44 Comments

1. David Thomson:

“Their hearts are more likely stuck back in 1492 and their real desire is “Al Andaluz.”

You have got that right. Ideological true believers are never satisfied. It is foolish to argue that the Islamic nihilists merely want control over the Middle East. No, their agenda is to dominate the whole world. Even the Siberian wilderness and the island of Greenland must ultimately be under Sharia law.

Jul 16, 2005 - 10:31 am 2. PeterUK:

Kind of begs the question, how did they knew Zapatero was on their side.

Al Andaluz? Rumour is the Italians want the province of Hispania back.We are going to have to stop this tactic of declaring the Caliphate year zero.

Jul 16, 2005 - 10:51 am 3. lindenen:

I hope this is big news in Spain. Of course, I suspect the buyer’s remorse from the last election set in awhile ago.

Jul 16, 2005 - 11:14 am 4. Patrick Tyson:

Zapatero said, if elected, he would withdraw the troops. He did. The Socialists seem to be doing exactly what they said they’d do.

This week in the news…

Spain’s first gay marriage

Are they unpopular?

Jul 16, 2005 - 11:45 am 5. Kyda Sylvester:

Spain’s lower house of parliament voted in favour of the bill on 30 June, overruling its rejection by the upper house, the Senate.

Wow–the lower house veto of the upper house–is this true of all parliamentary forms of government? There must be a way we can adapt this rule to fit our own system. Let’s work on it.

Jul 16, 2005 - 12:00 pm 6. Franco Aleman (Barcelona, Spain):

Roger, thanks for the link.

Patrick: you’re falling hook, line and sinker for the official Socialist spin. Zapatero said that, if on June 30th 2004 there was no UN resolution, he would not renew the mission who ended on that date (which would have been presumably renewed if Aznar party candidate, Mariano Rajoy, would’ve won). That’s exactly his campaign pledge (and I’m not going to go now on whether this put the country on the crosshairs)

But he withdrew them in april, saying there was not going to be a resolution. Which there was, as you know; it was number 1546.

And then in Tunis, a few weeks later, he encouraged all other countries fighting alongside the US in Iraq to follow his example. I didn’t read the small print in his electoral program, I must confess, but I doubt this was in it.

So he did something that was far from what he had pledged; he changed his decisions after the attack. As I have written several times in the past, a real stateman would have said on election night after winning: “look, guys, I know I said we would leave Iraq on June 30 but now everything has changed since we have been attacked by people who want us out from Iraq. Precisely because they want us out, we cannot leave. They must know that we will never yield to murderers,” or words to that effect.

And you know what? I’m pretty sure that, extremists aside, the majority of the people would have understood.

Jul 16, 2005 - 12:12 pm 7. PJ:

As far as criminal expertise goes, the Islamists are amateurish but deadly. Of course, we always find loads of evidence later, after a deadly attack.

My question is: do we or Britain or Europe have the guts to crack down before the next attack?

Jul 16, 2005 - 1:03 pm 8. Patrick Tyson:

Franco,

I don’t often write about this because my position, as a supporter of going in at the time and as a supporter of staying since, is that we can’t know one way or the other whether the decision to go into Iraq will have been worth the price until sometime in the, hopefully not too distant, future. My feeling is that it won’t, but I also hope it turns out I’m wrong.

What I’m specifically asking, and what you might know, is whether or not the government is popular or whether there’s “buyer’s remorse.” I wasn’t reacting to your linked post, but to a couple of comments that followed.

Jul 16, 2005 - 1:20 pm 9. Kevin P:

Roger:

Spain’s government decided to bow out of the battle and hope this might take them off the list of targets of the terrorists. The sad fact is this will probably be a good political tactic and a temporary solution for taking them out of the cross hairs of the terrorists. For now. The ability of the anti-war crowd to focus on strictly short term gains is very tempting and in a democratic society the side that can promise a year or two of “peace” has a political advantage over the side who states that ,Yes, this will be a long painful struggle but if we tighten our belts today and sacrifice, even some of our best young men and women, we will be better off in the long run.

That is why the left is struggling so hard to present the myth that the war in Iraq is the primary cause of all the trouble in the world. And that is such a simplistic and easy answer that if you are out of power and you want to take it back it is a no brainer as a tactic. It gives instant results. The troops come home. It allows you to focus on domestic issues and unless there is a terrible attack before you grab the reigns of power you are probably going to win,(unless of course you nominate someone like Kerry).

The drumbeat of the “It’s Iraq stupid” political sloganeering will not stop because of the 7-7 London bombings. Today I awoke to the op-ed section of the L.A.Times and read “Let’s not act Shocked” by Dilpazier Aslam, a “journalist in training” for The Guardian. By the headline I was expecting a we didn’t listen to the obvious warnings article and it was in a sense. Dilpazier used this idea and gave it the “It’s Iraq stupid” twist.”Shocked would be to suggest we don’t appreciate that when Fallouja was flattened last fall, the people under it were dead but not forgotten”

Without coming right out and stating it Aslam was saying that the London victims were no different then the Fallouja victims. He gives the terrorist who had taken over Fallouja in the same manner that a criminal gang, hanging and torturing Iraqi civilians unless they buckled under to their Fascist takeover. It is the Fault of the U.S. and Britain for not allowing the “insurgents” to ignore the wishes of the majority of the Iraqi citizens in their wish for a Iraqi style democracy and allow area’s of Iraq to fall under the controll of bandits who want to bring back the Sunni minority dictaorship of the Baathist party. It’s the theory of “Well there are dead people in Fallouja, there are dead people in london, so they are both the same thing.” This is easy to sell and there are lot’s of buyers out there.

Kevin Peters

Jul 16, 2005 - 1:30 pm 10. PeterUK:

PJ.

Our ruling elites are the problem,Blair’s Human Rights Act,Political Correctness,for example the Police Commissioner Ian Blair denied there were suicide bombers,Brian Paddick his deputy claimed the words Islam and terrorist do not go together.

Racial sensitivity has hamstrung the intelligence services…but…the people are right royally pissed off.All the calls for calm and restraint are because our elite knows that the first to feel the peoples wrath will be thems.

People are saying that they have been lied to and forced to sell their birthright for a mess of pottage.Subjects which were not discussed are being aired openly.

Give it a decent period and heads will roll as Tony Blair shuffles off the blame,his name sake has done his master’s bidding.Whether it is those who don’t think that the Blair government has not be tough enough or those who blame the involvement in Iraq,it is Blair who has to do something,fast.

The liberal left elite have lost the moral ascendancy,they will keep baying at the moon

Jul 16, 2005 - 1:52 pm 11. David Thomson:

ì…is that we can’t know one way or the other whether the decision to go into Iraq will have been worth the price until sometime in the, hopefully not too distant, future.î

We do not have to wait that long. The evidence is already available showing that our liberation of Iraq has been greatly successful—and that we never had a viable alternative. Am I a special person? No, I simply have a clearer understanding than the ideological liberals who dominate the Democratic Party and many of our intellectual institutions. You are wasting your time listening to such people. They are not worthy of your respect.

Saddam Hussein was fully cooperating with known terrorists. He had every intention of causing us considerable harm. Today the Iraqis have a fledging Democracy and Saddam sits in a jail cell. That, my friend, is a major success story.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:02 pm 12. Kyda Sylvester:

People are saying that they have been lied to and forced to sell their birthright for a mess of pottage.Subjects which were not discussed are being aired openly.

I’d love to have you elaborate, Peter.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:04 pm 13. PeterUK:

Patrick Tyson,

There are too many “ifs” to the Spanish election,there was no certainty that Aznar would lose,certainly that his government would make the fatal mistake of blaming ETA,or that Zapatero’s party would be so preternaturally adept at reacting to the atrocity.

Zapatero’s response could have been like that of Britain when the Falklands were invaded,that a nation cannot retain any crediblity if it allows thugs to push them around with impunity.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:11 pm 14. PeterUK:

Kyda,

Just let me check on the Hate Speech legislation and racial Discrimination Laws before I expose my fellow countrymen to the Star Chamber.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:16 pm 15. Connecticut Yankee:

PeterUK–

I wouldn’t mind if the Italians decide they also want to reclaim Gallia and Germania.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:20 pm 16. PeterUK:

David Thomson,

You will love this,http://powerlineblog.com/archives/011045.php

Via Powerline

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:23 pm 17. Buddy Larsen:

There’ve been several reputable reports (check google) that the Madrid Bombings were planned long before OIF. OIF of course was the putative reason for the bomb. A pro-OIF ousted for an anti-OIF government. There’s a disconnect here somewhere.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:27 pm 18. richard mcenroe:

PJ ó I remain convinced these lightning arrests and masses of evidence after each attack are not the sign of sharp Euro police work but evidence that these people were no secret to the authorities all along, who chose not to goad the scorpion as long as it was busy ranting against the arrogant Americans and perfidious Jews.

Of course, now they’re learning, perhaps too late, that if you let a scorpion into your house you eventually get stung by a scorpion.

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:34 pm 19. Jamie Irons:

You know, the whole notion of “causation” in this struggle with Islamic lunacy is a crock, and we need to stop worrying about it.

We don’t need to worry about whether our March, 2003 invasion of Iraq “caused” 9/11 (I am being deliberately asynchronistic here because the left is only a hair’s breadth away from trying to “prove” this), or whether the 3/11 attacks on Madrid were “caused” by the expulsion of the Moors from Andalusia, or whether particularly high sunspot activity “caused” the “Palestinians” to fabricate stories about a “massacre” in Jenin.

All these causes, “root causes,” correlations, non sequiturs and blind alleys are “caused” by exactly the same thing: a deluded, paranoid, vicious and highly toxic mindset that has captivated about a fifth of the world’s population.

If we don’t get busy changing the hearts and minds of those who indulge in Islamic fantasies, by whatever means necessary, we are all going to have ample cause for regret.

Jamie Irons

BTW, I suggest we rename this struggle the “War On Islamic Lunacy.”

W.O.I.L.

Rhymes with “oil,” so the left will find the name useful for its “thinking.”

Jul 16, 2005 - 2:47 pm 20. PJ:

PeterUK, I hope you’re right and that we do something before all that’s left is something draconian.

Richard, I know you’re right.

You mean, Jamie, our rallying cry should be NO BWOOD FO WOIL? Weawwy!

Jul 16, 2005 - 3:17 pm 21. PeterUK:

What we have to combat is this,http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/this_britain/article299460.ece the wieghing of an imaginary offence against a very real and brutal atrocity.

The bastards at the Independent couldn’t even wait until the poor victims were in the ground and the families had had time to grieve.

Jul 16, 2005 - 3:41 pm 22. Rick Ballard:

Jamie,

Austin Bay has a nice roundup on Pali politics. One might wonder at the advisability of the G8 folks offerring 3 bil to the Palis before the “elections” are complete. Hamas seems to have a home turf advantage in Gaza at the moment and Abbas shows no signs of effective leadership.

I wonder if Ladbroke’s is offering a line on this yet. Should be an exciting race. I just can’t figure out who to support.

Jul 16, 2005 - 4:19 pm 23. Buddy Larsen:

“Causes” is bigotry. As if the terrorists cannot help themselves, as if they’re pavlov dogs. Respect them more then that. Why not extend that respect–as an example–since it makes no difference to the solution, anyway.

Whether they can help themselves or not, they cannot be allowed do what they do. So even the most enlightened of us eventually arrive at “kill them”. They want to be killed as dogs, so don’t let ‘em. Kill them as humans.

Jul 16, 2005 - 4:21 pm 24. Kyda Sylvester:

DVH has a sober piece about Our Wars Over the War

at NRO:

So it is not true to say that Western civilization is at war against Dark Age Islamism. Properly speaking, only about half of the West is involved, the shrinking segment that still sees human nature as unchanging and history as therefore replete with a rich heritage of tragic lessons.

And a must-read transcript of his conversation with Hugh Hewitt at radio blogger:

And we have to tell Muslims of good faith, the end is over for tolerating this type of behavior. If you go to a mosque, and somebody stands up and says Jews are apes and pigs, or the West should be destroyed, then you have a duty as a resident or a citizen in a Western country to oppose that. And if you don’t do it, you’re abetting it, and you’re complicit in it.

Jul 16, 2005 - 5:40 pm 25. Pat Curley:

The Detroit News helpfully printed an op-ed from an Imam of a Michigan mosque calling for an end to the causes of terror. One of the causes?

It’s the Jooooz:

As long as Jews can immigrate to Israel by the tens of thousands each year while Palestinians stay hungry and homeless, I am afraid this will contribute to the violence in the Middle East and elsewhere.

Jul 16, 2005 - 5:55 pm 26. Kyda Sylvester:

Imam Mohammad Ali Elahi of the Islamic House of Wisdom in Dearborn Heights doesn’t appear to “get it”. Perhaps he should read VDH.

Jul 16, 2005 - 6:01 pm 27. Charlie (Colorado):

If we don’t get busy changing the hearts and minds of those who indulge in Islamic fantasies, by whatever means necessary, we are all going to have ample cause for regret.

I’m generally against the usual “it’s silly not to profile and/or expel Muslims” people, beause I’ve known a fair number of Muslims who I like and respect, and because I would hate to establish a precedent in case someone like Tom Tancredo wanted to expel the mexicans, or someone else wanted to suppress and expel the Jews.

But I think Jamie’s put his finger on it: we have to change the hearts and minds of those who indulge in Islamist fantasies, by making it clear and obvious that those fantasies don’t pay off.

Sadly, the cobbler’s response to 3/11 had the opposite effect.

Jul 16, 2005 - 6:45 pm 28. Kevin P:

Pat:

The Michigan Imam doesn’t get it in so many different ways. As segments of the Muslim communities continue to attack the small Jewish communities all over the world the migration to Israel will continue to flow. If you are going to get shot at anyway you might as well live in the country that allows you to shoot back. And if the Imam thinks that he can destroy Israel someone should inform him that Mecca can be reached by the IDF and this time the Jews of Israel are not going down by themselves.

Jul 16, 2005 - 6:51 pm 29. PeterUK:

I think we should reach out and try and understand http://www.leedsgrandmosque.org.uk/khutbahs/khutba-20040326.asp

Then praise the Lord and pass the ammunition.

Jul 16, 2005 - 7:54 pm 30. dtlc:

This is very funny and insightful and clearly shows the MSM’s liberal biast

CNN’s Bullshit Coverage” On Karl Rove

Lou Dobbs Tonight Show on July 15, 2005, as Lou was introducing a piece on the Rove story.

Lou says, “…Rove testifying that he first learned about Plame from columnist Robert Novak, a CNN contributor. Danna Bash reports.”

Immediately after that you can clearly hear a female voice on mic whispering “that’s bullshit”

Then Dana Bash continues with her report.

The video clip is attached at this link

http://satire.myblogsite.com/blog

Jul 16, 2005 - 9:29 pm 31. Kevin P:

PeterUK:

Thanks for the link. I learned something.I have a grievnce! Since my fathers grandfathers,fathers were forced off their land thru exclusionary religous laws, tennant rents designed to kick us out and a glaring lack of crop diversity I have the right to retun to Ireland and take back my ancestors land! And if I am refused, if I am reading it right, I have the option of killing any limey,or any one else for that matter, until I get it. And here is the beauty part. Instead of being considered a murderer I will be pitied and understood by a large portion of humanity! If only those damn Americans(I am no longer American because you never stop being Irish) hadn’t let us thrive and prosper and instead kept us trapped in camps so our rage could be properly developed. I knew my Irish nuns were holding back on something during those first eight years of school.

P.S.- My fathers even in a wheelchair so that gives ne even a better shot, granted he is not the pope and he hasn’t planned any suicide bomb attacks to send my nieces and nephews out on but he was a lecter at church so that should count for something.

Kevin Peters

Jul 16, 2005 - 10:15 pm 32. richard mcenroe:

Kevin Peters ó My nuns weren’t holding anything back. Those penguins swung for the fences like Mark McGwire…

,,, hmm. I wonder if the Guardian WOULD lobby for an Irish Right of Return…

Jul 16, 2005 - 10:50 pm 33. Luther McLeod:

Well surely there must be a hillside somewhere in Scotland with my name on it. Seriously, reading Peter’s link just reminds me of how thoroughly insane these people are. Frankly, its depressing. Now to hunt around for that ammunition.

Jul 16, 2005 - 11:16 pm 34. Kevin P:

Richard:

I was refering to doctrinal matters.I still flinch when I hear any sound that resembles the whush of a rubber tipped wooden pointer flying towards it’s target.

Kevin Peters

Jul 16, 2005 - 11:19 pm 35. David Thomson:

ìI have the right to retun to Ireland and take back my ancestors land! And if I am refused, if I am reading it right, I have the option of killing any limey,or any one else for that matter, until I get it.î

Victimhood status is only granted to those with dark skins. White Irish males need not apply. The not so subtle dogma of multiculturalism is that Caucasians are only getting what they deserve. This reverse racism regretfully assist the David Dukes in finding new converts for their nonsense.

Jul 17, 2005 - 12:17 am 36. PeterUK:

How cruel,to tell Kevin P that he is white,now he knows he is doubly disadvantaged.David Thomson it is only belief that he wasn’t white that sustained him.

Jul 17, 2005 - 4:21 am 37. PJ:

Hey, it’s not white, its’s Celto-Euro-American! And I will only say the nuns I knew could teach the interrogators at Gitmo a thing or two…

Jul 17, 2005 - 7:41 am 38. MaDr:

Do take the time to read what the good Detroit iman had to say. It’s not just the Jews he blames. Why its also Bush and Rumsfeld. Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo.

Jul 17, 2005 - 8:53 am 39. Kevin P:

MaDr:

Your words don’t quite make it clear but if you are coming from the if we just leave the Middle East they will leave us alone school I think you are missing the overall point.Of course those events and gentleman make the Arabic top ten hate list but they are not the sole cause of the troubles.

When the French proposed(and this was a silly idea but that is another argument) to ban all religous clothes and symbols for their school children a death threat was given. And of course the Dutch filmmaker was butchered in the street because he had the nerve to offer a critique of Muslim society. And Rushdie had to go thru the European version of OBL cave dwelling to avoid the book critics of the middle east, and the Iranian Frank Rich goes beyond just using cutting phrases on paper.

More Iraqi’s are being killed by their Muslim “brothers” then American soldiers. Sadat was killed for doing the unforgivable, swapping land for peace with Israel.Of course that pig of a man deserves death, he deprived his countrymen of the opportunity to get killed in three or four more senseless war against Israel. Ask the government and the people of Algeria and Indonesia and you will find that you don’t have to invade Iraq to get yourself on the bad side of OBL. And of course Andalusia is still apoint of contention and is on the things to do later list of these fascists theocrats.

Yes, we could pull out. But thats not all we would have to do. We would have to promise not to butt in while they wipe Israel and it’s citizens off the map. We would also have to accept the fact that the Taliban will be one of the options for the entire middle east. And of course we would have to look the other way while the female population of the middle east gets transported back to the barefoot, ignorant. eneducated and pregant way of thinking of those Muslim glory days.

If I misread your intentions I apologize. If not you may want to consider that the OBL’s of the world still want payback for the Crusades and they are not talking about reparations. And they will kill as many Jews, Muslims, Christians and any other way of thinking until they feel their shame has been erased.

Kevin Peters

Jul 17, 2005 - 12:46 pm 40. Kevin P:

un

Jul 17, 2005 - 12:50 pm 41. PeterUK:

Kevin Peters,

It is obvious from the atrocity carried out by young Yorkshiremen of Pakistani descent,who are Asian not Arab,thus having no connection with Iraq,that Islam believe that an offence against one is an offence against all.

If the West accepts this,as much of the idiot liberal left has,then there can never be any way in which we can treat with Islam.

There will always be a reason for offence.

Jul 17, 2005 - 3:00 pm 42. MaDr:

You’re quite right – I wasn’t very clear.

What I should have stated is that the Iman’s statement was just another in a long line of “yes, but”. I read mostly a long litany of excuses, not a clear message of there’s something wrong in our house and we need to fix.

Jul 18, 2005 - 8:53 am 43. MaDr:

Ooops

Kevin P

You’re quite right – I wasn’t very clear.

What I should have stated is that the Iman’s statement was just another in a long line of “yes, but”. I read mostly a long litany of excuses, not a clear message of there’s something wrong in our house and we need to fix.

Jul 18, 2005 - 8:56 am 44. Kevin P:

MaDr:

Thanks for the clarification. I tend to be a little over zealous on this issue. Even when I see a hint of it I tend to go into rhetorical overkill beause I am so tired of the moral relativism on this issue.

Kevin Peters

Jul 18, 2005 - 10:29 am

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