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	<title>Comments on: Obama, Iran and the ongoing saga of the liberal reactionary</title>
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	<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/</link>
	<description>Just another Pajamasmedia.com weblog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 27 Nov 2009 01:15:25 -0800</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: AST</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131249</link>
		<dc:creator>AST</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 03:05:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131249</guid>
		<description>&quot;making the point that any strong American comment on the Iranian election would only play into the hands of the mullahs, allowing them to blame the crisis on the Great Satan.&quot; 

All of which supports doing more than merely expressing troubled feelings.  If they&#039;re going to crack down on these people anyway, why not express our discomfort by putting a ban on any country or company doing business with Iran from doing business here.  Same deal as we gave South Africa.  Or are Iranian human rights less important to us than African ones?  

It&#039;s time to get serious about all this addicted to oil nonsense.  We might need oil at this time, but we don&#039;t really need Persian Gulf oil.  We should be developing our own energy resources as a national security issue. We have been whipped around by these creeps long enough. Why continue skiing behind their boat, when we&#039;ve got our own over at the dock? 

I&#039;m not necessarily hoping for a more democratic regime, so much as pressuring them where it hurts to give up this nuclear dream of theirs.  I&#039;d be perfectly happy with a sane regime that cares about the nation&#039;s economy. The Shah was hardly George Washington, but his sins on the human rights front weren&#039;t anywhere in the league of the Mullahs&#039;.

&quot;Let’s also remember that, as in most of the Middle East, public opinion is more anti-American and anti-Israeli than elite opinion.&quot; 
Oh, no!  It&#039;s the feared Arab Street all over again!  Why worry about it?  It&#039;s never going to favor us, because these people don&#039;t get any accurate, fair information about us.  All they know comes through their mosques and state-run media.  That&#039;s why all this trying to reach them through diplomacy is just a feel-good waste of time.  Bush knew that.  After all he had first-hand experience with our own media.  Obama seems to think that Iranian reporters will be as charmed by him as our own are.  Good luck with that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;making the point that any strong American comment on the Iranian election would only play into the hands of the mullahs, allowing them to blame the crisis on the Great Satan.&#8221; </p>
<p>All of which supports doing more than merely expressing troubled feelings.  If they&#8217;re going to crack down on these people anyway, why not express our discomfort by putting a ban on any country or company doing business with Iran from doing business here.  Same deal as we gave South Africa.  Or are Iranian human rights less important to us than African ones?  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s time to get serious about all this addicted to oil nonsense.  We might need oil at this time, but we don&#8217;t really need Persian Gulf oil.  We should be developing our own energy resources as a national security issue. We have been whipped around by these creeps long enough. Why continue skiing behind their boat, when we&#8217;ve got our own over at the dock? </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not necessarily hoping for a more democratic regime, so much as pressuring them where it hurts to give up this nuclear dream of theirs.  I&#8217;d be perfectly happy with a sane regime that cares about the nation&#8217;s economy. The Shah was hardly George Washington, but his sins on the human rights front weren&#8217;t anywhere in the league of the Mullahs&#8217;.</p>
<p>&#8220;Let’s also remember that, as in most of the Middle East, public opinion is more anti-American and anti-Israeli than elite opinion.&#8221;<br />
Oh, no!  It&#8217;s the feared Arab Street all over again!  Why worry about it?  It&#8217;s never going to favor us, because these people don&#8217;t get any accurate, fair information about us.  All they know comes through their mosques and state-run media.  That&#8217;s why all this trying to reach them through diplomacy is just a feel-good waste of time.  Bush knew that.  After all he had first-hand experience with our own media.  Obama seems to think that Iranian reporters will be as charmed by him as our own are.  Good luck with that.</p>
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		<title>By: Glenn A Knight</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131214</link>
		<dc:creator>Glenn A Knight</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Jun 2009 00:14:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131214</guid>
		<description>There are two good reasons for the President of the United States not to jump into the Iranian melee. There are lots of other reasons, some formal, some shaky, but there are two good ones.

First, most Iranians are not big fans of the United States. Even those who are not enamored of the present regime have been raised to believe that the United States, along with Britain, has played the villain more than once in Iranian affairs. It is one thing to note that some Iranians share some of our values. It is another to cause the broad mass of Iranians to identify the students and other protestors with the United States. There is no way that most Iranians would see that as us merely supporting a movement we like. They would have to see us as Khamanei wants to portray us - as puppetmasters of these brave young people.

Second, working out an arrangement which keeps Iran&#039;s nuclear program from becoming a nuclear weapons program is more important that who the political leader of Iran might be. If Mousavi wins, we&#039;ll have to deal with him (and he ain&#039;t no George Washington). If Ahmadinejad wins, we&#039;ll have to deal with him. In no case should we make it easy for these guys to refuse to talk with us.

Let&#039;s also remember that, as in most of the Middle East, public opinion is more anti-American and anti-Israeli than elite opinion. Iran might be an exception, but I&#039;d be somewhat cautious about accepting the idea that a more &quot;democratic&quot; government would necessarily better for us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are two good reasons for the President of the United States not to jump into the Iranian melee. There are lots of other reasons, some formal, some shaky, but there are two good ones.</p>
<p>First, most Iranians are not big fans of the United States. Even those who are not enamored of the present regime have been raised to believe that the United States, along with Britain, has played the villain more than once in Iranian affairs. It is one thing to note that some Iranians share some of our values. It is another to cause the broad mass of Iranians to identify the students and other protestors with the United States. There is no way that most Iranians would see that as us merely supporting a movement we like. They would have to see us as Khamanei wants to portray us &#8211; as puppetmasters of these brave young people.</p>
<p>Second, working out an arrangement which keeps Iran&#8217;s nuclear program from becoming a nuclear weapons program is more important that who the political leader of Iran might be. If Mousavi wins, we&#8217;ll have to deal with him (and he ain&#8217;t no George Washington). If Ahmadinejad wins, we&#8217;ll have to deal with him. In no case should we make it easy for these guys to refuse to talk with us.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s also remember that, as in most of the Middle East, public opinion is more anti-American and anti-Israeli than elite opinion. Iran might be an exception, but I&#8217;d be somewhat cautious about accepting the idea that a more &#8220;democratic&#8221; government would necessarily better for us.</p>
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		<title>By: Godzilla</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131173</link>
		<dc:creator>Godzilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 19:01:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131173</guid>
		<description>What a difference a &gt; makes. Why isn&#039;t there a preview option?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What a difference a &gt; makes. Why isn&#8217;t there a preview option?</p>
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		<title>By: Godzilla</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131172</link>
		<dc:creator>Godzilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 19:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131172</guid>
		<description>Let me try that link again:

Hmm, it seems that &lt;a href=&quot;//corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YWQ4ODQ2Y2QwYmE1ZjdkOWFhMjQ0NjgwMTQ2NzU3YzQ=”&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Obama is really serious&lt;/a&gt; about not wanting to “meddle” in Iran’s affairs. Being “troubled” is the line in the sand. After that, it’s a defcon 5 ramp up to “VERY troubled”. At that point, all bets are off. Even the nuclear “EXTREMELY troubled” will be on the table.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let me try that link again:</p>
<p>Hmm, it seems that <a href="//corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YWQ4ODQ2Y2QwYmE1ZjdkOWFhMjQ0NjgwMTQ2NzU3YzQ=”" rel="nofollow">Obama is really serious</a> about not wanting to “meddle” in Iran’s affairs. Being “troubled” is the line in the sand. After that, it’s a defcon 5 ramp up to “VERY troubled”. At that point, all bets are off. Even the nuclear “EXTREMELY troubled” will be on the table.</p>
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		<title>By: Godzilla</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131171</link>
		<dc:creator>Godzilla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 18:58:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131171</guid>
		<description>Hmm, it seems that &lt;a href=&quot;http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YWQ4ODQ2Y2QwYmE1ZjdkOWFhMjQ0NjgwMTQ2NzU3YzQ=&quot;Obama is really serious&lt;/a&gt; about not wanting to &quot;meddle&quot; in Iran&#039;s affairs. Being &quot;troubled&quot; is the line in the sand. After that, it&#039;s a defcon 5 ramp up to &quot;VERY troubled&quot;. At that point, all bets are off. Even the nuclear &quot;EXTREMELY troubled&quot; will be on the table.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, it seems that &lt;a href=&#8221;http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YWQ4ODQ2Y2QwYmE1ZjdkOWFhMjQ0NjgwMTQ2NzU3YzQ=&#8221;Obama is really serious about not wanting to &#8220;meddle&#8221; in Iran&#8217;s affairs. Being &#8220;troubled&#8221; is the line in the sand. After that, it&#8217;s a defcon 5 ramp up to &#8220;VERY troubled&#8221;. At that point, all bets are off. Even the nuclear &#8220;EXTREMELY troubled&#8221; will be on the table.</p>
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		<title>By: Ted</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131138</link>
		<dc:creator>Ted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 18:37:47 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&quot;Wingnut and Moonbat&quot;

Write the screenplay, Roger.  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Wingnut and Moonbat&#8221;</p>
<p>Write the screenplay, Roger.  <img src='http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Lightnin' Hopkins</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131136</link>
		<dc:creator>Lightnin' Hopkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Zing! Turned it right around on me. Pure genius.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Zing! Turned it right around on me. Pure genius.</p>
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		<title>By: Ted</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131135</link>
		<dc:creator>Ted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:23:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131135</guid>
		<description>Wingnut-iest comment thread ever!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wingnut-iest comment thread ever!</p>
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		<title>By: Lightnin' Hopkins</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131132</link>
		<dc:creator>Lightnin' Hopkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 14:25:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/?p=5578#comment-131132</guid>
		<description>Moonbat-iest comment thread ever!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Moonbat-iest comment thread ever!</p>
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		<title>By: sheesh</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/rogerlsimon/2009/06/16/obama-iran-and-the-ongoing-saga-of-the-liberal-reactionary/#comment-131129</link>
		<dc:creator>sheesh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 13:28:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Dear,  HonestJon,

Two things from your simmering brainpan: (This is almost too easy.)

Thing #1 . . . &quot;(I&#039;m a) verbal defender of liberty and freedom. Freedom for ALL people. Liberty for everyone. A defender of your freedom to make horrendously inaccurate statements which have no basis in reality or reason, science or fact.&quot;

Thing #2 . . . &quot;I would also humbly request that (Sheesh, et al) be permanently banned from PJM . . . I hope you read this and take action, Mr. Simon!&quot;

I think you need a new screen name. Let me know if you get stuck . . . I have some ideas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear,  HonestJon,</p>
<p>Two things from your simmering brainpan: (This is almost too easy.)</p>
<p>Thing #1 . . . &#8220;(I&#8217;m a) verbal defender of liberty and freedom. Freedom for ALL people. Liberty for everyone. A defender of your freedom to make horrendously inaccurate statements which have no basis in reality or reason, science or fact.&#8221;</p>
<p>Thing #2 . . . &#8220;I would also humbly request that (Sheesh, et al) be permanently banned from PJM . . . I hope you read this and take action, Mr. Simon!&#8221;</p>
<p>I think you need a new screen name. Let me know if you get stuck . . . I have some ideas.</p>
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