was both for the security fence and against it the Palestinians have shown an amazing ability to conduct war and peace at the same time and speak peace in English and war in Arabic at the same time.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger:</p>
<p>I would love to be optimistic but recent history has made me wary. The fact that Arafat is dead and their has been some positive noise coming from the rump PLO I can never forget that Arafat promised the end of violence as a solution and we know what a lie that was.</p>
<p>This does not mean we should not try to heal the open wound that is the Palestinian- Israeli conflict but we must do it realistically. We must let Israel defend itself and not listen to the &#8220;honest broker &#8221; garbage from the American left. Israel is not perfect but until Palestinian actions match the occasional good words we must hold fast. Just as Kerry was both for the security fence and against it the Palestinians have shown an amazing ability to conduct war and peace at the same time and speak peace in English and war in Arabic at the same time.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Rockford</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32792</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Rockford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2005 00:00:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32792</guid>
		<description>I am not optimistic, myself.



While Arafat was a *bad* leader, in one sense you can&#039;t blame him for not wanting to be Michael Collins. No major political force inside the PA or the Palestinian community was willing to make the Collins half-a-loaf deal; and Arafat was not willing to risk death to make that argument.



PA TV, radio, and newspapers all spew the very worst sorts of anti-Semitic filth, suicide bombers are praised, and Abu Mazen and other candidates have all embraced continuous terrorism as a means to victory, which is defined as a single Palestinian state replacing the Israeli one.



Unless and until the Palestinian people themselves and their political organizations embrace a two state solution, the best that can hoped for is a cold truce ala Egypt and Israel. Arafat no longer standing the way makes at least a cold truce possible, but there is not the neccessary conditions for a real peace deal.



Sadly, the Palestinians probably need a clear and catastrophic military defeat of massive proportions to dispel the fantasy that &quot;just more terror&quot; will make the nation of Israel just up and move to the US or Europe, which seems to be the major political calculation of all Palestinian organizations and society itself.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am not optimistic, myself.</p>
<p>While Arafat was a *bad* leader, in one sense you can&#8217;t blame him for not wanting to be Michael Collins. No major political force inside the PA or the Palestinian community was willing to make the Collins half-a-loaf deal; and Arafat was not willing to risk death to make that argument.</p>
<p>PA TV, radio, and newspapers all spew the very worst sorts of anti-Semitic filth, suicide bombers are praised, and Abu Mazen and other candidates have all embraced continuous terrorism as a means to victory, which is defined as a single Palestinian state replacing the Israeli one.</p>
<p>Unless and until the Palestinian people themselves and their political organizations embrace a two state solution, the best that can hoped for is a cold truce ala Egypt and Israel. Arafat no longer standing the way makes at least a cold truce possible, but there is not the neccessary conditions for a real peace deal.</p>
<p>Sadly, the Palestinians probably need a clear and catastrophic military defeat of massive proportions to dispel the fantasy that &#8220;just more terror&#8221; will make the nation of Israel just up and move to the US or Europe, which seems to be the major political calculation of all Palestinian organizations and society itself.</p>
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		<title>By: Promethea</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32791</link>
		<dc:creator>Promethea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2005 23:09:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32791</guid>
		<description>Wishful thinking? Deja vue all over again? A lot will have to change before I expect to see much progress in Israel and &quot;Palestine.&quot; In the 1990s, I was a hopeful believer in the power of kindness and human contacts. Since that time I&#039;ve learned much about taqiyya, hudna, the Treaty of Hudibayyah, and other Arab/Islamic stuff. Therefore, I believe NOTHING the Palestinians say about anything.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wishful thinking? Deja vue all over again? A lot will have to change before I expect to see much progress in Israel and &#8220;Palestine.&#8221; In the 1990s, I was a hopeful believer in the power of kindness and human contacts. Since that time I&#8217;ve learned much about taqiyya, hudna, the Treaty of Hudibayyah, and other Arab/Islamic stuff. Therefore, I believe NOTHING the Palestinians say about anything.</p>
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		<title>By: Terrye</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32790</link>
		<dc:creator>Terrye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2005 22:54:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32790</guid>
		<description>Wichita Boy:



I agree. So many of the people who indulge in the hysteria about Bush are obviously unaware of the fact that if Bush were indeed Hitler they would be lampshades. And by the same token the fact that the jihadis can not take over the world will not stop them from trying...like their fellow travellers on the left they see only what their hatred and prejudice has programmed them to see.



I do think that the sight of fellow Musims being murdered in Iraq has had some impact. When the dead were all Jews or infidels it was not so bad, but this.....is something different.



And you know as time passes I think many ordinary people wonder if they really want to die for the likes of Osama or Zarqawi.



But it only takes a few to really screw things up. And as for the evil taught in the schools and fostered in the culture, that will never be overcome until people are prepared to leave it behind. And it seems to me that Islam is not conducive to change.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wichita Boy:</p>
<p>I agree. So many of the people who indulge in the hysteria about Bush are obviously unaware of the fact that if Bush were indeed Hitler they would be lampshades. And by the same token the fact that the jihadis can not take over the world will not stop them from trying&#8230;like their fellow travellers on the left they see only what their hatred and prejudice has programmed them to see.</p>
<p>I do think that the sight of fellow Musims being murdered in Iraq has had some impact. When the dead were all Jews or infidels it was not so bad, but this&#8230;..is something different.</p>
<p>And you know as time passes I think many ordinary people wonder if they really want to die for the likes of Osama or Zarqawi.</p>
<p>But it only takes a few to really screw things up. And as for the evil taught in the schools and fostered in the culture, that will never be overcome until people are prepared to leave it behind. And it seems to me that Islam is not conducive to change.</p>
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		<title>By: thedragonflies</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32789</link>
		<dc:creator>thedragonflies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2005 21:41:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32789</guid>
		<description>&quot;Arafat made being a victim a strategy, not just a condition, and thus Palestinians were entitled, never responsible.î



This is the heart of the whole enchilada, isn&#039;t it?  Nothing improves in Palestine until the Palestinians take responsibility and stop pretending to be victims, and stop using victimhood to claim special entitlement status.



Gee, doesn&#039;t this sound familiar to American ears?  Political strategy of being a victim and using victimhoos to claim entitlements?  Sounds suspiciously like one of the major political parties in the U.S.  How is it working out for them, I wonder?  Winning big elections anywhere lately?




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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Arafat made being a victim a strategy, not just a condition, and thus Palestinians were entitled, never responsible.î</p>
<p>This is the heart of the whole enchilada, isn&#8217;t it?  Nothing improves in Palestine until the Palestinians take responsibility and stop pretending to be victims, and stop using victimhood to claim special entitlement status.</p>
<p>Gee, doesn&#8217;t this sound familiar to American ears?  Political strategy of being a victim and using victimhoos to claim entitlements?  Sounds suspiciously like one of the major political parties in the U.S.  How is it working out for them, I wonder?  Winning big elections anywhere lately?</p>
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		<title>By: WichitaBoy</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32788</link>
		<dc:creator>WichitaBoy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2005 21:30:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32788</guid>
		<description>The great irony of human progress is that the better we make the world the less capable we ourselves become. Students who grow up with calculators have weaker math skills than those who lack them. People who ride their bikes to work have better physiques than those who drive.



So in the moral arena. For those of us born in the West post-WWII, growing up with the Beach Boys and the Beatles, the word &quot;genocide&quot; is entirely beyond our personal ken. It refers to nothing in our experience, a reference without a referent. The concept of one group virulently hating another and using that hatred as their raison d&#039;etre--is inconceivable. The mind boggles. This is why &quot;Bush = Hitler&quot;: absolutely the worst thing the modern mind can imagine is a political leader who doesn&#039;t agree with us, who does not intend to immediately implement our own personal agenda. Since everyone knows Hitler was as bad as it gets, this must be the same thing. The same mental saturation occurs in both cases.



However, the necessity of survival dictates a certain adherence to reality, even an incomprehensible reality. Many of the Palestinians, perhaps most, and many Arabs and even Muslims as far away as Malaysia, want to kill all the Jews and all the Americans. Or they think they do, which amounts to the same thing in the end. We ignore this at our mortal peril.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The great irony of human progress is that the better we make the world the less capable we ourselves become. Students who grow up with calculators have weaker math skills than those who lack them. People who ride their bikes to work have better physiques than those who drive.</p>
<p>So in the moral arena. For those of us born in the West post-WWII, growing up with the Beach Boys and the Beatles, the word &#8220;genocide&#8221; is entirely beyond our personal ken. It refers to nothing in our experience, a reference without a referent. The concept of one group virulently hating another and using that hatred as their raison d&#8217;etre&#8211;is inconceivable. The mind boggles. This is why &#8220;Bush = Hitler&#8221;: absolutely the worst thing the modern mind can imagine is a political leader who doesn&#8217;t agree with us, who does not intend to immediately implement our own personal agenda. Since everyone knows Hitler was as bad as it gets, this must be the same thing. The same mental saturation occurs in both cases.</p>
<p>However, the necessity of survival dictates a certain adherence to reality, even an incomprehensible reality. Many of the Palestinians, perhaps most, and many Arabs and even Muslims as far away as Malaysia, want to kill all the Jews and all the Americans. Or they think they do, which amounts to the same thing in the end. We ignore this at our mortal peril.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Wrght</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32787</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Wrght</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2005 20:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32787</guid>
		<description>Sorry for all the bolding. My coding screwed up when I tried tto put in the WOC Link.



Here&#039;s the link to the WOC discussion.



&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/006063.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Link Here&lt;/a&gt;



Ron Wright
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry for all the bolding. My coding screwed up when I tried tto put in the WOC Link.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s the link to the WOC discussion.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/006063.php" rel="nofollow">Link Here</a></p>
<p>Ron Wright</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Wrght</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32786</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Wrght</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2005 20:27:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2005/01/02/optimism-from-ross/#comment-32786</guid>
		<description>Roger and All:



HAPPY NEW YEAR ALL!



FREEDOM FREEDOM FREEDOM



This is the answer in this war of ideologies.  Just posted this to the HSPIG Forums Section.



*****



[...]



here&#039;s a piece that cuts to the central core of why Islamofascism is a failed ideology. This is the key to ultimately winning this war. After all this is a war of ideologies, ideas, culture, religion, and the free will and universal rights (inalienable) of men and women.



*****



January 02, 2005



American Pie - America&#039;s war against aggressive fundamentalist Islam

Osama&#039;s Second Worst Nightmare



Finally-a column from Ralph Peters that doesn&#039;t repeat things he&#039;s already said over and over. I was beginning to despair of reading any new analysis from him.





December 29, 2004 -- MONDAY&#039;S message from Osama bin Laden told us what he fears: a vote.



Condemning any Iraqi who goes to the polls as an infidel, the terror master hopes to derail the elections. He knows that every ballot cast is a defeat.



Anyone who dismisses the importance of the upcoming Iraqi elections need only listen to Monsieur bin Laden&#039;s urgent plea for a boycott. Osama praised the atrocities of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a hands-on executioner, and welcomed his collaboration in efforts to block the balloting.



Islamic terrorists distrust the common people. They dread the strength of those who might think for themselves. Convinced that men and women must be governed fiercely from above, the terrorists are the gory religious incarnation of thousands of years of tyranny. Their god is a savage dictator in the clouds.



[...]



&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.hspig.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2045&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Read More&lt;/a&gt;



*****



Off thread - but related to this convenant by the people with those who they choose to govern and the MSM responsibility to function as a watchdog so the people can hold acccountable those who they choose to govern.



For those interested in the detective medical mystery thriller that isn&#039;t fictional that I teased here several days ago, here&#039;s more.



What was the causal factor of Gulf War Syndrome?  Entrenched gov&#039;t DOD bureaurcrats may not be telling the, &quot;Whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth.&quot;



Follow the discussion on Gary Matsumoto&#039;s new book, &quot;Vaccine-A,&quot; over at the Winds of Change Blog.



&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/006063.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Link Here&lt;/a&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger and All:</p>
<p>HAPPY NEW YEAR ALL!</p>
<p>FREEDOM FREEDOM FREEDOM</p>
<p>This is the answer in this war of ideologies.  Just posted this to the HSPIG Forums Section.</p>
<p>*****</p>
<p>[...]</p>
<p>here&#8217;s a piece that cuts to the central core of why Islamofascism is a failed ideology. This is the key to ultimately winning this war. After all this is a war of ideologies, ideas, culture, religion, and the free will and universal rights (inalienable) of men and women.</p>
<p>*****</p>
<p>January 02, 2005</p>
<p>American Pie &#8211; America&#8217;s war against aggressive fundamentalist Islam</p>
<p>Osama&#8217;s Second Worst Nightmare</p>
<p>Finally-a column from Ralph Peters that doesn&#8217;t repeat things he&#8217;s already said over and over. I was beginning to despair of reading any new analysis from him.</p>
<p>December 29, 2004 &#8212; MONDAY&#8217;S message from Osama bin Laden told us what he fears: a vote.</p>
<p>Condemning any Iraqi who goes to the polls as an infidel, the terror master hopes to derail the elections. He knows that every ballot cast is a defeat.</p>
<p>Anyone who dismisses the importance of the upcoming Iraqi elections need only listen to Monsieur bin Laden&#8217;s urgent plea for a boycott. Osama praised the atrocities of Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a hands-on executioner, and welcomed his collaboration in efforts to block the balloting.</p>
<p>Islamic terrorists distrust the common people. They dread the strength of those who might think for themselves. Convinced that men and women must be governed fiercely from above, the terrorists are the gory religious incarnation of thousands of years of tyranny. Their god is a savage dictator in the clouds.</p>
<p>[...]</p>
<p><a href="http://www.hspig.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2045" rel="nofollow">Read More</a></p>
<p>*****</p>
<p>Off thread &#8211; but related to this convenant by the people with those who they choose to govern and the MSM responsibility to function as a watchdog so the people can hold acccountable those who they choose to govern.</p>
<p>For those interested in the detective medical mystery thriller that isn&#8217;t fictional that I teased here several days ago, here&#8217;s more.</p>
<p>What was the causal factor of Gulf War Syndrome?  Entrenched gov&#8217;t DOD bureaurcrats may not be telling the, &#8220;Whole Truth, and nothing but the Truth.&#8221;</p>
<p>Follow the discussion on Gary Matsumoto&#8217;s new book, &#8220;Vaccine-A,&#8221; over at the Winds of Change Blog.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/006063.php" rel="nofollow">Link Here</a></p>
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