At the very moment Democrats are still wrestling with delegate selection in Michigan and Florida, Barack Obama has finally done what he should have done years ago – resign from the Trinity Church. How many years ago? Well, Oprah did eight, but I think she was late. Black Liberation Theology is reactionary and racist. Anyone who wants to see progress between the races should stay as far away from it as possible. It was fake at the beginning and it is fake now. That Obama ever had anything to do with it is repellent. He was not of the generation of Stokeley Carmichael and H. Rap Brown. He should have known better. Now he is riding the whirlwind.
UPDATE: From his presser, Obama calls the statements of current Trinity pastor Moss “innocuous.” I guess that depends on what your definition of innocuous is.
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22 Comments
1. Richard Nieporent:As Abraham Lincoln said You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool Obama all of the time, no siree. After 20 years he can see right through your lies. This is the man we need in the White House.
May 31, 2008 - 5:32 pm 2. Lightnin' Hopkins:I’m sure this means any further criticism of Obama’s ties to Trinity will now also be deemed “innocuous” by his campaign, as well as his willing accomplices in the media.
Because of the nuance, you see.
May 31, 2008 - 6:27 pm 3. Lightnin' Hopkins:Little off topic, but in regards to Mount Rushmore: Barry, seriously, “spiffy”? What are you, Bob Dole? Mr. Burns? I don’t want to hear the phrase “rock star” and Obama in the same breath ever again – what a nerd. He’s Urkel with a bunch of shady friends and the standard issue blind ambition required of any charlatan.
May 31, 2008 - 6:46 pm 4. TerryeL:I used to think Obama was a smart man, but I am beginning to think he is just an empty suit. A Chicago pol.
What difference does it make if he quits the Church? Everyone knows he is just trying to save his ass.
And he says some of the most ridiculous things.
May 31, 2008 - 8:08 pm 5. Captain Hate:“He’s Urkel with a bunch of shady friends and the standard issue blind ambition required of any charlatan.”
Lightnin’ FTW.
Barry’s dropping like a rock (and does anybody else enjoy the irony that Father Eminem was the final straw in this Trinity Church of the Blessed Malaise snafu?) because consigliere Ickes of the Clinton Crime Syndicate has announced the drawing of the long knives heading to Denver. I’m running out of popcorn dammit!!!!
May 31, 2008 - 9:08 pm 6. starttolive:I have heard many of Rev. Wright’s sermons. Not until this election did I hear the horrible things he has said. The sermons that have been shown lately are not typical sermons from Rev. Wright. For some reason people think Obama sat in a church and heard racist statements every Sunday! I watched a sermon by Rev. Hagee 2 weeks ago and he said the reason for the Social Security shortage is because of the number of abortions that have been performed in this country! I’m sure Rev. Hagee doesn’t speak this way every Sunday.
I am a Christian and I believe that we are all sinners that need constant prayer and guidance. Let us not forget that when Rev. Wright was speaking intelligently and without anger he saved a soul. Now because of Rev. Wright’s anger with this country that has mistreated many minority Americans, he must leave his church. Every person that has pushed for his saved soul to leave the church that has connected him with God, I will pray for your soul. Maybe God is still working with Rev. Wright as He is with me. Also, remember that Moses was a murderer and look at his accomplishments. I pray Obama doesn’t let evil win and stay without spiritual guidance. Many pastors of today allow greed and ambition to distort their views. Obama has made a very difficult decision and he is in my prayers.
May 31, 2008 - 10:23 pm 7. Roger:Thanks for sharing, starttolive, but I am an agnostic and your words make no sense at all to me. We live in a giant universe by, of some recent count by Australian astronomers, some 60 trillion stars. If you think that in an a universe of that size that God is a real estate agent on the Jordan River and Christ died for your sins, go ahead. Just don’t expect me to believe your mumbo-jumbo. What I do know is Reverend Wright and his ilk divide humanity racially. That’s creepy. Barack Obama bought into that bad stuff for twenty years. That’s creepy too. He’s a smart guy and he should have known better. I like to keep it simple.
May 31, 2008 - 10:37 pm 8. Gary Rosen:I hate to nit … well to be honest, I don’t :^). Roger, shouldn’t it be “reap[ing] the whirlwind”?
May 31, 2008 - 11:27 pm 9. Rhod:Startolive:
Whatever one thinks of the logic in Hagee’s abortion remark, I think it’s perverse that you find the logic more objectionable than either abortion OR Black Liberation Theology – particularly when you call yourself “start to live” – something denied the fetus in Hagee’s code.
I’m a lapsed Christian, mainly because YOUR modern Christianity, like modern liberalism, is unable to clarify right and wrong. Love and acceptance of moral derangement in humans isn’t Christian, it’s not even ambivalence, it’s a rejection of the discriminating capacity given to us by God or Nature.
Politics and power were offered as a temptation to your God in the wildnerness. He rejected them, probably, because he saw that it would do to Him what it’s done to you.
Jun 1, 2008 - 3:56 am 10. Hermie:Obama joined Trinity to get his street cred. He wanted to rub elbows with the power brokers in the black community and Trinity was the key to find those willing to back an ambitious ‘community activist’ (politician-in-training).
He didn’t care about the content of those 20 years worth of sermons as long as his fellow parishoners would continue to back him in elections. He kept defending Wright and Trinity until Wright called Obama just another politician. Then the man who he considered ‘like an uncle’ was abandoned. Next, Trinity’s pastor, whom Obama enthusiastically praised and supported, brought ‘Father Mike’ to the church and suddenly after just one ’sermon’, Trinity became just another ‘distraction’ from the Obama campaign.
This is a pattern in Obama’s life: When faced with an unpleasant truth, he: 1) Blames a staffer 2) Calls it a ‘distraction’ 3) Blames some outside force (racist, gun-totting, church-clingers) or 4) Votes ‘Present’
Jun 1, 2008 - 6:04 am 11. patrick neid:In other related campaign news, David Duke the leading Repub nominee has severed his ties to the KKK, the White separatist group.
Both CNN and MSNBC lauded his move and said his prior affiliation with the KKK should/did not have a negative impact on his views or his supporters. Rumors that Robert Byrd is said to secretly support him are just that, rumors.
Jun 1, 2008 - 7:21 am 12. susan08:“…Barack Obama has finally done what he should have done years ago – resign from the Trinity Church. How many years ago? Well, Oprah did eight, but I think she was late. Black Liberation Theology is reactionary and racist. Anyone who wants to see progress between the races should stay as far away from it as possible. It was fake at the beginning and it is fake now. That Obama ever had anything to do with it is repellent. He was not of the generation of Stokeley Carmichael and H. Rap Brown. He should have known better. Now he is riding the whirlwind…”
Jun 1, 2008 - 11:03 am 13. susan08:THANK YOU – This is exactly the point.We(of many colors)who worked for the Civil Rights movement did not do so to support a candidate who spent 20 years in a racist church.Is Obama so smug that he shrugs off our concern – implying we are the racists to recoil? Isn’t it just a worrisome that Michele’s family has members who are/were tightly connected to the Daley machine in Chicago?
When Barack went looking to improve his ‘creds’ with South side, he clearly made very bad choices. This is not the guy to run the country and given that McCain will have Rev Wright’s sermon’s in every ad, its unlikely he’ll get that chance.
What is truly ironic is the the latest hate-nut is a white priest… So Trinity now proves it give the stage to any and all lunatics who can construct a rabid sentence.
Jun 1, 2008 - 11:10 am 14. maxiee:All it took to capsize the Clinton campaign was one stupid ‘Jesse Jackson’ remark to a guilty white country.
Barry spent 20 YEARS listening, singing, laughing at hate speech..
As someone unqualified to lead but who’s dog and pony show has convince the nervous, and just because John has the tapes… why quit your ’spiritual leader’ now?
Obama’s political skirt is showing … he claims to want to stop or change politics as usual. This was the ultimate political move and motivation.
He thinks by quitting the church “now” will have people believe he doesn’t agree with the Trinity Church beliefs.
If he didn’t agree with the church’s philosophy and rhetoric – he would have left there a long time ago – say 20 years ago or so. Is he not very bright or does he think American’s aren’t?
Either way, he certainly isn’t someone I would choose to run this country.
Innocuous my eye … he’s one to preach a good bit but doesn’t seem to practice anything he says or preaches about. Harmless/inoffensive – hardly. The sermon at that church was meant to ridicule and demean an outstanding citizen and candidate for president. SHAME ON TRINITY CHURCH and all the parishioners who stayed in their pews instead up getting up and walking out.
OBAMA and Rev Wright as VP – that may be the ticket he’s aiming for.
Jun 1, 2008 - 11:11 am 15. christine:You all amaze me! How can a so called “LEADER” just up and quit the church he has been faithful to for 20+ years because of an embarrassing “MOMENT”? What happens to us (AMERICANS) when we embarrass Barack Obama? Will he quit us the USA? He claims to be a person that can handle pressure at all levels.. All I see is a person that quits and runs as soon as the going gets TOUGH!! Is that who we want for a President????!!! Is that the type of person we want representing us?? Where is working through the issue? Where is sitting with people that don’t share our views to come to a compromise? All I see is a PERSON that runs as soon as the going gets tough??? Am I the only person in the United States Of America that sees this??? Is this what “CHANGE” means? Is this what we are in for if he becomes the next President?? If so GOD HELP US ALL!!
Jun 1, 2008 - 3:41 pm 16. Scribe1906:Here’s why Black Theology is neither reactionary nor racist…my wife and I are both African-Americans; we both have multiple degrees, she was trained at an Ivy League institution, I have a doctorate from one of the top 5 business schools in the country.
But this is our world…she has repeatedly arrived for interviews and it became clear that everyone thought she was white. Because after all, her name is not ethnic sounding and she graduated from an Ivy..then and only then did she no longer fit the job requirements, or they need to expand the search. Once, an executive came running down because she was so excited to meet my wife, only to see her and have her jaw drop…she was no longer excited. This isn’t a rare incident — this happens more than it doesn’t.
I have the highest teaching rankings in my department, have received multiple teaching awards. Yet, I continually have students every semester who will make a “black” comment that none of my white colleagues have to deal with.
I can go on and on but my point is that this country is already divided. While some progress has been made, there is still much that needs to be done. Liberation Theology, which actually was developed by Latin American theologians is designed to show that God cares about those whom society could care less about. It doesn’t profess superiority of the disadvantaged — which racism does. However, it does proclaim the humanity of the disadvantaged. Racism argues that one group is inferior solely because they have more or less melanin. I have heard nothing from Pfleger or Wright or have read nothing from any of the major liberation theologians that makes those claims. Their language may be racial — it discusses issues related to race, but racist it is not.
Jun 1, 2008 - 8:27 pm 17. Scribe1906:Oh I forgot…and I’m sorry, but could all these other experts on Black Liberation Theology, please provide me with references to what they’ve actually read from Black Liberation theologians…instead of 2 minute sound bytes.
Jun 1, 2008 - 8:43 pm 18. Rhod:No, no, Scribe. You mentioned the Latin American version of liberation theology, which made its way here in the ’60’s. Then you ask US to define Black Liberation Theology. Clever, but no go. With all your credentials, you should be able to provide some info on Black Liberation Theology. Why not now?
Jun 2, 2008 - 5:05 am 19. Scribe1906:Sure Rhod,
I’d be more than happy to…Howard Thurman’s Jesus and the Disinherited is a classic, James Cone, who is considered the pioneering African American thinker in this area, has a two-volume set on Black Theology. Of equal insight are the writings of his brother Cecil Cone. I would argue that much of the writings and sermons of Martin Luther King, Jr. are influenced by liberationist thought, especially from 1965 until his death when he repeatedly railed against the Vietnam War and described America as the largest purveyor of violence in the world.
My point is that I’m not the one casting disparaging attacks to Black liberation theology. The individuals who do more times than not know nothing about it other than what they have seen on CNN, FoxNews or YouTube.
I don’t claim to be an expert in most fields. But at the same time, I try to avoid making bold proclamations about things about which I have limited knowledge.
Jun 2, 2008 - 8:40 am 20. Rhod:Thank you, Scribe.
But that much can be found on Wickipedia, a not completely reliable source on most subjects, but I’m familiar with Cone, and BLT’s theological framework. I also came of age in the early ’60’s, and having once considered myself part of The New Left, liberation theology in general is no mystery either.
Perhaps the question is, do you agree with BLT? The communitarian possibilities are enormous, but so are the separatist possiblities, and maybe even a kind of Christian Non-conformism. Whether or not you see racism in it, there certainly is racialism. It revolves upon matters of race.
Jesus had nothing to say about race and little to say about politics, but one can deduce enough from his ministry to get an idea of what he thought about materialism, self-assertion, or earthly power and its conceits. The denial and suppression of The Self is, in fact, essential in Christianity, and BLT exalts the self through racial identity and grievance. Maybe it’s possible to accept BLT and work through these theological problems. I don’t know.
As for this blog, the commenters here are extraordinarily informed, and not given to absolutism or orthodox conservatism. No one here would accept, as normal, the treatment you’ve described, but most of them probably wouldn’t see BLT as the solution.
In any case, thanks for the response, and I wish you the best.
Jun 2, 2008 - 9:32 am 21. Scribe1906:Rhod,
I find BLT to be a perfectly reasonable if not completely perfect theological framework. One of my favorite sports commentators often says that “reasonable minds can disagree” and I think that this will be the case here.
My reading of scripture says that Jesus has much to say about politics and race, albeit not in the way we narrowly define those categories now. Jesus launches his ministry in Luke’s gospel by citing Isaiah 61, when he proclaims that in himself that prophet’s words have been fulfilled. Isaiah wrote,”The Spirit of the Lord is on me, because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to release the oppressed to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.” Jesus then proceeds to do just those very things. If this isn’t a socio-political mission statement, I am not sure what is. (John Howard Yoder and Obery M. Hendricks have each written books entitled “The Politics of Jesus” that flesh this idea out in different but compelling ways.)
When seeking to teach about love of God and love of neighbor, Jesus uses a Samaritan as the one who embodies true love. This would have been an extremely “racially” charged analogy considering the relationship between Jews and Samaritans and I believe that this was exactly the point.
Where I believe that BLT falters is in its desire to reduce all of the gospel to just being a political manifesto. That much, I reject wholeheartedly. The Bible is not the Declaration of Independence. However, to apply the hermeneutic that the Bible is a collection of narratives written by a people in political bondage and that God has a preferential concern for the poor and destitute — which is a mainstay of Cone, Thurman, King and others – yes, I agree with that reading.
I accept that you and others would reject the treatment that we deal with daily and I don’t want to assume your race but for the same reasons I turn a sympathetic ear to feminist theologians, I give a sympathetic reading to Black Liberation theologians.
Thank you for your questions and for prodding me to clarify my position, I hope that went beyond Wikipedia
)
Have a wonderful one.
Jun 2, 2008 - 11:02 am 22. Rhod:Perhaps we disagree on first principles, Scribe. Liberation is political, political is the administrative state, and the state is coercive power. I start from here – although I dislike quotes and links, it means something to me:
“What is Divine in Man is elusive and impalpable, and he is easily tempted to embody it in a collective – from a church, a country, a social system, a leader – so that he may realize it with less effort and serve it with more profit…Yet the attempt to externalize the Kingdom of Heaven in a temporal shape must end in disaster. It cannot be created by Charters or Constitutions, nor established by arms. Those who set out for it alone will reach it together and those who seek it in company will perish by themselves” – Hugh Kingsmill
Thanks to Roger for the space.
Jun 2, 2008 - 12:27 pm