David T at Harry’s Place has done us all a service by pointing out a huge problem in Amnesty International’s worldwide survey on the death penalty for 2005.
[Before I go on, I would like to note, as I have frequently on this blog, that I oppose the death penalty except in the rare cases of political mass murderers like Saddam and Hitler whose adherents can too easily free them to kill again. This post is not about that, but about the methods of Amnesty International.]
Now. Here’s what Amnesty reports:
- at least 2,148 people were executed in 22 countries
- 94% of them were killed in China, Iran, Saudi Arabia and the USA“As the world continues to turn away from the use of the death penalty, it is a glaring anomaly that China, Saudi Arabia, Iran and the USA stand out for their extreme use of this form of punishment as the ‘top’ executioners in the world.” – Irene Khan, AI Secretary General.
The USA with China, Saudi Arabia and Iran? How embarrassing. But working from numbers on Brett Lock’s blog, David T. shows how the execution rate in the United States, on a per capita basis, is a statistically insignificant one per cent, not even in the same ballpark as China, Saudi Arabia and Iran (and this doesn’t even deal with what the people in those countries were executed for, like political dissidence, homosexuality, etc. In the US it is invariably for having committed murder.).
David then goes on to several possible reasons Amnesty lumps the US in with these totalitarian regimes, including the ritualized anti-Americanism that is correctly criticized in the Euston Manifesto. But … oddly for a website with writers of socialist background… he overlooks the greatest motivation of all. I will put it in block letters with an exclamation point: MONEY! Amnesty International exists by donation. Do you think they get one penny from opponents of the death penalty in China, Saudi Arabia and Iran? Please, Louise! No, they make virtually all their money from upper middle class supporters in New York, San Francisco and Los Angeles, etc. whose egos are flattered by giving their bourgeois bucks to an organization that is “sticking it to the man.” If the man’s not so bad, no bucks. Well, they’re not getting mine anymore. I don’t give to liars.
UPDATE: See Ron’s mathematical revision in the comments – even more damning of Amnesty.
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26 Comments
1. Laurence Simon:Texans like myself look at that number and wonder if Huntsville has needles on backorder or something.
Hurry up, Governor Perry! Finish the whole lot of ‘em off!
Apr 25, 2006 - 7:52 am 2. Knucklehead:In addition to the MONEY coming from the checkbooks of the comfy and safe, fashionably leftist sources who demand that AI hammer at the US it is in the US that they get the media attention they crave. The Chinese, Saudi, and Iranian press isn’t splasing the AI’s reports all over their media to serve as cocktail party patter over the pate.
Apr 25, 2006 - 8:35 am 3. cubanbob:Just relabel the death penalty to retroactive abortion.
Apr 25, 2006 - 8:55 am 4. In Vino Veritas:Western Democratic Countries that still have the Death Penalty:
Guatamala
The Caribbean Islands
The United States
Isn’t that a far more compelling reason for Amnesty to have highlighted the fact that the U.S., pretty much alone amongst civilized nations, still has this barbaric practice.
Further, I long to see the following caption in American tourism materials:
“The United States: Fewer executions per capita than Saudi Arabia!”
Apr 25, 2006 - 9:35 am 5. chuck:Just relabel the death penalty to retroactive abortion.
That reminds me, wasn’t there a proposal in the Netherlands to allow doctors to euthanize disabled children up to the age of twelve despite the parent’s wishes? In fact, wasn’t that the defacto Dutch practice for disabled infants? Didn’t someone in England propose withholding organ transplants from obese patients? I think all we need to do is replace the courts with panels of doctors who will label perps disabled and incurable, no need for defense teams and appeals and all that other unprofessional junk. Then all will be well in the world as the perps are sent to happyland by lovingly administered happy making injections. Quick, scientific, and cheap, the wave of the rational future is upon us.
Apr 25, 2006 - 9:43 am 6. Godzilla:As the post points out, the U.S. executes individuals who were themselves executioners. A little off-topic, but I was thinking about this the other day, and it’s not TOO much off topic.
I was wondering, probably from all these Iranian posts and their associative connection to Hitler, what would someone do if:
They had right in front of them a cute looking little boy who happened to be the young Hitler. There were no bones about this. The boy was Hitler, he would grow up to do what he did, nothing would change that, except you could kill him right then, and only then, and stop the future holocaust.
Would you kill him?
Well, for me the answer was easy: yes, with no compunctions.
Okay, now back to this death penalty thing.
Assuming, as I do, that our life is the only life that we’ll ever have, and that it is the only context in which we will ever exist, then life trully IS priceless.
Is one time infinity and smaller than 10 times infinity? Or six million times infinity? No. Infinity is infinity, pricelss is priceless.
The death penality is moral and good.
Apr 25, 2006 - 9:56 am 7. Godzilla:People can die any number of ways at the hands of other people. In my comment, I was specifically thinking of cold-blooded murder.
Apr 25, 2006 - 10:21 am 8. In Vino Veritas:Some other reasons the United States should be singled out:
Countries where the execution of juvenile offenders has taken place since 1990:
Democratic Republic of the Congo
Pakistan
Yemen
Saudi Arabia
Nigeria
Iran
United States
(note that even China has made it illegal to execute juveniles)
The United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, which forbids capital punishment for juveniles, has been signed and ratified by all countries except for:
Somalia
Apr 25, 2006 - 10:41 am 9. jbrookins:The United States
As Simon points out it’s the mis-leading that is the problem.
Apr 25, 2006 - 11:12 am 10. Kevin Peters:VV:
Apr 25, 2006 - 11:15 am 11. maryatexitzero:The United Nations can’t get a vote that states that the suicide bombings are immoral and we are supposed to be shamed by their verdict on our country. The United Nations, that passed a resolution equating Zionism and racism. The United nations, That had Syria and Cuba on the Human Rights commission. The U.N. that was on the ground “peace keeping” as the slaughter in Rwanda and Bosnia took place without lifting a finger and now is watching the slaughter in the Sudan go on without doing anything other then discus what they might do.Remember, President Bush is practicing the beloved multilateral International U.N. approach to Sudan that is so beloved by the left. Results, nothing gets done, the killing goes on unchecked. And we are supposed to respect anything they have to say. The U.N. has many lovely charters and resolutions but does nothing. Signing a U.N. resolution and then ignoring it is S.O.P. all over the world because they do nothing to anyone that violates their charters. They wait for us to do it. When the Tsunami hit they were arguing about what helmets our sailors and soldiers should wear while our ships were sending helicopters out to save people while the U.N. dithered and discused. Spare me the self rightous finger pointing from the U.N.
Isn’t that a far more compelling reason for Amnesty to have highlighted the fact that the U.S., pretty much alone amongst civilized nations, still has this barbaric practice.
Since you appear to know a lot about this issue, I’d have to guess that you are deliberately omitting the fact that civilized Japan still has the death penalty. From the Washington Post article Why Japan Still Has the Death Penalty
There is a place in the advanced industrial world where people are regularly sentenced to death, and executed, for their crimes. Some of the condemned deny their guilt — and there are confirmed cases of mistakes in sentencing. But government officials say the system delivers retribution and deterrence fairly and efficiently.
This place is not Texas. It is Japan — the only industrial democracy other than our own that still regularly executes convicted murderers. In 2004, the Japanese conducted two executions by hanging, the sole method employed there. In some years, the rate is double or triple that. This is nowhere near the rate in the United States, where 59 convicted murderers were put to death in 2004. But there are many more murders in the United States than in Japan, and our population is 295 million people compared to Japan’s 127 million. When you adjust for those facts, Japan has recently been about as likely as Texas and Virginia to sentence killers to death.
The same article describes how, according to polls, most Europeans would prefer to bring back the death penalty.
Personally, I only support the death penalty in cases of wartime/political crimes. It’s a crime not to hang a Pol Pot, Osama bin Laden or Idi Amin. The UN’s pacifist policies encourage these crimes of omission, and the UN’s pacifist minions, like Amnesty, have absolutely no moral ground to stand on. Neither does your argument.
Apr 25, 2006 - 11:34 am 12. Kevin Peters:Roger:
Apr 25, 2006 - 11:45 am 13. beautifulatrocities:I think our death penalty needs serious reform. People who are convicted strictly on a single eyewitness or strictly on circumstancial evidence should not be eligible for the death penalty. But when you carve out excemptions for political crimes(Hitler, Stalin ect) you are ignoring the fact that many murderers that are given life sentences kill prison guards or the ones that are in gangs order murders from their cells on people outside and in jail. We have to restrict the penalty to murders who have multiple witness’s and physical evidence to make sure that innocent people are not executed. But the fact that Charles Manson is still alive is a crime. I hope the 20th 9-11 bomber is executed. Letting some of these murders who we have no doubt about their guilt live is an insult to the innocent people they killed. They don’t deserve to live. Saddam should hang. All the arguments that preserve the life of Manson could be used to spare the life of Saddam. Saddam has obvious mental problems. We could cut off outside communication so he could no longer influence others and spare us the idignity of being called “barbaric.”. Remenber, many of those who think a child rapist and multiple murderer should be spared the death penalty because it is a “barbaric” practice feel the same about Saddam. They think if we kill him we are no better then him. It’s the same logic.
The United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, which forbids capital punishment for juveniles, has been signed and ratified by all countries except for: Somalia, The United States
Wow, if the esteemed UN says it’s immoral to treat a 16yo who viciously murders in cold blood as an adult, that’s good enough for me!
RE: execution of tyrants. For sophisticated Europrudence in all its glory, just look at the Milosevic circus. The summary execution of the Ceaucescus, on the other hand, sent shock waves thru the Kremlin, & hastened the unraveling of that 70-year tyranny
Apr 25, 2006 - 11:46 am 14. In Vino Veritas:Re: Japan
I noted that the US was one of only three Western democracies to have the death penalty. Many Asian and African democracies (including Japan) still retain the practice.
About Amnesty’s “methods,” I don’t see what is so upsetting about them. Amensty is highlighting the U.S., because, among Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, etc., the US is the one country where a public outcry may actually have an effect on policy. I should say this is their motive, not completely unproven, unbacked, and unreasonable accusations of “fund-raising.”
Apr 25, 2006 - 11:55 am 15. Kevin Peters:Ba:
Apr 25, 2006 - 12:11 pm 16. maryatexitzero:Milosevic is the classic example to give for those who are pushing for the handover of our sovereignty to the World Court. Even a war torn Iraq will be able to give Saddam a fair trial and come to a verdict faster then the fools at the Hague. They did such a lousy job on Milosevic that they took a man who at the time of his arrest was even reviled at home and turned him back into a folk hero.
Amensty is highlighting the U.S., because, among Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, etc., the US is the one country where a public outcry may actually have an effect on policy.
So why aren’t they highlighting Japan or Thailand? Those are democracies, and a public outcry would have a great effect.
I should say this is their motive, not completely unproven, unbacked, and unreasonable accusations of “fund-raising.”
“Fund raising” in scare quotes? Are we supposed to believe that the Sainted members of Amnesty are above such common concerns?
Unlike Japan and Thailand, the US is the only nation that seriously challenges the UN’s (and their satellite NGOs’) power. The need for power and money motivates Amnesty, just as it motivates the UN. It’s understandable that they hate us and they want to target us, but the fact that these corrupt creeps expect us to fall for their holier-than-thou routine is insulting.
Apr 25, 2006 - 2:21 pm 17. Ron:“David T. shows how the execution rate in the United States, on a per capita basis, is a statistically insignificant one per cent,”
Got to be careful with those figures. There is about 295 million in the United States not counting the illegals which could bring it up considerably and 1% is 2,950,000 executions per year. How about something like .001 and that even sounds high.
Just Googled the amount executed in all of the United States last year [2005] and it was 60. So, even .001 is way to high by over 2000.
China would probably get the prize because they have made it a business in harvesting body parts. All prisoners are now given medical exams just in case a lucrative offer comes in. Communists are a detestable bunch of thugs.
Apr 25, 2006 - 3:56 pm 18. Captain Hate:“Western Democratic Countries that still have the Death Penalty:
The Caribbean Islands”
Where did you get this fact (I omitted surrounding fact with bullshit quote marks in the rare chance that you know what the hell you’re talking about)? The nearest I could come to finding this was an entry in Wiki that defined it as a commonwealth of a number of very diverse nation states, not all of which have the death penalty. Why didn’t you single out your socialist paradise of Cuba? Old delusions die hard, eh?
Apr 25, 2006 - 4:59 pm 19. Luther McLeod:Cap’n Hate. Har.
Apr 25, 2006 - 7:45 pm 20. Pixy Misa:That “1%” is: If you were to adjust the figures by population, the US would account for 1% of world-wide executions.
Apr 25, 2006 - 10:08 pm 21. Former CNN Watcher:Just look at Amnesty’s report from last year on the global state of human rights.
The USA got more pages devoted to its horrible human rights abuses than any other country: more than China or Sudan, and more than twice the space of Pakistan, North Korea, the Palestinian Authority, Cuba, or Venezuela.
The anti-American fixation of these tranzies is glaringly obvious.
Details here:
Apr 26, 2006 - 3:17 am 22. Bostonian:http://noonshadow.blogspot.com/2005/05/amnesty-points-out-top-human-rights.html
Let’s take a look at these numbers. If China, SA, Iran, and the US are responsible for 94% of 2148 executions, that is .94 * 2148 = 2019 people.
Let’s subtract the US’s 60 and we get 1959 executions by China, SA, and Iran. That makes up 91% of the world’s executions in 2005.
Roger is right. It’s the 3% of executions, performed by a country with solid rule of law, laws written by representives of the citizens, that Amnesty is highlighting. They couldn’t care less about the 91% of executions, done in countries where dictators can invent the law and put a man to death on the spot.
Amnesty thinks that it’s only the execution that matters, not the process that precedes it. Idiots.
Apr 26, 2006 - 4:52 am 23. Steven Mitchell:The real travesty is that Amnesty has a role to play. That they are so unserious in playing it leaves it unplayed. Furthermore, their behavior makes their stated objectives less likely to happen.
Apr 26, 2006 - 9:30 am 24. waterdragon52:I presume that the 1% rate in the US that Roger cites is 1% of convicted felons and not 1% of the country’s population. 1% of convicted felons is still a large number. But a more important point about capital punishment in the US may be found in the demographics of who is more likely to receive the death penalty on the basis of gender or race. When one of my law teachers (Canadian born, but lived in the US from childhood to university, then came back to Canada) offered that perhaps it would be OK to bring back capital punishment in Canada because systemic racism wasn’t as great a problem north of the 49th parallel, I debunked his argument vis a vis our aboriginal people and access to good legal representation. There was also a case at the time, of an accountant almost being convicted of the murder of his wife, who died by drowning and not by way of a bullet to the head. On investigation, it was discovered that practices at the forensics facility were so bad, they mixed up a lot of information. Had the accused been a less sophisticated and wealthy person, he would have been convicted and potentially executed.
Keeping slime like Paul Bernardo alive seems a terrible waste of taxpayers’ dollars, but until the legal system can be made so fool-proof as to never see a wrongful conviction, better not to reinstitute capital punishment.
Apr 27, 2006 - 9:56 am 25. Stephen M. St. Onge:Remarkable how poor so many of you are at long division.
According to Amnesty International’s figures, there were 2148 to something like 8350 executions last year, a range of uncertainty of approximately four. 60 were executed in the U.S., so that means that 1 to 3% of worldwide executions took place here. So 99 to 97% took place outside the U.S. 95 to 82% of all executions world-wide seem to take place in China.
Robert Conquest once said that any organization that is not actively right-wing will become left-wing, because the left-wingers will infiltrate it. Amnesty International became a left-wing, USAmerica-bashing organization long ago. I’m surprised anyone didn’t know that.
Apr 27, 2006 - 1:21 pm 26. Tom Grey - Liberty Dad:Amnesty has the problem of most Leftists when confronted by stark, hard choices:
war or genocide.
This was the Vietnam rot in 1974; more war or genocide, and the Peace Now folk got the Dem Party to vote against more war.
Thus, to allow genocide; 600 000 murders in Vietnam; 1.5 mil. murders in Cambodia.
Because the US left, and stop fighting “the Evil Empire” there.
The Dems didn’t want to fight in Rwanda in 1994.
Neither the Dems nor Bush seems to want to fight in Sudan, now — so the slo-mo genocide in Darfur. I really wish Bush would blame the Dems and their “Global Test” giving the responsibility to the UN; and blame the UN for not calling it genocide. As Amnesty doesn’t call it genocide — to do so would require UN action = war. Amnesty doesn’t want that. So it would rather have genocide. Or, maybe sanctions … so that the continuing genocide could then be blamed on the US for imposing sanctions.
The world needs regime change in Sudan, even more urgently than in Iran, though Iran is a bigger near term threat to freedom.
Apr 28, 2006 - 12:31 am