88 Comments

1. Pajamas Media » Congress: Government Health Care for Thee, But Not for Me:

[...] Read the entire story here. [...]

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:20 pm 2. Pajamas Media » Congress: Government Health Care for Thee, But Not for Me:

[...] Read the entire story here. [...]

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:20 pm 3. Zhombre:

“What’s astonishing about the Obama crew, however, is that they arrived on the wings of untold optimism supported by almost the entire media and still they have plummeted to near nothing in less than a year.”

Welcome to the Bipolar Nation.

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:26 pm 4. cfbleachers:

Washington D.C.

You swim in a filthy swamp, you get malaria. No surprise there.

Rules don’t apply to the lords of the manor…only the serfs?
No surprise there.

Waxman finds naked hypocrisy not germane? No surprise there.

Roger Simon spends REGULAR time in that fever swamp???? What the…???

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:36 pm 5. exceller:

What I’d like to know about this bill is do they give any preferential treatment to unions and government workers? Are they going to have to play by the exact same rules?

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:51 pm 6. Eric:

All members of Congress that vote for this unconstitutional monstrosity should be publicly hanged. This is nothing less than the indentured servitude of the American people. This will tear this nation in half as there are fare more people passionately opposed to this grotesque plan than there are in support of it.

If the grasping classes already feeding off the blood, sweat, and tears of American taxpayers were excluded form polls I suspect opposition to Obamacare would be far higher than what current polls reflect. And even those show a majority are opposed.

Any Democrat from a Red state that supports this bill against the wishes of their constituents should be investigated as soon as they lose their seats next Nov. There is simply NO reason for supporting this takeover except the expectation of a payoff, either in cash or by a plum position with a generous salary.

I’ve already written the Arkansas Democrat Gazette and the WSJ demanding Senator Blanche Lincoln be investigated. I’ve also written to two of the GOP candidates vying for her seat next year.

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:52 pm 7. ConservativeWanderer:

Roger:

How can you possibly expect the self-anointed elites to volunteer to use the same medical services the rest of us peons in flyover country use?

The elites must use elite services, let everyone else eat cake.

The catch is, of course, that in other nations the elite can get their top-notch medical care by coming here. However, once they destroy this nation’s medical system, where are they gonna go for good health care? Great Britain? Cuba?

They’re hoisting themselves by their own petard, and the truly pitiful part is that they don’t even realize it.

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:55 pm 8. Banned by Huffpo:

We must trust our leaders. They know what is best for us.

I will work harder.

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:57 pm 9. Sebastian Shaw:

The elites want to control the masses & ObamaCare is the Trojan Horse to do so; they know it. I expect more than a simple unprising if this thing passes & becomes law. Many more legislatures will become former politicians by 2010. And the uprising will not end until the monstrosity is repealed. Nancy Pelosi is playing Pandora & ObamaCare is Pandora’s Box. The Democrats also want a permanent majority & this is a means to that end. Power corrupts & absolute power corrupts absolutely.

The blow back is coming…

Nov 20, 2009 - 5:59 pm 10. Miked:

What is coming Sebastian, is not blow back. What is coming is revolution. The Democrats can decide whether it is benign or violent, but it is coming. The opposition is more than just angry at the treasonous self-serving, and they may or they may not wait until 2010.

Nov 20, 2009 - 6:38 pm 11. Sallie:

It would nice to hear Palin weigh in on this.
She seems to have a larger more interested audience than anyone in america.

Nov 20, 2009 - 6:47 pm 12. 438miler:

OK, repeat after me:

WAR IS PEACE, FREEDOM IS SLAVERY, IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH.

Nov 20, 2009 - 6:51 pm 13. Praetorian:

Don’t anyone buy into the conservative meme being trotted around lately that has the 2010 midterms a referendum on the passage of health care reform. For those who are old enough (well you actually don’t have to be that old) the 1994 elections were a referendum on the Democratic party largely by Democrats themselves. The Democrats failed at passing health care reform and so their most energized base voters stayed home. The GOP filled the vacuum and that led to sweep and capture of both chambers. They’re trying to scare Democrats with the same mantra again. Vote for health care reform and lose your seat, they’re told. The problem with this assumption is that the people who push it don’t really believe it. The fact is the GOP, birthers, and the teabagger crowd will not vote for Democrats under any circumstances, so appeasing them is pointless. Obama has even said this – “that they’re gonna come after you no matter what.” What they really want is a repeat of 1994 and a way for Democrats to help them meet that goal is by not passing health care. In any case, it would seem to make more sense to go down with an accomplishment that benefits hard working American families than nothing at all. However, I don’t think it will turn out that way at all. I think the exact opposite will happen.
When health care reform is passed many in the conservative movement will be very disillusioned with their party leaders in failing to stop the bills passage. They will be the ones staying home in 2010. The GOP knows quite well once passed health care reform will permanently shift the center of gravity in American politics. It will not mean the death of the GOP. Far from it. It will, however, reduce and isolate even further the most conservative elements in the party. They will no longer have a seat at the table. They’ll be like little children peeking through the crack in the door as mommy and daddy have sex.
Already, we’re hearing the 2010 and 2012 campaigns will be largely about repealing health care. That won’t ever happen and the Boehner’s and Cantor’s in the GOP know it. They (the GOP) said they would do it with Social Security (1930s) and Medicare (1965) and it didn’t happen, so it is doubtful it will happen with this as even more people will be damaged losing the health care that they just got. I’m guessing running on a platform of taking away someone’s health care for “their own good” won’t go over well. But please try. Nevertheless they will talk about repealing health care a whole bunch, just like they’ve been talking about repealing abortion for the last 30 or so years. The notion of repealing health care reform is just another new carrot to dangle in front of the useful idiots we see at teabagger rallies. They’ll eat it right up like a devoted old hound. So, they may get some mileage out of it with certain demographics but that’s about it. Interestingly, many of those that get hoodwinked by the GOP with the repeal meme are likely to be benefiting from one or more of those, evil, evil, socialist programs themselves. In this country at age 65, the age at which we have decided it is appropriate for the American government to give a flying crap about the health of its citizens, and at which age we have decided it is appropriate for the government to become involved in providing very evil, very socialist health insurance. What about 63 or 64? That’s Socialism! What about 65? Oh, that’s fine then. You see the GOP could care less if you drop dead. In fact if you get sick they’d like you die as quickly as possible so that you don’t take any caviar out of the mouth of private health insurance shareholders. We wouldn’t want them to miss out on another spa vacation. Your sick child is merely a sacrifice at the altar of their bottom line. Bottom line: Democrats pass health care reform and we WON’T be staying home like we did in 1994. This makes the GOP very, very, scared.

Nov 20, 2009 - 7:04 pm 14. Palmer Hinsdale:

Roger–Your analysis is very reassuring to me. Far from “scary” as you conclude.

Rather, President Obama has demonstrated with healthcare, the stimulus, cap and trade, the unattractive dismisal of the White House counsel, that he is little more than a dishonest bait and switch artist whose preferred method of motivation is to create a stampede. A major clue occurred when his minions, President Carter and Maureen Dowd, called health care opponents rascists, and Speaker Pelosi called us Nazis. Recently we learn from Jesse Jackson that one cannot truly be black unless one supports President Obama’s health care plan.

Now that we are seeing the implosion with concrete evidence from VA and NJ and the collapse of the dollar and the new peaks in the price of gold, it is becoming apparent that the middle classes including Jacksonian Democrats and the world markets will not tolerate his brand of riding rough shod over the wishes of the American people and the common sense requirement for sound money.

All of these factors suggest President Obama will not be re-elected. I would even say he will not be renominated. I think President Obama will make an LBJ speech.

Roger, I really like your work, so I hope you will not misunderstand my contrary interpretation of your report.

Palmer Hinsdale

Nov 20, 2009 - 7:18 pm 15. Roger L Simon:

So I take it, Praetorian, unlike the Dean of Harvard Med, you like the proposed legislation? Or did I misread your? (I prefer short comments. Sorry.)

Nov 20, 2009 - 7:25 pm 16. ricpic:

Everyone is talking about not taking it anymore but you know what? too many have too much to lose to rise in violence, and that’s all that’s left, or haven’t you noticed that the response of the thugocracy to the tea parties and 9/12 and even New Jersey and Virginia has been a big frig you, we’re gonna do what we’re gonna do and you can’t stop it. No. I see slavery ahead.

Nov 20, 2009 - 7:48 pm 17. Now and Then:

11. Sallie:
“It would nice to hear Palin weigh in on this.”

Allow me to channel her:

“Insomuch as it makes a difference to you and me and the other everyday Janes and Joes of this great country of ours, I have to say it sounds like the same old same old and that’s not what the American people want, at least not the American people I know who are good, solid, hardworking Joes and Janes and know just what it takes to put food on your table day in and day out and then day in again and before you know it day out rolls around again and where are you by gosh, you’re right back hard at it, building the American dream one step at a time, and I think Congress should do the same and honor their hard work and effort and the expectations of those great Americans, just like we have up in Alaska, who voted them into office. They are honor bound to serve their constituents and so . . . oops . . . did I say that last part out loud?”

Nov 20, 2009 - 7:51 pm 18. Eric:

Praetorian, you’re right. We really, secretly do want to be conscripted into the socialists new world order where we toil for the benefit others. Where our lives are dictated from birth to death, dusk to dawn by a bunch of elitist Leftists in DC.

Sir, you are gravely mistaken and if you are unable to sense the deep anger of the American people, those not sucking at the government teat, then I suggest you get out of your cloistered urban enclave.

The advantage we have over the Left is that we are armed, angry, and have a lot of military veterans with exceptional martial skills.

Nov 20, 2009 - 8:48 pm 19. Dave Surls:

“The fact is the GOP, birthers, and the teabagger crowd will not vote for Democrats under any circumstances…”

I don’t know about those guys, but it sure applies to me. If you think I would ever trust the Slaver-crats with political power, given the colorful history of their party, and their political philosophy…you be crazy.

Nov 20, 2009 - 9:30 pm 20. CK:

I am a Canadian. Our single payer works fine. Yes, there is room for improvement; that is: to improve our single payer, not expand private for profit.

Bottom line, I would trade our health care system with the current inhumane one you have.

A good example of this is my father is getting great care here. They won’t lose their home over it.

In the U.S. my parents would be wiped out financially. No, neither of my parents would qualify for insurance under your system; they both have pre-existing conditions.

How people can support a system like that is so inhumane, it’s beyond comprehension

Nov 20, 2009 - 11:15 pm 21. Alan Kellogg:

Proposed Constitutional Amendment

Equal justice under the law being am important bulwark of American justice, Congress shall enact no law making any member of Congress or Congressional employee immune to legistation.

Nov 21, 2009 - 12:35 am 22. Delia:

20. CK,

Are your Canadian elite politicians under the same care as your dear ol’ dad? It seems our noble ‘NOBEL‘, blue-blooded, high falootin’ politicians want nothing to do with the ‘care’ they intend to generously foist upon their tax-burdened constituencies. Methinks this is patently unfair and a red-flag alert if ever there was one. *ahem*

Nov 21, 2009 - 12:39 am 23. AQUA:

There should be

BI-PARTISAN PETITIONS signed in EVERY STATE,
SWEARING NOT TO RE-ELECT any SENATOR OR CONGRESSMAN

who refuses to sign a LAW that LEGALLY BINDS THEM TO ENROLLING IN, FOR THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILIES, ANY PUBLIC HEALTH CARE OPTION THEY EVER VOTE FOR —

FOR THE REST OF THEIR LIVES WHETHER THEY REMAIN IN OFFICE OR NOT. PERIOD.

Nov 21, 2009 - 1:17 am 24. Delia:

Elitists getting better treatment than the unwashed masses? I smell the stink of Commies.

Nov 21, 2009 - 1:46 am 25. Marc Malone:

#20 CK – You are confused about so much. Your parents get the care, because they were early enough in line, but many others are DYING, because of rationed care. Survival rates in this country are far higher than yours. Under the current medical system, yes, your family would go broke, but government created this problem, and now, present themselves as the solution.

An estimated 20+% of medical costs in this country are outright waste, fraud, and abuse. I don’t know about your country, but I imagine it is higher, as it is all government-run.

Another 2.2% goes to lawsuits, about twice the average of other countries. I don’t know if that number counts the cost of malpractice insurance. Knowing what portion of revenues doctors pay for it, I seriously doubt it.

Insurance abuse greatly adds to the cost of care. It is a third-party payer system. It is also tax-free, so the forfeited tax revenues must be made up for it in some way. The constant rise in prices result in reduced wages and many people being forced out of insurance, as it becomes unaffordable.

Having one’s insurance tied to one’s job exacerbates the problem of maintaining coverage. Lack of portability is a big problem. Non-employers cannot compete with the tax-free benes provided by employers. If all wages spent on healthcare were tax-free, you could join a large co-op and get better rates and a menu of plans. Portability would also cease to be a problem.

Socialized medicine in other countries add to our costs. We here in America subsidize those countries, because we pay for pharmaceutical development, then pay full-price, while others get it on the cheap. This is why we have re-importation of drugs. Even with mark-ups, we still pay less for re-imported drugs.

The AMA has a monopoly in this country. They are not interested in the cheap cures, which actually exist, by the way. We pay single-provider prices, as a result. The government created the single-ptovider monopoly, then come along and offer a single-payer solution.

Without all this crap, healthcare would cost so much less, that we would not need but catastrophic coverage. Treat the disease, not the problem.

Here are my solutions:

1) Break the monopoly. Allow competing healthcare organizations. If doctors can’t lose their licenses, they are free to provide solutions they know work, but that the AMA won’t allow.

2) Tort reform. Most of the tort lawyers are parasites. They add no value, except to keep some docs honest, but their role should be far more limited. It should not be a gigantic crapshoot. Limit damages to aactual loss, and only with gross negligence. Loser pays. (One could also “kill all the lawyers”. .45 caliber tort reform.)

3) Make health costs 100% tax-free. Better, eliminate the 16th amendment (the income tax system). Then establish a national sales tax system (the Fair Tax). It is easy to do. Simply pass a Constitutional amendment banning income taxes. Congress will then find another tax system (unless they want no money for the government). This will have the added benefit of making manufacturing far more competitive in this country.

The moment you do this, people go out and join co-ops and get great rates. Places like the Elks, Kiwanis, etc… were all set up originally for the purpose of allowing their members to get group health discount rates.

Then, the government screwed them by making Employer-based insurance benes tax-free. Who uses taxed monies to buy insurance, when you can get it tax-free via your employer? Problem comes when your employer offers it not, or has a small group of employees, and so, gets a lousy rate. Ending the income tax system means these co-ops will become huge, maybe even millions strong. Great rates.

4) Force the Pharmaceutical companies to sell to other countries at the same rate as they charge their biggest customers here. They will then pay more, and we’ll pay less. Watch how quickly their glorious socialized medicine systems go broke, once we are no longer subsidizing them.

5) Fix SS/Medicare. Decree that those now under 50 will no longer be eligible for benefits upon disability or retirement. Move the retirement age back a couple years, since people are living far longer. Prosecute all the fraudulent disability claims (like faked bi-polar). Tack on a sales tax to pay for it. This will eventually end the Ponzi scheme, while honoring the obligations. We have to stop adding people to the roles.

The tax continues until the system ends (when all the beneficiaries pass on), but since the revenue is guaranteed, we can allow the SS/Medicare system to issue debt based on the revenue stream. The money must be kept separate from the General Fund, and must no longer be allowed to be lent to the government.

This is a complete solution, and COSTS NOTHING! It is merely changing the laws. Problem solved with a Constitutional Amendment and a one-page bill. This government stuff is actually really easy, except for, for the morons in the government. Congress should be a damned part-time job done by videoconference.

Nov 21, 2009 - 3:12 am 26. tehag:

In dictatorships, divine right monarchies, and tyrannies, the elite has always held itself apart from its subjects to prove to themselves they are a class nobly apart from the commoner whom they rule. Why should our former republic be any different?

Nov 21, 2009 - 4:54 am 27. David Thomson:

“What’s astonishing about the Obama crew, however, is that they arrived on the wings of untold optimism supported by almost the entire media and still they have plummeted to near nothing in less than a year. Scary.”

There never was any rational reasons to justify this optimism. Barack Obama was obviously an intellectually shallow and poorly read man. His resume was a joke. Obama should be no more than a minor Illinois elected official. Obama is president of the United States only because of race guilt. Too many well meaning people desperately wanted to prove they were not racists. The also failed to realize that the soft science departments of Harvard are often not worthy of respect. Obama’s law degree should not have been taken that seriously.

The odds are that Obama has been a marginalized leader for over six months. No significant legislation has been signed into law since early in the year. This is why a number of Democrats are doing their utmost to get any sort of health care bill passed through both houses of Congress. Obama’s very presidency is on the line. They prefer to ignore the disastrous consequences for the nation.

Nov 21, 2009 - 5:57 am 28. DS:

#13 – I think you’re underestimating the anti-big-government movement that’s getting inspired by the current Administration and Democratic majority.

A new majority can easily undo a bill that starts collecting taxes immediately and doesn’t deliver any benefits for 3-4 years. A presidential veto will guarantee one term for 44.

Conservatives are not going to stay home in 2010 or 2012.

Nov 21, 2009 - 6:07 am 29. Julia:

From Canada’s Globe and Mail, November 20, 2009:

The cost of Canadian health care is now at $5,452.00(Ca $) per person, per year. This converts to $5,109.17 (US $).

$5,109.17 x 300 million = $1,532,751,000,000.00 PER YEAR for government health care in the US.

Nov 21, 2009 - 6:11 am 30. Fearless Leader:

@-27 David Thomson

Obama hasn’t brought anything to the table for signing because he has been too busy shucking, jiving, and bowing in far away lands.

The man acts like he is campaigning for world leader.

Americans are spoiled-
We have always had presidents that cuddled us here at home,
now we have a gone all month travailing sales rep. that has limited sales ability’s.

I guess Washington is imploding because they miss their daddy?

5. exceller:

What I’d like to know about this bill is do they give any preferential treatment to unions and government workers? Are they going to have to play by the exact same rules?

Your union Cadillac plans will be taxed at 40 percent, never mind that you gave up 3 dollars per hour for 30 years to pay for those 100 percent union Cadillac plans.

100 percent health coverage Cadillac plans will only be offered to the fearless leaders/Congressional elite.

Nov 21, 2009 - 6:48 am 31. biblio44:

“They know government-run medicine hasn’t worked in Canada and the UK.”

I guess that’s why the Canadian and British public continually demand that their governments drop their health care systems and adopt the American model.

Nov 21, 2009 - 6:59 am 32. Dinocrat » Blog Archive » Suicide pact:

[...] yet the suicide march of the Democrats in Washington continues. Roger Simon adds: “I don’t think I’ve even seen the nation’s capital in such a genuinely depressed [...]

Nov 21, 2009 - 7:32 am 33. LeighB:

I would hope the tone in Washington DC is tense and “scary”. Representatives and Senators have made it clear they are not going to listen to their constituents so they are left talking “at” each other and being bullied by Pelosi-Obama-Reid and shielded by the MSM.

I know readers of this board are tired of hearing me say the same thing over and over and perhaps I’m saying it in hopes the people in DC hear my plea…in my 33 years of voting history, and I vote in every election, I have voted for many more Democrats than Republicans. Unless the final health bill includes tort reform and portability and little else, it will be my pleasure to vote against everyone who supported government run healthcare.

Jobs and national security should be Congress’ top priorities and instead they are dithering with this job killing, tax raising, care rationing pile of paper. People in DC are wondering whether there will be any consequences for them if they vote for this. Keep wondering and I’ll keep filling out my ballot in advance….

Nov 21, 2009 - 7:44 am 34. ConservativeWanderer:

Boy, did Praetorian pick the right pseudonym or what?

The Praetor (from which Praetorian is derived) was a semi-high official in ancient Rome, and Praetorian clearly sees himself as one of the self-anointed elites, though not one of the leaders.

I guess that makes the rest of us the Roman slaves.

Nov 21, 2009 - 7:55 am 35. ldd:

Blow it out your a$$ CK!

I’m a Canadian and my girlfriend died at age 48 from breast cancer unecessarily!
WHY?
Because they waited her as ’stastically’ she was not a high risk. By the time they listened to her and did a biopsy, and started agressive treatment, it was too late.
SHE WAS ONLY 48 years old, children still at home.

I’ve had internal bleeding on and off since last March and I’m still waiting for a specialists to call.

YOU make be in a pocket area of lucky patients in Canada, but I’m sure not and YOU don’t speak for the rest of us Canadians, being ill and untreated on waiting lists.

Still waiting for a family physician as well.
Been without one since 2003.

Nov 21, 2009 - 8:03 am 36. EnemyoftheState:

I love this country. I swore an oath to defend the Constitution. I fought for this country. I’m willing to die for this country. Every day I watch further indignities perpetrated by the corrupt socialist government against the country. I listen to the conservatives and the liberals argue about what the government is doing as the country slides into the cesspool.

It’s all very fascinating. I’m an old man with no children. I have no reason to care what happens to the country, the worst they can do is to kill me. Your descendants will be slaves. But I watch and wait for the revolution, and all I see is words.

AG Holder was right. You’re a nation of cowards.

Nov 21, 2009 - 8:32 am 37. Jeff:

Very nicely written piece. This article shows that there are quite a few of our esteemed leaders who really don’t have our best interests at heart.

I’ve seen and heard hundreds of great articles about the shenanigans of our duly elected leaders. These leaders get elected by campaigning with political contributions that just happen to be a matter of public record. What I would love to see along with an article such as this are the results of interviews with the very contributors that put these folks in office.

How different would the political climate be if the Chairman of “XYZ Corporation” was suddenly being inundated with requests for interviews concerning this vote? After all he did contribute thousands of dollars to get the offending member elected. Do you think any of the other contributors would relish being called to task concerning this blatant double standard? I think not.

When law enforcement agencies go after a criminal enterprise they attack the money. I think its time that the bloggers of the world point the finger to where it really belongs, the contributors that got the Henry Waxmans elected in the first place. That would be an article I’d really love to read.

Nov 21, 2009 - 9:26 am 38. venividivici:

Everyone is talking about not taking it anymore but you know what? too many have too much to lose to rise in violence, and that’s all that’s left, or haven’t you noticed that the response of the thugocracy to the tea parties and 9/12 and even New Jersey and Virginia has been a big frig you, we’re gonna do what we’re gonna do and you can’t stop it. No. I see slavery ahead.

A big part of that “too much to lose” mentality has been driven by the stock market’s rally since March, combined with the whole “green shoots” message out of the media and government. Once those factors are exposed as false, and the evidence is mounting, especially on the “green shoots” side, the cost-benefit analysis starts to look different.

Don’t anyone buy into the conservative meme being trotted around lately that has the 2010 midterms a referendum on the passage of health care reform. For those who are old enough (well you actually don’t have to be that old) the 1994 elections were a referendum on the Democratic party largely by Democrats themselves. The Democrats failed at passing health care reform and so their most energized base voters stayed home.

That’s an empirical statement, so I presume you have some data to back it up, right? The Dems’ “most energized base voters” are to the Left of Lenin. You really think people like that are going to sit out a political campaign, when it’s the only thing that they think makes their lives worth living?

Boy, did Praetorian pick the right pseudonym or what?

The Praetor (from which Praetorian is derived) was a semi-high official in ancient Rome, and Praetorian clearly sees himself as one of the self-anointed elites, though not one of the leaders.

Americans have been lucky, historically-speaking, to be relatively immune from large-scale political violence. This may be about to change. I hope it happens while I’m still young.

Nov 21, 2009 - 10:45 am 39. Now and Then:

36. EnemyoftheState:

Wow! Throw down the gauntlet!

Well, conservatives, whaddya think? Is it time to . . . you know . . .

Nov 21, 2009 - 10:45 am 40. Barefoot Doctor:

Ever since Roger took away his mojo here, youknowho now posts by the tenfold daily on almost every other PJM blog.

Nov 21, 2009 - 11:13 am 41. ConservativeWanderer:

Venividivici @ 38:

Americans have been lucky, historically-speaking, to be relatively immune from large-scale political violence. This may be about to change. I hope it happens while I’m still young.

Thomas Jefferson was of the same opinion:

God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. … What country before ever existed a century and half without a rebellion? And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.

It’s entirely possible that such a rebellion may happen soon.

Nov 21, 2009 - 11:55 am 42. David Thomson:

“The man acts like he is campaigning for world leader.”

In back of Barack Obama’s mind—he is campaigning for world leader. Our elected leader perceives his own country as a victimizer of the poor and disenfranchised of the planet. It is his duty to slap American around and make her humble. Obama also does believe in a one world government. This is not a fantasy perpetuated by right-wing crazy people. Obama is a non-violent radical. The evidence was there during the presidential campaign, but conveniently ignored due to leftist motivation or race guilt.

Nov 21, 2009 - 12:24 pm 43. wilmo:

Among its countless terrible features, the bill includes unbelievable assistance to labor unions, including a $15 billion “reinsurance” provision to cover their unfunded medical liabilities (leaders stole this money over the years rather than putting it in reserve). Also a provision which will promote if not enforce the unionization of health care workers. The 20+ visits of SEIU’s Stern to the White House seem to have paid off big.

Nov 21, 2009 - 12:48 pm 44. CJ:

in a way, conservatives are to blame about this!!!

How many of us conservatives stayed home and did not vote for McCain or voted for an independent candidate because we didn’t like McCain?

I warned countless of my Conservative friends that this was going to happen.

Now live with the consequences of the moronic action of NOT voting for McCain.

Now we must fight this with everything we have, a fight that we could have avoided if Obama would have lost.

Nov 21, 2009 - 2:14 pm 45. Sebastian Shaw:

CJ, the Republicans are at fault because of the Democrats’ Communist leanings & the Communcrats now control the White House, House, & Senate? Your logic is screwed.

Nov 21, 2009 - 3:09 pm 46. Promoguy:

Sebastian, unfortunately CJ’s logic is correct. Ever listen to people calling up the talk circuit and telling whoever will listen that it’s time for a third party or this time I’m voting an on ballot third party. Well, this is what you get. The oh, I can’t vote for McCain cuz of the McCain / Feingold bill was all over the place. Well, for those of you out there who took that line, this is what you got. Hell, it happened in ‘92. Remember when that third party midget (no offense to midgets) got Clinton elected.

Nov 21, 2009 - 3:18 pm 47. venividivici:

41

We’ve also been lucky in having the most opportunity-driven society in world history, where a man or woman with absolutely no “connections” could make it big. The drying-up of that reality makes life much more of a zero-sum game, which changes the violence/non-violence equation immensely.

I had a relative who lived through Weimar Germany. The same people who a few years prior were pillars of society turned into bloodthirsty supporters of the most ruthless sort seemingly overnight. Human nature is stronger than any mere social norm against non-violence, although I would think something more along the lines of Pinochet-lite would suffice.

The real issue is to get a separate governance structure in place for those who prefer a Constitutional regime. Let the Left continue to f*ck up CA, MI, NY, MA, etc., but get the future liabilities associated with said f*ck-ups off of the “balance sheet” of those who retain common sense. I’m in favor of majority rule, provided there is a strong Constitutional structure to prevent it from degenerating into mob rule, which is what we’re looking at here with the 52% who voted for Obama essentially decreeing that the other 48%’s wealth is theirs for the plundering. Well, if the endgame is me ending up with nothing for all of my labor, why not engage in a little violence against the 52%? It’s actually the only rational choice.

Nov 21, 2009 - 3:25 pm 48. LM:

To all the liberals (this includes Praetorian, our comrade President and Anderson Cooper) who delight in using the term “teabaggers”, just because you find it pleasurable to have some random guy’s testicles shoved into your mouth, don’t project those fantasies onto normal Americans.

Nov 21, 2009 - 5:12 pm 49. Rich Vail:

Here’s the best concept for government health care seizure to date. I hereby propose the following as the 28th Amendment to the United States Constitution.

1. No citizen of the United States shall be elected to the House of Representatives to more than four (4) consecutive, two (2) year terms to office.

2. No citizen of the United States shall be elected to the United States Senate for more than two (2) consecutive, six (6) year terms of office.

3. No citizen of the United States shall receive any retirement benefits from serving in either the United States House of Representatives or the United States Senate.

4. Congress shall not exempt itself from any laws of the United States of America, in whole or in part.

5. Congress shall be in session for a period of not less than 90 consecutive days in the Spring, and 90 consecutive days in the Summer of each year. Each sitting of Congress may be extended by the President for a period not to exceed 30 days. The Spring session shall start on the first Monday of March. The Summer session shall begin on the first Monday in June. An additional 45 day session to begin on the 2nd Monday of November shall be called by the President if so deemed necessary, this session may not be extended unless a period of National Emergency is formally declared by the President, and past by a 2/3rds majority of both houses. {This section I think is necessary to basically force Congress to actually work…in the past decade they generally only spend 2 1/2 days per week actually working in Washington, DC. Most often only from Tues afternoon to Thurs afternoon!}

This should begin in part to eliminate, or at least reduce the professional politicians who have inhabited Washington, DC for the past 170 years. Many of those men and women have on the whole, been honest, but when you begin to have individuals holding office for decades and who have built up a “fiefdom” that isn’t really answerable to the people. Additionally, Congress has made it virtually impossible to unseat an incumbent, as they are able though corrupt practices to build up a huge election “war-chest” of funds.

Nov 21, 2009 - 5:32 pm 50. Nora:

The problem with term limits for Congress is that there will be a severe unintended consequence with staffers. The system right now is set up so that it takes years and decades to gain the institutional knowledge necessary to know how the system should and does work, to build up the connections to know where to get that knowledge. What happens with term limits is that staffers associated with the committee fill in the vacuum left — they become the ones with the institutional knowledge. Staffers now are not always well compensated, but senior permanent staffers would be the king-makers. Every lobbyist would want to get in with them, they would be the ones writing bills (yes, I know they do now, but it would get even worse) and meeting with the lobbyists. And unlike reps, they would never be voted out. They are part of the bureaucracy, and would almost be a mandarin class. How do you deal with that (I would support term limits otherwise.)

Nov 21, 2009 - 6:27 pm 51. ConservativeWanderer:

The biggest problem with that Constitutional Amendment is that the chances of it being passed are about the same as Obama admitting he’s a massive egotist and narcissist and resigning before Thanksgiving.

In other words, none or even less.

Rather than spend time fantasizing about impossible amendments, and posting virtually the same comment on multiple threads (it may even be exactly the same, but I haven’t done a word-for-word comparison), let’s look at ways that we can get the best possible results out of the system we have, hmmm?

Nov 21, 2009 - 7:26 pm 52. myth buster:

51. That’s where you’re wrong. In fact, I’m sure there are many ambitious State Legislators who would love the slots it would open up, and so will vote in favor of calling a Constitutional Convention for the expressed purpose of passing such an Amendment. We are overdue for an Article V convention to usurp Congress and pass Amendments for term limits, repeal of the Income Tax, and prohibition of abortion.

Nov 21, 2009 - 8:15 pm 53. ConservativeWanderer:

MB, if you really think that you can get something like that passed in America today, I got some oceanfront property in Nebraska for sale.

Even with the tea party anger at government as a whole, it’s a whole ‘nother ballgame to translate that into enough support for long enough to pass an amendment.

If ya don’t believe me, give constitutional scholar and lawyer Mark Levin a call and ask him… he’ll set you straight right quick.

Nov 21, 2009 - 9:14 pm 54. jerseyjen:

Marc Malone for President!!!! Great solutions for all our ills.

Nov 21, 2009 - 10:50 pm 55. SukieTawdry:

Praetorian, you bloody twit, are you spinning for the Democrats now or do you just buy into the preposterous spin they’re putting on the ‘94 election? I was there in ‘94 as was Bill Clinton and we both know why what happened happened. And it had little to nothing to do with disgruntled voters staying home because they didn’t get their universal health care despite what Bill would conveniently have you believe today.

And, CK, please spare us another specious comparison (by personal anecdote yet) between Canada with its population of 33 million fairly homogeneous souls and the US with our crazy quilt population of 300+ million. Nothing has been tried on this scale anywhere else in the world ever. The US is not Canada; we’re not the UK; we’re not Australia; we’re not Sweden; we’re not France; we’re not Switzerland; we’re not Japan; we’re not any of the places the left throws in our faces demanding to know if there, why not here.

I realize it’s all the fashion these days to portray the US as just one more among nations, neither unique nor exceptional, but we are unique and we are exceptional. And as much as people around the globe get off on disparaging us, they, in fact, count on that exceptionalism. Where the heck do you think the majority of advances in medicine and pharmaceuticals come from? (Hint: it’s not Canada, the UK, Australia, Sweden, France, Switzerland or Japan.)

Nov 22, 2009 - 12:28 am 56. rachel peepers:

The plot to bring socialized medicine to this nation is unfolding just as I said it would in a comment that
I wrote on PJM last week.

Two or was it three moderate democrats exchanged silver for ethics. On top of that, Joe Lieberman stuck a knife in our back.
If anyone ever doubted it, Harry Reid has the principles of John Conklin, and the deviousness of the Devil. Few hate this nation as the founding fathers envisioned it more than he.

As for me, well, I drew my personal line in the sand a week ago. The line was crossed yesterday.

From now on,in order to get my country back, there is virtually no mission that I won’t lead. Needless to say, as far as I’m
concerned, the need to save this great nation trumps all state and federal laws, many of which intentionally have
been broken by the administration of President Barack Obama.

The breaking started with their oath of office; an oath to uphold the constitution. And extends to the lies and misdeeds they
committed yesterday.

There is no going back. I see the Obama administration both as a group and individually to be a clear and present danger to the
security of the United States. And will take any and all actions necessary to defeat the evil that exists be it foreign or
domestic.

Incidentally, though non-violent, all of my actions henceforth will be as brutal and as devoid of compassion as I am capable.

Romeo Alpha Charlie Hilo Echo Lima, signing off.

Nov 22, 2009 - 2:17 am 57. Rich Vail:

One of the secrets on amending the Constitution, is that Congress doesn’t have to introduce it. Any of the various states can introduce Amendments…and present them to other states, they become part of the Constitution when enough states pass them.

I agree about staffers and bureaucrats are a huge part, if not most of the problem. People working in the different departments have the ability to stymy any and all reforms as they are attempted simply by doing nothing, or being passive aggressive…

I don’t really know how to fix that problem beyond making it easier to terminate under performing government employees. Additionally, I suspect that unionization of federal employees has been very detrimental to actually being much more difficult to impose from above any efficiencies into the government.

Nov 22, 2009 - 6:29 am 58. ConservativeWanderer:

Okay, let’s lay this constitutional amendment stuff to rest once and for all.

First of all, if you wanna bypass the federal Congress, you have to have 2/3 of the state legislatures request a constitutional convention. That means, you’ve got to get 33 state legislatures to request one. After that, you have to get 3/4 of the state legislatures to ratify it, which means you need 38 of the 50 states.

Republicans control 21 of the upper houses and 15 of the lower houses right now. Therefore, the GOP doesn’t control enough state legislatures to request such a convention, and it’s highly unlikely that the Democrats will.

It’s also doubtful that the Republicans will, for several reasons. First of all, given your tone, I think you’d agree that the GOP has become just as interested in staying in power as the Democratic Party. The state legislatures are also full of people who dream of making it to the federal Congress someday. Do you really expect these people–these professional politicians–to put forward an amendment that’s going to limit how long they can stay in Congress once they get there? Look at it this way, would you sign a document saying that if you got promoted to, say, your boss’s job that legally you’d have to leave it in 6 years, regardless of your performance, ability to find another job, or any other factor?

Another reason they wouldn’t is because they are scared of it catching on. Currently there are 35 state legislatures without term limits. However, if a constitutional amendment is adopted limiting the terms of members of the federal Congress, many in those state legislatures are afraid that it would come to their state… therefore, they won’t go for it at all.

Finally, as Mr. Levin points out often, if you have a constitutional convention, there is no legal way to limit discussion to just one issue. It’s quite possible and even probable that the discussion would move on to other topics, including those pushed by the lefties, such as enshrining abortion in the Constitution, repealing the 22nd Amendment (term limits on Presidents), and perhaps even digging up the ERA. Are you sure you want to hand the leftists in this nation that kind of blank check?

Talk of amendments like this is nothing less that foolish in this day and age, when it would be easier to get the sun to rise in the north than to get one passed. The society and government have just deteriorated too far; the left has had the upper hand for far too long. Therefore, such discussions are a waste of time, energy, and bandwidth. So let’s deal with working within the system we have instead of coming up with pie-in-the-sky ideas that will never be adopted.

Nov 22, 2009 - 7:02 am 59. LiveFreeOrDie:

Perhaps an analogy will help people understand ObamaCare.

Suppose for a moment that the government decided everyone was entitled to a house.
Let’s call it “The Americal Home Ownership Entitlement Act”, and here is how it works.
The government forces you to take out a new 30 year adjustable rate mortage, even though you already may have a home, a mortgage or pay rent. You taxes will go up to provide housing for those
americans, legal or otherwize, less fortunate than yourself. It’s your duty to see these folks moved from their current taxpayer subsidized housing into a new government house, just like yours, you know, spread the wealth around, it works better that way. The government will decide if your lender is suitable or not to continue in the mortgage business and if not, you will be forced to find a different, more expensive lender or loose your current home. After you have paid 12 years on your government ‘home entitlement’ mortage, you can move into your new ‘entitlement’ house, chosen just for you. Well, not really just for you, your new house was chosen by a overnment housing czar based upon your community rating. Once in your new ‘entitlement home’, AKA FEMA trailer, you’ll only have to pay another 18 years on the government mortage until the trailer is yours, unless, of course, the government decides to change the terms of your government mortgage. It may be hard for the government to find carpenters willing to work for the government mandated pay scale after all, especially after the SEIU unionizes them through card check…..

Well, you see how it goes, so I’m with Rachel, “all of my actions henceforth will be as brutal and as devoid of compassion as I am capable.”

Nov 22, 2009 - 7:11 am 60. MarkD:

Oh, Congress can exempt itself from this program, but Congress cannot take advantage of the medical technologies that will not be created because there is no money to be made developing them.

There is a certain Schadenfreude in imagining Obama having stifled the cure for his future lung cancer, or Chuck Schumer with Alzheimer’s. It’s just too bad the innocent must suffer with them.

Nov 22, 2009 - 8:36 am 61. Now and Then:

I asked Retard Peepers “What have you ever done to contribute to society?”

That really put her into a tailspin. Been very thoughtful and frothy ever since. Well, all that conjutatin’ has paid off. She now has a plan for contributing:

56. rachel peepers:
“From now on, in order to get my country back, there is virtually no mission that I won’t lead . . . Needless to say, as far as I’m concerned, the need to save this great nation trumps all state and federal laws . . . all of my actions henceforth will be as brutal and as devoid of compassion as I am capable.”

Well, well, well, I look forward to the onslaught of self-righteous indignation and loser’s angst that will no doubt define your march to permanent irrelevance. But you haven’t yet identified the mission which you will lead. This concerns me.

As a potential loyal follower of Frau Peepers, I urge you to take command. You can’t stand idle any longer, waiting for your cause and process to be handed down from News Corps. Beck is busy down in The Villages riling up retirees. You simply must decide on your own what that cause, that mission, will be.

To help you get started, I’ll offer an idea. You guys can spitball it. . . . Baby Farms. That’s right, put unemployed single women to work birthing the next generation of American patriots. Of course, there will have to be some “screening” involved. But I’m sure we can get some good seed stock from the fellas right here at PJM. Think about it. It’s not as retarded as it first sounds.

Hail Rush. Go Sarah.

Nov 22, 2009 - 10:10 am 62. Insufficiently Sensitive:

Barack Obama was obviously an intellectually shallow and poorly read man. His resume was a joke. Obama should be no more than a minor Illinois elected official. Obama is president of the United States only because of race guilt.

Race guilt, and a staggering propaganda campaign by our mainstream “news” agencies, who did no vetting of Obama’s past, nor executive accomplishments, nor the crookedness of his caucus manipulations, his illegal campaign financing, and illegal support from the ‘nonpartisan’ ACORN. And if that wasn’t enough, they’d just run a six-year negative campaign against GWB. What was left after that, but to elect the most anti-Bush candidate? His desire for defeatism overseas was only enhanced by his PC color-coding.

Nov 22, 2009 - 12:02 pm 63. SukieTawdry:

Now and Then, you smug ignorant slut, I’ve got your mission right here.

As it stands now, the “mission” on the national level is to rid ourselves of the toxic majority in Congress and, at the first opportunity, the poseur in the White House. Secondary to that goal is the clear and unequivocal message to the Republicans that we will no longer tolerate business as usual and demand a return to Constitutional government. I know how that must seem pale in comparison to your Baby Farms brainfart, but what are ya gonna do? Guess I just don’t have your flare for creative genius.

I would not attempt to speak for Ms Peepers, but here’s what I’m prepared to do: I have stopped making estimated tax payments. Oh, I fully intend to pay my income taxes, but I will do so now on my own schedule (and, yes indeedy, there are ways around those pesky penalties and interest). I am blessed to have a healthy amount of disposable income every month which heretofore I have used primarily to fund my passion for travel. I intend now to stay home for the duration and redirect those funds to aid in the recruitment and election of conservative candidates around the nation. (What I need is a place where I can go for discussion and analysis of the various districts and races to see where my money is best spent–how about PJM, Roger?). As for my own boots on the ground, I will continue to support rallies and Tea Parties and marches on the Capitol. I will work to unseat Barbara Boxer (and since I would prefer to not replace her with Carly Fiorina, I’m presently taking a look at Chuck DeVore) and elect Meg Whitman. Unlike Roger, I am well represented by a bona fide conservative in the House who will not require my assistance for his reelection. And since I’m just over the hill from Reno, I will offer that assistance instead to efforts to put Harry Reid atop history’s ash heap.

Did anyone happen to hear Huge Hewitt’s show the day he had his Ten for Tark brainchild? Tens of thousands of dollars poured into Danny Tarkanian’s campaign coffers just from that day’s appeal alone. Hewitt boasts an audience of around two million, I believe, so just think what could be done with an effort like that writ large. We just have to figure a way to do it.

Nov 22, 2009 - 1:22 pm 64. SukieTawdry:

That’s Hugh Hewitt, of course. A mere typo, not an attempt to cast aspersions.

Nov 22, 2009 - 1:36 pm 65. Poor Citizen:

Mr Simon writes:

They know government run health care hasnt worked in Canada and UK.

Well, if that is true then really dont know anything about the health care systems of the U.S. , Canada or the United Kingdom. Because we all know it does not work in the US (unless you have been in a cave the last 100 years).

Not sure about Canada, but it sounds like know one else knows either.

And as far as the UK goes. The national healthcare system works. It does have some problems, but those problems are nothing compared to the current American debacle. It does work, and has worked since the implementation of 1948. It expanded coverage for millions without coverage. ..”AND” ….”AND” it also kept a private system of coverage for those that want it and can afford it. Just wanted to let you know some fact(s).

Politicians that can support spending billions on wars and killing..should at the very least support health care for its citizens, specially those that are young, old and disabled. Shame on those that cannot or refuse. Its that simple.

So there. We can all chew on some real fact for a “real change.”

Nov 22, 2009 - 2:27 pm 66. Now and Then:

63. SukieTawdry:

” . . . rid ourselves of the toxic majority in Congress and, at the first opportunity, the poseur in the White House. Secondary to that goal is the clear and unequivocal message to the Republicans that we will no longer tolerate business as usual and demand a return to Constitutional government.”

I applaud your mission, and I assure you it can be done. We just did it. And you’re right, you don’t have my flare for creative genius.

Thanks for being so quick to offer that “onslaught of self-righteous indignation and loser’s angst.” You’re very accommodating.

Nov 22, 2009 - 3:10 pm 67. Mark Richardson:

As far as I can tell, the majority of Americans oppose the current health care package.
I consider it taxation without representation when our elected refuse to listen to the voters.
Others might call it treason.
Seems like we had a war over this once..
Oh yeah, the American revolution.

Nov 22, 2009 - 3:39 pm 68. SukieTawdry:

I’m neither angsty (not in my nature) nor self-righteously (or otherwise) indignant (waste of time), you pompous ass. The self-righteous indignation you detect must be coming from a different direction where, if I’m not mistaken, there also wafts the distinct odor of eau de flopsweat.

Nov 22, 2009 - 6:16 pm 69. Insight:

Constitutional convention/term limits, etc: ain’t gonna happen; unintended consequences including what 50 said – paralysis of government. Fact is that the government has too many tentacles into our lives, and has every possible type of interest group played off against another so that you can’t get agreement to cut anything. It is a spider web of laws and regulations that we are enmeshed in and can’t get out of – the more we struggle the more entangled we get. We are caught in the inevitable downward trajectory of all societies, as Mencken’s Law takes suffocating hold: “It doesn’t take a politician long to realize that every time he takes a dollar from one man and gives 50 cents to two men, he gains two votes for every one that he lost.”

You know the old saw about a frog in a pot of water that’s gradually heated, and the frog never notices the temperature rise because its gradual and gets boiled to death? Well, it turns out that frogs actually do jump out after the water gets to a certain temperature. People, however, are not so smart.

Nov 22, 2009 - 6:30 pm 70. Terye:

So much for post partisan..in fact I would say that Washington is more partisan today than it has ever been.

Nov 22, 2009 - 6:36 pm 71. Now and Then:

68. SukieTawdry:

I frustrate you. I get it. The mission you have taken on, the one we just accomplished, seems daunting. I know. But stay the course, until you change your mind then say it was never about staying the course and chart a new one. That’s the ticket. Stick with what you know and those scarlet billows will start to spread. Until then, keep accommodating by calling names. it has no effect on me, but I’m sure it makes you feel better. And after all, isn’t that what it’s all about? Besides, it will give Bill Perron a reason to pontificate.

Sing with me, Sukie. “Oh that . . . “

Nov 22, 2009 - 7:00 pm 72. Jim Rockford:

– What’s astonishing about the Obama crew, however, is that they arrived on the wings of untold optimism supported by almost the entire media and still they have plummeted to near nothing in less than a year. –

Any serious person knew Obama’s many campaign promises were nothing but snake-oil. He never had a clue how to implement any of his vague policies; not that he ever intended to. He’s content to enjoy his celebrity and let the Pelosi and Reid run the show.

Nov 23, 2009 - 9:34 am 73. Paul -Indiana:

Obama was elected by 31% of the electorate. Basically he was elected by the 42% of voters who wouldn’t get off their butts to cast a vote. We may get one more chance to resolve this peacefully, but I am sure it will be resolved one way or another.

Nov 23, 2009 - 12:58 pm 74. Jestersmith:

“They know government-run medicine hasn’t worked in Canada”

This is as uneducated a statement as me saying Americans need a public option. Got some evidence? Please describe your experience with the CND system?

Succinctly: Chronic Dislocations, Specialist (trained under Dr. Andrews AL) no charge, MRI no charge 1 week later, torn labrum 0-6 repaired 3 weeks later, can still pay my mortgage

Nov 23, 2009 - 3:08 pm 75. Now and Then:

73. Paul -Indiana:
“We may get one more chance to resolve this peacefully, but I am sure it will be resolved one way or another.”

Let’s see, Bush was elected without the majority vote. It took us eight years but we resolved it peacefully. So play nice, or we’ll have to institute Marshall Law and confine you to your homes.

Nov 23, 2009 - 3:59 pm 76. ConservativeWanderer:

Perfect example of Now and Then’s grasp of political-societal concepts:

…we’ll have to institute Marshall Law…

It’s “martial law.” It’s not capitalized, and the word is “martial,” as in pertaining to the armed forces, not “Marshall,” as in a person’s name.

A wise person will keep this lack of understanding in mind whenever reading any of NaT’s comments.

Nov 23, 2009 - 5:15 pm 77. elc:

“It’s ‘martial law.’ It’s not capitalized, and the word is ‘martial,’ as in pertaining to the armed forces, not ‘Marshall,’ as in a person’s name.”

Thanks, ConservativeWanderer. Now and Then may play very nicely indeed, but first he/she needs to stay in for a few recesses to learn some spelling and some history.

Nov 23, 2009 - 6:57 pm 78. Roger L Simon:

Perhaps the commenter was referring to the laws of the Marshall Islands – how many scuba divers are allowed in the water at one time, etc.

Nov 23, 2009 - 7:36 pm 79. ConservativeWanderer:

Perhaps the commenter was referring to the laws of the Marshall Islands – how many scuba divers are allowed in the water at one time, etc.

Or maybe the rules for the Marshall Plan, Roger?

Nov 23, 2009 - 7:49 pm 80. Now and Then:

77/78/79

Wow, fellas. You got me! I stand corrected on my spelling of martial law – an unforgivable transgression. Please, don’t track me down. Don’t threaten me and my family. Please, don’t shoot me with your gub. Or karate chop me. Or appear in my dreams as an evil clown. I was wrong. Oh, so wrong.

Nov 24, 2009 - 8:12 am 81. Paul -Indiana:

#75. There is a huge gulf between peaceful and violent. You implied violence and I did not. BTW, a ‘majority’ vote is not ever required to elect a president. It’s all based on the Electoral College.

Nov 24, 2009 - 11:53 am 82. ConservativeWanderer:

Now and Then @ 80:

Very good, Grasshopper. The ability to admit that one is wrong is the beginning of wisdom. The man who knows everything cannot learn anything; he who knows that he does not know can learn.

Nov 24, 2009 - 3:30 pm 83. elc:

Now and Then: “Please, don’t track me down. Don’t threaten me and my family. Please, don’t shoot me with your gub. Or karate chop me. Or appear in my dreams as an evil clown.”

You wish.

Nov 24, 2009 - 6:00 pm 84. Now and Then:

83. elc:
FO

Nov 25, 2009 - 12:53 pm 85. elc:

Happy Thanksgiving!

Nov 25, 2009 - 4:51 pm 86. Now and Then:

I’m looking forward to it

Nov 25, 2009 - 5:31 pm 87. young money$:

man this is tha life young mulaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaby.

Nov 30, 2009 - 10:09 am 88. Pajamas Media » If ObamaCare Passes, Will You Ever Be Able to Trust Your Doctor?:

[...] how they do it in Europe. The ruling class has its own high-quality medical system, just as the U.S. Congress has the best medical insurance today. It’s just like an Agatha Christie murder mystery, where [...]

Feb 2, 2010 - 12:21 am

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