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	<title>Comments on: Are We Really All Socialists Now?</title>
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	<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/</link>
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		<title>By: Ron Radosh &#187; America&#8217;s Socialist Future: Martin J. Sklar vs. John B. Judis</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-3325</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Radosh &#187; America&#8217;s Socialist Future: Martin J. Sklar vs. John B. Judis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jun 2009 23:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-3325</guid>
		<description>[...] ago, on this blog, I talked about the theoretical analysis of</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] ago, on this blog, I talked about the theoretical analysis of</p>
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		<title>By: TL</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1961</link>
		<dc:creator>TL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 23:20:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1961</guid>
		<description>Articles like this are like the Borg in Star Trek warning their victims that &quot;resistance is futile.&quot;  Don&#039;t expect surrender Ron.  Remember Patrick Henry?  Resistance is inevitable.  Get used to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Articles like this are like the Borg in Star Trek warning their victims that &#8220;resistance is futile.&#8221;  Don&#8217;t expect surrender Ron.  Remember Patrick Henry?  Resistance is inevitable.  Get used to it.</p>
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		<title>By: Valjean</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1958</link>
		<dc:creator>Valjean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 17:46:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1958</guid>
		<description>In the fine tradition (&quot;quite a long time&quot;) of the mixed economy, Mr. Radosh has given us quite a mixed essay. What&#039;s the larger point here? We&#039;ve always had this, so lie back and enjoy it? I especially appreciated these howlers:

&quot;Conservatives who fight this reality are tilting at windmills. Rather than fight necessary regulatory measures, it would be better to see that they work efficiently, and not be so restrictive and punitive as to threaten business enterprise itself.&quot;

Ah, the old &quot;just make government work *better*&quot; canard. This has been around almost as long as the &quot;mixed economy&quot;. Has it occurred to our author that we know most &quot;necessary measures&quot; (care to *name* a few, rather than mealy-mouth it?) won&#039;t work, and *that&#039;s* the reason we fight it? Tilting at Quixotean windmills? How about fighting for what&#039;s right?

&quot;... Obama has to pump up the economy ...&quot;

By taking hundreds of billions in taxes and splaying it around as he and Washington see fit? Sure, that&#039;s always worked.

&quot;Decades ago, in the years of FDR’s New Deal experiments ...&quot;

Oh, is *that* what they were. Many of us windmill-tilters call them &quot;entitlement programs&quot;, which you claim the president will get around to *cutting* (?!?) once he&#039;s done with this &quot;pumping&quot; he &quot;has&quot; to do. Really curious how that&#039;s going to go over.

Again, seems like Mr. Radosh&#039;s theme is &quot;don&#039;t sweat it, we&#039;ve always done it this way and we have to press on.&quot; To paraphrase our new erudite president (with a bit more emphasis): WE&#039;VE TRIED IT YOUR WAY - AND LOOK WHERE IT&#039;S GOTTEN US!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the fine tradition (&#8220;quite a long time&#8221;) of the mixed economy, Mr. Radosh has given us quite a mixed essay. What&#8217;s the larger point here? We&#8217;ve always had this, so lie back and enjoy it? I especially appreciated these howlers:</p>
<p>&#8220;Conservatives who fight this reality are tilting at windmills. Rather than fight necessary regulatory measures, it would be better to see that they work efficiently, and not be so restrictive and punitive as to threaten business enterprise itself.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ah, the old &#8220;just make government work *better*&#8221; canard. This has been around almost as long as the &#8220;mixed economy&#8221;. Has it occurred to our author that we know most &#8220;necessary measures&#8221; (care to *name* a few, rather than mealy-mouth it?) won&#8217;t work, and *that&#8217;s* the reason we fight it? Tilting at Quixotean windmills? How about fighting for what&#8217;s right?</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230; Obama has to pump up the economy &#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>By taking hundreds of billions in taxes and splaying it around as he and Washington see fit? Sure, that&#8217;s always worked.</p>
<p>&#8220;Decades ago, in the years of FDR’s New Deal experiments &#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Oh, is *that* what they were. Many of us windmill-tilters call them &#8220;entitlement programs&#8221;, which you claim the president will get around to *cutting* (?!?) once he&#8217;s done with this &#8220;pumping&#8221; he &#8220;has&#8221; to do. Really curious how that&#8217;s going to go over.</p>
<p>Again, seems like Mr. Radosh&#8217;s theme is &#8220;don&#8217;t sweat it, we&#8217;ve always done it this way and we have to press on.&#8221; To paraphrase our new erudite president (with a bit more emphasis): WE&#8217;VE TRIED IT YOUR WAY &#8211; AND LOOK WHERE IT&#8217;S GOTTEN US!</p>
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		<title>By: Nomad</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1956</link>
		<dc:creator>Nomad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 00:43:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1956</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll never ever buy another Newsweek Mag.... EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll never ever buy another Newsweek Mag&#8230;. EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!</p>
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		<title>By: johnc</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1952</link>
		<dc:creator>johnc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2009 03:41:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1952</guid>
		<description>So let me get this straight, we are suppose to embrace a economic system (Socialism) that put 120+million people in mass graves in the 20th century and displaced and ruined the lives of millions more?? The likes of National Socialist party ie. NAZI, Union of Soviet Socialist Republics ie, USSR, Peoples Socialist Movement ie. Red China, the list goes on.
 Sorry, not this American!
 Any American that embraces socialism should have their citizenship stripped from them and deported!
There are three words that make us Americans and these words go against the tenants of Socialism,,,
LIBERTY, INDEPENDENCE and INDIVIDUALISM</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So let me get this straight, we are suppose to embrace a economic system (Socialism) that put 120+million people in mass graves in the 20th century and displaced and ruined the lives of millions more?? The likes of National Socialist party ie. NAZI, Union of Soviet Socialist Republics ie, USSR, Peoples Socialist Movement ie. Red China, the list goes on.<br />
 Sorry, not this American!<br />
 Any American that embraces socialism should have their citizenship stripped from them and deported!<br />
There are three words that make us Americans and these words go against the tenants of Socialism,,,<br />
LIBERTY, INDEPENDENCE and INDIVIDUALISM</p>
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		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1951</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:29:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1951</guid>
		<description>So we should all submit to the state as our new master and overlord and just get used to it? Those of us that work hard, get an education, and achieve a good salary should be happy to sacrifice our hard won gains to our those Americans who can only be described as lazy, unproductive, envious, helpless, and who believe the government, via the productive, owe them something? No. I will be no man&#039;s indentured servant and will fight this until my dying breath. If you refuse to try, you deserve to fail.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So we should all submit to the state as our new master and overlord and just get used to it? Those of us that work hard, get an education, and achieve a good salary should be happy to sacrifice our hard won gains to our those Americans who can only be described as lazy, unproductive, envious, helpless, and who believe the government, via the productive, owe them something? No. I will be no man&#8217;s indentured servant and will fight this until my dying breath. If you refuse to try, you deserve to fail.</p>
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		<title>By: Hyphenated American</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1949</link>
		<dc:creator>Hyphenated American</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:40:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1949</guid>
		<description>This was pretty funny..
&quot;Rather than fight necessary regulatory measures, it would be better to see that they work efficiently, and not be so restrictive and punitive as to threaten business enterprise itself.&quot;

Actually, as a conservative I believe most if not all labor regulations are unnecessary. That&#039;s just to start with. So, a more honest debate tactic on Radosh&#039;s part would be to explain why he thinks American people should give up their freedom - instead of claiming that this submission is completely necessary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was pretty funny..<br />
&#8220;Rather than fight necessary regulatory measures, it would be better to see that they work efficiently, and not be so restrictive and punitive as to threaten business enterprise itself.&#8221;</p>
<p>Actually, as a conservative I believe most if not all labor regulations are unnecessary. That&#8217;s just to start with. So, a more honest debate tactic on Radosh&#8217;s part would be to explain why he thinks American people should give up their freedom &#8211; instead of claiming that this submission is completely necessary.</p>
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		<title>By: Omar</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1948</link>
		<dc:creator>Omar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Feb 2009 06:32:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1948</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Jon Meacham and Evan Thomas argue in their  cover story for Newsweek that the United States, though remaining a center-right nation culturally, is increasingly coming to resemble the  European social-democratic welfare states. &lt;/i&gt;

American Liberals have a tendency to view European Social Market economics as simply a more interventionist form of American Market Capitalism. So you often see the metaphor of a continuum applied to describe their distinctions. But this is a flawed means of comparison. The European &#039;Social Market&#039; model is fundamentally a political system w/ commercial components. It is not interventionist according to the meaning that most American writers intend - which is actually an ad-hoc Populist approach rather than a thoroughly managed, state sponsored, economy. Interestingly, though it often produces very bad economic policies, American Populism may protect the United States from the excesses of Social Market political economics. For these rely on an acceptance of permanent social stasis, rigid class hierarchy, and both psychological and existential passivity that I think is anathema to even the most Liberal Americans.

* I would advise against looking to Newsweek for economic or social commentary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Jon Meacham and Evan Thomas argue in their  cover story for Newsweek that the United States, though remaining a center-right nation culturally, is increasingly coming to resemble the  European social-democratic welfare states. </i></p>
<p>American Liberals have a tendency to view European Social Market economics as simply a more interventionist form of American Market Capitalism. So you often see the metaphor of a continuum applied to describe their distinctions. But this is a flawed means of comparison. The European &#8216;Social Market&#8217; model is fundamentally a political system w/ commercial components. It is not interventionist according to the meaning that most American writers intend &#8211; which is actually an ad-hoc Populist approach rather than a thoroughly managed, state sponsored, economy. Interestingly, though it often produces very bad economic policies, American Populism may protect the United States from the excesses of Social Market political economics. For these rely on an acceptance of permanent social stasis, rigid class hierarchy, and both psychological and existential passivity that I think is anathema to even the most Liberal Americans.</p>
<p>* I would advise against looking to Newsweek for economic or social commentary.</p>
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		<title>By: GCA</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1947</link>
		<dc:creator>GCA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Feb 2009 06:30:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1947</guid>
		<description>I buy the mix of socialism and capitalism premise but I do not buy Obama&#039;s methods as being necessary to preserve what we have.  As to Obama&#039;s ability to pump up the economy while narrowing entitlements, I am extremely skeptical; I suspect that he sees both a depression and increased entitlements as opportunities to consolidate Democrat power.  The real danger he faces is that Americans, used to living well, will grow restless and throw his congress, and prehaps even him, out when things don&#039;t start to turn around within the next 2-3 years.

From what I can see, the so-called &quot;stimulus plan&quot; is short on pump priming and long on entitlements.  It will be interesting to see reactions in a couple of years when those of us who still have jobs face decreasing income coupled with increasing taxes.  Watch California - it is already happening here and talented people are leaving in droves.  When it happens to the rest of the country, people will have nowhere to go and the only option, assuming Obama and company have not succeeded in making net tax takers (those who get more in govt. services than they pay in taxes) into the majority, will be to throw the bastards out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I buy the mix of socialism and capitalism premise but I do not buy Obama&#8217;s methods as being necessary to preserve what we have.  As to Obama&#8217;s ability to pump up the economy while narrowing entitlements, I am extremely skeptical; I suspect that he sees both a depression and increased entitlements as opportunities to consolidate Democrat power.  The real danger he faces is that Americans, used to living well, will grow restless and throw his congress, and prehaps even him, out when things don&#8217;t start to turn around within the next 2-3 years.</p>
<p>From what I can see, the so-called &#8220;stimulus plan&#8221; is short on pump priming and long on entitlements.  It will be interesting to see reactions in a couple of years when those of us who still have jobs face decreasing income coupled with increasing taxes.  Watch California &#8211; it is already happening here and talented people are leaving in droves.  When it happens to the rest of the country, people will have nowhere to go and the only option, assuming Obama and company have not succeeded in making net tax takers (those who get more in govt. services than they pay in taxes) into the majority, will be to throw the bastards out.</p>
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		<title>By: marsouin</title>
		<link>http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2009/02/13/are-we-really-all-socialists-now/comment-page-1/#comment-1946</link>
		<dc:creator>marsouin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Feb 2009 02:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=507#comment-1946</guid>
		<description>Big Government by definition is authoritarian. When has authoritarianism ever been good for humanity? As the radical Whigs once understood, Big Government can never ever be just and honest government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Big Government by definition is authoritarian. When has authoritarianism ever been good for humanity? As the radical Whigs once understood, Big Government can never ever be just and honest government.</p>
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